Sleep issues with a 4 year old please help

[hillview]

DS1 sleeps well. He falls asleep on his own and usually sleeps through the night. If he wakes up to pee he usually goes back to bed himself, on occasion he needs me to walk him back to bed and tuck him in, but he then falls asleep on his own.

DS2 is a pita. DS2 requires that we lay next to him til he falls asleep in his bed. This is usually short -- 10 mins or so but sometimes can be 25. He almost always wakes up at night and DH has been going back into his bed with him and often spends the night in there. This has to stop.

I am thinking that we need to break the lay next to him habit because this is likely making middle of the night wakings an issue (eg he can't get himself to sleep). Does this sound right? If so, this will be a KNOCK DOWN DRAG OUT with DS2. He doesn't want to go to sleep alone.

Any tips? The boys sleep in the same room so I am thinking of making DS2's bed time closer to DS1's bed time and putting them to bed at the same time, that way he isn't alone per se.

Other suggestions??

TIA!
/hillary

[arivecchi]

My 4 year old is the exact same way. DH has to lie down next to him. He usually falls asleep quickly. Like clockwork, he jumps into our bed between 1-3 every single night.

He says he is afraid if the dark, but night lights do not help. I may just have DS2 sleep in the same room as DS1 when he outgrows the crib and hope this solves the problem.

[nfowife]

have you tried the sleep lady shuffle? You sit on a chair next to the bed and then slowly move further and further away until you are outside the door and then gone? You can google it for more details. Sounds like it would help and hopefully not be to traumatic.
For the nightwakings how about some sort of reward system. Like for every night he stays in his bed all night he gets a sticker or a piece of candy or whatnot. Whatever his "currency" is.

We have this stoplight clock thing http://www.onestepahead.com/catalog/product.jsp?productId=535846&cmSource=CrossSell&relatedProductId=535263
and it has helped us a lot with my DS:

We just chant over and over "when the light is red, stay in bed!". It isn't perfect but it certainly helps.

[elektra]

No solution but we are in the same boat too. Must lay down with DD, then she comes in our bed every night.
DS just started climbing out of his crib too (crib tent arriving today!) so it looks like he will similarly not want to stay in bed either.
Wah!

Bribes for getting her nails done has not worked. I am tired of it too. :(

The bedtime thing sounds like a good first step to me.

When I have tried to return her to her bed, she clings to me so frantically that it is physically difficult to remove her from my leg.

[hillview]

When I have tried to return her to her bed, she clings to me so frantically that it is physically difficult to remove her from my leg.
:yeahthat::yeahthat:

[BigDog]

No advice since I'm in the same boat as you... I'm just happy to know that I'm not alone! Every morning, DH and I just shake our heads and say "this has gotta stop!". I'll be watching this thread!

[daisysmom]

My 4.5 year old has never been a great sleeper, but we find that she will get in the habit of coming into our bed. Like she will come in within 10 minutes of each other visit for several nights in a row. We break the habit with rewards, but the key is finding the right one. Most recently it is "silver dollars" which is really a 50 cent piece, but since they are the sterling silver ones made in the 1950s, they are actually worth about $3 now. If she stays in her bed all night, she gets one. She is very motivated by rewards, and that worked for 5 nights. Then she did good on her own for awhile and was in a few nights ago with these words "I thought about it Daddy, and I think I have anough coins" at 2:30 am. New reward is saving money to buy a purple diamond (some bead that she liked at the bead store recently).

Ever since she was in a big girl bed, I would lay with her also for 5-15 minutes until she fell asleep. I don't that that caused the waking in themiddle of the night for us... as she falls asleep with a sitter not laying there, or her dad not laying there, enough times.

My knowledge of other friends with older children is that some kids just come into their parent's room, and that's life.

[chozen]

our dd still sleeps in our room in her own bed, it works for us but i know some don't like the idea of it.

[brittone2]

Can you replace with a new ritual that is shorter? DD likes when I draw hearts, starts, or ponies (her choice) on her cheeks, forehead and chin. I don't know why, but she likes it. She names the colors, I and I "draw" them with my finger on each cheek, her forehead, chin, and a big one on her overall face. Her routine when we moved her into her new room (and wanted to stop having to lie down next to her) was read a book, nurse, stars/hearts/whatever, and her CD on.

DS1 and DD both did well when transitioning to their won rooms at age 3 with listening to a book on CD or a sleep/relaxation CD.

I would try to hype up a new and shorter ritual.

eta: When DD wakes up in the middle of the night (usually only if scared or sick), I can usually just hug her, reassure her, put her back in bed and we do her hearts and turn her CD back on. FOr some reason that works well for her. It didn't work *as* well with DS1, but it did work many times.

[lovin2shop]

Hmmm, this post has me very worried. My nearly 3 year old does this also, and I had it in my head that 4 would be the magical age upon which he would sleep through the night!