CIO -- How long does it take the first night???

If you did CIO, how long did your baby cry the first night? Ava has been crying for over an hour now. It is so hard, esp. since I am very reluctant to do this at all :(

Robyn & Ava

Well, my son cried for close to two ... please don't judge, he was 14 mos old at the time and I was at the end of my rope.

It took quite a few weeks, some nights better than others and quite a few tears (on both our parts). Good news is now he goes down prettily easily, though still an EARLY riser (between 4 - 5 am).

It will get better ... and you will both move on from what seems endless.

Well, I also hope no one will judge me, but DD cried on and off for maybe 4 hours total the first night, but she did sleep in between--it was maybe 4 hours out of 8? I need to check my log, but it definitely got better the second night. And she woke up the next morning all smiles, so I know she was okay.


Eileen

Mother of Beautiful Kaya
http://www.babysfirstsite.org/newtic...4.birthday.png

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbo..._garnet_6m.gif Breastfed 7 months and counting

Hi Robyn,

How old is your baby? We actually just started doing CIO. I posted 2-3weeks ago about whether to CIO or not. There is really no right answer. I've been reading Dr. Weisbluth's Healthy sleepy habits. DD at 6.5mo still needs to be rocked to sleep and has been waking up every 1.5-2hr crying. So finally we decided to let her CIO. The first night (it was Sep22) she cried for 1hr and 35min and fell asleep. The second night was 45min. But from then on it was about 20 every night for the next 2wks. We thought we were doing something wrong since I read and heard that usually it took people about a wk. Then we started to let her CIO for her naps (she takes 20-30min naps; we had to pick her up at least 3times for a 2hr nap). That day, she cried the whole 40min for two of her naps and never fell asleep. She slept for a total of 2hr all her naps combined that day. She was so cranky and fussy. The moment we put her down to let her play she would start to cry. I thought that she was traumatized and completely sleep deprived. I felt so horrible about it. So we stopped letting her CIO for naps. Now we would usually just rock her for few min before her bedtime. If she doesn't fall asleep, we would just put her down. She still cried 15min tonight. Oh I forgot to mention that she still wakes up several times a night. I try to let her cry for few min if I know she's not hungry. We are still working on it.

Every baby is different. If you have a easy baby(unfortunately not our DD), it doesn't take long for CIO to work. I believe the key is to be consistant, do the same routine every night.

I wish you best of luck and hope this works out for you.

Keep us posted. I would love to know how Ava does.

I also have a marathon crier - ranges from 2-3.5 hours then I cave in and rock him.

He doesn't cry the whole time - he'll stop and play with his zipper tag, half-heartedly makes the crying noise (ughh, ughhh, ughhh) but not really cry, babble to himself...then he'll remember that he's supposed to be crying and it starts all over.

The first night we used Ferber went pretty well (2 weeks ago). He cried up until just before the 15 minute check in then he fell asleep. DH and I were shocked - we were anticipating a 3 hour ordeal. But then we remembered that he didn't nap that afternoon and he didn't sleep the night before so he was exhausted. That helped a lot in setting the stage for us.

The second night - he hit the 15 minute mark twice then fell asleep. Third night, 10 minute mark. Now some nights are better than others but the overall situation is a whole heck of a lot better than what it was last month.

He goes to sleep fine (I still nurse to sleep - our problem was nighttime waking), and if he wakes up then he'll cry for 5 minutes then fall back asleep. Sometimes he'll actually sit up, look around for 10 minutes, makes some noises then lays back down.

It's the naps that we're having problems with!

Good luck - I thought Kael wasn't ever going to sleep through the night and that he was not cut out for Ferber. Luckily we worked through it and things are looking better.

Thanks everyone! Ava will be 9 months on Friday. Up until about 6 months old, she was a great sleeper at night and would go to sleep right away and stay asleep for 5-6 hours, wake to nurse, then sleep another 4-5 hours. Then she got an ear infection and has been a terrible sleeper ever since, waking 2-3 times a night to nurse and I would have to lay down with her to get her to sleep. In the last few weeks, even that hasn't been working and she hasn't been falling asleep until around 10 (after lots of fussing), so that is why we decided to CIO finally.

Last night, she cried for about an hour and a half, fell asleep, woke about 30 min. later and cried another 15 min. or so before falling back asleep. She woke up to nurse about 4 hrs. later, then cried for about 5 min. before she fell back to sleep, and slept 3 hours. So that is a little progress. I am hoping she'll be better tonight.

Naps are a whole other story. She was horrible about naps until about two months ago. Then one morning when she was sleepy, I put her in her crib awake to see what would happen. She fell asleep with no crying and slept almost two hours! I tried it again the next morning and it worked again! So now I put her down around 9 and 1 every day and she falls asleep on her own and sleeps for 1-2 hours. Sometimes she will fuss a little, but mostly she babbles to herself for a few minutes, then goes to sleep. Now to get the nighttime to go as smoothly!

Thanks for the words of encouragement!
Robyn & Ava

It honestly gets better, and you will appreciate your investment. For us the time was about 1/2 the previous night until it stopped in 3 or 4 nights. Now if he wakes he cries for less than 5 minutes. He plays in his bed at bedtime and is happy about going there now. I do think a dark room helps, and he has a blanket and his Monkey (no pun intended) to play with.

When he goes to bed now he sings and talked to himself for up to 30 minutes. I am guilty of sitting outside the room and listening to his happy noises, but I wish he was sleeping during that time! I like the happy noises, but want him to sleep that additional 30 minutes!

I'm glad to hear that I'm not the only mother who did CIO and who apparently has a baby who is sometimes a marathon crier! There are definitely days when I question whether we should be doing it, especially if she seems to have one bad night. But I know milestones and all sorts of things can interfere with their sleep, so I have to remember to be consistent over time! This week, the disruption is that she no longer has a fan on in her room (white noise) because it's been so much cooler in her room. So I think she's adjusting to being able to hear all the noises around her room. We're going to give it a week, though, to see if she can adjust to sleeping without white noise. She does seem to be doing better after 3 days, so we'll see.

After 3 months of sleep training, I will say that she still has her bad days, but overall, she is sleeping soooo much better than before the sleep training and seems far less cranky during the day that I know we made the right decision for us.

Eileen

Mother of Beautiful Kaya
http://www.babysfirstsite.org/newtic...4.birthday.png

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbo..._garnet_6m.gif Breastfed 7 months and counting

Dear Li
1) What do you do when she wakes up at night and you know she is not hungry? Just CIO for however long it takes?
2) After hom many hours do you decide she can be hungry, thus feed her?

My son is 4 months and wakes up every three hrs at night. We are reding Weissbluth too. We tried CIO last night and after 45 minutes I couldn't take it and picked him up and nursed him...I know it was wrong to give up on our part, it was just sooo hard. I feel it will never work, I feel he will cry forever.... and I am so tired....
Silvana
mom of Luca
May 30, 2004

Hey ladies....
I do want to sleep and I want Luca (4 mo.) to sleep, so I think I really need to CIO. But I've tried twice and was not able to, I ended up picking him up....Have you ever heard of a baby who will not stop crying? A baby for which CIO will not work? Or is it always a success? I am so scared but I really need to do something about it....
Please help. I feel things will never change and my Luca will never sleep.
Thanks
Silvana

I tried CIO when my DS was 11 months old. He was a good sleeper from 4 months on but when he reached 10 months-just started to crawl-his sleep habit became pretty bad. He woke up 2-3 times at night and some nights he wanted stay up and play for 2 hours(like 3am...)

He refused to take naps and it took me hours and hours of rocking to get him to sleep for 30 minutes or so...

I finally decided to do CIO for naps and bedtime and he cried for 1 hour and 30 minutes first night. Some naps were all crying. It was getting better..Some night 5 minutes then fall asleep..He didn't wake up during the night anymore. Or he did, he cried a little and went right back to sleep. I knew I could not stand any longer and seeing my baby all tired crancky during the day was worse.

I did it for 2 weeks and I stopped since I got such a negative support from my DH and my live-in MIL. Although my MIL was convinced towards the end that she even let him cry to sleep one night when we were out.

He's 14 months old now and I soothe him to sleep for naps but at night I do bedtime routine then put him in his crib, he rolls around and talks to himself for 30 minutes or so then falls asleep on his own. Even for the naps, sometimes I rock him for a while then put him in his crib, he sleeps. He has pretty good sleep pattern(or getting better) and he sleeps good 10-11 hours at night without waking up.(even with my DH's snoring!)

Only thing I have to pretend that I am there next to him... Due to renovation and flood in his room, he's with us. His crib is right next to our bed and it worked out fine.

Time to time he fights to go to bed or wakes up...I let him cry to sleep sometimes or pick him up to soothe him. All depends on intensity of his crying.

CIO was really hard for me too. I thought I was dying watching him through the monitor but I knew I was doing the right thing for DS. But when all pissed off DH yells at you while he watches him with me. I gave up becuase it was harder for me to argue with DH ALL THE TIME.

Good luck and hope it works out for you and your baby.

I can't speak for any other CIO thoerists but I know Dr. Ferber states you can't/shouldn't try CIO on children any younger than 6 months old. I think it's because they still cry for needs at that age or something.

Good Luck,
LeAnn
Mom to Alex 11/12/02

Silvana

A four month old is still a very young baby. I honestly think that's too young to do CIO. Have you tried swaddling him to help him sleep? A baby that young still cries because he needs something from you, whether it's food, a cuddle, or just some close contact. This is strictly my opinion, but I would not worry about any type of sleep training until your DS is at least six months old. At 4 months, he is still so young, and he is crying because that's the only way he can tell you he needs you or something that you can give him. It is definitely likely that he needs to eat every three hours still, even during the night. It's been a while since I've read Weissbluth, but I seem to remember his philosophy being that it's fine to feed a baby during the night until at least 9 months of age. FWIW, I nursed mine during the night until she was 18 months old.

Good luck! I know how tiring it is, but give him a few months and things will improve. Four months is a notoriously hard time for baby sleep.


http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_emerald_18m.gif[/img][/url]
19 months and counting!

Hi Silvana,

I think 4mo-old may be too young for CIO. I believe it's normal to nurse every 3hr at your DS's age. Again, everybaby is different. I have couple of friends whose babies slept through the night by 3mo. Since we started CIO, we have been letting DD cry for up to 10min if she wakes up at night and I know she's not hungry. I usually judge that by the time of her last meal. If it has been more than 4-5hr since her last meal, then I usually just pick her up as soon as she starts crying and nurse her. Otherwise I let her cry for as much as 10min then pick her up to console her. But DD is on the smaller side -- 16lb at 6mo (50%), so I think she has a small stomach and may need to eat more freq than other babies her age. She usually only takes 4oz EBM plus 1oz solid during the day. I'm planning on not nursing her at all at night next. One of the nights she didn't drink anything from 8pm till 5am (since at was at work and she refused to take the bottle from DH when she woke up). So that kind of lead me to believe she doesn't really need the night time nursing. I believe most baby will take the breast to nurse if you offer to them when they are upset. It just soothes them. Many times when I nurse her at night, even if it's been 4-5hr from her last meal, she only sucks for 5min and falls asleep. I have no idea if I'm doing the right thing to help her sleep through the night. But knock on the wood, the last 2 nights, her 1st stretches were 5.5 hrs! A big improvement from every 1.5-2hrs.

I wish you best of luck. I hope everything works out and keep us posted.

Yes, probably you are right. He is young. I keep on going back and forth. To be honest, I was almost hoping to read a comment like yours (and other ladies who kindly took the time to answer me) becasue I cannot have him cry...at least for now.
Although Weissbluth does say that night feeding is OK until 9 months, he does also stress to start to sleep train at 4 months (unlike Ferber). That's why I tried (unsuccesfully, I am such a loser!).
Thank you all, you are all very sweet. Maybe I'll postpone the training of a month or two. But I'll do it!
XXX
Silvana

Don't do this if you're reluctant because you will break and go inside, making it more confusing... For me, CIO works only when I am at the end of my rope, when I know for sure that I can not go through another day like that, no matter what.

I did it twice. Once when she was 5 month old - took 15 minutes, which were the worst 15 minutes of my life, but it worked like a dream (until the first vacation). Second time she was 18 months, after many nights of waking up again to nurse, I waited a long time to go through that again. It took 20-25 minutes, and it's been great ever since. My DH said, why did we wait so long? all those nights we woke up, and we ended up doing CIO anyway? Well, before that point I would have broke down and go inside, and at that day I just had it!

Good luck!

I think that 4 months is a little young, but I think a lot of research will say it is the minimum age you can start CIO. But some babies aren't ready for it at that age. We started DD at 18-19 weeks, so she was about 4.5 months old. But no matter what, you shouldn't sleep train until you and DH are ready for it. If it's not until 6 months, then wait until then. And no, you're not a loser if you tried it unsuccessfully. You just realized that you and DS are not ready for it yet. And that's a good thing.

And by the way, some of my friends started sleep training (sort of) by around 2 months, but they weren't CIO'ing. They were just starting to get the baby used to a routine before every sleep time and watching for sleep signs, and not letting them get overtired, etc. That is all part of sleep training and can certainly start now.

Eileen

Mother of Beautiful Kaya
http://www.babysfirstsite.org/newtic...4.birthday.png

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbo..._garnet_6m.gif Breastfed 7 months and counting

I didn't really do the crying part of sleep training until DS hit the year mark. Before, it would be random nights of CIO for varied amounts of time but I would always be in the room with him. At 4 months he definitely still communicated via crying so I did what I could to soothe him. Around 6 months I started letting him cry for a bit.

We started with the bedtime routine early on - bath, massage, book, nurse and bed - around 2 months. Now DS is totally wired into the whole routine and knows what to expect.

I didn't feel that he understood or "get" the whole lesson of CIO until he was older. I think that attributed to our recent success. That and the fact that I was at the end of my ropes and was able to consistently stick to my plan.

Ok, well, I couldn't do it. After Ava cried 1.5 hours the first night (Mon) and for her entire morning and afternoon nap on Tues (upsetting b/c she had been going down for naps with no problem), I decided it just wasn't the right thing for her.

So here's what I did instead and (fingers crossed) it seems to be working. Last night I nursed her, read her a story and put her in her crib. Of course, she screamed, but I pulled the rocking chair up next to her crib and rubbed her back until she stopped crying and fell asleep. It took a LONG time, about an hour and a half. She still woke up twice to nurse, but went back to sleep each time with no fuss.

Morning nap today, same routine. She cried for 30 min. but this time I just sat next to her and patted/rubbed her back only occasionally to calm her. She slept about an hour.

Afternoon nap, same routine, but only about 5 min of fussing and she fell asleep with no back-rubbing. Progress! She seemed to "get it" right away.

So... my plan is to be strict with the routine and hope each night gets better until she only needs me to sit with her a few minutes before she can sleep on her own. Then we'll tackle the night nursing :)

Robyn & Ava

Robyn,

You found what's right FOR YOU and that's the best thing. It's great that its working. And just know that what works this week/month may not work next week/month or it might work tonight and not tomorrow but work the day after that. The best thing is routine so Ava (and you) know what to expect.

Congrats on using your mommy instinct and getting your angel to sleep!!!