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  1. #1
    AnnieW625's Avatar
    AnnieW625 is offline Black Diamond level (25,000+ posts)
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    Default If you live in a HCOL area do you live paycheck to paycheck?

    We do. Right now have no liquid assets we can grab on to if we need them ASAP unless we raided my DD1's savings account which I won't do. We live paycheck to paycheck each month in what I would classify as a high col area (but it still isn't the highest col area we could live in, but for our income it is pretty darn high). We do have a few months of contributions in our FSA and DCA accounts so I need to request that. Other than our mortgages and my car payment we pay cash and or pay off our credit cards monthly so we have no debt. Between the two of us we save about $400 a month for dca, $150 for FSA, $200 extra for state and federal taxes (we owed a little last year), and we save between the two of us $1400 for retirement (for non matching 401k, 457b, and we each have a pension; our 401k/457s are worth $68,777) but it is rather frustrating that we go through the entire $8800 a month we take home from our job. We are just starting to work with a broker to reduce our home loans as for the first time in almost 6 yrs. we have equity and I am honestly afraid that the broker is going to laugh at us when he looks at our financial statements.

    Oh and fwiw we pay our property taxes from the DCA account which covers 85% to 90% of that but we know that after next August our DCA will decrease as DD2 will no longer be in full time daycare (so that should save us about $4k a year). We also know that when we refi we will be impounding because we don't have 20% equity. Unless we really screwed up we should also get a federal tax refund since my paycheck deduction is $150 since I filled out my W4 wrong and forgot to put my withholding at M-2 when I put in for the Feds to take out extra money of my paycheck so I am at M-0.

    Is anyone else in the same boat?
    Last edited by AnnieW625; 09-18-2014 at 01:39 PM.
    Annie
    WOHM to two wonderful little girls born in April
    DD E, 17
    DD L, 13,
    baby 2, 4-2009 (our Tri-18 baby)

  2. #2
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    Default If you live in a HCOL area do you live paycheck to paycheck?

    I don't know how "regular" people do it in HCOL areas. My sister was living paycheck to paycheck until she married someone who had substantial savings and a good income (he's older than her.). My best friend and her DH are both teachers in a HCOL area and it's really hard for them. They have no wiggle room.

    Doesn't your DD go to private school? Could you save money by putting her in public?

    ETA: my entire family lives in Southern California, and we decided to live in the Midwest so we could enjoy a better lifestyle and I could SAH. DH also has to support his parents, and that would be nearly impossible if we lived in so. Cal.
    Last edited by georgiegirl; 09-18-2014 at 01:51 PM.
    DD (3/06)
    DS1 (7/09)
    DS2 (8/13)

  3. #3
    janine is offline Emerald level (3000+ posts)
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    Can you move? HCOL is tough even for dual incomes on a "high" salary. It's ridiculous - even if you pay off your mortgage you have the property tax which is like a mortgage.

    To answer your question we do not live paycheck to paycheck but we are in the corporate world and work round the clock and have family help us at home. Makes me want to move!

  4. #4
    AnnieW625's Avatar
    AnnieW625 is offline Black Diamond level (25,000+ posts)
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    Default If you live in a HCOL area do you live paycheck to paycheck?

    (bear with my explanation, but it makes sense to me!)

    yes she does go to Catholic school and the cost including after care is $597 a month. Before and aftercare at our local public school if billed correctly (friends have said it isn't at their school, but we did not get school of choice for that school and it is routinely full with it's own home area kids so there is no guarantee we could get it now either) then I would need 1 to 2 hrs. in the AM as school starts at 9 and 2.5 hrs. in the afternoon so that is about 22 hrs. per week at $4.95 per hour so that would be $445.42 per 4 week month, or $556.90 per month for a 5 week month. If our home school was a top school in our area and or had free aftercare then yes public school would be a no brainer, but it is smack dab on the middle to the lower side of public schools (the homes near the better schools were $80k-$100k more in 2005 when we bought our home and our area is still very safe and full of retirees w/out kids so our home school is classified as the district's overflow school to keep it opened so hence the middle to lower performing status). Now if we were to send both our girls to public school next year and since kindergarten is from 9 to 1 so add in another 6 hrs. a day and that would be $150 a week before any discounts for having sibling (which I honestly don't know if the have) so that cost could potentially be $600 just for DD2. My tuition and aftercare at the Catholic school for two kids will be $908 a month. Public school before/aftercare could be over a $1000.

    We have talked about moving, but if we move back to Nor Cal I am not sure how much money we would save because where I want to live for the girls to not have to go to Catholic high school isn't that much cheaper (although we could potentially get a larger house for the same price as our current mortgages $444k) than where we live now because prices are going up there again. We would also have to rent for a few years because we wouldn't have more than 5% down from the sale of our current place. We most likely won't move out of state, which would save us the most money because in January I will have 15 yrs. of civil service with my state, and would be out of work as well, plus I am sure DH wouldn't make anything close to the gross $94k he makes now. DH has also talked about working for a utility where he would make more money, but he likes his job.
    Last edited by AnnieW625; 09-18-2014 at 02:17 PM.
    Annie
    WOHM to two wonderful little girls born in April
    DD E, 17
    DD L, 13,
    baby 2, 4-2009 (our Tri-18 baby)

  5. #5
    sariana is offline Diamond level (5000+ posts)
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    No, we don't. My DH has a high salary, and he's a miser. We have substantial savings and could live for several years without an income, even without gong into retirement savings.

    But DH is a total stress case all the time. He works a full- time job plus puts at least 20-30 hours a week into his job as a Navy reservist. We rarely see him, and when we do, he is in a bad mood.

    We do get good health benefits, cost-wise, because he is in the Reserve. It's one main reason he has stayed in. But it keeps him very busy, and he deployed for a year when DC were little. That had an impact on DS, who struggled in school at the time.

    There are all kinds of trade-offs in life. I can't go to evening events or meetings because DH rarely gets home before 9 or 10. Weekends often are out too because of Reserve duties.

    And remember is said he was a miser? He doesn't believe in paying babysitters minimum wage. So unless the grandparents are available, I/we don't do things without the kids.

    Financially we do well, but socially I am usually like a single parent.
    DS '04 "Boogaboo"
    DD '08 "Lilybear"

  6. #6
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    hillview is offline Blue Diamond level (20,000+ posts)
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    We were in our fancy condo in town. When we realized this, we down sized and moved to the suburbs. Great move for us.
    DS #1 Summer 05
    DS #2 Summer 07

  7. #7
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    No. Two reasons: DH makes a good salary and we live below our means.

    After years of student loan debt, car loans, etc, we made a decision to be debt free about 8 years ago and I really think that has been a big part of it. At this point, there is no way in tarnation we can buy a home in SoCal with cash (NONE!!!) so we are saving and thinking about what we want to do.

    Another big factor in our lives is tithing/charity. I don't believe one iota in the prosperity gospel but I do believe that the more you give, the more you get to give. Not the more you get to keep but the more you get to help others. Call it God, Karma or whatever you like but I've seen that principle at work my entire life.

    Annie, when we lived in MD we decided to sell our house (roughly the same value as yours) and move into a rental townhouse. Our friends thought we were nuts but we had a multitude of reasons for doing so and in the end making that move gave us the flexibility and finances to pick ourselves up and move cross-country to where we wanted to live.

    ETA: I suppose many people would think our decisions extreme: particularly the no debt and downsizing but those decisions have given us SO MUCH more freedom to be in the position we are today.
    Last edited by crayonblue; 09-18-2014 at 05:16 PM.

  8. #8
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    We live in a very HCOL area, just outside of NYC. My county has the unfortunate distinction of having the highest property taxes in the entire country and my town has among the highest in the county, so not good for affordability! However, we do not live paycheck to paycheck at all. In fact, we have considerable savings, enough to last us for a very long time if we lost our jobs. We make good salaries (similar to your DH) so that puts us very close to your income level. I don't want to make you feel bad, Annie, but I think that if you don't have any other debt besides mortgage and one car payment, then you and/or your DH may have a spending problem. If you have a spending problem, I think it is a very common one as I have had occasion to become very closely acquainted with the details of two friends finances recently because of separation and possible divorce. In both cases, I was completely astounded by how couples who earned substantially more than DH and I do could actually have so much less in savings. I think that people often don't realize how things add up in a month and much of their money gets basically frittered away on little things that they never thought would cost them savings and security. I think it is unfortunate that our culture has really become a consumer culture so I feel like people such as my two close friends are kind of set up to fail.
    I know you haven't asked for advice, but I would strongly consider doing a really critical review of your spending to look at where it all goes. It's a trap to tell yourself that this is just the way it is in HCOL areas, because it isn't always that way and my situation and that of others is the proof of that. If you want to have savings and security, you must live below your means while you build up a good cushion (then you can loosen up your spending a bit as we have now that we have the savings). I think I recall that you received a minor inheritance a couple of years ago (maybe 10k). I remember thinking at the time that it would be great if you saved all of it but I think you were considering using a portion of it for a small vacation (not sure if you did or not). Had you invested that money in an index fund through Vanguard, it could be worth about 14k now (based on the performance of our Vanguard index fund over the last two years). Unfortunately, if you spent that money, you have lots of company. It seems like it is very hard for most people not to increase their spending to meet whatever their income is.
    DD '06
    DD '14

  9. #9
    AnnieW625's Avatar
    AnnieW625 is offline Black Diamond level (25,000+ posts)
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    Default If you live in a HCOL area do you live paycheck to paycheck?

    We could sell our house we think (this is based on my searching Zillow for comps...although the broker is suppose to search for us as well) for between $485k and $500k so after 6% standard realtor fees we would probably net between $11k and $25k on the sale of our home and that is assuming we wouldn't have to put any money into it in order to sell. Rental prices here are kind of high and if all goes well our mortgage payments (including impounds and pmi) will be about the same as rent of a 3 bed., 1 bath 1100 sq. ft. house about $2600 a month in our same area, and in some areas with great schools the rents are even higher. I know I sound like I am making excuses, but this is simply life for us. We were young and stupid (27, and 30) when DH took the job here, but DH had been out of work in a competitive field, area, and time (post dot.com bubble bursting) for almost two years so he took the best offer and the most stable offer he had received at the time. We had 6 months of our income saved when we moved (DH had saved the bulk of this money when he was with that first job out of college) but we opted to buy a house before prices went really crazy, but were still high, and we wanted kids so that money has been used in various ways so I could take extended maternity leave, covered a majority of DH's 25% pay cut he had for 3 yrs. during the CA budget crunch (he had 36 furlough days a year) and so we were able to make improvements to the house (new windows, new heater, new window AC units) as needed.

    We also don't do crazy stuff like buy expensive cars, take expensive trips, buy expensive clothes, we chose a reasonable summer camp this year, and had it not been for work trip to San Diego DH had and my parents paying for myself and the girls to come and visit them we would have gone no where this summer.

    Vludmilla, we make $160k combined gross so I am not making what my DH makes, if we were making equal salary that would be awesome. Yeah maybe I am in denial a bit about what we spend, but it doesn't really add up to anything really nice, it is just normal everyday stuff for us. We commute a lot too and have no public transportation options to get to work so we commute each about 12k miles a year, and our gas bill is probably high too, maybe $400 a month, and hence why we have a car payment (we were putting a ton of miles on our Pilot vs. our much smaller 01 Corolla because that was no longer comfy for two tall adults and two growing kids to go pretty much anywhere than church in).

    We did not invest the 10k and we didn't take a vacation. We used it to pay property taxes, the income taxes we owed in 2013, a portion of DD1's summer camp, and yeah it really sucks that we didn't invest it and don't have 14k or so, but even if we invested it instead of using where we needed it instead of racking up credit card debt we wouldn't have been able to reach it without taking out a penalty so it would have become un reachable income too and we'd still be in the same spot as we are now.
    Last edited by AnnieW625; 09-18-2014 at 06:40 PM.
    Annie
    WOHM to two wonderful little girls born in April
    DD E, 17
    DD L, 13,
    baby 2, 4-2009 (our Tri-18 baby)

  10. #10
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    This may be obvious, and easier said than done, but I think you need to look for a higher paying job. For someone who's worked at the same job for what, a decade, you don't have a very high salary. I think you should look outside of the public sector. Maybe you have to get a different degree, but it will pay off soon.

    In answer to the original question, no. We aren't flush, but we have some savings, retirement, and 529s
    Mommy to my wonderful, HEALTHY twin girls
    6/08 - Preemies no more!

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