Need some parenting books and resources

[maestramommy]

Dh and I are seriously at a loss as to how to deal with Dora. Her tantrums are increasing in number. It's as if she can no longer handle any limits. Any no's or "yes you have to" upsets her, and she starts out whining, complaining, escalating, and if we don't figure out a way to snap her out of it, it becomes a full blown meltdown. Being with her is (it saddens me to say) become rather joyless. In addition she is resisting parts of the daily routine that only a couple of weeks ago were nothing. Like brushing her teeth before bed. The last couple of nights were a wrestling match, and tonight the only way to get her to cooperate was to say, "okay, you're just going to bed then." Meaning I was going to put her pjs on, and she wouldn't get reading time. That snapped her out of it pretty quickly, but she complained the entire time.

We just returned last Friday from a weeklong trip to CA, so I can understand if she's still out of sorts, jet-lagged, whatever. And she just started preschool today, 2 hours. The teacher said she did great, but she started going south even before we left, and by the time we got home she was screaming and ranting because I couldn't figure out which CD she wanted to hear in the car

Dh and I decided to read some books that outline developmental stages so we can 1) confirm whether this is normal behavior, and 2) see what we can do about it until it blows over into the next stage. So far I'm getting "What to Expect the Toddler Years" and "1-2-3 Magic" from my local library. Any other suggestions for titles? Also, we have access to some parenting resources from our regional center even though we're not clients. Is there anything I can ask about, from those of you who have availed themselves of such resources? TIA!

[egoldber]

Welcome to 3. Or rather 3.5. That's when we hit the wall with Sarah.

But, she is going through a LOT right now. Starting school/preschool can be a very, very hard transition for some kids. If I remember correctly, she's a bit of an introvert/observer? In which case, the energy and dynamic of preschool is probably very, very emotionally draining to her. It uses all her resources to hold it together at school and then she comes home and just explodes. Very normal. Tough, but normal. And then plus adjusting from a cross country trip over the holidays....well that's just a lot.

I would give it a few weeks to see if it gets better. In the meantime, consistency and routine are key. Make sure she eats a good brekafast with plenty of protein. And a quick snack (even giving it to her as you pick her up in the classroom and while walking to the car) immediately after preschool helped Sarah immensely.

[brittone2]

I know tantruming is annoying (DD is more into tantrums than DS was, at least so far). Is she still having some issues w/ her verbal skills? Increased tantruming is pretty common if she has any sort of expressive delay persisting.

I'm also of the mindset that you can't do much to control a tantrum. (I try to tell myself happy isn't the only acceptable emotion. Note, I say try )

Have you considered teaching her some self help/self regulating skills? Gentlechristianmothers has some good info on the comfort corner, teaching things like deep breathing, etc. Basically these are life long skills, and I think many of us (myself included!!) wish we had more coping mechanisms to deal w/ stress. There are also tips for getting kids to get their frustrations out in other ways (subbing stamping your feet for hitting, or learning to do an "angry dance" or draw a picture about your anger.). Some kids need the physical release that a tantrum gives them, which is why the "angry dance" and ideas like that can work...it gives an outlet to those boiling up feelings.

My favorite books:
Playful Parenting. Totally worth buying IMO. This is probably one of my all time favorites and you can apply the techniques across many different ages. It feels so awesome when we are able to make strides using *fun* techniques, kwim? And honestly, it often works sooooo well

Kurcinka's books (Kids, Parents and Power Struggles (excellent!) as well as Raising your Spirited Child)

Positive Discipline (Nelsen)

Easy to Love, Difficult to Discipline (Bailey)

Kids are Worth It (Coloroso)

Parent Effectiveness Training (Gordon) and P.E.T. in Action (oldies but goodies! )

Ames and Ilig's series (Your One Year Old, YOur Two Year Old, on up). These I don't like the discipline tips when given so much overall (these are relatively older books), but for a snapshot of typical development and reassurance that my children are not indeed monsters and are in fact doing the very things developmentally that other kids their age are/have been doing for years is oddly reassuring .

Faber and Mazlish's books (all of them ) How to Talk so Kids will Listen and How to Listen so Kids will Talk is awesome and applies into the teen years and even into adult/adult relationships (like dealing w/ DHs )

My favorite free resource is www.gentlechristianmothers.com Their Gentle Discipline board is a treasure of great resources and tips IME. I don't consider myself a conservative Christian, but that site has helped me sooooo much through the years, I can't even express it. Truly. Everything from "bean dip" to the 5 steps, to the comfort corner, to happy is not the only acceptable emotion, to "don't ride the wave of *their* emotions"...that site has truly, truly helped our family.

[Twoboos]

I have no immediate advice, but my DD2 is a couple months older than Dora. 3 has been a nightmare. CONSTANT tantrums, HER giving US choices ("The only things I want to eat are ice cream or cookies, you pick one."), whining, complaining, etc. It's so bad that DD1 will plan things around it - "When DD2's done crying, can we go outside?"

You might not want to listen to me too much, since I don't know if we've done a stellar job with handling it. But we always reiterate that 1) the tantrums will not get what she wants, 2) she can have the tantrum/complaining/whining but has to go into her room or another room so as not to bother others, and 3) stop discussing w/her when she's in that mode, since there's no talking her out of it anyways!!

I also agree w/beth about the snack. DD2 is ALWAYS hungry and will melt down w/o timely food.

There is no way I should be writing the following but... it's getting better? only a little slight bit. maybe. Oh, how I hope I haven't jinxed myself.

Good luck. It's a very frustrating time!!

[brittone2]

Originally Posted by egoldber

Welcome to 3. Or rather 3.5. That's when we hit the wall with Sarah.

But, she is going through a LOT right now. Starting school/preschool can be a very, very hard transition for some kids. If I remember correctly, she's a bit of an introvert/observer? In which case, the energy and dynamic of preschool is probably very, very emotionally draining to her. It uses all her resources to hold it together at school and then she comes home and just explodes. Very normal. Tough, but normal. And then plus adjusting from a cross country trip over the holidays....well that's just a lot.

I would give it a few weeks to see if it gets better. In the meantime, consistency and routine are key. Make sure she eats a good brekafast with plenty of protein. And a quick snack (even giving it to her as you pick her up in the classroom and while walking to the car) immediately after preschool helped Sarah immensely.

To all of the above. So, so true. They often save it up all day and then explode on their parents, unfortunately. They let go because they feel safe doing so with the parent. As an introvert, I find I get totally tired and exhausted when I'm around a lot of people. I can only imagine what it is like for kids with that type of personality. I like people, but it doesn't recharge me like it does for an extrovert

[bubbaray]

Welcome to 3 (and 4 in our case). Both are waaaay worse than 2 IMO. I like to say that 4 is the Terrible Twos with a better vocabulary.

We find we have to be consistent and use consequences/logic. I think every kid is different and has different things that work, KWIM?

I'm told (by the wise moms here) that 5 is better. I'm holding them to it because there are days when I think I might seriously lose my mind. Now that DD#2 is soon to turn two, I'd like to implant that twisty straw directly into a vein. J/K. Kinda.

[brittone2]

Originally Posted by bubbaray

Welcome to 3 (and 4 in our case). Both are waaaay worse than 2 IMO. I like to say that 4 is the Terrible Twos with a better vocabulary.

We find we have to be consistent and use consequences/logic. I think every kid is different and has different things that work, KWIM?

I'm told (by the wise moms here) that 5 is better. I'm holding them to it because there are days when I think I might seriously lose my mind. Now that DD#2 is soon to turn two, I'd like to implant that twisty straw directly into a vein. J/K. Kinda.

For DS, like a week before he turned 3, there was a noticeable change in behavior. 3 was waaaaaaaay harder for us than 2. But DS's 2 was kind of mild. I suspect DD's version of 2 will be more challenging 4 hasn't been a picnic either. He's almost 5. Things seem to be easing up maybe a wee bit.

[maestramommy]

Omigosh, I'm so glad I posted. I've been so frustrated and drained by her lately, and the pregnancy and *&%#@ itching are not helping!

Yes, Dora is still introverted/observer. When I arrived to pick her up it was still a few minutes early, so I peeked in. They were doing music time, which seemed consist of listening to a song and doing movement. Dora, to my utter non-surprise, was doing none of the specific movements, and was standing off to the side, shifting from one foot another while holding a toy. If I had been there, she would've buried her head between my knees until it was over

The class is only 2 hours, but they seem to have a lot of activities listed. Assuming they get through most of them, there are a lot of transitions, something Dora isn't used to. Unless it's mealtime or naptime she basically has free play all day at home.

Brittone, to answer your question, Dora is diagnostically caught up in speech, but it's obvious to me that her expressive abilities are still far behind her peers. A lot of her conversation with us consists of scripts she's lifted from Dora the explorer, Blues Clues, or books she's read (where's the bag over the head smiley?). She does have spontaneous conversation, but it's not that often. So when she gets upset the only thing she can say is, "No ____!"

Twoboos, we do try to ignore her during the tantrum, but most of the time it just goes on and on. Picking her up and holding her seems to be the fastest and most permanent way of stopping it, something I've discovered only recently. Also, we're having trouble with the time out because traditionally it's always been in her crib, and now she's able to climb out and stand outside her door to continue on. Basically she hates being isolated, but doing it no longer calms her down like it used to.

I've looked at the Gentle Christian Mothers site before, but I'm a little confused. Do you have to join the forum? Or do you just start clicking on titles? I did that a few times, but it was over a year ago when Dora's issues were different

[brittone2]

Originally Posted by maestramommy

Omigosh, I'm so glad I posted. I've been so frustrated and drained by her lately, and the pregnancy and *&%#@ itching are not helping!

Yes, Dora is still introverted/observer. When I arrived to pick her up it was still a few minutes early, so I peeked in. They were doing music time, which seemed consist of listening to a song and doing movement. Dora, to my utter non-surprise, was doing none of the specific movements, and was standing off to the side, shifting from one foot another while holding a toy. If I had been there, she would've buried her head between my knees until it was over

The class is only 2 hours, but they seem to have a lot of activities listed. Assuming they get through most of them, there are a lot of transitions, something Dora isn't used to. Unless it's mealtime or naptime she basically has free play all day at home.

Brittone, to answer your question, Dora is diagnostically caught up in speech, but it's obvious to me that her expressive abilities are still far behind her peers. A lot of her conversation with us consists of scripts she's lifted from Dora the explorer, Blues Clues, or books she's read (where's the bag over the head smiley?). She does have spontaneous conversation, but it's not that often. So when she gets upset the only thing she can say is, "No ____!"

Twoboos, we do try to ignore her during the tantrum, but most of the time it just goes on and on. Picking her up and holding her seems to be the fastest and most permanent way of stopping it, something I've discovered only recently. Also, we're having trouble with the time out because traditionally it's always been in her crib, and now she's able to climb out and stand outside her door to continue on. Basically she hates being isolated, but doing it no longer calms her down like it used to.

I've looked at the Gentle Christian Mothers site before, but I'm a little confused. Do you have to join the forum? Or do you just start clicking on titles? I did that a few times, but it was over a year ago when Dora's issues were different

GCM has some forums you have to join to read, but the Gentle Discipline board is open to the public...you don't need to join or register. What rocks is that it is a free site and it really incorporates a lot of different ideas. I truly think it helped my family *so* much.

The expressive thing is a good point and I was thinking about it a bit before you responded. Even if a child is "caught up" it doesn't mean that they have a huge variety of speech easily accessible to them when their are caught up in big feelings, kwim? I am sure it is tremendously frustrating, but I'd bet that you get some extra tantrum behavior, etc. due to her frustration with maybe not having the right words ready and accessible, especially when she's already frustrated/tired/upset/angry, kwim?


eta: if she responds well to being comforted by you with the tantruming, I wonder if she'd do well with a comfort corner. It is basically a non-isolated, non punitive time out. On GCM they often say to think of it as the child version of an adult coffee break...a chance to regroup, get your emotions back under control, do something you like (read a book, etc.). I know it is hard to go with them to the comfort corner, but if you do it consistently, over time they'll often start going on their own. The other thought with that is that ideally you work toward getting them to the comfort corner before they start to spiral totally out of control. Use it proactively to try to get them to self-regulate/self modulate their emotions...a pretty useful life skill.

[o_mom]

We have been going through it here as well. It's three. The only thing keeping us sane is that we have been through it and the other side was a bit better.

I think for us, it has been a communication issue. This little person who can say some pretty sophisticated things just loses all that skill the second things go south. We spend a lot of time saying "I can't understand when you are screaming like that" and "use your words". It's like a tape loop of The Exorcist though until he gets it out and can calm down. Sometimes 'legitimate' stuff (brother hit, etc.) sometimes not so much (plate is the wrong color, dog licked his foot).

It also is a control thing. They get an idea and when it doesn't happen, for whatever reason, they can't be detered from trying to do it or focus on anything except the loss.

Beth has some great book recommendations!