Q? Do you plan to give the H1N1 Vax when it comes on the market?

[ha98ed14]

I have been thinking about this for weeks. When they come out with the vaccine, am I going to give it to DD? The testing will not be as thorough as other vaccines, including the regular seasonal flu, but apparently it is being mfg'd very much the way the seasonal flu vax is, so that is supposed to comfort people. But apparently in the 70s, there was a vax developed for an anticipated pandemic and it left some people really disabled. (I'm not exactly sure how; I heard it on NPR, and I'm too scared to look!)

I selectively vax'd, so I am not opposed to vaccines. I just worry about giving one that we don't know the history on because we have not had time to test it, but at the same time, this disease can be deadly. But so can regular flu and I did not give that last year. But I am particularly worried because this is the first year DD is in group daycare.

Anyway, my thoughts are muddled in the issue. What are yours?

[bubbaray]

I did a poll on this a while back: http://www.windsorpeak.com/vbulletin...highlight=h1n1

I have since done some more research. The issue for me is adjuvants. The WHO has asked all countries and manufacturers to use "vaccine sparing methods" because the yields are so low, 1/10th that of seasonal flu vax's.

The Canadian gov't has flat-out admitted that it will be using adjuvants and GlaxoSmithKline's H1N1 vax uses its proprietary AS03 adjuvant. Novartis has a similar proprietary adjuvant as do all the other H1N1 vax manufacturers.

Apparently, the US FDA and CDC have not said whether they will or will not use adjuvants, but the "word" on the street is that they will pretty much have to because that is the vax that the manufacturers are producing, KWIM? Plus, the yields are so low, that is the only way to vax enough people to make a campaign feasible.

Adjuvants are typically used in vax's. Aluminum is one example. The role of an adjuvant is, AFAIK, to stimulate the immune system to give a more robust response and produce more antibodies. I understand that and am, in general terms, OK with the use of adjuvants as a proven methodology in vaccinations.

However, I am extremely concerned about the proprietary adjuvants that will be used with this particular vaccine. The GSK and Novartis adjuvants contain squalene. They have NOT been tested in children or adults under age 65. They have only been used in Europe (for a long time) in adults over age 65. Squalene was implicated in Gulf War Syndrome from anthrax vax's given to soldiers in the 1st GW.

The other issue for me is that squalene is typically derived from sharks livers. My DD#2 is anaphylactic to finned fish. Is she anaphylactic to shark? No one knows. I have calls into GSK and our public health nurse (nurse specialist who deals with my children b/c of her knowledge of allergies and vax's). The nurse called me back and left a message that my query has been escalated to our CDC -- will this vax be contraindicated for people who have fish allergy b/c of the use of squalene adjuvant? There ARE other sources (plant) of squalene, but sharks livers is the most common.

Bottom line, at this point, my DD#2 will NOT get the H1N1 vax. She IS now cleared to have the seasonal flu vax for the first time (she previously had a greater egg allergy than she has now -- she has specifically been cleared to have the flu vax this year). She will get the seasonal flu vax.

I'm not sure what I will do for DD#1 and myself. We both have asthma and DD#1 is probably at the greatest risk in our family for complications from the H1N1 flu. I'm really torn on this. I've seen her in the ER struggling to breathe in June. The docs and nurses there were really scrambling to stabilize her and it was really REALLY scary. I can't imagine a worse scenario (that was only from seasonal pollen allergies) where she has fever and other physical symptoms.

All of us will get the seasonal flu vax. I'm actually hoping that what I have now and the girls have just come down with is the H1N1 in its mild form. Sore throat, fever, cough, runny nose, aches, etc. We have pretty much all the symptoms.

[ha98ed14]

Thanks Melissa! My own tutorial. I have no clue what half those words mean, but at least I know what to look up!

[mecawa]

My girls will def. get the seasonal flu shot, and DD#2 will def. get the H1N1 vax, if available. DH will also get both seasonal and H1N1. DH has two severe underlying health problems, and the thought of him getting H1N1 scares me. It would not be good. DD#1 is extrememly healthy, I would actually consider her not even getting the seasonal one at all. DD#2 had a really rough year medically (10 weeks hospitalized, surgery,etc.) so she will be getting both, as it has been advised to me by her docs. I won't get one as long as (I won't qualify for either first of all) DD#2 and DH have them.

[tnrnchick74]

I too am torn. I think right now, having done more research, *I* am going to get the H1N1 vax because I have asthma and am a health care worker. Yeah, I work with babies, but we have had 3 Mom's with H1N1 who delivered recently.

As far as DS - I do not think I'm going to give him the H1N1 vax. I will be protected and won't be bringing it home. DS has milk allergies, but hasn't been exposed to eggs yet (besides cooked in bread,etc) and he didn't get a flu vax last year due to recurrent ear infections, colds.

If the H1N1 vax was exactly the same formulation (adjuncts, methadology, etc) as the seasonal flu, then I might consider it - but there are too many things that are different and the CDC is planning on releasing it before all trials are completed. That scares me a little.

[DebbieJ]

No way in you-know-where we'll be doing that shot. We don't do the regular flu shot either.

[bubbaray]

Originally Posted by tnrnchick74

As far as DS - I do not think I'm going to give him the H1N1 vax. I will be protected and won't be bringing it home. DS has milk allergies, but hasn't been exposed to eggs yet (besides cooked in bread,etc) and he didn't get a flu vax last year due to recurrent ear infections, colds.

You might want to ask your DS' allergist about this. My girls' allergist says that as long as a child can tolerate hidden egg (in baking, etc), they are fine to have the flu shot (seasonal/H1N1) as the amount of albumin is very small.

As far as the "creation" of the H1N1 vax, it is being made in the same way as seasonal flu vax -- cultured in eggs. IIRC, it is actually a dual vax that is partially made from the SARS vax from the last pandemic (2005?). The adjunct issue is as set out in my post above. If I was in the US, I'd be more than a little perturbed that the FDA doesn't seem to want to disclose the adjuvant issue "transparently", possibly b/c of the squalene/Gulf War Syndrome possible link. I dunno. I highly doubt ANY country will be able to access non-adjuvant H1N1 vax b/c there are only a limited number of co's making the stuff and they are all being reported here to be fully intending on using their proprietary adjuvant -- and the yields are low for all the companies too. Its kinda like a mass-trial. If I was a pharma co, I'd be pretty happy -- I get a free human trial. On the whole planet, all age groups, etc..

[scrooks]

I've been thinking about this as well and I don't know what I will do. DD has had all her vacs and gets an annual flu shot so she will get that for sure. DS will be born in Sept. He will be too small to get either flu shot (DD was a July baby and got her first flu shot when she was 6 months old). I don't want DD to bring H1N1 home but I don't want her to be exposed to a potentially dangerous vaccine either. Since DS will be small we probably won't be leaving the house much this winter so I am thinking the risk will be lower for us....I don't know if this is good logic.

[SnuggleBuggles]

Melissa, that was great information- thank you!

I do not plan to get the vaccine for anyone in the family b/c of the newness of it...and what Melissa said.

Beth

[1964pandora]

I believe that we had the swine flu a couple of weeks ago. It was widespread in Virginia and supposedly it was the only thing that was in major circulation. I have a 4 year old and a 3 year old. They felt really awful for about 36 hours. My husband and I had flu symptoms for about the same period of time. Basically, we were all just completely exhausted with fevers. It was really nothing for us compared to what I thought it would be and I'm glad that we got it.

P.S. Oh, my 3 year old threw up several times, but that is supposedly the way it can affect the very young.