Cocktail set for a 3 year old?!? Just plain wrong IMO

[jennifer_r]

I am all for having a drink or two (for adults ofcourse) but to encourage that at 3 years old is just weird and wrong. I'm surprised this playset ever came to be produced:

http://www.moolka.com/jzv/prod/1753/Erzi/Toys/Kitchen_Play/cookware/Cocktail-Party-set


Jennifer

Mom to:
Christopher 12/29/89
Adelaide 8/23/04
Bronwyn 11/9/05

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_garnet_6m.gif[/img][/url]

[newmomto3kids]

That is slightly disturbing. Hmmm....

[elliput]

Keep in mind that Erzi is a European toy manufacturer. Europeans have a very different attitude about social drinking.

Personally, I think it is cute. And kids will always copy what they see. Did you read the post in the Lounge a week ago by Kristen (kboyle) about her son pretending the PBK play juice was *beer*? It doesn't take much of a stretch for a young mind.

[Ceepa]

The first thing that came to mind ... it's European, as pp said.

[newmomto3kids]

ITA, kids will copy what they see us do. And it doesn't really bother me in the context of kid's pretend play that they have conceived (like juice being called beer). What bothers me somewhat is channeling their pretend play towards coctails at such a young age.
JMO

[sdbc]

I don't have a problem with it. Then again, I don't have a problem with adults partaking in responsible social drinking. My 2 year old daughter has a baby doll, but I certainly don't want her to go out and get pregnant and have a baby any time soon!! She's just mimicking adults. I would view this set in the same way. Not planning on buying it, but still...

Sue, mommy to Aurora (Rory) born 5/13/04

[Jenn98]

Just to play devil's advocate: What if this is approached as in "What a great way to teach the little ones about responsible social drinking?" Talk about a teaching moment!!!

Or thought #2: Maybe they're virgin drinks? :)

I do think it's cute, too, but I'm not sure I'd buy it.

[miki]

I think it's cute. You don't need to label them cocktails. I make interesting fruity drinks for my DD -- fruit juice and sparkling water mixes, smoothies. It's fun to have a funny drink in a funny cup.

[holliam]

That's exactly what I thought. My daughter thinks it's the most exciting thing in the world if she gets a cherry with her water. LOL She would LOVE a set like this, and she has no clue that they're supposed to be alcoholic.

I got her a pretend soda (or dark beer ;)) set from Land of Nod. Not because I let her drink either but because she sees Daddy doing it, and I know she will get a kick out of it.

Holli

[Tondi G]

YUP... I thought about how I loved getting shirley temples or virgin pina coladas when I went out to nice dinners with my parents! I always felt like part of the crowd if my parents were having a drink or a glass of wine with dinner!

I think it's kinda cute! Our friends kids call sparkling apple cider kids wine... I bet they would love little wine glasses for it!

Kids do as they see!

~ Tondi

[madelinesmom]

Another shot at Devil's Advocate, what if it were a pack of cigarettes???

Jane
Madeline's Mom
1/20/03

[Jenn98]

To me that's a little different, because what you might put in a fancy drink glass varies quite a bit. But what you put in a cigarette wrapper is always the same and is always toxic to whoever uses it. (I know you can make the arguement that any amount of drinking is also toxic, but for the sake of arguement I'm assuming we are talking about moderate, social drinkers.)

I guess I'm in the camp that says, not all drinks in those kinds of glasses are alcoholic drinks. We make smoothies several times a week here with nothing but fruit and sometimes yogurt and we always drink them in odd glasses - just makes it more fun. I was just thinking the other day that soon DD will be old enough to really enjoy the fun of opening the fridge and picking out fruit to toss in the blender.

The first thing I thought of when I read your Devil's Advocate is that after the martinin glasses and cigarettes we should expect boxes of condoms? hee hee :) Somehow this sounds like a Saturday Night Live skit waiting to happen.

[holliam]

Yea, I don't see how the two are remotely the same, actually. We too drink smoothies here and really it's just a fun fruit drink. It's not like it comes with a pretend play gin bottle. ;) It's really hard to pretend that cigarettes are anything other than toxic.

Holli

[Joolsplus2]

Cute...but weird...
I had a little tiny wine glass I got to use on special ocassions when I was little (with wine, no less!).
I don't mind so much when my kids pick up a banana and it becomes a gun, or a pencil that becomes a cigarette, or use one of our little wine glasses with wine, either, but I'm not going to spend any money acually buying toy guns or candy cigarettes (remember those? I remember them being really stale gum with a lot of talc on them...yick!) or toy martini glasses.
Though, they look fruity enough to be 'toy smoothies' anyway!

:)
Julie CPS Tech and mom to 3 in seats
http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/RFAlbum/SarahMA.aspx

[daisyandacorn]

To each their own (obviously) but I'm not into it at all.
I'd just never buy it, I'd put it in the same pile as the McDonalds play food you can get at TRU-I'm sure that it's appealing to most kids but not something we'd have at home.
Susan

[madelinesmom]

I love the idea of toy condoms... maybe they could be gum... really awesome bubble gum that help its shape...Hee Hee..I really can't believe Saturday Night Live hasn't picked up on these toys yet...


Jane
Madeline's Mom
1/20/03

[boys2enough]

It's funny you mentioned the McD playfood. They also have a set of McD play set complete with headsets (for taking drive-thru orders). DH and I always look at it and say, "Boy, I really want my kids to aspire to THAT!" LOL


>To each their own (obviously) but I'm not into it at all.
>I'd just never buy it, I'd put it in the same pile as the
>McDonalds play food you can get at TRU-I'm sure that it's
>appealing to most kids but not something we'd have at home.
>Susan


Cheers, Lin
Mom to 2 wild boys
D 3/98
G 11/02

http://smilies.vidahost.com/kao/chika/chirol_buha.gif

I am celebrating: just passed my "1000 posts" mark. Yipee!

[holliam]

LOL.. see, I'd never buy McDonald's play food. All hail fruity drinks! ;)

[MarisaSF]

Cute!
This morning, Jazzy gave me a cup of "hot coffee" in a plastic easter egg filled with pool water. I asked what she was drinking and it was "Jamba Juice." Next time I will ask for a margarita since apparently that's what kids are *supposed* to be making with their toys. ;)

[MarisaSF]

In my world, you can't start the responsible sex talk too young. In fact, the cocktails should come packaged with the condoms. :P

[sdbc]

LOL!!!

Sue, mommy to Aurora (Rory) born 5/13/04

[sdbc]

I guess I don't see it the same way because in my opinion, drinking in moderation isn't unhealthy. I guess smoking in moderation *potentially* might not be unhealthy (like one cigarette a week), but most smokers smoke much more than that. Therefore, I see the cigarettes as a more unhealthy habit. Two other thoughts:
1. I would NOT be OK with a toddler beer-bong, which are used pretty much only exclusively in binge drinking.
2. While I'm not OK with toy cigarettes, we had cigarette chewing gum when I was a kid and we LOVED it. Neither I nor any of my siblings actually smoke now.
Sue, mommy to Aurora (Rory) born 5/13/04

[mimieliza]

Honestly, that's stretching it a bit far. Healthy adults can enjoy an alcoholic beverage a couple of times a week with no ill effects. It's not unhealthy and it's not wrong for adults to do so. However, it is VERY unhealthy to smoke, and the vast majority who do so do not limit it to a "safe" amount.

I hope my child grows up to enjoy and appreciate alcoholic beverages in a safe and healthy way. I do not think there is a safe and healthy way to smoke.

[mimieliza]

"toddler beer-bong"

LOL! yes, that would definitely be NOT OKAY. :)

[1964pandora]

Jennifer, I have to say that I'm with you on this one and I'm really surprised that other people are having tamer reactions to the toy. I assume that people are just trying to be light hearted about it. To me, it's definitely "weird and wrong." Parents worry about their children trying drugs, but alcohol can cause just as many problems for kids/young adults. The problem that I have with the toy is that IT COULD MAKE IT DIFFICULT FOR CHILDREN TO UNDERSTAND THAT ALCOHOL CAN BE DANGEROUS!

Susan

Mom to

Francis Xavier "Frank" 9/29/04
John Patrick 5/3/06

[Joolsplus2]

I got my ds his first happy meal toddler toy when he was 1-ish, and it wasn't the cute little FP toys they have now: It was plastic chicken mcnuggets! I was so embarrassed to have that 'badge' of feeding my baby junk food. Now I wish they'd give them out again, as it was one of my dd's favorite kitchen items and I'd rather get them free than have to buy a set at the store.

:)
Julie CPS Tech and mom to 3 in seats
http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/RFAlbum/SarahMA.aspx

[jennifer_r]

Thanks for your opinion - I was starting to think I was being really close minded or uptight. I understand that it's a European country but I guess it's still being sold by a US company so I'm wondering why Moolka decided to sell it. If it was being marketed as a "smoothie" set, than that would be fine but it says "Cocktail-Party set" and lists the glasses as "martini" - clearly alcohol. Ofcourse, it's one thing for a child to pretend that they are drinking alcohol from a regular glass if they come up with that idea on their own. I'm sure I did that when I was a kid. What I don't like is that alcohol drinking at a young age is being encouraged by this product.

BTW, I am for socially responsible alcohol drinking and when I am not pregnant or nursing (and then I do indulge occasionally), I will have a couple drinks.


Jennifer

Mom to:
Christopher 12/29/89
Adelaide 8/23/04
Bronwyn 11/9/05

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_garnet_6m.gif[/img][/url]

[daisyandacorn]

I don't think that you're being uptight at all. I hope that you don't feel bad about your original post.
I can't really see anyone coming down on their kid for pretending to drink alcohol or pretending to do much of anything at all (unless its really crazy-like pretending to kill their dog or something).
It was pretty obvious that your issue was with the Cocktail Party Play Set and not with the imaginations of toddlers.
We drink sometimes too, my family is from Europe, my children play freely and I think the set looks pretty sad too.
Susan

[madelinesmom]

To the 3 pp I am the cigarette devil's advocate poster and I was pretty surprised how I got spanked. I thought it was a reasonable question. I come from a family with a tendency toward addiction, all kinds of addiction, drinking, smoking, gambling, etc. IMO an addiction is an addiction, and drinking isn't really that far from smoking, so in the same thinking toy cigarettes and toy poker chips aren't that far from a toy drinking set.

Thanks for the reassurance that I'm not crazy...

Jane
Madeline and Emily's Mom
1/20/03 11/29/05

[sdbc]

I didn't mean to "spank" you. I'm sorry if you felt that way. I was just voicing my opinion that I don't think it's the same, and I think others were doing the same. You said were were playing devil's advocate--that invites people to express their opposing positions. I don't think anyone meant to offend you. Honestly, I wouldn't buy either for my daughter, but the martini set just didn't disturb me (and my father was an alcoholic).

Sue, mommy to Aurora (Rory) born 5/13/04

[holliam]

But by playing devil's advocate didn't that mean you wanted to hear our opinions?

This whole thread confuses me. I guess the OP was looking for support not alternative opinions? I don't recall any of the dissenters implying that people were crazy.

Holli

[madelinesmom]

WAIT WAIT WAIT...

I wasn't offended, my feelings were not hurt, and I know you don't think I am crazy... I guess I need to choose my words a little more carefully... Sometimes I just type what I am thinking and don't proofread... Sorry... The reason why I posted a devil's advocate is because my husband thought they were ok and I said they were like cigarettes and he said I was nuts... I basically wanted to know what others thought. Nothing more.

Really I am not into making waves and I really never posted much before I got the darn laptop and wireless internet and now cruise the internet way too much... etc. etc. etc.

By the way I still think the whole condom thing was funny and my neighbor added that they could make a toy roach clip and all of my friends had a good laugh at that.

Jane
Madeline and Emily's Mom
1/20/03 11/29/05

[sdbc]

Sorry for the misunderstanding. All is good. :)
Sue, mommy to Aurora (Rory) born 5/13/04

[lisams]

I wouldn't spend my own money to get it, but... when we go to my parents, my mom has a plastic wine glass for DD and they serve her sparkling apple cider with dinner and she thinks it is the most special thing in the world! She knows the real stuff is for grown ups only. I remember getting Shirley Temples (sp?) when I was a little girl. Funny thing is I don't drink at all, just not my thing.

I could understand how this could be seen as an odd toy for a young child.

[holliam]

Ditto that!

Let's all kick back with a few wooden margaritas! ;)

[jennifer_r]

I wasn't necessarily looking for support or alternative opinions when I posted this and I never felt anyone was calling me "crazy". However, I was very surprised that I was in the minority on this board.


Jennifer

Mom to:
Christopher 12/29/89
Adelaide 8/23/04
Bronwyn 11/9/05

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_garnet_6m.gif[/img][/url]

[mamicka]

I don't think I'd spend my money on it, but I actually think it's adorable. But there isn't any addiction in my family, so maybe I'm just clueless. I must admit that I'd probably buy this if I say it on clearance somewhere. {{sheepish grin}}

Allison

[mimieliza]

I just had a different opinion than you. I certainly wouldn't think twice if a family decided NOT to allow this toy in their home. I don't plan to allow my kids to play with toy guns, but plenty of other people have no problem with it. It's okay - we each have to decide what we're comfortable with for our kids. I would be fine with this playset.

[boys2enough]

Julie,

I know you know (gosh, what a silly way to start one's sentence! LOL) that I didn't mean to criticize parents who purchase the McD playsets. Kids tend to be fascinated by professions/jobs that they can actually see what people do. "Working in an office" is probably not that easy to imagine. LOL.

If I ever come across any plastic chicken mcnuggets I would send them your way! :)


Cheers, Lin
Mom to 2 wild boys
D 3/98
G 11/02

http://smilies.vidahost.com/kao/chika/chirol_buha.gif

I am celebrating: just passed my "1000 posts" mark. Yipee!

[holliam]

LOL, my daughter plays "work" all the time. I'm a full-time high-tech telecommuter so she thinks "work" consists of putting on a headset for meetings and typing at the computer a lot to write books and check email.

Several times a day she says she has to "work"... so sadly she does know what working in an office is like... *sigh* ;)

Holli

[1964pandora]

Hmmm... I'm sorry, but that comment is the straw that breaks this camel's back. I can't for the life of me understand why people keep chiming in to defend this toy-- calling it "adorable" no less!! You don't need to have addiction in your family to understand why this toy is a very, very bad idea. The research has been done, and this site lays the arguments against toys like this out better than I can. It's really not cute (the "sheepish grin" thing) to keep acting like this is a sweet and innocent toy. It's not.

http://www.medialiteracy.net/purchase/toys4.shtml

Susan

[holliam]

It's only alcoholic because it is labeled as such. My daughter has never seen us drink alcohol from martini glasses. She has absolutely no idea. She has only seen smoothies in "fun" glasses.

I am sorry to say that I think things like commercialism and character-based products are far more influential in children's lives than a pretend drink set that is only alcholic in adult's minds.

Holli

[jennifer_r]

Like I said in a previous post, if it was marketed as a "smoothie" set, than I would not have given it a second thought. But, it's marketed as a "cocktail" set with "martini" glasses. I do have an issue with that (obviously :) ).

I am not a big fan at all of commercialism and character-based products. We have VERY FEW toys, books, DVDs etc. that would fall into that category and those we do have have been gifts. While they're not exactly my taste, I would and do let my DDs play, read, etc. with most of those gifts. However, if someone gave us a "cocktail" set for our DD, I would probably shelve it and wonder about about the people who gave us the gift. Big difference between a play cocktail set and Winnie the Pooh dinnerware.


Jennifer

Mom to:
Christopher 12/29/89
Adelaide 8/23/04
Bronwyn 11/9/05

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_garnet_6m.gif[/img][/url]

[Jenn98]

I think Holli has a point in that it might be more important in how WE market it to our kids (assuming we were buying it for them and they don't see the ad.) If I gave it to my DD and told her if was for smoothies how is that bad? I can respect those who have opinions that giving it to a child and "marketing" it to him or her as an alcoholic beverage might be bothersome. But, what if it were labeled as a smoothie or Kiddie-cocktail set? Would that change anyone's opinion? And if it does, why not just think of it that way instead of as a martini set like it advertised in the link?

I hope no one is offended by my questions - I'm NOT attacking anyone, just trying to ask an honest question in the is discussion. TIA

[tarabenet]

Candy cigars and candy cigarettes were some of my favorites when I was a kid. But I had the intelligence to know there's a difference between pretend and real. I confess to smoking one freakin' cigarette one night in college. And that is all. Never again! Candy didn't set me up for a life of emphysema. I watched cartoons, too, and I know that if I drop an anvil on someone they aren't going to pop up making accordion noises. Again, I have the sense to know the difference between pretend and real. I had a doctor kit, too, with candy "medicine" and, yes, even a fake syringe -- and yet I have managed not to become a drug addict or user in any form.

More controversial, but my brother and I both played toy guns, and yet I have never ever *ever* aimed an actual gun at a person or mammal (OK, a couple of snakes , yes, but they were water mocs in our front yard and I think protection from that kind of stuff is what weapons are for.)

Even now, I enjoy movies. And I'm a huge Disney fanatic. I read sci-fi. I watch television. And I know that these things are not real.

I think alcoholism is a very serious issue. But I think the causes are a lot deeper and far more involved than the toys a kid plays with. It is more than parental attitudes about fake glassware and pretend drinks. It has a great deal more to do with parental and societal attitudes about how we cope with uncertainty, change, sadness and grief. It is about healthy coping mechanisms as opposed to self-medicating the psychic pain. It is so much more serious than a set of toys.

[annasmom]

Honestly, I think this is a "to each their own" type of issue. I agree with Jennifer, there is something that doesn't sit right with me about this toy.

That being said, I probably would have loved it as a kid, and trust me, I would have pretended that it was alcohol, not a fruit smoothy!! Does this toy *really* *really* bother me, no. But will I ever buy it, no.

I let my dc do things and play with toys that others here (including those who think this toy is just fine!) may disagree with, and there are some things that I do not let my dc do that other moms may think is kind of kooky. Oh well!!

[sdbc]

ITA. Very eloquently stated.

Sue, mommy to Aurora (Rory) born 5/13/04

[mamicka]

I'm sorry that you disagree with me so vehemently, but that's just my opinion. You have a right to yours as well. I happen to think that this is an innocent toy, but I do understand why you don't think it is. Again, you have a right to your opinion.

Allison

[mamicka]

>I think alcoholism is a very serious issue. But I think the
>causes are a lot deeper and far more involved than the toys a
>kid plays with. It is more than parental attitudes about fake
>glassware and pretend drinks. It has a great deal more to do
>with parental and societal attitudes about how we cope with
>uncertainty, change, sadness and grief. It is about healthy
>coping mechanisms as opposed to self-medicating the psychic
>pain. It is so much more serious than a set of toys.

As usual, Benet, very well said.

Allison

[jennifer_r]

I have nothing else to contribute to this "conversation" and it is only upsetting me. I know people think this toy is "cute", can teach responsible social drinking, and it is the labeling of this toy that makes it alcoholic. I've also gathered from other posts that problems with alcohol related problems don't arise from toys - that is obvious. However, by marketing a toy as alcoholic, it encourages parents (maybe not you, but others)to market this set to their children as alcoholic.

Do you think that if a larger company, such as Pottery Barn or Target, sold this set, the rest of the US would think it is "cute"?

I'll be 100% honest with you all - I am shocked that I am in the very small minority on this issue. I am starting to wonder why I can't see things that the rest can see - am I truly backwards on this issue?


Jennifer

Mom to:
Christopher 12/29/89
Adelaide 8/23/04
Bronwyn 11/9/05

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_garnet_6m.gif[/img][/url]

[JElaineB]

I agree with you Jennifer. I would not buy this toy for my son. Sure, I could tell him it was for a smoothies or fruit juice drink set. But it isn't marketed as such, and the glasses, sugar cubes, etc. are meant to imitate alcoholic drinks or the set would not be marketed as such. And I wouldn't want to contribute to a company thinking that a toy based on an alcoholic beverage is a good idea by my purchase. I would much rather have him pretend that he is baking a cake or making an egg.

But I'm uptight, it bothers me when I see parents drinking at restaurants with their kids there, knowing they will be driving them home after drinking, so what do I know?

Jennifer
mom to Jacob 9/27/02

[holliam]

Jennifer, my last response was to Susan who was basically flaming another user. I thought it was completely inappropriate.

You and I were cool several messages ago.

Holli

[daisyandacorn]

Oh, no!!!! I didn't mean to flame anyone.
I just said that I didn't like it and would never buy it but I tried to make it clear that I'm aware that other people often have different boundries/levels of tolerance for certain things and a set of wooden playfood isn't something I'd get my knickers in a bunch over.
I voiced my opinion to help the op know that she wasn't alone in her opinion, and just because I thought it was okay to have a diffreent viewpoint.
I'm truly sorry if someone was "flamed" or had their feelings hurt by me. It wasn't my intention at all. If it was you Holli, I'm sorry.
Susan

[mum1day]

It's European!

I think it's adorable!

[holliam]

No, no, no! Wrong Susan! HUG!!

Holli

[mamicka]

You're definitely not the right Susan, don't feel bad at all. You didn't flame anyone. No worries!

Allison

[1964pandora]

Sorry, Allison-- Holli is right. I shouldn't have said that I didn't think that your sheepish grin comment wasn't cute. I really am sorry that I said that. I know that you were just trying to have a fun conversation. This thread just makes me really angry, so I'll check out too. Susan

[jennifer_r]

First, I never thought anyone was trying to flame me. I was just getting really upset because I feel very strongly one way and most others felt the other way. So, for my sanity, it is just better for me to leave this thread.

Nobody here is going to change anyone's opinions so, if I can use that corny expression, "let's agree to disagree".

I hope that I didn't "flame" anyone or upset anyone. I actually like "heated" debate, as long as it's civil.

Edited to clarify that everyone is welcome to keep this thread going - I am the one who is leaving this thread.

Jennifer

Mom to:
Christopher 12/29/89
Adelaide 8/23/04
Bronwyn 11/9/05

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_garnet_6m.gif[/img][/url]

[Jenn98]

We might disagree on this toy (although I did say I probably wouldn't buy it) I agree that we can agree to disagree. But as long as this conversation stays "heated" I'm gonna grab a bag of marshmellows, some graham crackers and some chocolate. Anyone else want a s'more? ;)

[jennifer_r]

"So, for my sanity, it is just better to leave this thread." should have read "So, for my sanity, it is just better *for me* to leave this thread."

Sorry for the confusion. I promise that this will really be my last post on this topic (after I edit my previous post).

Jennifer

Mom to:
Christopher 12/29/89
Adelaide 8/23/04
Bronwyn 11/9/05

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_garnet_6m.gif[/img][/url]