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View Full Version : **UPDATE** Today's car seat check left me fuming... (long)



DebbieJ
06-03-2005, 04:17 PM
Wow, that was fast! Especially for a Friday afternoon. I called the Park Dist. office to find out who was in charge of the techs today. I spoke to Carol, who was in charge of the event for the park district, and she told me she'd find out who was in charge of the techs and would have them call me. Not five minutes later, I got a call from the Sheriff's office! I couldn't believe it.

The officer I spoke to is in charge of the car seat techs. I described to him what happened (basically read down my post here) and he was profusely apologetic. I told him that I was not personally angry about what happened to me, but I was extremely sad that this man was giving out misinformation to parents all day long and he probably convinced many of them to turn their children FF when in fact RF is safest. He thanked me for calling with my concern and said he would look through the paperwork on Monday to find out which tech it was that I dealt with (because unfortunately, I did not get his name.

Anyway, I feel I did my good deed today. Maybe one day I'll get certified too so I can show these bozos how it's supposed to be done.

----------------------------------
Our park district put on a "Touch a Truck Day" today at a local park. They had fire trucks, dump trucks, tractors, etc, that kids could sit in and climb on. I went with my 18 mo ds and my sister and her 3 yo son.

They were also doing a car seat check. I had noticed that the seatbelt on my MA installation was looking a little loose btwn the lockoff closest to the door and the belt anchor next to the door (if that is the correct term, you know where the belt is anchored in to the frame of the car--that side). I have it installed RF behind the driver's seat. The belt is locked, the lockoff is closed, and the base does not move and I *KNOW* that I have it installed correctly, but I figured they could help me tighten it up a little. And honestly, I wanted to hear what kind of misinformation they would give me. }(

So I drive up and they hand me the paperwork to fill out. I'm sitting in the driver's seat doing that while the tech opens the back door to start checking my ds. He asked how big he was. I said 18 months and 22 pounds. He announces it so all his colleagues can hear and he's kind of laughing as he's doing it. The tech tells me that since he's that big, he can turn the seat around for me. Strike one. I said no thank you, he's fine like that. So he keeps checking the harness, tells me the chest clip is in the right spot. He checks it for tightness and tells me that it could be tighter. It probably could, but it's super snug on his shoulders and because my ds is so tiny, it is a little looser in the lower chest and belly area, which is where the tech was checking. Strike two.

So I pointed out to him that it was tight on his shoulders. He proceeds to tell me that since he was over 20 pounds, I could move the harness up a slot. Doesn't he know it's supposed to be at or below his shoulders? Strike three. I told him it was fine where it was; it isn't falling off his shoulders. Honestly folks, it is *just* below his shoulders. If I moved it up one, it would be WAY above. Not safe!!!

All the while he keeps telling me that he can turn the seat around. That the recommendations used to be 1 yr/20 lbs, but now pediatricians are saying 18 mo/20 lbs. (I should have asked him how a pediatrician knows anything about car seat safety--this isn't a medical issue, folks!) I tried so hard to be polite, I really did. I told him no thank you, I said he's fine, I informed him that my car seat has a RF limit of 33 lbs and my son is only 22. But he wouldn't stop! How many strikes am I at now???!?! LOL!

So I took ds out and he checked the belts and wiggled the base. It didn't move. He said good, your seatbelt is locked, you must have read the manual. Ha ha. I said yes I did, I bet you don't get many people who do.

But he didn't stop there. He told me that kids are more comfortable FF and that parents like it better because they can see their kids and hand them things like bottles and food. I had had enough at this point. I don't see why he didn't leave it alone. I said to him "You are a car seat tech. You have seen the crash test videos and so have I. Why in the world would I want to turn my son around?" He then tried to tell me that in a rear-end collison, the force of the crash would fling my son's head forward. I then told him that he would then rebound and most of the impact would be absorbed by the shell of the seat instead of my son getting whiplash if he were FF. He then mumbled something that sounded like agreement. Strike 200?

He climbed in the back seat to get the information off my seat to finish his paperwork. I then put ds back in. He then "quizzed" me by asking where is the safest spot in the car for the seat. I said, yes, I know, it's the middle. But I care for my nephew a couple of days a week, so I need to put his seat on the other side. Ha ha, sucker, you thought you'd get me on that one, didn't you!

As I was loading back up, one of the tech's colleague walked over and joked that he just couldn't convince me. The tech then kept trying (!!!), pointing to my son's legs and remarked that his feet are already touching the seat and that it's uncomfortable for him. I told him he's just fine, he can see out the window and look at all the trees, dogs, cars, etc. Then he called ANOTHER tech over who took one look and said (in a very snotty tone, I might add) "yeah, look, his legs are already bent, that's no good." Then she asked if I had the manual. I said, "yes, would you like to see it? It's right here." And I pulled it out of it's nifty hidey-hole that Julie showed us. She said no and walked away. :P

My tech finished up and we said our goodbyes. He reminded me that when I do turn ds FF, that I'll have to use the tether. I said he already is tethered. So then the tech hopped back in my car and checked that out, but he had no comment.

He seemed forlorn that he couldn't convince me to move my son forward. I told him that I didn't spend $200 on a car seat to not use it to its limits.

He never did help me tighten it up. I'm sure they talked about me all afternoon. I shudder to think of how many moms and dads they convinced to move their children FF today. In fact, I saw a mom next to us with two small kids--one in a Snugride and one in a Britax seat of some sort and they installed the Britax FF for her. :( Instead of trying to convince me (and others) to turn our kids FF, shouldn't they have been trying to convince us to leave them RF? Who trains these people?!?!?

I am seriously considering calling the Park District and finding out where these techs came from so that I can write their supervisor a letter. It just saddens me that they are out there giving this misinformation and many people are probably taking them at their word.

*sigh*

Edited to add this photo (taken on May 10) so you can all see how comfortable my ds *really* is! Oh yeah, and I like to show him off. :)

http://www.windsorpeak.com/dc/user_files/26741.jpg


~ deb
DS 12/03
And a niece or nephew arriving in early August!

http://www.windsorpeak.com/dc/user_files/10029.gif

http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/candle.gif

Beth568
06-03-2005, 04:21 PM
Sigh. I would have been LIVID. I do think you should write the letter.

Joolsplus2
06-03-2005, 04:22 PM
Wow, he so made up that crap about the AAP 18 months and 20 pounds? Puh-lease! (Ok, it's better than 12 and 20, but it's NOT what the AAP says AT ALL :P)

What a very interesting experience you had, I must say!
Julie CPS Tech and mom to 2 in seats
http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/RFAlbum/SarahMA.aspx

jkpalotay
06-03-2005, 04:42 PM
Deb,
What a cutie! I would have been furious. My 25 months old son is still RF, and despite his feet resting on the seat, (which he loves...), he is still extremely comfortable. He also often falls asleep in it, thanks to the recline with the versa-tether, something much harder to do FF. Keep at it, sister!

Kelli
Mommy to Luke (April 2003)
Hoping for another this year sometime!

MamaParis
06-03-2005, 04:53 PM
WOW!
He was *almost* as bad as a 17 year old BRU employee!! ;)

I would have been upset as well.

I've brought our seats in maybe like 5 times in the beginning (until I was comfortable doing it on my own) - and I was never satisfied with what the tech did.

It was tight and secure .. just not AS secure as I KNOW it can be (because I can get it tighter myself!)



Your DS looks perfectly fine RF!!

My 2 year old is RF and she's 37" with the legs of a tall 4 year old! And shes perfectly content RF! She just crosses her legs!


I'd write a letter or call or something! geez ... what an ordeal!

Joolsplus2
06-03-2005, 05:42 PM
Aw, too cute! He looks comfy, safe...you got it all.

This guy today would have had a coronary to see MY kid in the same seat at age three, lol.
Julie CPS Tech and mom to 2 in seats
http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/RFAlbum/SarahMA.aspx

kijip
06-03-2005, 07:06 PM
Quite a few of the Techs in my class were officers there at the order of their lieutenant. And when we went to do our class car seat check event, sure enough they were STILL thinking more than 20 pounds and 1 year equals FF. The one I was working with was surprized when I told him we could/should leave a 13 month old in a Cosco AO RF. This was after taking the exam and passing.....

Joolsplus2
06-03-2005, 07:24 PM
Hey, glad you did something and got a good response :)

We struggle with this issue a lot..."How do you 'report' this sort of thing? Who's ultimately in charge?" That kind of thing....No one quite knows, most of the time :P

:)
Julie CPS Tech and mom to 2 in seats
http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/RFAlbum/SarahMA.aspx

Splash
06-03-2005, 07:55 PM
Glad to know that the problem *might* be taken care of. I feel the same way you do... WHY are they trying so hard to make parents turn their kids around? And why don't they even say anything to someone about the benefits of RF? Julie, when you install seats FF for a kid you *know* should still be RF, do you even mention it? What about when they are there ON the kid's first birthday to turn them him around?
When our girls first got placed with us, we had an awesome social worker. She left after several months and we got a new one who was just horrible. She saw that I had BOTH seats RF (for a then nine month old and a 2.5 year old) and she FREAKED. Threatening to pull the kids from our care and everything. She said we had an obligation to keep them safe and we stated we knew how to use a car seat. Uh, yeah, we do. This woman would not give it up and demanded that we turn DD1 around immediately in her presence, and that when DD2 turned one/20 pounds we were to have the seat inspected that day and have a police officer state that the seat was correctly installed FF. I refused to turn DD1 around and she said she would be back with police to force me to.
I called her supervisor who really didn't know anything about car seats (honestly, foster kids normally don't even ride in car seats, especially in the SW cars... if they do it's more like shield boosters and overhead bar seats, always FF...this has been my experience, not necessarily true everywhere) but when I told her that in fact RF was the safest way to be, and kids should ride RF until the limits of the seat and I could offer her proof of this, she agreed with me and said she would call off the hounds. Three weeks later we met our new (current) who didn't know about extended RF but was only too happy to learn (she had a 5 month old baby then who now is 19 months still happily RF thanks to what we told her) and was glad we cared enough to keep them safe, even though it is more inconvenient (because, face it, FF is easier). We love our SW now.
Good for you for standing up for you kid. If I were you I probably would have made a huge scene, but that's me.
E

Beth568
06-03-2005, 08:27 PM
Aww...he couldn't BE more comfortable in there. How adorable! :D

You know, I think a lot of people are confused about the 12 months/20 pounds thing. Maybe it's just poor wording on some manuals, or something. When my first DD was about 11 months, I had several friends remind me that it was almost time to turn her around - they thought it was a requirement that she be turned FF, not just a choice.

I'm still horrified to think that techs don't understand that, though. Some day, when my kids are older and I can manage child care for that week, I want to do the training...and then I'll be on a RAMPAGE, lol!

MarisaSF
06-03-2005, 10:01 PM
Girrrrrrl, you go.
That was a truly excellent post. It made my day. :)

Joolsplus2
06-04-2005, 12:27 PM
If the kid is under 14 months or so, I really make an effort to keep them RF, especially if the car doesn't have top tethers (top tethers are awesome at protecting even younger babies from head and neck injury...not as good as RF, but better than NOT being top tethered).

Fortunately, most of the parents I get have been pre-trained by an awesome tech who worked at the store before me, and they think kids have to RF till age 3 or so :D
Julie CPS Tech and mom to 2 in seats
http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/RFAlbum/SarahMA.aspx

DebbieJ
04-19-2006, 08:19 PM
Bumping so we can read again about this idiot posing as a CPS tech. :)

~ deb
DS born at home 12/03
2 year check up: 25 lbs with clothes on and 35 inches!
BFARed for 20 months and 6 days
(Breastfeeding After Reduction is possible! www.bfar.org)

http://www.bfar.org/members/fora/style_avatars/Ribbons/18months-bfar.jpg

Oregonmother
04-19-2006, 08:31 PM
Thanks!

DebbieJ
04-19-2006, 08:44 PM
When looking at the seat, pull up the cover on the right side. There is space under the foam piece to roll up the manual and slide it in there.

~ deb
DS born at home 12/03
2 year check up: 25 lbs with clothes on and 35 inches!
BFARed for 20 months and 6 days
(Breastfeeding After Reduction is possible! www.bfar.org)

http://www.bfar.org/members/fora/style_avatars/Ribbons/18months-bfar.jpg

tjham
04-19-2006, 08:53 PM
I hate to say this, but this situation is one reason I have never been to a carseat check myself and have not recommended it to anyone. I am TERRIFIED that I (or whoever I send) will get one of these idiots instead of one like you guys on this board. I work to get a good install and take all the advice you guys give and repeat that to others. I just hate to tell someone something and then have a tech tell them the opposite. Besides me being embarrassed, they may not believe any thing else I tell them about carseats.

Oregonmother
04-20-2006, 09:01 AM
thanks!

hudsonam
04-20-2006, 09:04 AM
Ugh. I haven't read the replies yet, but it's frightening, isn't it? When I went to our local car seat check, the police officer doing it wanted to turn him FF because of his weight, I think (?), but he wasn't even a year yet. And when I pointed that out, he said, "Oh, yea." He was full of mininformation. It's really discouraging.

lisajay
11-13-2006, 11:34 PM
I saw on TV the other day that, at least that's where I think I saw it, that many pediatricians are encouraging parents to leave there kids RF until they are (at least)18 months. I think it is a step in the right direction. However some people just don't get that it doesn't mean that you need to turn them once they get to that point. Somehow they misunderstand the (at least) part.

That's understandable, so many people don't understand that it is 12mo AND 20lbs not OR! I had some coworkers that flipped them so young. It was so scarey seeing their very young babies strapped in FF. One of my coworkers didn't even wait until her ds was 20 lbs. The other coworker was told by her pediatrician that her twins could be forward facing at 12 mo OR 20 lbs. Unfortunately they were really heavy babies and were flipped before they were even 7mo. I tried to tell her what I had seen(the crash video) and about the spine not being strong enough, and she just tuned me out. She said the carseats were much easier to adjust FF. Besides, her pediatrician told her they were fine. I'm not putting her down for this. I'm just annoyed at the misinformation that the pediatrician is probably telling all the other Mom's too.

All Pediatricians need to be educated on this subject. I was shocked that a Pediatrician wouldn't know this!?

LJ

MarisaSF
11-14-2006, 01:52 AM
Man, I was confused when I saw this thread pop up. "Debbie's son is only 18 mos old?," I thought. It was like time stopped til I figured out this was an old thread with a new update.

I think the instructions on the carseats are confusing. My friend has a PhD so you'd think if anyone would get this, she could. The sticker on her Britax said, "Use only rear-facing up to 20 lbs." I had to read it a couple times to interpret. I could totally see how someone would see this and think "Use for rear-facing ONLY up to 20 lbs and then turn it forward facing" as opposed to "Do not use it forward facing for child less than 20 lbs." My newer Britax has more detailed directions.

DebbieJ
11-14-2006, 02:31 AM
Hey, at least we all get to see a pic of my cutie. If only he were that docile these days.... *sigh*

And the niece or nephew I was alluding to in my old siggie actually arrived in July of that year and is now 16 months old and walking and talking and signing!

oh, and LisaJay, if you're reading this--watch what you're posting to. Your settings must be screwed up b/c you also resurrected a really old thread about dogs in the Lounge.

~ deb
DS born at home 12/03
Breastfeeding After Reduction is possible! www.bfar.org

http://www.bfar.org/members/fora/style_avatars/Ribbons/18months-bfar.jpg