If we can't discuss politics here...

[mommd]

is there somewhere else you go online that you can discuss "controversial" topics without name calling and personal attacks? Is that possible? I *need* to discuss things! Thanks! :)

[Rachels]

We can discuss it here. :) We just can't name-call and attack. For good discussion, although often intense, check out the activism forum at MDC. There's a war and politics subforum, and people there know all kinds of stuff.

-Rachel
Mom to Abigail Rose
5/18/02

http://www.planetsmilies.com/smilies/character/2/character39.gif

"We have a secret in our culture...it's not that birth is painful, it's that women are strong!!" - Laura Stavoe Harm

[redhookmom]

Speaking of politics, I would love to share something my brother wrote:

So I Went To See This Great Scandal Last Night

By Bill



Once upon a time I immersed myself in politics. I took classes in political science, learned about capitalism in ancient Greece, Keynesian economics, the birth of the nation state and the death of the Cold War. I read two or three newspapers a day with the fervency of a soap-opera addict. I started picking my movie rentals from the documentary section. I found out who Noam Chomsky is and was blown away by the profound paradoxical potentiality of money.

Then I became a reporter. I saw how decisions are made and tried to explain the process in clear and objective language. I sat through hundreds of town, village, and school board meetings, stretching my attention span to fit around four and five hours of mind-splitting tedium. I was berated by both sides of the issues, then by three or four other sides. People put on shows for my benefit at the board table. Then I had to talk to the parents and teachers in the parking lot to find out what was really going on. In time-honored fashion, the more I learned the more I became aware of how much I didn’t know. I also figured out that many people knew less than I did.

Then I stopped. I lost interest. I got tired of people talking. It was a continuous process of weeding through the non-stop yammering to see what people were actually doing. Whether it’s in front of a microphone, over drinks, or at the playground, people like to hear themselves speak. Nowhere is this more apparent than in politics, with the possible exception of the media. When the two bed down together it’s a love fest of infinite syllables. People talk to hear themselves speak and to entertain. That’s the kicker, politics is entertainment. News junkies talking about this week’s scandal bear a striking resemblance to busybodies viscously dissecting Mrs. Robinson’s affairs over a cup of coffee or at the poker table. I learned that gossip drives decision making. Talking about what is happening in the public arena with righteous indignation is often just gossip.

Politics is something to talk about. It’s important to talk about politics but I ask myself what changes. This week’s political scandal is bantered around by a group of my friends and nothing changes. I am part of a few email circles in which friends endlessly debate political issues and scandals. I don’t think I have ever seen someone admit they were wrong or change their point of view. People decide what side of the issue, as if there are only two sides, they are on before they even read a headline. Passions brew in these heated circles and the issue is often lost in obscure historical references. Some people love to argue. These same people rarely engage in conversation. Few times do I see the willingness to look at something from a different point of view. People spit out pithy summations of this week’s scandal, argue a little bit more about 9/11, and move on. It’s entertainment on a high horse.

“Well,” Joe says with a snarl, “if you knew anything about the far-reaching effects of colonial economics you would understand what I’m talking about.”

This statement could just as easily be about Hollywood’s new release.

“Well,” Sarah replied with a sneer, “if you knew anything about French cinema in the 1950s you would clearly understand that this is a weak imitation.”

I realize I am trying to justify my apathy for politics. It’s just tiresome to hear the same arguments rehashed by the same people and then to suffer their righteous indignation that the world should share their addiction. I vote and I’ll continue to vote. I pay attention and I’ll continue to pay attention.

But maybe I need to forget everything I know. Maybe I need to not know where I stand on the issues and enter into actual conversations about what’s going. Maybe a full admission of my ignorance is the key to re-igniting my passion for politics. Maybe I need to be quieter, listen more, take small actions, and stop yammering.

Or maybe I just need to go see better movie

[mommd]

Great essay!

>I don’t think I have ever seen someone admit they were wrong or
>change their point of view.

Me! I've recently changed my POV on things.
>
>But maybe I need to forget everything I know. Maybe I need to
>not know where I stand on the issues and enter into actual
>conversations about what’s going. Maybe a full admission of my
>ignorance is the key to re-igniting my passion for politics.

This is what I'm looking for. Actual conversations with facts, not mudslinging, not "I'm right you're wrong" statements. Sadly, I don't think it is possible. Many message boards are mostly one sided and all you hear is one side. My friends don't seem to be that interested in discussing politics, so I guess I will just continue to yell at the TV. :)