How do you feel about continuing/discontinuing the birthday list?

[justlearning]

I originally posted the following under the thread that Deborah started with a poll about where to put the birthday list. Based upon her recommendation, I'm posting what I wrote here as a new thread. (You can read her response to me under her thread.)

I never posted this before because it's not that big of a deal to me and probably isn't to others as well, but here's one perspective on a possible negative consequence of the birthday list as it's currently being used... Here's the excerpt from my other post:


In some ways, I wonder why there's the list in the first place. I really appreciated all the work you did for it, Deborah, and thought it was a truly wonderful idea at first. I was impressed by your initiative in compiling and organizing all that information. Like many others, I asked you if you could add my son's birthday to your list and you did, which I appreciated.

But then, on my son's birthday, no one posted a "Happy Birthday to Ethan" thread whereas I believe there were well wishes for Rachel's daugher, also born on the same day. I know it's a really stupid thing to feel this way, but I did feel a little hurt that my son's birthday wasn't acknowledged, considering I've been a member of the board since before my son's birth and have always felt so welcome here. (To make matters worse then, DS's birthday was shortly after the list was created, so there were many other "Happy Birthdays" being given then because everyone was newly aware of birthdays.)

Now, I told myself that I shouldn't really let that bother me and that if I truly wanted his birthday acknolwedged, then I should have posted some pictures of his birthday party so everyone could say "how cute!" and "happy late birthday to Ethan!" OK, but if I did that then, what was the purpose of my information ever being on that list in the first place? If the point of having a list is so that others can look at it and then acknowledge other's birthdays without the parent being the one to start the thread, then I feel a little uncomfortable posting a birthday thread because it's almost like I'm saying "Hey, look at my son--he's having a birthday too even though no one acknowledged it." Do you get my point?

Just so I'm clear now, I do want to say that I didn't let it bother me that much because I just chalked it up to the fact that his birthday was overlooked and that it wasn't a big deal. I also realized that I was never the person to initiate a "Happy Birthday" thread (although I had chimed in on many), so I did not really deserve to have someone else initiate that for my son. But, I'm just sharing how I felt in case anyone else's birthday on the list also gets overlooked--they may feel a little hurt too.

But what's the alternative? Well, we could have a different person assigned to start threads for all the birthdays during a one or two week period or something like that to make sure that no one's birthday gets overlooked. But then we'd be having LOTS of birthday threads in the Lounge (especially if all members' birthdays were eventually added to the list), and I'm not sure if that's what we want either. If we do, I'd be happy to volunteer for a week or two. If we don't want to acknowledge each and every birthday on the list, then I think we need to perhaps reconsider even having the list in the first place. Why? Because if people are only starting threads for their friends whom they know well, then they really don't need the birthday list--they would likely have their friend's child's birthday noted somewhere so they don't forget (or be reminded by their friend's signature lines).

So, I'm truly not trying to "stir up the pot" here, and my personality is the farthest thing away from being a troublemaker. Also, I'm not one to harbor hurt feelings or anything like that. I'm not posting this as a way to have people say "Oh, I'm sorry we forgot to acknowlege Ethan's birthday," nor am I posting it to lead to any hurt feelings to Deborah or anyone else on the merits of the birthday list. Rather, I'm just trying to open up a discussion on the purpose of the birthday list and the way that it can be used to lead to positive feelings for all BB members rather than to any hurt feelings.

Just thought that sharing my experience could be helpful...

[redhookmom]

http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/nod.gif

I am not sure what the answer is. I would hate to see the list go.

[mommd]

Maybe there can be a weekly post for babies who have a birthday that week, or even monthly. That way, everyone gets recognized, the list doesn't need to be checked as often, and we don't feel the need to respond to tons of birthday posts.

I felt bad about people who don't post alot having birthdays missed and started initiating posts for a while, but I just don't check the list as much anymore. It does seem to be a popularity contest at times, but with a board of this size, that is bound to happen.

By the way, Happy Birthday Ethan! :)

[NEVE and TRISTAN]

Well Anne I love you dearly so I hate to see that this could have upset you, but wanted to share my thoughts...

And you really hit the nail right on the head so I'm not telling you anything that you don't know or haven't thought about, and I'm trying to say this as nicely as can be so please know that I'm thinking how do I say this genuinly as nice as I can...
My gut instinct is to not to post this and to not respond BUT then I owe it to Deborah's efforts to do so and that is the ONLY reason I really am chosing to go out on the limb here...

BUT I don't think anyone can expect anyone to take the time out to make an announcement for anyone. We all have to chose how we spend our time here and it is a HUGE responsibliltiy for anyone to try to take that on-I KNOW first hand. I felt a special bond to the February (jan-feb-mar) babies (since many of us were pregnant together, had babies together and keep up with eachother) so I posted a lot of the Happy Birthday's to those babes, and in return one of them watched out for me and wished Tristan Happy Birthday...and then I made certain when it was her sons Birthday to post his Happy Birthday. But after March I was done with that, I was afraid that the responsibility, the hurt feelings would fall on me (that is my problem that I had these feelings and no one elses) but I feared that, but I also didn't want to take on that "burden" and no one here should. Tristan got a lot of well wishes on his Birthday, and I think I have responded to everyones Birthday that has come down the boards, everyones pregnancy etc..., and if I haven't I was out of town that day or something for it is important to me to acknowldge such big days in our lives. That is how I chose to spend my time it is important to me...and I feel safe to say it might be why Tristan got acknowledged on his, for that is human nature.

So my suggestion is to team up with someone whose Birthday is near the date of your child and "buddy up", I do think it takes the initiative to celebrate others to be celebrated, and you have clearly done that if you have participated in Birthday threads, but maybe like you mentioned start a few threads wishing others Happy Birthday and see what happens :)
I don't think it right for anyone here to have to take on that responsiblity, that could be a huge hornets nest and I for one wouldn't take it on for a salary.

It's not hard to follow threads and to see who takes the time to wish your child happy birthday, to respond to your pregnancy, to respond to your miscarriage, to respond to the good and the bad...as of late I have to rely on that often for I don't have the time to respond to every post, nor the desire...but if folks can been there for me I will do what I can to be there for them.

Anyway with that said I like the Birthday List...I have never referred to it honestly, but I like that it is there...and Deborah spent a lot of time making it I can only assume. It was the most generous of gestures non of us can dispute...her responsiblity with it should end at that...

Again I highly encourage "Birthday Buddies" to announce Birthdays if yor "buddy" hasn't surfaced naturally via friendship etc...
I can proably assure you had you started a thread for a Baby near the time of your childs wishing a Happy Birthday it would have been done in return...it is human nature...

But unless the Boards are programmed to automatically start these threads it is a responsiblity that no one should have to take on...

I only share this so you don't feel alone...
But I also want to say that feelings can get hurt over such things from any of us, even if "stupid feelings"...mine were hurt in my pregnancy thread by folks who I always thought dear to me not responding...folks who I even took the intiative to start their childs Birthday thread didn't respond to my pregancy, folks who have been to my home, folks who I have been there for for their pregnancies and loses...my feelings were and are VERY hurt, so don't feel badly for your feelings, they are true...I am just giving you some advice since you asked us to talk about it on how this can be handled...


Neve and Tristan born Feb 25, 2003
***********************************
EDD with #2 March 18, 2005
heartbeat and "looking great" so far
************************************
Traveling in Jan insearch of the rest of our family-adopting in Ukraine
***********

[MommytoDylan]

I'm so sorry your feelings were hurt! I would have been sad too.

Meredith

[stella]

I'm sorry that your baby's birthday was not remembered in the midst of everyone always posting these "Happy Birthday" threads. My babies' birthdays have never been acknowledged either - although until you mentioned it, I hadn't noticed.

I don't think the birthday list is necessarily the culprit. I think that some of these ladies are just chummier with each other than the rest of us.

I would try not to let it bother me. Your post is well-taken, though. I can think of many times when I have posted and have gotten 2 or 3 responses while other posters asking variations of the same sorts of questions (should I go back to work? Is my baby normal? Why isn't he sleeping? Did you have a vbac?) get a much larger response. And it bothers me a little, but what can you do? With a few exceptions, most of us don't know each other in real life - only in this cyber-"community."

I think that these boards have a real cliquey side, and it's hard not to feel like an outsider when YOUR baby is not acknowledged or your "what my baby did" post is not responded to much. But there's nothing to do about it. It just sucks to be ignored.

Or, if you subsribe to the "wrong" political party and you stick your neck out (whether or not it is in good taste to do so), you can be blasted and called an idiot and ridiculed by a whole group of members. Try that next time you're feeling ignored!

I think you're brave for writing this post. And Happy Birthday to your sweet baby - whenever it was. I don't even read the birthday list or posts as what is there really interesting about reading "happy birthday" 25 times?

Sorry if I sound bitter, I just think that people can be insensitive sometimes and you really shouldn't take it personally. Just remember that you and your baby have real friends in the real world who wouldn't dream of missing your birthday or your child's birthday!

Have a better day tomorrow!

[justlearning]

I do agree with you completely, Neve--you get what you give on these boards, and I had never started a post about a birthday and that's why I said I didn't deserve to have one started for me. And I hope no one's thinking that I was really hurt over this. I should have probably worded it more as disappointment--I saw the other thread wishing Rachel's daughter a happy birthday and thought, "Oh, that's too bad there's not one for Ethan because they're both listed back to back on the birthday list." (But of course, I also realized that Rachel is one of the most dearly loved members on this board, so I completely understood that as well.) My point about the function of the birthday list is that I would have never had been even disappointed if my son's information hadn't been on the list. But, once it was on there, I guess it just felt like magically that should lead to being wished a happy birthday.

I do appreciate all the work Deborah put into making the list and to everyone who does take the time to wish others a happy birthday. (Neve, I know that you are one of the individuals who does this the most, and I think that's wonderful.) It sounds like the list is functioning well for those who do wish to refer to it, so I think it's great that it will be kept pinned to the top of a forum--whichever forum Deborah decides to pin it to.

It is a little awkward on these forums with all of the birthday/pregnancy/new birth threads to know how to respond to some and not to others. (That is, if I respond to some poster's threads who I don't know, then I feel like I should try to respond to them all.) I must admit that I felt badly going into the Bios forum today for the first time and realizing how hypocritical I was for even posting a thread about feelings being hurt about a birthday thread when I've never even taken the time to look in that forum and congratulate others on the birth of their children.

Having said all that, the reason why I don't post much (and that includes reponding to congratulatory threads) is that I try to limit the amount of time I spend on these boards. In fact, I am actually trying to wean myself off of these boards completely so I can focus more time on completing my graduate degree. (Thus, this will likely be one of my last posts for awhile--BTW, I'd hate to have you, Neve, or anyone else interpret my departure as having anything to do with this birthday thing.) If I were going to continue being an active participant, I would definitely make more of an effort to "give love" out to others on the board, including those who are new posters. This is truly a wonderful community, which is why it's so hard to wean myself from it. :)

I'm truly sorry I even brought up this question regarding the purpose of including the birthday information on the list. If I could just go back and edit my posts to take them all out, I would but it's too late for that and would seem odd to others reading this thread if I just erased all of my previous comments. It does make me sound petty, which I'm really not (that's why I would have never posted a thread about this in the first place--I just thought to do so when I saw Deborah's other thread). I was just trying to ask a question with the thought that it may help others realize a possible downside of the list.

I will miss hearing about all of the things going on in your lives as I take time off from the boards, but hopefully I'll be able to join up with you all again in a few months after my dissertation's done. (I'm definitely going to check back in later to hear how your pregnancy and adoptions go, Neve.) Thanks for everything! :)

[justlearning]

Stella, thanks for your comments. It looks like your son, Wade recently celebrated a birthday--I hope that he had a great birthday too!

I really wish I had never even posted about this because I'm afraid that it sounded like I took it way more personally than I actually did. My only point was that when someone asks for their information to be included on the birthday list, they may (wrongly) expect for that information to be used in some way. That was my only point. I looked on the list and didn't see your children's birthdays on the list. That may have been why you didn't even realize until now that your children's birthdays were not acknowledged.

Regarding the forum being "cliquey," that's to be expected because actual friendships do develop between posters on this board. And like Neve said, everyone basically has the ability to start forming their own "cliques" by finding others who have children of a similar age or by finding others with similar political leanings, etc.

I'm sorry that you have had some negative experiences on this board. My guess is that--judging from the number of your posts--you, like me, do still feel that's it a wonderful board to be a part of.

[deborah_r]

Anne, I don't think you sounded petty at all, and I think it was great that you brought it up for discussion. As I said before, I've had some of the same concerns myself before. Sometimes I see someone's birthday is coming up, but I don't really "know" them well enough to feel like it be anything other than weird to wish them a happy birthday. Which is silly I guess, because I think people will be happy with anyone recognizing their baby's birthday. I guess I also never expected the list to grow to over 200 babies! Not that it is a bad thing, it is just much bigger than I expected.

I've seen very, very similar discussions on other message boards I have lurked on, and I think some of these even have an automatic thing in a certain section of the page telling that it is someone's birthday.

It's also hard because even if you have the best intentions of remembering a birthday, some days you just don't have as much (or any) time to give to the boards. Part of the thing that is great about the message board concept to me is that you can jump in and out of the conversation as it is convenient for you. it is easier than being on the phone, where you have to end the conversation if your baby is probing the dog inappropriately :) But here you can just get up, do what you got to do, and pick up where you left off. but it also means that people miss certain events and certain conversations. I think if we all read every thread, we'd never get anything else done!

Well, I'm rambling now, but just wanted you to know I don't think it was petty at all, and glad you brought it up! Good luck working on your degree!

[flagger]

>Or, if you subsribe to the "wrong" political party and you
>stick your neck out (whether or not it is in good taste to do
>so), you can be blasted and called an idiot and ridiculed by a
>whole group of members.

Hey! I resemble that remark! ;)

[NancyJ_redo]

Anne - please don't worry about having raised the issue. I totally understood what you were saying and could certainly understand your feelings - I'm sure I'd feel the same way...it's human nature. And I also understood the 'intensity' with which you were saying it, if that makes any sense. Not that it ruined your day, not that it left you incredibly upset, just one of those things that got you thinking. You were a bit disappointed, and were concerned about how someone else might feel if put in that position.

Don't give it a second thought. Your comments are part of what make this a great community - that you were thinking, thinking of others, and willing to share your thoughts on the subject.

Good luck on your dissertation.

[lisams]

Anne, I'm glad you spoke up, I have a feeling you are not the only one who feels this way. Personally I think every baby on the list should be celebrated regardless of how often they post or "popularity". I think you are very thoughtful for bringing this up - I can tell you don't want anyone to feel hurt.

Good luck on your dissertation! I hope we "see" you around more when you are done!

Lisa

[justlearning]

You paraphrased exactly how I'm feeling...thanks so much! You even said it much better than I did. Now if you could just teach my husband to be such a great paraphraser/empathizer! :) Your comments are very much appreciated.

[luvbeinmama]

Personally, I have often felt that the "Happy Birthday" messages belonged in a PM or an email rather than a thread in the lounge. Mostly because of what you are saying. JMHO.

[s7714]

I agree.

Jennifer
Mommy to Annalia 03/03/03

[deborah_r]

That's an interesting idea, I had never thought of that!

[NEVE and TRISTAN]

I think bringing up things like this is what makes our boards our boards...as well as discussing them-and I also agree you didn't sound like it was the most devastating thing, it was the begging of the disussion that made me respond at all on how I felt.


Neve and Tristan born Feb 25, 2003
***********************************
EDD with #2 March 18, 2005
heartbeat and "looking great" so far
************************************
Traveling in Jan insearch of the rest of our family-adopting in Ukraine
***********

[jk3]

Prior to reading this thread, I didn't know that wishing someone a happy birthday was a random event. I just assumed that a few people each month had the "job" of checking the list + posting the birthday wish. Maybe that would make it easier if 2 or 3 people each month could volunteer to check the list + post.

Jenn
DS 6/03

http://lilypie.com/baby2/030603/2/5/1/-5/.png

[McQ]

I hear what you're saying, but I'm offering up a different point of view. I never expected the birthday list to automatically generate a happy birthday message to Declan or that because his information was on there that someone would check it and post a message to him.

Nor do I think it should be someone's job to take that responsibility on and post the messages. If it was someone's job, then it wouldn't feel sincere.

I for one never check the birthday list but I like that it's there if I was ever interested. Maybe the geek in me one day would want to see how many babies we have. Or know the average age of babes on the board. Or who has a child close to my child's age that I may want to seek out and connect with. Which month had the most births etc...

I am sorry you felt bad about Ethan's birthday not being recognized, but did just want to offer up a different take on the list.

Allison
~ mommy to Declan 3.24.03
and number 2 EDD 9.14.04

[luvbeinmama]

Well, I don't really think that is the answer. As some other posters said already, I think that's a lot to ask of anyone, and I'm pretty sure it is highly unnecessary. I have never been offended or affected in any way when my kids' birthdays go unnoticed here. Of course, no one knows their exact birthdays, anyway. I'm pretty sure that most people here don't care one way or the other. Whenever I see a birthday post, I go right by it. If I want to wish a happy birthday to someone or their child, I will do it personally, not here.

[Melanie]

Sorry that your little guy was overlooked and I completely understand how you feel. That is one of the reasons why I have not added our dates to the list. I would probably feel sad if they were overlooked.

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_sapphire_24m.gif

[starrynight]

I'm with Melanie on this one. I haven't added our dates because I don't want to get sad about it, also I know I am not here everyday and can't possibly wish every child happy bday so I don't want to be part of the list. I do say HB on all the threads I see but if I'm not here for a few days I am sure I have missed a few babies and sorry if I have!

As for if it stays or goes that doesn't matter to me really but I do like that it's not this hugh thread taking up half the first page now. Only because I hate going to the 2nd page because I only have so much time to catch up around here!