Tricky situation, can anyone help?

[Kate888]

When you go out with friends (e.g. moms night out), do you devide the bill evenly at the end? That's what I usually do, but here is the situation...

I had a moms night out with my neighbors yesterday :) It was such a relief to go to a nice restaurant and just eat, instead of having to entertain a toddler. We had a blast and enjoyed each's company. When the bill came, it was devided evenly among us (5). Although my bill was $22, I had to pay $32. The reason my bill was lower is because I didn't order wine (cups). It was awkward to bring it up, since I only knew one of them well. Plus, it reminds me of the Friends episode in which everyone gets upset at the end.

Someone suggested doing this every month. I'd love to do that and getting to know the moms better. However, I can see the same thing happen again, because I'm the only one who don't (and can't) drink.

What would you do?

Thanks a lot for your help!!



Kate
Mama to Maya 2-17-02 and Polo (my big black dog)http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/dog.gif


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[toomanystrollers]

Order a dessert or an appetizer to even out your share next time :)

[Kate888]

Thanks! I forgot to mention that we all had dessert :) I was so full that it was hard to get out of the chair!

Kate
Mama to Maya 2-17-02 and Polo (my big black dog)http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/dog.gif


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[Mommie2MadLyn]

I think that is a tricky situation, but its the way we always do things too. If 4 of us go out, we split the bill evenly by 4. It just makes things easier, and I figure that although I may sometimes put in more $ than I actually ate/drank...at least I had a good time. And maybe next time I'll order the more expensive dish,so it all evens out in the long run. (at least in my head it does ;) ) I would say you should definitely keep going out with these other women, because I don't think its worth giving up on a good time. If you really want to, you could say something to the one that you know well, and see if maybe she feels the same.

About a month ago I went out to dinner with a friend, and she brought along another friend that I did not really know...well the woman broke out a calculator when the bill came! Sorry if anyone here does this, but I was mortified! She literally pulled it out of her bag and set it on the table and started tallying up what each of us owed!!! I thought it was extremely tacky and embarressing...the waiter even gave a look. I think its fine when people DO figure out the bill instead of just splitting it...but whipping out a calculator is a bit over the top in my mind!!!

[lisaE]

I would probably think, "Oh well, I had $10 worth of fun." It sounds like you had a lot of fun!

To me, it probably wouldn't be worth the awkwardness of bringing it up.

[MamaKath]

A couple times I have ended up with a group where a couple people will order drinks, and I end up loosing out in the end on the money score. The first time I chalk it up to learning. The second time, I request that the drinks be kept on a seperate tab since they can add up so quickly. I have never encountered a problem on that score. :-) Good luck and glad it was fun!!!

[suribear]

I also went on a MNO last night (so much fun!). Anyway, when it came time to split the bill, we were going to split it evenly but one mom asked that we itemize it, so that's what we did instead. Noone really cared either way. So I pulled out my palm pilot calculator to make it easier (the person doing the accounts asked for it). I honestly don't see why that's tacky or embarrassing!! What's the big deal? I believe in making life easy - why do accounts in your head? Maybe we're a bunch of techno nerds LOL

The mom who requested to itemize it had been burned in the past with another group. Actually, I would ALWAYS lose out when we split evenly, as I don't drink, and I'm vegetarian (the veg. entrees usually cost less) so my bill usually comes to much less than the others. I have never said anything, but the others usually chip in a few dollars extra for their drinks, out of courtesy.

It's more awkward when you don't know the others, so maybe you can bring it up to your friend if it's an issue.

Kris

[peanut4us]

I don't drink at all... and i ended up paying almost $15 more than my meal... which was only about $20 because we just divided equally. honestly, yeah, I had a good time... but I don't just drop $35 on myself for dinner... barely ever. So when we talked about the next get together came up, I said I coudln't go because it was too expensive. They all said it was about normal of what they would pay... but I pointed out that they usually pay for drinks with their meals and I don't... It was just a polite conversation, and they could all see what i was talking about. So from then on, we did itemized... which I found out from some other gals in the group they appreciated because they ordered less drinks and no dessert... saved themselves about $8-10 each get together.

In any case, no, you don't need to pay for your friends' drinks and if you talk about it ahead of time... it shouldn't be a problem.

[MartiesMom2B]

I don't think it's fair to split the bill when you haven't been drinking. I always try to remember to ask the waiter to split the bill when I'm ordering. I've never run into a problem and then I give them a little extra tip for doing so.

-Sonia

[KrisM]

Maybe it's because I and all my friends are engineers and therefore like precision, but we always pay only our own part. I've never been in a situation where we just split the bill evenly, unless the totals are within a dollar or two of each other. We never have any problem with it.

[miki]

I don't think it's a tricky situation at all. I do a MNO with moms in a local group and there are always people I don't know that well because there are new members or different people show up. We always just ask for separate bills. No one is offended. Or if we have forgotten to ask, we still itemize. You never know when someone else's budget is a little tight that month and $10 could make a difference.

[jubilee]

We always ask upfront to have separate bills. I've never had a waiter give me any problem. Hope you get to go out again!

[hez]

Have done it multiple ways-- the equal split works best if you're out for lunch and no one's drinking alcohol :) Have also split the food equally, and just paid for our own beverages at places where we're sharing entrees. The vast majority of the time we all just ask for separate checks up front. It results in the fewest hurt feelings or pent-up resentments in the end.

[hellosmiletoday]

In small group we ask for separate checks...in large groups we usually estimate how much everyone paid so that no one has to pay extra. Its crazy to pay for other's drinks if you didn't have one, and I feel that your friends should have picked this up before splitting the bill evenly.

If you continue to go out and no one suggests that you pay less b/c you do not drink alcohol, I would ask the waiter in advance, discreetly, for a separate check b/c you dont have much cash and need to pay by credit card.

Mommy to baby girl 5.8.04

[redhookmom]

When we go out we pass around the check and everybody just throws in what they owe. Since most everybody has had 2 margaritas the server usually ends up with a big tip!

I was at some chain restaruant recently, maybe TGIFridays and the check acutally itemized and totaled each individual automatically. Pretty cool.

[Kate888]

THANK YOU for all the input and suggestions!!! I really appreciate it :)

I also asked my sister and her boyfriend for ideas. Apparently she had a pretty bad experience. She was having dinner with some friends. Then one of them got a call and she told the caller to meet her at the restaurant. This person (a total stranger to all of them except the one he called) showed up and ordered a bunch food and drank 2 bottles of wine by himself. At the end, they devided the bill evenly,and it was more than $60! My sister's boyfriend insisted that Americans always devide the bill evenly, even in this situation. He said "if someone is like this, we just don't invite him next time". Therefore, he said I shouldn't just pay my portion (obviously he doesn't represent ALL Americans).

I seriously considered all the suggestions. It wouldn't be a problem for me to chalk it up (for the fun) if this is just a one time thing. However, there will be more people joining in next time and the wine bill will be piling up. It seems that itemizing or asking for a seperate tab for wine (instead of ordering more food than I want to eat), is the best way to go.

But, how do I word this next time? English is my second language, so I don't want to cause any misunderstanding. Should I communicate with the mom I know best beforehand? She is the one who ordered the most wine last time and I don't want her to feel awkward. How do you word it casually?

Thanks for all the help!! :)



Kate
Mama to Maya 2-17-02 and Polo (my big black dog)http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/dog.gif


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[miki]

>My sister's boyfriend insisted that Americans always devide the >bill evenly, even in this situation. He said "if someone is like >this, we just don't invite him next time".

And why would you invite a total stranger to a "next time"? Whatever.

I would mention it to either your friend beforehand, the group as everyone is being seated, or the waitperson when they first come to the table. You can ask, "Does anybody mind if we ask for separate checks?" If anyone looks like they don't understand why you would do that, I would just say that you think it will make the math easier because you don't plan on ordering wine/drinks.

[californiamom]

LOL on the "engineers" thing. I can TOTALLY picture my dad doing the exact same thing and he was also an engineer. So funny. :-)

[August Mom]

I would just ask the server for separate checks when you order your beverage. If anyone at the table questions it later, just mention that it's easier than dividing it at the end. That way, everyone can use their own credit card, you don't have to do math, etc. I do this at every Moms' Night Out and have never had a problem.

[californiamom]

This does not sound very fair to me either... It seems to me like you have a few options:

1. Talk to the waiter as he/she is taking the orders and ask for a separate check. You can say you will be paying with a card and therefore a separate bill would be easier for you

2. Talk to your friends and tell them that since you don't drink maybe you guys could itemize the bill, or have your check separate... Maybe explain that normally you don't spend over $30 on dinner for yourself

3. Take advantage of the situation and order the more expensive entrees on the menu... The tricky part though would be if everybody else also decides to order lobster! ;-)

I have encountered this situation a few times and it was not pleasant. Sometimes I did wish my friends would realize that I only had a salad and they all ate and drank, but it just doesn't happen this way. Obviously if you pay more than you owe it also means they will pay less than they owe... Who doesn't want that?! ;-)

So now what I do is I normally use option #1 above and ask for a separate check directly to the waiter. Unless I know that the crowd I am with that day/night is pretty fair and won't make me pay for (expensive) things I didn't order... HTH and have fun on your nights out!

Ana

[suribear]

Maybe you can ask them, "Hey, do you mind if I get a separate check, since I don't drink." That should be enough.. Maybe it's just me, but I don't see this as a big deal!

I'm fairly sensitive to this, as I understand that some people live from paycheck to paycheck, whilst others have seemingly unlimited resources. Although, in my case, it's just a question of fairness :)

Kris

[lukkykatt]

Usually I do just split the bill, but I have also been with people who want to have everyone pay for their own items, and that has never been a problem. I would probably just ask the waiter for separate bills at the beginning of the night - that to me is the cleanest way to do it.

So many people don't carry cash anymore, that most restaurants are very accomodating in doing this. And that way you don't have to make a point of saying that you don't drink and everyone else does.

PS: If ever there is a situation where I am starving and have alot more to eat, or drink when no one else does, I always offer to pay extra when the bill is being split, fyi.

[pritchettzoo]

I'm American and I've never divided the bill evenly. Maybe that's because almost all of our friends go back to college and grad student days where every last penny was important. We always ask for separate checks at the get go. Just tell your waiter when you're ordering that you'd like a separate check. Sometimes when the party is more than a certain number (usually 6 or 8), they won't split the bill. In that case, I've never had a problem with saying, "Here's my $15." You know what you ordered and how much it would be with tax and tip, so just put in that amount. I wouldn't expect someone who ordered chicken to pay for my lobster.

I personally would never go out again with someone who drank two bottles of wine and expected ME to pay for it!

Anna

[lizajane]

i don't have a bunch of extra money to spend on going out, so when i do i want to be sure i am really getting what i pay for. i will often order water, no appetizer and no dessert so that i can get a good entree. so i CERTAINLY do not want to pay for others' meals that i can't afford. if i could afford to split the bill evenly, i would have bought more stuff!

i think it would be very appropriate to ask the waiter before your order if separate checks are available. if he/she says yes, then just say, "great, is that ok with everyone?" and then tell the waiter to make the checks separate. if anyone says it is not ok and they just want one bill, then just tell the waiter you will take yours separate.

it is NOT FAIR for you to pay for things you DID NOT order. it makes me so mad when everyone just assumes that we can all afford the same things.

[Dcclerk]

That is frustrating, Kate. It sounds like you have received a lot of good suggestions. In my neck of the woods, we always split the check evenly. In fact, just last week, I paid $40 for my hamburger and water when others ordered filet mignon and wine. Not fair, but to be expected. Honestly, I can't remember the last time each person paid individually. Initially it was really hard for DH because he always makes his choices by price. When he saw that he had to pay for others, it really bothered him. But since it would be quite hard to change group dynamics, he changed his own mindset. It is now quite freeing for him to order whatever sounds good to him, without regard to price. We don't go out all the time, but it is actually more liberating for him now. I hope you have a better time next time!

[LaurelC]

I have a group of friends that I have dinner with often. In the group, there is always someone who is pregnant, or nursing, or just not drinking for whatever reason, and those who like their wine(or whatever.) We usually just have the server put the alcohol on a seperate tab and then split the food bill evenly.

Then the "drinkers" figure out what to do with the alcohol bill - usually split that evenly between them.

I guess we all figure that we are friends, and it all evens itself out.

[mclianne]

WOW! I had no idea that splitting the bill evenly was such a common thing. I laughed at the Friends episode that was mentioned above because it was a foreign situation to me. i must say that I have lived in Maryland, Texas, Arkansas, Nebraska, Florida, and Indiana and have never simply split the bill evenly. There are always people that order more drinks or more expensive food and it just doesn't seem fair that everyone else subsidizes them.

I don't drink alcohol, often drink water, and often order vegetarian. Usually my bill is less than others in the group. I must be cheap because I wouldn't want to chip in for others Filet Mingon (however you spell it!) and more expensive drinks. Paying $5 extra is doable, but $10-15 extra evertime would make me think twice about continuing to attend.

Usually we ask for separate checks and if that isn't an option, then the bill gets p[assed around and everyone estimates their share and pays it plus some extra for tip.

Maybe suggest the separate checks next time right off the bat...

[KrisM]

It's somewhat handy. And, at least, we don't have to break out the calculator...we just do the math in our head.

[ett]

I had no idea that some many people would simply split the bill evenly at the end. When I eat out in groups, we always pay for what we ordered and then add in a couple of dollars for tax and tips. The only time we would share is if we were sharing entrees and even then, people that ordered drinks would usually chip in a little extra. It seems unfair to split the bill evenly when you haven't been drinking. I don't drink either and usually only order water so if we split the bill evenly, I would always lose out at the end.

[JacksMommy]

I will say that in general I am for splitting the bill evenly unless there is a huge disparity in what people ordered. When you tally things up individually I find there is often someone who doesn't give as much as they should (usually due to not calcualating enough for tax and tip, or assuming their drink was less than it was or whatever) and then whoever is collecting the checks either winds up pushing people to pony up more (and often it's not the offender who winds up covering the difference) or paying the difference themselves. But I would never have a problem if someone wanted to have separate checks, so that sounds like a good way to go.

Kate, I don't think there is one right way to approach this next time. I can see where you might feel awkward saying it to a whole group of people you don't know well, so you might be more comfortable speaking with your closer friend in advance of the evening. Then she can chime in when you bring it up (or if you feel really uncomfortable and she knows the others better, she might even be able to bring it up.)

Good luck - let us know how it goes!

Laurel
Working Mama to Jack, 6/4/02
EDD #2 12/24/02

[Kate888]

Again, THANKS for sharing your thoughts and experiences!! This is the first time I encountered the problem, too. From my past experiences with friends, people who drink wine or order more expensive meals just chip in a few more dollars, so the difference isn't that big. I also avoid ordering lobster when everyone else is ordering pastas ;) I wouldn't feel comfortable if someone is paying for my filet mignon.

Thanks for all your help and support!! :)

Kate
Mama to Maya 2-17-02 and Polo (my big black dog)http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/dog.gif


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