My toddler: napping early but not often

[lmintzer]

Joshua is down to 1 nap per day as is typical of a baby/toddler his age (20, almost 21 months). However, he did the backwards thing and dropped the p.m. nap. His brother did the same thing, and it took a long, long time for him to shift to the p.m. I think he was still napping around 11:30 or noon even at his second b-day. It's all a blur now.

Joshua wakes up for the day around 6:15 a.m. (yuck!) and starts looking tired around 9:30 a.m. If we're busy, he can make it to 10/10:30, but that's it. If I get him in at the right time (before he's too tired), he'll sleep a good long time--sometimes even up to 2 3/4 hours. I wound up having to wake him at 12:45 to pick Jack up from camp this summer. I felt so badly--he was so sleepy still and that was it for the day.

We have a 4 week break between camp and school. I'm wondering if I can push him 15 minutes/day (or maybe even 15 every other day) until we shift to a p.m. nap. Part of me really wants this, as Jack still naps most days, and then I can have a break in the afternoon as well as not having to worry about school pick up. But I can also see how truly exhausted Joshua looks in the morning--it feels wrong on some level not to respect that. We do our little pre-nap routine, and he goes down so peacefully, cuddling up with his lovey.

Anyone else have a toddler who just seems to need to nap early? What do you do when s/he tired around 4 p.m.? (We ususally do a video or a car ride to somewhere so he can rest.) Have you had any luck in trying to shift them?

The other issue with this early nap is bedtime. Joshua probably really needs to be in bed by about 6:45 p.m. Needless to say, we just don't make it. We try to eat dinner with dh at about 6:15 (on days he gets home that early), and if we do a bath afterward, it's more like 7:15 or even 7:30. Sometimes I can swing a bath before dinner, but sometimes not, since the late afternoon is literally the only "nap-free zone" in our house. Otherwise we'd be toal hermits and never get out to do anything or see anybody.

Sorry for the long-winded posts about not-so-heavy subjects undeserving of this much attention this morning. I don't know what happened to my ability to be concise.

[jbowman]

Lisa,

I could have written this post about Ellie. She gets up very early (5:45 am this morning!) and, as a result, naps early as well. She usually goes down b/t 10:30-11:30. Often I try to feed her an early lunch (around 11) and 7 times out of 10, she'll fall asleep in her highchair! The only way to get her to "last" longer before the nap is to go out when she's still alert in the morning and return around noon (and then carefully unbuckle her from her car seat and deposit her in her crib). I have been trying to push her nap back, with little success--for example, I pushed her nap until noon on Friday and she slept for 30 minutes (only to fall asleep on the living room floor at 3:30 and sleep for two hours, LOL).

Usually I try to take her swimming late in the afternoon or try to run an errand. I used to let her watch a video, but we are desperately trying to make our home an Elmo-free zone, LOL.

FWIW, Ellie goes to bed b/t 7-7:30, so I think that it sounds as if Joshua and Ellie's schedules are pretty similar. Although occasionally she stays up a little later (like on our recent vacations), she needs the early bedtime (b/c of the early wake/nap times). We have had no luck pushing her bedtime later (and frankly I need the evenings to work, so that's not happening).

I know I've been absolutely no help (and very long-winded, sorry!), but I just wanted you to know that you are not alone and I'll be following this thread for ideas!

[lmintzer]

Wow--Ellie falls asleep in the high chair and on the living room floor? Those are unheard of sleep places my house. I had to chuckle reading this--I'm sure it looks cute even though it is less than ideal.

I guess these little guys are just not ready. You are ahead of me with the 11 a.m. time. We only made it until 10 today.

To be honest, I wouldn't really care if he was my only child right now. It's more a matter of trying not to spend the whole day at home with someone napping.

I get a bit frustrated when I hear about parents who just "decide" it's time for the nap to be at a certain time. That just doesn't seem to work with my kiddos. If I don't follow their lead, at least to some extent, I usually pay.

I've thought about allowing a cat nap in the a.m. (under an hour) and then doing a real nap in the p.m., but I don't know how to achieve only a cat nap unless I wake him.

Glad to know I'm not alone. I'm sure they'll grow out of this (my first one did). It's just hard for now.

[jbowman]

>Wow--Ellie falls asleep in the high chair and on the living
>room floor? Those are unheard of sleep places my house. I had
>to chuckle reading this--I'm sure it looks cute even though it
>is less than ideal.

Indeed it's not ideal, but I am so tired these days, that I let my "sleeping toddler lie" on Friday and I took a nap too! Sometimes I can move her and sometimes I can't, so I let her stay on the floor. I can usually move her from the high chair easily, so that's not a big deal.

>To be honest, I wouldn't really care if he was my only child
>right now. It's more a matter of trying not to spend the whole
>day at home with someone napping.

I almost addressed that in my post--since it's just Ellie, it's not that big of a deal to me. I can understand, though, why it is so frustrating for you. I keep thinking about what it will be like when #2 comes around in January!

>I get a bit frustrated when I hear about parents who just
>"decide" it's time for the nap to be at a certain time. That
>just doesn't seem to work with my kiddos. If I don't follow
>their lead, at least to some extent, I usually pay.

ITA! That sounds like my situation! Ellie has not been a great napper since day #1 (I remember when she was about 4 or 5 months old, I was fixing dinner while she was in her bouncy seat--I looked over and she had fallen asleep and I remember thinking: so this is what it's like when your child ACTUALLY naps! LOL!).

>Glad to know I'm not alone. I'm sure they'll grow out of this
>(my first one did). It's just hard for now.

I agree--it makes it hard!

[chlobo]

My DD is the same way. She's 21 months. Today she got up at 5am. Then fell asleep for her nap at 9:30. She goes to bed around 8pm so doesn't seem to need as much sleep. We've tried and earlier bedtime without much success.

If DD get's up at a more reasonable hour (6am) I can usually "push" her until 11:30. However, her naps are often 1 hr or may 1.5 hrs if I'm really lucky and let her sleep on my lap for the later part. It can get very frustrating.

I feel for you with two. It must be very difficult not having them on the same schedule. And I know what you mean about those "other" parents who are just able to put their kids on a schedule. There is a woman in my playgroup who has two sets of twins and the younger set naps once in the am and then will nap in the afternoon at 2pm, same as the older set. My DD would never let me be that rigid. She naps when she wants on her own schedule. But I am a bit of a pushover.

[mudder17]

Ooh, that sounds like a really tough situation especially because your sons are on such different schedules. Kaya is on a 5:00/5:30 p.m. - 6:00 a.m. schedule with a nap at around 10:00 (or that's the way it has been for the last 5 months. But lately, she's been fighting going down so early and last week, she actually played through two of her naps. So we've been following her lead on this one and we are now trying to put her down for a nap around 11:00 (except it's 12:30 on Sundays). Since I did that, things are working out a little better, except now I'm thinking her bedtime will be closer to 6 rather than 5.

With Kaya's early bedtime, we've definitely been limited to mid to late afternoons being a nap-free zone, and we always have to hurry home to get her down in time for bedtime. So I definitely feel for you! Since she's pushing her nap time a little later, I'm hoping that now we'll have a window of being able to go out both in the morning and the afternoon!


Eileen

http://www.mothering.com/discussions/images/smilies/candle.gif for Leah

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_gold_12m.gif , 17 months & counting


http://tickers.baby-gaga.com/t/catcatcvi20040222_4_Kaya+is.png

[TraciG]

I was going to post something similar. Sydney wakes up around 6:45 -7:00 , she has been napping in the morning but dropping the afternoon nap , but her morning nap has gotten later, it's been around 11:30 BUT she still sleeps the same amount of time, not 2 to 3 hours like I "thought they're supposed to do " today was the first day I didn't even put her in in the afternoon ( I put her nap off today until after lunch ) she slept only an hour & 20 minutes & was EXHAUSTED & crazed pretty early ( my parents were here, I wasn't home for a few hours ) anyway she fell asleep almost instantly at 7:30, her usual bedtime is about 8:00.

Funny Sydney has a doc appointment tomorrow, I was planning on asking him about this, dont know if I should be having her nap after lunch or still try to the 2 naps.

Sydney is also 21 months

It must be SO HARD having 2 kids & dealing with naps !!!!!!!!

[lmintzer]

Traci,
Maybe you could try moving Sydney's bedtime earlier? It sounds like she is dropping to one nap and is doing a good job shifting toward afternoon (much better than Joshua). If you move her bedtime earlier (by 20 mins./night) until you find the time that seems right, you might be able to combat some of the exhaustion in this transition time. If, after going to bed at 7:30 tonight, she isn't less tired during the day tomorrow, try her at 7:10 (roughly). She SHOULD sleep just as long in the a.m. and may be able to weather the day with 1 nap better.

Joshua went to sleep for the night at a little after 7 tonight. He was already overtired by this time, but my inlaws were here, and we were grilling for dinner, so that's the best we could do. I did his bath before dinner which helped some.

Hope ALL of these babies settle into a better routine soon!

[TraciG]

wow that was nice that u replied to me since I feel I hijacked your thread, telling my problems as I'm reading your's !

I really like Sydney to take 2 naps, BUT that seem's to not be happening a lot of the time lately . The problem I have is every Friday we go to in-laws & are out late, Sydney goes to bed 10:30 - 11:00 those nights so that day I NEED her to nap later in the afternoon, I am worried that when she does sleep one nap that it will be MUCH harder for her to be up soooooo late, also this week & next are tough, DH 's family from CA. will be here so I'm afraid we'll be going out during the week YUK !!!!!!!!!!!

Normally I wouldn't mind an earlier bedtime but the next 2 weeks willbe hard so I am praying she'll sleep 2 naps, seem's unlikely though :(


Do u find when your kids go to bed late or are overtired that they dont sleep well or wake in the middle of the night ? This happens with Sydney, I am betting that she'll be crying later on & having a hard time going back to sleep.

[lmintzer]

Hi Traci. Yep, when my kids go to bed late or are overtired, they won't do as well with future sleeping. Joshua might wake up at night (and he's finally sleeping through most nights--thank goodness), and both will wake up at the exact same time in the morning. Just now at 4, Jack is STARTING to sleep in if he up late. But he is not at all consistent.

Staying up late also messes up naps for the next day. The rule "sleep begets sleep" certainly holds true in our house.

I don't know what to tell you about the difficulties you have juggling Sydney's sleep and your family's expectations. I know it's been a challenge for you. If it were me, I would just say something like, "This is hard on my child. She isn't ready to be up this late. All kids are different--some are more flexible in this way and some aren't". You could try to put her to sleep at your inlaws' house in a pack and play and transfer her to the car when you are ready to go home. Maybe if you made a routine of it (put her in pjs, brush teeth, do books/songs, or whatever you typically do at home), she would get used to it. It might take a few weeks for it to feel familiar enough to work. How long of a drive is it to their place? Would you consider her staying over night there if the transfers don't work? That's a slightly "out there" idea, but if you are really serious about keeping sleep consistent through this 2 to 1 nap transition, then you might want to try this (of course, they have to be open to the idea).

Weissbluth says that 90% of toddlers have dropped at nap by, I think, 22 (23?) months. So what our little ones are going through is totally typical. It's just not fun while it's happening.

Good luck--I have to go attend to my already-tired boy (and it's only 9:00 a.m.).

[muskiesusan]

Lisa, I have no advice, but wanted to chime in that we are going through the same thing here. I have tried hard to delay Alex's nap to when Nick has his "quiet time" (he is very random on the nap these days, but I need a break!), but it almost always backfires on me. If I hold him off too much, then he is just too tried to fall asleep, but if he naps in the morning and then isn't tired until 4, well, that isn't a good time for him to take another nap for a host of reasons. He is usually in bed by 6, which makes us even more house bound!

Hope it gets better soon!

ETA-Alex tends to wake up about 6, and Nick 8-these times are pretty consistent no matter what time they go to bed. I wish they were more in sync!

Susan
Mom to Nick 10/01
& Alex 04/04

[TraciG]

When Sydney was an infant we used to put her to bed at MIL's then wake her when we we're going home ( when we woke her, she'd be in the best mood ! ) Now there is too much action, she'd never want to sleep there , I dont think !!! We live about 20 minutes away from MIL, as long as it's only one night it's ok, it's just the next week we might be out more & definitely this Friday will be real late, if I can I'll even let Sydney nap passed 5:00, ( normally I try not to let her sleep passed 4 :00 )


Today I had to wake her to go to the doc at 12:30, before lunch, she never napped again, I tried around 3:45 but I put her to bed early, she was asleep by 7:15 !

No the transition isn't fun, I dont like changes, our whole routine will have to change !

How are your kiddos ??

[KCR4]

My two boys are the same! DS #1 (7/01) and DS #2 (10/03) dropped their p.m. naps as young toddlers. DS #2 is usually asleep around 11 am for his nap. On days like today, when DS #1 skips his nap, it works great as long as we can do dinner at 5 pm and bath at 6 pm, they are both asleep at 7 pm!

And....I was going to ask if you can get out in the afternoon time on days DS #1 skips nap? We did today - it worked great. The little guy napped 10:30 a.m. - 12:30 p.m. and then we blasted out of here. Went downtown to the aquarium and were there from 1 - 4 pm! Yes, I showed them a DVD on the ride home to keep 'em both awake (a special treat in our minivan). And yes, they were both asleep at 7 pm for the night.

On the other hand, I was so irritated about it last week. We were trying to go to a mall with a carousel and of course by the time it opens at 10 am, the little guy is already exhausted and grumpy and ready to sleep. And I'd been letting him watch Noggin starting at 6 am to keep him quiet so he didn't wake up the rest of the house. It's like "could you please just sleep a little later so we can actually do something before your nap????"

Too funny - I rarely meet people with such early napping toddlers!
Karen

[miki]

My DD is almost 2 now and just a few months ago she was waking at the crack of dawn and taking her nap maybe around 11am. But I knew she would be going to preschool from 9-noon in the fall so I've been working on pushing the nap back. I don't know whether it's what I've done or just that she's older now, but now she wakes for the day around 7:30am (today a really late 8am). She's tired enough for a nap at noon but I try to keep her busy until 12:30 or 1pm. But the flipside is that she used to have that very early bedtime and I'd have most of the evening free (for all that unfolded laundry). Now she doesn't go to bed until at least 8:30pm. But if she has a short nap and gets tired (cranky) mid-afternoon, sometimes she will ask for a rest in her crib or I'll let her watch a video or we'll go grocery shopping so she can be wheeled around in a cart.