Warning: morbid post about my ethical conundrum

[mamato1]

Ok I know this is a pretty morose topic, but I am not sure with whom to even talk this out and I really value and trust the opinions offered here. So, here goes. I was raised Catholic and have since done a 180 degree turn and while I still consider myself a Christian I am by no means a practicing member of any church. With the birth of DS it became apparent to me and DH that we need to start preparations in case of death. We have picked guardians for DS and worked out the money details and all of that. What remains is the plans for our funerals and remains. I feel very strongly that I not be buried. Everyone in my family has been buried and my mom has a purchased plot next to my dad (he died when I was young.) Of course my family would prefer that I do the whole casket/burial in a Catholic cemetery thing, but I am not willing to bend on that. So, all along I have been pretty certain that I just wanted to be cremated and have the ashes scattered in a location of my family's choice. I have made it very clear that I want any possibly usable organ donated. Since then I have begun to really feel that I would like to donate my remains to science. It seems like a helpful thing to do, and in many ways would be a legacy that I could be proud of rather than being fertilizer for a tree IYKWIM. When I mentioned this to my mom and sister they freaked out. They begged me not to do this and I told them I would consider their thoughts. FWIW DH does not have an opinion and is OK with whatever I decide. So do I go with my gut and check into donating my remains to science or do I respect my family's wishes and go ahead and plan for cremation?

Chris

Mama to Brendan (aka Boomer) 01/04


http://b3.lilypie.com/FnI6m5/.png

[searchdog]

That is a tough one, but from my understanding bodies that are donated to science can still be cremated later the remains sent to the family after they are done with the research. So if this was truly an option would that make it easier for your family???

[maestramommy]

I'm not a Catholic so I can't advise you on that, but I do think that wanting to donate your organs is a wonderful thing.

[bubbaray]

Whatever you decide, make sure you put it in your will, so your family can't do whatever they want (if that ends up conflicting with your wishes).

Good luck with your decision!


Melissa

http://b3.lilypie.com/rppJm7/.png[/img][/url]

[deenass]

With regard to donating your organs PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE sign the back of your driver's license (and have it witnessed as required) and be VERY vocal about your wishes to your family with regard to that topic, it is a GIFT that you can give another family.

[aliceinwonderland]

Honestly, I have zero preference over what happens to my body after I die.

But I am sure DH and DS (if I were to go before them) would have certain ideas. I know I do not want to be pumped full of chemicals for a showing or what have you (do they make organic embalming fluids? LOL), but if it was important to them, then they can do that to. My thinking is that the funeral is primarily for those left behind, not for the one who departed already.

I have very specific ideas, for example, of what I will do if my husband were to go before me. Which of course, he has no permission to do :)

[mamato1]

Thansk, already had been done and I have a living will with VERY explicit instructions about when to pull the plug and donate!

Chris

Mama to Brendan (aka Boomer) 01/04


http://b3.lilypie.com/FnI6m5/.png

[kijip]

>Ok I know this is a pretty morose topic, but I am not sure
>with whom to even talk this out and I really value and trust
>the opinions offered here. So, here goes. I was raised
>Catholic and have since done a 180 degree turn and while I
>still consider myself a Christian I am by no means a
>practicing member of any church. With the birth of DS it
>became apparent to me and DH that we need to start
>preparations in case of death. We have picked guardians for
>DS and worked out the money details and all of that. What
>remains is the plans for our funerals and remains. I feel
>very strongly that I not be buried. Everyone in my family has
>been buried and my mom has a purchased plot next to my dad (he
>died when I was young.) Of course my family would prefer that
>I do the whole casket/burial in a Catholic cemetery thing, but
>I am not willing to bend on that. So, all along I have been
>pretty certain that I just wanted to be cremated and have the
>ashes scattered in a location of my family's choice. I have
>made it very clear that I want any possibly usable organ
>donated. Since then I have begun to really feel that I would
>like to donate my remains to science. It seems like a helpful
>thing to do, and in many ways would be a legacy that I could
>be proud of rather than being fertilizer for a tree IYKWIM.
>When I mentioned this to my mom and sister they freaked out.
>They begged me not to do this and I told them I would consider
>their thoughts. FWIW DH does not have an opinion and is OK
>with whatever I decide. So do I go with my gut and check into
>donating my remains to science or do I respect my family's
>wishes and go ahead and plan for cremation?


Well, let's just hope that your children settle your affairs many, many decades from now and that your mother does not have to bury/cremate her daughter! Honestly, I would proceed as I wished without making a big deal to the people I know would panic about it due to relgious concerns. I figure my grandmother would have a heart attack if she realized that my will states a "burial" that is direct opposition to the Catholic faith. My parents are not wild about it either but they (parents and grandmother) are 26-60 years older than me. The chances that they will even have to deal with that are slim. In that unlikely case, my will and my spouse will have to speak for me. Donate your body to science, make the arrangments to get it done (see about cremation afterwards) and don't stress yourself or your family about it.

[AddiesMom]

As for cremation after donation of body to science: I recently saw an obituary in the paper for a young woman's funeral... she died last year and donated her body to research and that is why the obituary was running again in the paper for her funeral.

[psophia17]

My very Catholic parents are both leaving their bodies to science, at least they were the last time we discussed it. So far as I know, their funerals will still be held in their parish, at the Catholic church, and I don't think it was a dilemma for anyone...

[lisams]

Personally I would go with what you want. I don't think I would even bring it up, that gives family a chance to chime in on what they think should happen with *your* body. If it does come up, you could ask for them to respect your wishes as you do theirs.

[Zansu]

Both of DH's maternal grandparents donated their bodies to science. We got the ashes back. So both you and your family will get what they want (sort of).

The story: Grandpa went first, and Grandma got a lovely card from the medical school thanking her.

Some weeks after Grandma died (several years after Grandpa died), we got a call saying we could come pick her up. Lo and behold, we got Grandpa back too! They'd found him on a shelf when they'd gone to get Grandma from storage.

They both rode in the back of my truck for a few days, until the family get-together during which the ashes were partially distributed in a state park (probably illegal, btw). The remainder of the ashes were taken to Boston, where DH and his siblings made ash-balls (snow and ash) and tossed them into a pond.

Needless to say, we have an irreverent attitude towards death around here.;-)

[aliceinwonderland]

"Needless to say, we have an irreverent attitude towards death around here"

LOL. We do too :) I once thought of the romantic notion of having my ashes spread over the Atlantic, but then I thought of the time and effort and expense and decided I wasn't worth it ;)

[kedss]

I would stick to my guns, your burial or non burial is up to you.

Big hugs!

[dr mom]

The majority of my knowledge of human anatomy was acquired in my medical school anatomy lab, studying donated bodies, long before I was doing procedures on living patients. I'm deeply grateful to those individuals and families who were willing to donate their bodies to science - studying a photo in a textbook is just NOT the same as hands-on learning. Remains were handled respectfully in the anatomy lab, and were creamated and returned to the family (if desired) at the end of the year. We also had a memorial service every spring which all the students and instructors attended, and families were of course invited to join us. It was a nice way for families to see how their loved one's generous anatomic donation had contributed in a very meaningful way toward medical education and science. Needless to say, I'm a big fan of going the organ donor/anatomic gift route. :)

Ideally you will outlive your mom, bury her in the fashion she has obviously shown a strong preference for, and have your children carry out YOUR wishes, many many decades from now.

[KBecks]

I'm not sure I get the question, but I think you should have done what you want with your body. So if it's going to science, so be it.

If you care about Catholic tradition, I'm sure you can find a reference on the Internet about what the rules are about donating your body to science. I dont' know the specifics, but maybe if it's OK by the church, that will ease the minds of your mom and sis.

Frankly, your mom will likely not be alive when you die. Your sis might be, but her opinion is not as important as your immediate family's peace with the final arrangements.

HTH,

[cmdunn1972]

All of my grandparents were Catholic (as are we), and they donated their bodies to science. (They had Catholic Memorial Masses said for them when they died.) FWIW, the Catholic church has no problem with donating one's body to science, so the only ethical dilemma is your own family's tradition of using the family plot.

No one in my family has been cremated, so I don't have a clue what the Catholic church specifies regarding that. I can't imagine it would be much different than donating one's body to science, though. (My Dad keeps saying that he'd like to be cremated and have his ashes dispersed at the Grand Canyon, but I think there are laws against doing that at a national park so he's SOL.)

Your decision isn't so much a religious one as it is a question of whether or not you choose to follow family tradition. Honestly, that's a question that you and your family should discuss together. It's probably good that you're talking about it while you're young so that they can get accustomed to the idea since they feel so strongly about it.

The worst thing is for you and your family to continue to butt heads over this until you die, and then for your family to refuse to honor your wishes in favor of their own. The way you avoid this is through compromise.

I know you're not religious, but funeral and memorial services are more for the survivors. Would it really hurt you much if they had a Catholic Memorial Mass said for you? If you're cremated or donate your body to science your body wouldn't even be there. Maybe there are compromises such as that that could be made with your family.

I also would advise avoiding discussing the topic with your parents unless you have to. It's hard enough for parents to imagine their children dead, let alone manage controversy surrounding your last wishes. Of course, you should be clear with your decision with your siblings, your DH, and your child(ren), since they will most likely survive you.

HTH!

[mamato1]

I appreciate all of your input, you have given me a lot of food for thought. I know many of you think that I might be a little silly to worry about this so early. But, with my dad's young death I think it weighs more heavily on my mind than most. Thanks again.


Chris

Mama to Brendan (aka Boomer) 01/04


http://b3.lilypie.com/FnI6m5/.png

[ykc]

I agree with PPs that you should do what feels right for you and your husband, while respecting and considering the wishes of the rest of your family.

FWIW, I think it is a wonderful gift to donate your body to science. If you live near a medical school, you can probably get information from them about what happens exactly--most schools have an Anatomic Gift program coordinator who can answer any questions you might have. I don't think it's possible to have individual cremations, but I believe the remains are usually cremated--I'm not sure what happens to the ashes. Most places have a memorial service at the end of the year for those who donated their bodies. Families are also often invited to the memorial service. The service at my school was very moving. The students and researchers who benefit truly are very appreciative of the donor's gift.