Bratz Dolls

[Fairy]

I'm very interested in how our community feels about the Bratz dolls. I was inspired by yesterday's episode of Boston Legal. I purposely created a poll that asks you to choose a side; no inbetween. The question is not if your kids play with them, but if you would allow them to own one or not, whether purchased by you or given by someone else.

[Wife_and_mommy]

I've never seen a show so don't know what they're about. I dress myself and my dc's pretty modestly and am horrified that these dolls' dress is marketed to young(meaning under 16) girls. They might be fine and dandy but I can't look past their IMO ugly/raunchy appearance to see that.

My just-turned-6YO niece has their posters all over her room and I find it quite disturbing but my sis isn't as conservative as I am.

http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_gold_12m.gif[/img][/url] http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_gold_12m.gif[/img][/url]

I love them most when they are sleeping.--Me
http://b4.lilypie.com/HSUwm4.png
http://b2.lilypie.com/UgAXm5.png

[Fairy]

I think these dolls are kind of reprehensible. They encourage almost nothing of value. Now lots of toys do nothing to encourage anything worthwhile, but for me, the difference is that Bratz dolls actually go a long way to encourage negative behavior.

1. Let's start with their name. Bratz. The name itself tells kids it's fun to be bad.

2. Like they said on the show last night, these dolls (ok, their fictional version were called Tarties), these are HookerDolls. They're dressed so provocatively that if I saw a person dressed that way on the street, my first reaction would be to wonder how much for basic service?

3. Some of the specific lines of Bratz are really questionable.

4. They're targeted at children, not teens, little kids, and I've seen 3 year olds at my daycare carrying them around. Not one 3-year-old. More. The foster blatant sexualization of girls, cuz these obviously are not women, and then they're pushed on the child demographic. Unbelieveable.

5. Finally, these dolls are obviously "mean girls." And I don't ever want my child to be one of them.

So, how is this different from Barbie's big over-sized boobs? Very different. In countless ways. That said, I don't support banning them from being made or sold. But we ain't partakin'.

-- Fairy

[ellies mom]

My niece wanted one for Christmas this year. Between those and the trampy My Scene barbie brand dolls, there was almost no room on the shelves for plain old fashioned well-endowed Barbie. After several shopping trips, I almost broke down and bought on of the sports Bratz dolls until I read on the back, "It isn't just how well you play the game but how hot you look playing it" Yeah, I put it back. I figure she's got plenty of other relatives who can buy her slut dolls. I'm having no part of it.

[jenjenfirenjen]

ITA!!! Except I really do support banning them from being made or sold. I do not see any value in this dolls at all; just tons of problems with the sexualization of young girls. I especially hate how they seem to be aimed at certain ethnic groups who really do not need women to be any more demeand than they already are.

[elliput]

LOL! I happened to see this article on MSN today. http://health.msn.com/pregnancykids/kidshealth/articlepage.aspx?cp-documentid=100160211&GT1=9303

Personally, I find the dolls comically ugly with their odd facial and body proportions. The brand name alone is enough to make me not even walk down that aisle in the toy department, and I see no value in my DD owning one.

[egoldber]

I used to feel strongly in the first category. I've now moved into the second category. While I wouldn't encourage her to want one, if she really, really, really wanted one I would consider buying her one. If someone bought her one, I wouldn't make a big deal over it. Honestly, I'd be more concerned about what other moms would think of *me* than I would about the doll itself.

IMO, the toys your kids play with have no influence compared to what we as parents have as role models. So if *I* have poor body image and project that, then I can get DD all the most normalized body image dolls in the world and it won't make a bit of difference. And I don't think that playing with a doll that wears trendy clothes and make-up will make my daughter have a poor self image or low morals, however one might define that to be.....

[lisams]

I think they're ugly, and really wouldn't want them around my house. Luckily DD really isn't into those kinds of dolls (she got a Barbie for her birthday and hasn't played with it once).

I wouldn't buy one, and if someone got one for DD I'd let her decide what she wants to do with it. I wouldn't ban them, but I also wouldn't encourage liking them.

[Sillygirl]

Bratz dolls are one reason I'm really, really glad I have two sons.

[gatorsmom]

ITA. And this is how I voted. On the other hand, as another poster mentioned, parents can go along way in helping their child see the parent's viewpoint- not the message given by the marketing company. I remember when I was little I wanted the "Sea Wees" mermaid dolls. I thought they were cute. But I remember my mom saying to me, "do you really want them? They look kind of silly and not very exciting." As a little girl who adored her mom, that changed my opinion of them immediately. I remember that.

I don't have daughters, just 2 boys, but I find that they are confronted with many images of violent toys that are marketed specifiically for boys. (I often run into this problem with Happy Meal toys). I take the opportunity to talk to my child about the toy. "This looks like a mean toy, doesn't it? We don't like mean toys or mean people, do we? It has a gun/laser/baton and those can hurt people can't they? We have to be very careful not to hurt someone, don't we?" This can be really effective.

I think with many things in life, there is a risk that if you ban these objects without letting the child have any exposure to them, this makes the object more interesting. Sometimes it just takes a small experience with the toy for the child to realize the toy isn't that "cool" after all.

That said, it sure would make our lives as parents easier if this crap wasn't introduced into the market to begin with, wouldn't it?
Lisa
Mom to Gator July 2003
And Cha-Cha July 2005

[Jenn98]

thanks for the link to the article. VERY interesting.

[Jenn98]

Read the article posted above. It's influencing the boys, too, unfortunatley.

[Fairy]

ITA with everything you said! Especially the discussions about the happy meal toys. Excellent.

[o_mom]

Two boys so far, but I wouldn't allow a girl to have one. I have gotten the 'Groovy Girls' for my nieces and that seems to fill the need for them.

[KBecks]

I've seen the dolls and I don't see them as being that different from Barbie. I think playing with the dolls is OK as long as the children are otherwise balanced and grounded kids, and the kids are just playing, not buying into some sort of value message.

I don't watch Boston Legal.

[KBecks]

I agree, I'm much more concerned with parents who are obsessed with telling their daughters that they are pretty, or that they need to look good to have value and be loved. Or that girls can't be smart, do math, play sports, or lead the world, blah blah blah.

[KBecks]

Very good article, and here's a good quote that applies to the poll:

...It’s certainly worth trying to limit children’s exposure to inappropriate media, music, clothing, etc., but experts agree that the most important thing parents can do is communicate with their children. “Help them to recognize and go beyond these stereotypes,� says Levin. “Don’t just say ‘no’ to something, since that cuts you off from discussion.�

[klwa]

I voted in the "Wouldn't let my child have one" although with just 1 son, I don't have this issue. Yet. I know my SIL who has a 6 yo daughter has been fighting this issue for a while. She finally allowed my niece to get one from another SIL, but she had to see it and approve of the clothes before it could be bought.

Oh, & gatorsmom, thanks for reminding me about SeaWees. :) I had 3 of them. Right now, my mom still has them at her house, and they've been great tub toys for me, my 3 nieces, my 2 nephews, and now my son. If my parents weren't moving to a house with no tub, they'd probably also be there for my youngest niece & any future children. Hmm... Wonder if I get those when they move.....
-Kris

[o_mom]

The violent toys for boys thing really gets me too. I am amazed at kids 2-3 yo who have toy guns and want to play war or fight all the time. These kids also watch some pretty violent TV (IMO), so it is not a big stretch, I guess.

DS1 has no idea of what a gun is, let alone what to do with it. He is perfectly content with non-weapon toys, so I'm not about to introduce him to them just for fun. When he's older we will work something out, but a preschooler just doesn't need that stuff. We get hand-me-down clothes from a couple friend and all the Power Ranger and Ninja Turtle stuff get passed on to Goodwill.

[tarynsmum]

ITA with pretty much everything there. I asked my 4 (now 5) y.o. niece why she liked them, as she's usually very articulate. Her answer? "They're pretty". I asked her if Yasmin (the one she has) was smart, and she said, "Not really, But she's pretty." yep, sums it up for me...

[lilycat88]

I don't plan on buying one and will highly discourage family from providing one either. I'm pretty conservative with toys/dolls and I find them, and their message, horrible. I dislike the name...the clothing...everything. I realized the other day when I saw them in a store that one of the biggest things bothering me about them is the spelling of the name...Brats with a Z. I was brought up by parents who were teachers and refused to go into Toys R Us because of the backwards R. They said it was entirely inappropriate for a store catering to children to spell something wrong or reverse letters. So, the Z...it bothers me.

That being said, I'm totally positive that DD will have some doll/toy some day I consider inappropriate and we'll have to deal with the "just because your doll wears skirts up to her hoohaa, doesn't mean you can" discussion.

[momathome]

Thank you, Beth, I totally agree with what you said. My 9 year-old has them. While I am not thrilled with the general concept of them, they have proven to be absolutely harmelss. I noticed that pretty much everyone who responded negatively to this thread either has boys or girls under the age of 5. It becomes a whole different ball game once you have a dd in elementary school. For the record, my dd is very bright (straigh A's, gifted program), very sweet (asked for donations to a local animal shelter this year instead of birthday gifts), and has very little attitude compared to the typical 9 year-old. She does not dress like a slut and has no aspirations to do so. She reads classic books and loves her American Girl doll even more than the Bratz dolls. They have made no negative impact on her life, she just enjoys playing with them with her friends sometimes.

Think twice before you say never.

[emilyf]

I voted against them, but I'm not there yet obviously. I wasn't allowed to have Barbies when I was a kid, and it wasn't ever an issue. I wouldn't create a huge battle over it though-if she absolutely had to have one, or was given one and became really attached I wouldn't make a huge deal out of it. I just think there are better toys out there.
Emily mom of Charlie born 11/02 and Zoe born 9/05

[cstack]

My DD was a huge Bratz junkie - when they first came out and there were only 4 of them. As far as their clothing, well, I teach (7th grade now, but high school at them time) and I can tell you, the Bratz doll's clothing was downright conservative compared to what the real-life teenagers where wearing.

>3. Some of the specific lines of Bratz are really
>questionable.

Yeah, OK, this is where they got me. This is where they went really over the line. The Bratz kids were bad enough, but BRATZ BABIES?!? These are without a doubt the tackiest things - babies in full makeup and slutty shirts. Yeah, this one's a "no way".

[gatorsmom]

I did end up getting Sea Wees as a birthday present. And I really didn't play with them that much. As a matter of fact, my mother saved almost all our toys from when my brother and I were children so I still have them. I also have all my old Barbies and their outfits still packed in their suitcases. I really hope I have a girl one day because my Barbies are in such excellent condition and I think I would still enjoy playing with them :). But fortunately, I have all my brother's old toys and those are the toys my sons prefer to play with! They prefer them to the new, noisy, light-up toys. I wonder what that means???

I also had GlamourGals- remember those? Ah, I love trips down memory lane...

Lisa
Mom to Gator July 2003
And Cha-Cha July 2005

[dr mom]

I'm glad I have a boy. We don't have to worry about slutty dolls, or for that matter, slutty toddler clothes. When I see a child under the age of 5 wearing pants with "Sexy" emblazoned across the butt, I want to grab the mother and shake some sense into her. Why on earth are we pushing children to grow up so fast, and sexualizing them long before they have matured enough to understand it?

The boy issues tend more toward violent toys. We don't have toy guns, and I've thus far managed to keep most of the "hit first ask questions later" trademarked-superhero-character toys out of the house. Of course, DS still picks up sticks or blocks and pretends that they are swords...I think some of that active rough-and-tumble play must just be imprinted on the Y chromosome!

[crayonblue]

"I'm much more concerned with parents who are obsessed with telling their daughters that they are pretty"

What do you mean by this? I tell my daughters that they are beautiful every single day and I do it on purpose! I do this because my mom NEVER told me I was pretty and to this day I fight feelings of ugliness.

I also tell them they are smart, kind, considerate, etc. But, I think it is very, very positive to a young girl (or an old one like me!) to be told she is pretty. We all want to be beautiful, right?

[KBecks]

It's about balance. Girls can be given balanced messages about beauty, or messages and hints that looking good and being attractive is the most important thing, the most valued thing about womanhood.

[fortato]

I hate them, I don't want them in my house...and I am thrilled that I have a son and I won't have to worry about him wanting them.

And... As we did with that stupid Tickle Me Elmo X... we would bring it directly to Good will... Let someone who wants it have it.

[elephantmeg]

well said Beth!!!!!!!!! Thank you. As a mother of a boy I think I'll stay out of the vote/discussion but your post really hits ALL sorts of toys and decisions we make as parents.

[Fairy]

Lana, I think you and your blue crayon are very very pretty :-)

[Fairy]

Lisa, if your Barbies are in very good condition, you might wanna see what they're worth these days. I do that with my Star Trek collectibles often. Not that I'd ever sell the stuff, but it's fun to know.

I had the Sunshine Family. No one I tell this to remembers them at all, and they think I'm insane and that they never existed. They did! I had the camper!

[Fairy]

To this day, I really don't understand Tickle Me Elmo or X or Y or Z. I mean, I like Elmo, he's cute and fuzzy and everything. But the rage over Tickle Me Elmo I really never quite got. We were asked if we wanted one. We said thanks so much, but no he has one already. We hope they don't go looking for it . . .

[Tracey]

While boys may not be playing with Bratz dolls, they are still being fed a message. Girls have value as sex objects. If your son is five or older, ask him if it is more important for a girl to be pretty or smart and you might be shocked at what you hear...already. Talk to your sons about how boys and girls relate to each other and that girls make good friends too. Tell him that the same qualities that are good for boys to have are good for girls to have---integrity, bravery, compassion, intelligence, etc. Don't be afraid to read him books with female characters as the protagonist. Look for those teachable moments when some image sexualizing girls or women is thrown at him.

As far as the Bratz dolls go, I find them repulsive on all levels. I sincerely doubt DD will want one. I never played with Barbies as a kid. I liked Lite Brite, books, and playing school with stuffed animals. If she starts going over to other people's houses in elementary school and decides she wants these dolls, we'll go in with the discussions and see where to go from there. I won't so "no, and that's final"...but there will definately be a talk about what she likes about the dolls and what she thinks is good about them.

Edited to clarify...I will never willingly buy a Bratz doll of my own accord. She will have to convice me why she should have one. If she can provide a good enough argument, she'll get one.

[kijip]

I have a hard time taking an absolute stance on a doll. It's a doll. I don't like them, they are fugly and silly and I wonder why they are even made BUT:

I worry far more about the fact that they are popular in our culture than about if Toby will ever play with one or banning them. It is not the dolls that promotes a sexualized view of children. It is the culture where kids are sexualized that produces the dolls. Boycotting dolls does not really get to the heart of the cultural problem.

And I will admit it- I bought at least 1/2 a dozen of them this last Christmas for girls that specifically wanted them. I did stick to the pj and sports ones but they were like $6 and high up on a few girls wish lists...it is not my job to police their wants.

[JoyNChrist]

>It is not the dolls that promotes a sexualized view of
>children. It is the culture where kids are sexualized that
>produces the dolls. Boycotting dolls does not really get to
>the heart of the cultural problem.

You said that so well!

That's my main concern too - not that the dolls are having an influence, but what sort of influence caused them to be created in the first place.

Having said that, I think the dolls are absolutely repulsive, and I refuse to buy them as gifts (my neice is in *love* with them, but I just buy her other presents for Christmas/birthdays). But since I don't have a daughter (or a son who's old enough to be influenced by this yet), I can't absolutely say what I would do if my child really really wanted one. But I'll go so far as to say it probably wouldn't happen. They're just too icky for my taste.

[MelissaTC]

ITA. Well said.

[bisous]

I agree with everyone else. I don't love them and I don't know any little girls that do. I HATE the name, the clothes, the attitude etc. What's more I actually LIKE Barbie. This seems very different to me. I can see my niece (now only 4) going on to like these dolls, although at this point she is blissfully ignorant. She loves anything that she considers "pretty" which includes Disney princesses, mermaids, fairies, ballerinas, Barbie and yes the Anaheim Duck Girls (the cheerleaders for the Ducks). The Duck girls are not the epitome of modesty and subtlety to be sure. I know that her parents are worried about her. I've talked to them several times about it and mentioned that I was kind of the same as a little girl. What disturbs me is that little girls don't understand the sexuality of a doll or a cheerleader--all they see is pretty clothes, hair etc. and they want to be like that. I honestly think that the best antidote to something like a Bratz doll might be something like "Veterinarian Barbie" or something like that that is still "pretty" (sorry girls just naturally are attracted to pretty things) but teaches a message of being modest, helpful, and smart too.

Just my two cents,

jen

[Katia]

I remember the Sunshine Family dolls! I loved them! Anyway, I just thought I'd post this in case you need to prove to anyone that they really existed :-)

Katia
DS 2003 and DD 2006

[maestramommy]

I've never seen the show, only the dolls. They look obnoxious. If Dora wants one, tough toenails.

[crayonblue]

Why thank you very much!!! :)

[MayB]

I can't imagine ever buying my DD one, but I'm even more adamantly opposed to all the Princess garbage Disney is constantly foisting on little girls. I don't care how many girls at preschool have Princess everything. I won't buy it for my DD.

[sweetpea]

I think Bratz dolls are disgusting. My nieces love them, much to my sister's dismay.

They remind me of Paris Hilton, or the back-up dancers in trashy music videos. I will never purchase one for dd, and if someone gave her one I would not help her keep track of it and hope it gets lost or forgotten in a grocery cart.

[Melanie]

I don't support banning them, but on the same hand I also don't think they should exist and the only way to keep crap like this out of our kid's lives is to hit them where their wallets are.

My Dollar is my vote and these get a big "NAY!"

[alexsmommy]

>I noticed that pretty much everyone who responded negatively
>to this thread either has boys or girls under the age of 5.

>
>Think twice before you say never.

I noticed this too. I think, like most parenting issues, there tends to be a lot more slippage in the "ideal" standards vs what will really happen when you are faced with weighing out all of the factors with an older child. Not that I think everyone will change their mind when their DD hits 6, but I do think that it won't be as simple as some think it will be if something you disagree with is all the rage with your childs friends. Bratz would have been right up my DSD alley had they been big when she was that age. Luckily, her crowd was into American Girl - pricey, but at least some decent messages there. I also found that my ideals were often at odds with some of DSD's extended family, and gifts I made clear I would prefer not appear in our home would wind up in her bag after an overnight. It made picking my battles very complicated.
I think the important thing is talking, talking, talking. DSD had Barbies, but she also knew what I liked about them (imaginitive play) and what I didn't (large breasts, long hair = pretty). I never bought a single one for her, but lots of people did. I only forbid one that was dressed completely inappropriately. The battle still continues. She purchased one of those monkey message shirts which read, "Rock My World" when she was 11. It went right back to the store, but we also discussed why it was forbidden in our home. At 11, she did not make a sexual connection to the phrase - or the connection she made was more benign than the shirt intended. I used the opportunity to talk about several things including what type of company would market a shirt that means, "Have good sex with me" to young girls. It's not easy parenting in the current marketing climate we live with.


Alaina
Alex Feb '03
and #2 in early summer '07

[hwin708]

I have a 9 year old as well. And while I agree with Beth, I still voted in the first category, and I don't buy the dolls.

I completely agree that it is more about the message the parent sends, and I really don't see a doll scarring my child's self-image.
For me, though, it's the personal ickiness factor. Like someone mentioned above - these dolls look like hookers. I think of them like hookers. I don't give my daughter hooker dolls to play with, any more than I would pimp dolls or drug dealer dolls. And if I did, I'm sure she would play with them in the exact same way she plays with the rest of her dolls, dress them up in their ridiculous outfits, and shove them all in the dollhouse. She wouldn't know or care. But I would. And it squicks me out.

[hwin708]

I completely agree with this.

Even though I'm not completely sold that this these dolls are warping our children's minds, I simply don't like the idea of supporting a company's attempt to market sex to youngsters. The slogan someone mentioned above on the sports doll box, about how it's not so much how you play the game but how good you look playing it... I mean, come on! I don't think my DD will be reading the box and taking this advice to heart over our parenting, but I still think it's sickening that executives sit around a table and decide that the best way to market to girls is to dumb everything down to looks and sex as much as possible. And the more they sell, the more it sends the message to keep on making these kind of toys.

[julieakc]

I only have one child, a son, so I assume he will never ask me for one, but I am, seriously, morally outraged by these dolls. I would never buy one for my child (if I had a DD), or anyone's child no matter how much begging they did.

[mommy111]

Lana, so so so agree with everything you said....for my parents, smart was important, beauty came from inside and pretty was pretty much taken for granted (they are both very good looking people). They never told me I was pretty and I have fought with feeling unattractive/ugly/plain all my life.
I tell my DD every day that she is smart and good AND very, very beautiful.

[purpleeyes]

Yes, I agree that boycotting may not get at the heart of the problem, but if enough parents/guardians/grandparents/gift-givers boycotted these dolls, maybe that would send a good message to the company. Maybe they would remove them from their production lines, and there would be one less sexually suggestive, trashy item marketed to our children, at least.

Beth

[Fairy]

This is a very good post. Very well-said. Thank you, Alaina.