has anyone read The Explosive Child? If so - did it help?

[KarenNYC]

I am frustrated and upset over things that have been going on with DS who is 4 and is in pre-school. The teachers ae telling me that he is causing issues as he just will not listen when he is asked to stop doing whatever they have asked him to stop doing - yelling, spitting/making rasberries, using potty words etc.... They said the other kids stop when asked once or twice and DS not only won't stop but has been yelling and "spitting "at them when he is told to stop. TO's and taking away rewards/punsihments are not working and I am at the end of my rope. I've read The Spirited Child and while it was helpful in a few ways it has not helped me lessen the issues. I have also seen him get frustrated/mad and act this way towards DH and me at home and it just makes me nuts.

The therapist I have seen/spoken with suggested I read The Exploisive Child and before I go nuts hunting it down in the AM - I wanted to get your feedback on it and whether it was worthwhile and helped at all.

I am beyond frustrated and upset about this and I do not know where else to turn. I feel like - why is it always my kid that is a problem? Why am I always the one having to deal with this stuff? am I just a crappy mom? Is this my fault? Do I just yell a lot at home and have such a bad temper that it causes him to act this way or is it, as I suspect, that the teachers for his class are adding fuel to the fire with him.

[gatorruth]

I haven't read the book, but I was SURE you were the mom of a child in my carpool!! This 4 yr old boy sounds just like your DS. He is the only one who sits in 'the yellow chair' (time out chair) at school. I have to literally pull him out of my car bc he wants to look at my baby. He'll scream if he doesn't sit in the right seat. And this is BEFORE he steps foot in school. He spits, yells, throws things, and doesn't help clean up- oh, and did I mention the whining?? (My son likes this boy and we have him over for play dates- only 1 or 2 hours at a time...)

I feel badly for you, but the things I notice with this boy's family are the following- and maybe they apply to you...

1. Both parents work full time and a nanny takes care of the kids after school till 6pm.
2. The parents threaten but don't follow through with their punishments.
3. This child has EVERYTHING- every cool new toy, train set, you name it... and I'm sure he values none of it.

I noticed you potentially place some blame on the teachers-- I suggest that you observe for an hour or 2 to see for yourself. Maybe this school/teacher/teaching philosophy isn't the right fit for your DS.

I am not sure if this will help you, but be assured, you aren't the only one out there with this child!!

Good luck!
Ruth

[gatorruth]

I haven't read the book, but I was SURE you were the mom of a child in my carpool!! This 4 yr old boy sounds just like your DS. He is the only one who sits in 'the yellow chair' (time out chair) at school. I have to literally pull him out of my car bc he wants to look at my baby. He'll scream if he doesn't sit in the right seat. And this is BEFORE he steps foot in school. He spits, yells, throws things, and doesn't help clean up- oh, and did I mention the whining?? (My son likes this boy and we have him over for play dates- only 1 or 2 hours at a time...)

I feel badly for you, but the things I notice with this boy's family are the following- and maybe they apply to you...

1. Both parents work full time and a nanny takes care of the kids after school till 6pm.
2. The parents threaten but don't follow through with their punishments.
3. This child has EVERYTHING- every cool new toy, train set, you name it... and I'm sure he values none of it.

I noticed you potentially place some blame on the teachers-- I suggest that you observe for an hour or 2 to see for yourself. Maybe this school/teacher/teaching philosophy isn't the right fit for your DS.

I am not sure if this will help you, but be assured, you aren't the only one out there with this child!!

Good luck!
Ruth

[julieakc]

It has been HIGHLY recommended to my support group by the facilitor who has read it and is a MFCC. Although behavioral problems are part of DS's syndrome, he doesn't really have any out of the ordinary issues right now which is why I haven't read the book yet, but I plan to one of these days because it sounds like there are strategies that can help everyone.

[Sillygirl]

>>1. Both parents work full time and a nanny takes care of the
>kids after school till 6pm.


And this has what to do with the OP's child's behavior problems? Please, let's not start the "mommy wars" again. A consistent single caregiver, such as a nanny, has not been linked to behavior issues in any meaningful way. I found the implied judgement in your post hurtful and thoughtless.

[stella]

Katie, thank you. I have been struggling over this post myself, but not sure exactly what to say.

[octmom]

Me too.

Jerilyn
DS, 10/03
DD, 3/06

[hez]

Thank you, Katie.

[Laurel]

Me three.

[Puddy73]

Thank you, Katie.

Jennifer
Mommy to Annabelle 9/08/03 & Finn 10/31/05

"If we couldn't laugh, we would all go insane." - Jimmy Buffett

[gatorruth]

I never meant to be hurtful or thoughtless-- the child I know has not had his parents around for much of his little life. How that can't affect his behavior is beyond me. I'm not sure if the OP works or not- nor does that matter. I was just relaying what I've seen IRL. I'm sorry if I offended anyone.

Ruth

[stella]

Ruth, I think that the OP was asking for information about a book or some sources of information about how to help with her son's behavior issues.

The fact that you are acquainted with a difficult child, and have some theories about why he acts the way he does comes across as blaming and offensive to me - and apparently some other members as well.

It is offensive to me because you are blaming the parents' inattention and over-indulgence for the child's behavior issues, which can certainly contribute, but you don't know if the child you speak of may have a diagnosable disorder unrelated to his parents' habits. Or whether his nanny is a loving individual who is the best person the boy's parents could find to care for their child, or whether he does or does not appreciate the nice toys he has.

I did not see how your post was responsive to the OP's question, and it really struck a nerve with me - a mom doing the best I can to raise responsible, loving, happy children - who, by the way, are cared for by a nanny while their dad and I work to support our family. I know a lot of children with SAHMs who act out regularly as well. I think so much depends on the child's temperament.

I appreciate that you didn't mean to be offensive, but I hope you aren't mystified about why it came across that way.

[ShanaMama]

I agree that Ruth's reply did not answer the OP's question, but I'd have to say I agree with her point. The OP was asking for a specific book review but did suggest that her parenting might contribute to her DS' behavioral issues. While I have no idea if it does or not, I think she's courageous & wise to ask herself those questions. In our PC society (& yes, that includes the culture on these boards) we are very quick to diagnose children with all kinds of disorders and very slow to look at the environment in which they are being raised.
Let me be very clear. I am not saying the two are mutually exclusive or that parents are to blame for every or even some disorders that affect children. We are lucky to have the tools available to diagnose & help children with all different issues. However, I think that in certain instances, parenting styles/ choices/ lack of support or tools, etc. can contribute to the child's difficulty. I can say with certainty that the root of my DH's anxiety disorder is because of his parents' anxiety, low self esteem, lack of parenting skills, & lack of support to deal with these issues.
This is something I think about often. I WOH FT & have been sending my DD to a group daycare situation since she was 5 months old. The DCP has many children under her care, and can't possibly be giving my DD the amount or quality of attention that I do. However, this is the best arrangement for us for the time being. I think that 8-9 hours a day is too long for a newborn to be cared for by a stranger. That's my personal opinion, not a judgement on others who make these choices. In fact, I make that same choice. Currently, my DD (2 yo) is doing very well, and it's a short term arrangement. However, if I had a child with a different temperament, or if I have a newborn, I might very well have to make changes in my life.
Could I be worse as a SAHM than a WOHM? Possibly. I don't think Ruth was intending to pass judgement on working parents. And neither am I. I feel pretty strongly that this country has seen a break down of the nuclear family, which contributes to our culture in numerous ways. Some may see it as positive, I personally see it as a negative trend which I hope will reverse. I am not afraid of having non-PC views, however I am afraid of saying them so clearly. But every once in a while I just can't resist. I'll go hide under my rock now to observe the fallout.

[octmom]

Karen,

I get spam mail from ParentCenter.com and happened to notice that this was linked to today's newsletter:

http://parentcenter.babycenter.com/expert/preschooler/pdevelopment/70240.html?ccRelLink=&url=%2Fexpert%2Fpreschooler%2Fpbehavior%2F70243.ht ml&xTopic=pbehavschool&bus=content

And I saw this one when I drilled down a little more: http://parentcenter.babycenter.com/refcap/preschooler/pdevelopment/63881.html

Not sure if it will be helpful, but at least you know that you are far from alone!

Jerilyn
DS, 10/03
DD, 3/06

[sdbc]

Isn't this mutually exclusive? "I think that 8-9 hours a day is too long for a newborn to be cared for by a stranger." If it's someone who cares for your child 8-9 hours per day, it can hardly be a stranger! LOL. (Not flaming, just pointing that out).

I do agree with the sentiment that a child cannot have as much attention if there is only 1 caregiver for many children (and the same would be true in a household with a SAHM with many kids). *But* I tend to disagree that this would necessarily lead to behavior problems. My DD is in a home daycare from 9-5 M-F and we have a very strong family bond, and we also have a strong bond with her caregiver. Her behavior hasn't suffered. Kids have different personalities. I've seen both nice behavior and poor behavior coming from home kids and daycare kids, in fairly equal percentages.

Poor behavior, in my opinion would stem mainly from 2 factors: the nature of the child, and caregivers not following through with discipline (teachers or parents). Some kids naturally want to please, and you don't even need to worry about the follow through, and some kids/people are contrary by nature, and then you always need to follow through, and then still it might not be easy!




Sue, mommy to Aurora (Rory) born 5/13/04

[MamaKath]

I have read parts of it, but not all the way through cover to cover. (I don't have the time often to read cover to cover it seems!) I felt it was worthwhile. I also would recommend The Misunderstood Child by Dr. Larry Silver and The Out-of-Sync Child by Carol Stock Kranowitz as books to take a peek at. If you aren't sure about buying them, many Borders have them and a coffe shop where you could take a look. Many library's have at least one of them as well.

I also second the recommendation of taking a closer look at the school. As a parent of an explosive and often out-of-sync kid, I understand that kids can be like oil and water with certain adults (or surroundings, activities, etc.) and in turn act out more!!! I also realize as a teacher that my concerns about kids are often dismissed as being me even when multiple teachers (either within the same year or over a period of years) raise similar concerns. While I might not be a students favorite person, I get to see their colors in a great variety of situations a parent may not. Kids certainly act very different with teachers than they do for their parents!!!

Lastly, once you have done some research, I would encourage you to seek intervention for your child if needed. I am so grateful I pushed for my own child to be tested. A year of intervention with OTs; teachers willing to help make his year better through adjustments when needed, open communication, meeting with specialists; and education for myself about what is going on and how to help has made such a tremendous difference. He actually will test out of about half his current interventions most likely by the end of this month!!!

You certainly will have my thoughts and prayers with you as you approach this difficult situation.

[chiqanita]

Hi Karen
I just wanted to send you some support and a hug. Please share your opinion of the book if you do get to read it. I have read The Spirited Child and feel it helped us understand our 2.5 y.o. twins.

You are by no means alone. One example, my cousins' youngest son (she has 3) used to have similar issues. He would not stop when told. He drove his teachers crazy. During quiet time in school he would toss his pencil in the air, shout 'everyone down' and dive off of his seat under the table. My cousin was so worried, frustrated, tired...you name it. They did a lot of positive reinforcement and consistancy between home and school. She visited his classroom regularly and observed as much as possible. Her son is now a football player in high school, gets good grades, is very respectful towards all, and he has hopes of becoming a firefighter.

I hope things start to look up for all of you. And, as a pp said, maybe you should take a new look at the school and teachers.

[chiqanita]

I would have to agree.

[kransden]

I doubt it is the teachers that are causing him to behave like this, especially since you have seen him do it at home too. One of the kids at dd's daycare acted really whack. Come to find out, his tonsils were extremely large and it caused him sleep apena. So he was constantly sleep deprived. They had the tonsils removed and he is a different kid! (Well except for the potty words lol)

My dd has issues too, just not at school. So maybe we are crappy moms, or maybe that is just how are kids are. I have had several suggestions given to me.

Other issues besides sleep are: too much sugar, dye - especially red - sensitivity, other chemical sensitivity, a higher protein diet may be needed. You might try any of those. My dd always acts horrible when tired. I have a strict bedtime policy now, and it really has helped us.

Also children that have drama in their life i.e. moving, divorce etc. often are a PITA in my classes. They act up so much. You might want to try to give him some 1:1 attention at home. Like at least 30 minutes working on a craft, playing cars, whatever. Because you might not think there is drama, but your ds may think differently.

I hope some of these suggestions are useful to you.


Karin and Katie 10/24/02