want info. on how CD hurts environment in terms of water

[american_mama]

I was just thinking about cloth diapering from different angles and wondered if there is any info. on the negative impact of cloth diapers on the environment in terms of water usage. Ages and ages ago, I may have read something in Consumer Repots (or maybe it was actually in "Baby Bargains", I have no idea) .... anyway, the article was about diapers and suggested that you might choose your poison (cloth or disposables) based on region, that the West had more space but less water, and therefore disposables might be a better environmental choice there, but on the East Coast, it was the reverse.

That logic is probably very incomplete, but it just leads me to ask the question: how much am I helping the environment by using cloth, but being so extravagant with water while washing them? Any info.?

[mommyj_2]

I don't have any articles I read on hand, but I remember reading that it takes water to manufacture disposable diapers as well. I can't remember how much, but just thought I'd mention that sposies do use some water.
I know a lot of moms try hard to have wash routines that save as much water as possible (by only washing when they have full loads, etc). Some people also use diaper services, since some have a way to reuse their water.
Also, I don't see how the West having more space would justify using products that take forever to decompose and are filled with chemicals that are horrible for the environment. I would like the see the article that makes that argument. I do think it's important for CDing mamas to try to use as little water as possible. I know I've been guilty of using too much with a fancy wash routine, so I've tried to cut back on my water usage.
Hmmmm...this post is rambling and not all the helpful. Hopefully someone else will remember some articles that have more precise info.

[nohomama]

You read that argument in Baby Bargains. I remember reading it too. It wasn't substantiated in any way as far as I can remember and I've never read anything that does. It is a thought provoking argument (water is a scarse in the west) but I think that things like building a city in the desert (think Vegas) does more to put a strain on a valuable natural resource than washing cloth diapers many times over.

[writermama]

The argument that CDs use too much water may also assume everyone washes the way diaper services do -- up to 13 cycles in hot water, using bleach and rinsing extra.

I saw this a while ago and thought she had some good points:

http://www.apronstringsbabythings.com/cloth_diapering_information.htm

ETA:

I like the answers to the 2nd question: Isn't it wasteful and detrimental to the environment to wash so many loads of diapers?


And at the bottom of the page after the mama cloth info:
A Case for Cloth: Rebecca's Commentary: Isn't it just as wasteful and detrimental to the environment to wash so many loads of diapers?

[tarahsolazy]

Well, the water doesn't just "go away" when you wash your dipes in it. The waste water gets piped to a treatment plant, treated, and released back into the whole water cycle. So, although it takes resources to treat water, the water remains. With sposies, the paper pulp and chemicals that make them are used once, then never again. Those resources are lost forever in the landfills, and it takes resources to transport the dipes to the landfills, and bury them, etc. And, the human waste, which should be handled by those waste water treatment plants, is sitting in a huge pile, leaching into ground water, uncontrolled. So, I can't buy an arguement that the four wash cycles a week with my high-efficiency front loading washer is worse for the environment. I read somewhere that washing CDs for one baby is like flushing your toilet 6 extra times a day. No one advocates keeping kids in dipes forever, to avoid them flushing the potty, and using water that way. I think the toilet flushing analogy is helpful, I've used it for some CD discussions with sposie-brainwashed folks.

[writermama]

Here's another article that gets a bit more in-depth and technical:

http://webhome.idirect.com/~born2luv/e-concerns2.html

It discusses the results of three studies on the topic -- two of which were funded by the disposable diaper industry the third by a neutral advocacy group.

The technical discussion gets a bit dense but here is a key conclusion of the report of the neutral advocacy group which compared both of the Proctor & Gamble funded studies and their own statistics:

" ... they still found that disposables use '20 times more raw materials, 3 times more energy, 2 times more water and generate 60 times more solid waste' than do cloth diapers."

It's worth noting that they assume a wet-pail and dunk-and-flush wash routine which uses a lot more water for washing diapers than I use with my dry pail and front-loader. Even when they assume more water usage than I probably use with my system, they conclude that washing diapers once every 3 days uses about the same amount of water as normal toilet usage for an adult for 3 days.

So, washing cloth diapers has approximately the same environmental impact as having a house-guest ... or a new member of the household. I can live with that.

[american_mama]

Tarah: I'm totally not trying to negate your point about the relative environmental costs of CD vs. disposables, but your comment reminded me of a new story I heard a few years ago but forgotten. There are in fact companies which recycle disposable diapers. Here's one that did a demo project in Santa Clarita, California: http://www.knowaste.com/sanclardemo.htm.
CLick on the links at the bottom for "diaper disposable" to find out about ways of disposing of disposables, and the somewhat dry link "Knowaste Process" to discover how they recycle diapers.

If I remember the story correctly, there is good potential for recycling diapers in Japan, which has a large population and little landfill space. The story said the norm there to change babies very frequently, so there are a lot more dirty diapers produced.

Anyway, it's obvious that the vast majority of the US is not currently recycling diapers and that doing so still consumes tons of water and energy, so I'm not bringing this up to say it's the answer. Just that it's an interesting possibility to help reduce untreated diapers in landfiills.

[kozachka]

There is an alternative to diapers. You can potty your DC starting as early as when you get home from the hospital. It's called elimination communication, infant potty training or natural infant hygiene. People of many cultures worldwide never use diapers, relying instead on the natural communication between mother and child to keep their babies comfortable and their homes clean.

We've been practicing this approach since DS was about 2.5 months old and it has significantly reduced the number of diapers we've used (not to mention how few poopy diapers I had to take care of). At 16 months we are down to 2-3 dipes a day and trying to go diaper-free. Yes, we flush if it's inside but most of the times DS pees on the bush since we are out a lot.

ECing is more work that diapering at the beginning but worth the connection you develop with your child. Besides you'll have to invest time into potty training/learning your DC at some point anyway. So it's like paying upfront :).

[Melanie]

It was my understanding that disposable diaper recycling was deemed a failure, no?

There was a GREAT article on this in Mothering...around December 2002 or January 2003.

It addressed all the false propaganda against CDing, and who funded it, etc. I feel prey to the water study, too. It was funded by a diaper manuracturer!

[center]http://lilypie.com/baby4/011106/1/2/0/+10/.png[/img][/url]

Expecting #2
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[lizajane]

IMO (to make a long story short) it takes a lot more x, y and z to MAKE disposables that get used ONCE than it does to make and wash cloth that get used over and over.

[Jeanne]

If cloth diapering makes you feel good, then you should do it.

Diapering is a necessary evil. It's six of one, half dozen of the other. I'm a degreed environmentalist and I don't cloth diaper.
Admittedly, I haven't looked at it since 1995 when there weren't any definitive studies that took all factors into consideration.
And I seriously doubt that anyone has been able to do a study that shows the environmental benefits simply because of the complexity.

The landfill issue is only one component of disposables vs. cloth and not the largest component of the argument. You have to factor in the use of resources both natural and manufactured, deforestation, energy consumption, waste management, waste water management etc... Each of these components listed above has several sub components as well - what type of power (nuke or fossil) etc... On and on, ad nauseam, ad infinitim...

It could be argued that cloth diapering contributes to excessive home usage of water and power thus substantiating America's appetite for fossil fuel. But it can also be argued that the consumption of disposables are the mark of a throw-away society only interested in the present and unconcerned with future impact. Both have implications - environmental, political, and economical.

Also, you'd have to seriously look at the lifestyles of people who cloth diaper vs. disposable diaper. Some cloth users are fully committed to the environment in every way - public transportation or car pool to work, green or reduced emissions vehicles, reduce, recycle, reuse mantra, sustainable agriculture, secondary solar power users, etc... And then there are those cloth users that drive SUVs, don't buy organics, etc... Once again, ad nauseam, ad infinitem...............

It's really hard to articulate without writing a book - too many variables to list. But the long and short of it is, if you feel good that you are making a positive contribution to the environment by using cloth, then you should. That's your contribution and it's certainly not a bad thing. There really shouldn't be camps of cloth vs. disposable users. A person may use disposables, but they may drive more fuel efficient or low emission vehicles, recycle more aggressively, capture rain water, etc...

[Melanie]

I found this one to be really fascinating:
The Politics of Diapers: A Timeline of Recovered History

A quote from the above article references the erroneous study that *I* read years before coming a parent which caused us to use disposables for the first year or so:
"1990 Proctor and Gamble commissions a study by Arthur D. Little, Inc., a consulting firm in Cambridge, Massachusetts. The consultant finds that laundering a cloth diaper over the course of its lifetime consumes up to six times the water used to manufacture a single-use diaper. In addition, the study concludes that laundering cloth diapers produces nearly ten times the water pollution created in manufacturing throwaways. (Arthur D. Little, Inc., "Disposable Versus Reusable Diapers: Health, Environmental and Economic Comparisons.") "

If you read on in the article, there are rebuttals to it.

Another highlight:
"1991 P&G's $750,000 disposable diaper recycling project in King County (see 1989, June; second entry) is declared a technical success but an economic failure, yet continues to be touted in brochures for Luvs and Pampers. (Seattle Times, January 25, 1991) "
================================================== =======

The Diaper Debate 10 Years Later

[nohomama]

Yes, yes, and yes!!! Thank you Jeanne for your post. IMO what you've written offers the most accurate and balanced overview of the cloth vs disposable debate in regards to how each impacts the environment. Your point about how people choose to live their lives outside the question of diapers is something that I think often gets ignored.

As for me, I'm happy to primarily use cloth with a disposable or two sprinkled in, to own a single fuel efficient car, to buy energy star appliances when I can, to minimize my use of toxic chemicals... I'm NOT a saint. I'm far, far from it. But I try as much as possible to be mindful and that's at least a start.

[calebsmama03]

"Many people argue that cloth diapering creates the same impact because too much water is used to wash the diapers. Sure, you need to use water to wash diapers, but it also takes a lot of water to grind wood pulp for disposables.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

According to the Landbank Consultancy Report, it takes twice as much water to produce disposables, three times more energy, and twenty times more raw materials. At least the water that is used to wash cloth diapers goes into the sewage system, where it is properly treated at a wastewater plant. Overall, the water used to rinse and wash cotton diapers every three days is equivalent to an adult person flushing the toilet 5-6 times the day. "

Here's the full article
http://www.thediaperhyena.com/ichosecloth.htm

Lynne
Mommy to Caleb 3/3/03
http://www.gynosaur.com/assets/ribbons/ribbon_emerald_18m.gif[/img][/url]
And Miss Purple due 5/21/05

[maestramommy]

Hi:

I apologize for jumping in with a question that is only slightly related, but I'm very new to this board, and I'm still trying to figure out how it works. My sister (Eileen, mother of beautiful Kaya) has been encouraging me to try CD's. Since my baby isn't due til October, I've been using the time to gather as much info as possible. I posted on some other topic, but found this to be more in the same general area. Okay! Here's my concern.

I have a specific question concerning waste laws in the US. I had read somewhere, either on a posting, or a link that it is illegal to dispose of human feces in the trash, that it should be flushed instead. My sister has explained the chemical reasons why this is a bad idea, but can anyone confirm the legality of this, and refer me to some documentation? My husband was quite interested but wanted some official evidence. If this is true, then the thousands of people who use sposies, must be dumping a lot of poop in the trash. I don't remember ever seeing anyone flush the contents of sposies down the toliet.

Thanks for any info!

maestramommy