Travelling by air for first time and overwhelmed!

[firsttimemommy]

This will be the first airplane trip for my kids - DS age 4, 37 lbs and DD age 5, 39 lbs. We will be flying to Boston, taking a cab to the hotel, staying in Boston for 4 days (riding the "T" to get around) and then renting a car and driving to Vermont for 4 days to visit family (and then flying back to Texas from Vermont)

I've read the forum/archives and am still kind of lost as to what my *best* option will be for seating for the kids. We own 2 Marathons, 2 Frontiers and 2 Graco Cargos (our spare set of seats).

Do I need seats on the plane? If so I was thinking of trying to bring the Cargos b/c I don't care (as much) if they get a little messed up. Or should I buy cheaper lighter smaller seats to take? Or the travel vests? Should I get the gogokidz or strap to our luggage??

If I don't need a car seat for the plane (do I?) then should I just try to buy seats while in Boston to use for the car portion of our trip and just leave with relatives at the end of the trip in Vermont? Or should I check (or gate check) some of our seats and hope for the best (that they arrive safely!)

So confused - I almost don't want to go!! LOL

Thanks

[C99]

You don't need seats on the plane. Well, I suppose you could bring them, but if you are flying alone w/ a 4 and 5-year-old, that is so much to lug! I'd check or gate-check them. I flew in March with all 3 of mine, by myself, to Houston (2.5-hour flight) and didn't bother w/ carseats for any of them. I packed Ride Safer vests for my DS1 and DD, and checked DS2's Britax RA.

[801kelle]

The only thing about checking your carseats as luggage is.. now with the new rules.. you have to pay a fee for checked bags.. some airlines allow one free bag and then charge you for the rest.. so if you are going to take carseats .. I would gate check them. You could get the rider safe vests for the car? If you don't want to take yours at all. Or like you said if you really want to you could buy seats and leave them there?

[firsttimemommy]

Ok, so I am hearing that having a seat on the plane is not necessary (didn't I read that airlines won't even allow them for children over 3?). So my concern now should just be what to do at my destination. It looks like I have 3 options:

1. Bring a set of our seats (Cargos) in bags and gate check them (might be an additional fee though..)

2. Buy the Ride Safer Travel Vest for the rental car but there is no SIP protection for the one who will sit outboard. Maybe I should buy one ride safer vest and just bring one car seat (the Cargo?) for the child who will sit outboard?

3. Buy seats (I wonder which relatively inexpensive ones would be easy to find??) when I get to Boston (don't know if I'll be near a store though - staying in Cambridge) and use them for the trip and then either lug them back on the plane to Texas or leave them with relatives.

Of course I am looking for the cheapest option, however safety is never something I will compromise for $$$, so....which to choose???? UGH!! What would you do??

Ronda ;)

[vickimaggie]

I'm live right outside Boston and I think it would be a PITA to buy seats once you are here. There really isn't any place T accessible that would have cheap seats, all the stores in the city itself would sell high end seats. You'd have to get to a Walmart or Target which would require a car and a bit of a drive so one of you would need to go alone to bring the seats back to the kids.

[firsttimemommy]

Thank you, I kind of had a feeling getting a seat once in Boston would be a real PITA. We weren't planning on renting a car until we were literally driving OUT of Boston (heard parking is $$ and driving is a nightmare there) so I would be taking the T pretty far I guess to try to find a store to get seats at.... and I'm limited on time while there b/c I'm actually attending the Barefoot Books convention.

So it looks like my options are:

1. no seats on plane, get ride safer vests (but again, no SIP) or or an inexpensive booster that breaks apart for easier transport - turbobooster??? for the car rides

2. Take Cargos and using on plane - if the airline will allow??? (although DD is right at the verge of outgrowing the harness weight limit on them so maybe I should bring the Frontiers) Lug them in rolling case or go go kidz.

Thanks for helping me narrow this down!

[o_mom]

The Cargos on the plane would be OK. The airline must allow you to use them if you have paid for a ticket, so no worries there. Also, carseats do not count toward your checked luggage allowance, so again, not an issue (this could change, but even the ones that are charging for all bags have said carseats would be free). The Cargo can have comfort issues on planes, though, because the buckle may end up right in the middle of their back.

What about something like the Compass B510? - folds for travel and some come with a carry bag. Nice tall booster that would last a long time, SIP.

The Safeguard Go would be another option that would keep them harnessed in the car and very, very easy to travel with. More $$$ than the Ridesafer, though. Both of these should be fine for rental cars which will have LATCH. The Go would be slightly easier to use than putting the vest on for each ride.

[bubbaray]

Without hesitation, CARES harnesses for if they are still within the limits, if not, just the plane lapbelts and RideSafer vests for the rental car.

As far as I know, North American airlines are still allowing child restraints on planes if you pay for the child's seat and the seat is FAA or Transport Canada approved. Its code shares with foreign airlines that you have to watch out for, many of them don't allow child restraints or have weird rules about them (Air France and Quantas come to mind, as does Alitalia and BA).

[firsttimemommy]

Thanks so much everyone :)

I have spent all afternoon researching and it seems to be about 50/50 as to whether you should put a child in a car seat on a plane or just use the lapbelts. So that's my first decision I guess.

If I decide they need to be in their 5 pt harness car seat for the plane ride, I will plan to use the Frontiers or the Cargos for the whole trip. I just hope they fit in the airplane seat and I have to check to see if they are FAA approved. I'll bungee them to a cart or to my wheeled carry on.

If I decide they don't need to be in their car seats, I'll likely get the CARES harness (need to read more about this) because just having the regular lapbelt doesn't seem enough for their little bodies. Then I will buy a Graco Turbo booster, FPSVB or Compass 510 and carry them on board with me (folded/disassembled) to use in the car later in the trip. Any advantage to the Compass 510 foldability over the disassembling of the Graco or FP?


So.... can anyone help me with the decision to use a real car seat (vs. the CARES harness) on the plane? Like I said, so far when researching opinions it seems split but my gut tells me to go with the car set - although I get stressed out super easy so I may be setting myself up for failure if the seats are tight fits, I get FA attitude or if they are hard to install.....

Ugh, so much to think about for a little trip!

Thanks again :)

[o_mom]

The Compass B510 booster will last much longer than the Turbo or FPSV Booster and has better SIP than the other two. It is also easier to buckle, with the flip up armrests.

I think the CARES harness is fine for the plane.

[bubbaray]

Thanks so much everyone :)

I have spent all afternoon researching and it seems to be about 50/50 as to whether you should put a child in a car seat on a plane or just use the lapbelts. So that's my first decision I guess.

If I decide they need to be in their 5 pt harness car seat for the plane ride, I will plan to use the Frontiers or the Cargos for the whole trip. I just hope they fit in the airplane seat and I have to check to see if they are FAA approved. I'll bungee them to a cart or to my wheeled carry on.

If I decide they don't need to be in their car seats, I'll likely get the CARES harness (need to read more about this) because just having the regular lapbelt doesn't seem enough for their little bodies. Then I will buy a Graco Turbo booster, FPSVB or Compass 510 and carry them on board with me (folded/disassembled) to use in the car later in the trip. Any advantage to the Compass 510 foldability over the disassembling of the Graco or FP?


So.... can anyone help me with the decision to use a real car seat (vs. the CARES harness) on the plane? Like I said, so far when researching opinions it seems split but my gut tells me to go with the car set - although I get stressed out super easy so I may be setting myself up for failure if the seats are tight fits, I get FA attitude or if they are hard to install.....

Ugh, so much to think about for a little trip!

Thanks again :)


Remember that the physics of plane turbulence/crashes are different than those of a car crash. For younger children, especially those who sleep well in their car seats, car seats are wonderful. I would be probably OK with my 4yo using the plane lap belt, though. If you really want a 5pt harness on the plane (and assuming they are within the weight limits for it), I'd use the CARES harness over a car seat.

I'd still go with a RideSafer vest over a booster for the rental car, especially as you won't need either for half your trip. My main worry is that with my 4yo, I'd then have a hard time once we were home explaining why she can't use a booster again.... Also, you won't have to worry about the airline losing them -- you can just take them in your carryon.

[trales]

How about a carseat rental with the car? We have done this a few times and had a mixed experience. Not all the best seats, but never had one that was expired, last time with Hertz it was a brand new Britax. Then you don't have to worry about the plane, I take the T and cabs in Boston every week with no seat, the car rental seat is ready for you.

FYI, not all T stops have evalvators, so if you are using a stroller, make sure it is a light one. There are also a lot of older buildings without ramps, and curbs without ramps, you will have to lift the stroller a bit.

[firsttimemommy]

Thanks Tracey, Melissa, everyone!

Ok, I have a lot to think about but your advice has helped tremendously! I think I am much more comfortable with the idea of them being in seats of some sort in the car (I'm sort of obsessed with SIP), but I will look at the ridesafer vest again. As for the plane, I will probably do the CARES (we will likely fly again in the spring to Florida, so it should get some use then too)

Tracey - we're not even taking strollers - but we will only have a day and a half to sightsee and will probably not venture far b/c we are so clueless. I am sure Boston will intimidate me! (small town Texas girl here) That day and a half will likely be the only time we would even consider needing strollers since the rest of the time we will be in Vermont at my parents cabin on Lake Champlain. We will do some sightseeing there, but nothing that my 4 and 5 yr old can't handle walking I'm sure. So I've decided against taking any.

I do have a question about the logistics of where we were planning to stay, where the convention is and where I'd pick up the car (all different but within a 1-3 mile radius of each other) - are you familiar enough with Cambridge to tell me if I will be running around like a chicken with my head cut off or not? :)

Thanks again,
Ronda :)

[801kelle]

THE FRONTIERS ARE FAA APPROVED! We have Frontiers too. I was excited because we usualy travel with our Marathon but not as comfortable anymore for our 5 yr DD.. so I will be using that seat to take with us when we travel now!!!!!!!!

Here is some info from the FAA on carseats:

The FAA does not require the use of CRS's on commercial airplanes because a mandate would require parents to purchase an extra airline ticket for their child, forcing some families who can't afford the extra ticket to drive, a statistically more dangerous way to travel. However, the FAA strongly recommends the use of CRS's or an alternative FAA-approved device based on a child's weight. A child safety device is an FAA-approved alternative to using a hard-backed seat and is approved only for use on aircraft. It is not approved for use in motor vehicles. For example, the FAA has approved a new harness-type device appropriate for children weighing between 22 and 44 pounds. Airlines currently allow children under the age of two to fly free of charge as "lap children," not the safest way for a child to travel. Many airlines offer half-price tickets so parents can be guaranteed that their child can travel in a CRS or device. Parents should call their airline to ask for a discount and/or ask what the airline's policy is for using empty seats.


The FAA strongly urges parents and guardians to secure children in an appropriate restraint based on weight and size. Keeping a child in a CRS or device during the flight is the smart and right thing to do.


Child Safety on Airplanes

Did you know the safest place for your little one during turbulence or an emergency is in an approved child restraint system (CRS) or device, not on your lap?

A CRS is a hard-backed child safety seat that is approved by the government for use in both motor vehicles and aircraft.

www.faa.gov


If you don't want to lug carseats or buy when you are at your destination I would buy the ridersafe vests for the car and the Cares Harness for the plane.. then you can just shove them all in your carry on!

[stillplayswithbarbies]

The FAA says that kids should be 40 pounds to use the lapbelt without a carseat. I'd take whichever car seats they are most comfortable in and that you know how to install the best.

If you take the two Marathons, get the Gogo Kidz wheels for them. That makes it very easy.

[801kelle]

The FAA says that kids should be 40 pounds to use the lapbelt without a carseat. I'd take whichever car seats they are most comfortable in and that you know how to install the best.

If you take the two Marathons, get the Gogo Kidz wheels for them. That makes it very easy.

But the FAA also says:

The FAA strongly urges parents and guardians to secure children in an appropriate restraint based on weight and size. Keeping a child in a CRS or device during the flight is the smart and right thing to do.


I still travel with my 5pt harness on the planes. just because my DD is more comfortable and contains her too!! hee hee.. She is 5 yo, 40 lbs and 42.5 inches tall.. Now the Frontier is FAA approved and has the higher weight limits

[firsttimemommy]

Thank you so much everyone for your advice. I have narrowed it down to:

1. Taking the Frontiers and using on plane and in rental car. (cheapest option and overall, the one I feel safest with)

2. Buying the Compass/turbobooster/FPSV booster, disassembing it/folding it and carrying on plane in carryon baggage to use in the rental car and then using the rider safer harness in flight. (much easier to lug around BUT since DS is still only 4 and 38 lbs, having him in a booster mode even for just a week in the rental car is not *ideal*)

Thanks again for the suggestions...

:)

[o_mom]

I wouldn't rule out the RideSafer vest for your DS. Although it doesn't have a side impact rating, it is similar to having a 5 pt harness, which is superior to a booster in just about any situation.

I think that CARES harnesses on the plane, a booster for your DD and the RideSafer for your DS would be a very safe option that wouldn't be too bulky. It's a bit pricey, but if you arent planning any other travel you could sell the CARES harnesses afterward and make some of that back. The RideSafer is always nice to have around for fitting three across in a pinch.

What about CARES on the plane and the Cargo your DS/booster for DD?

[firsttimemommy]

thanks for the suggestions o-mom - it's amazing how complicated this can get! LOL

On your last suggestion, if I take the CarGo for DS, then I can bring it on the plane instead of the CARES for him, right? Or is it not FAA approved (guess I could go look for the sticker...) So that would be:

Plane: DD-CARES; DS-CarGo
Car: DD-booster (that is carried on plane); DS-CarGo.

As far as your first suggestion (that has DS in ridesafer harness), I can't seem to wrap my head around NOT having a "shell" (meaning a car seat or booster) for them in the car - it's just so weird thinking of them in *just* a harness in the seat, although what you said about harnesses being safer than the booster protection makes sense. And they would love it I'm sure (using the ridesafer harness)

So your vote is for *something* in the plane, right - some say just the belt is ok, but I just don't know!

sigh.

(thank you!!!)

[o_mom]

Yes, you could use the Cargo on the plane. It is FAA approved. The only complaint I have heard is that the seat buckle can end up directly behind their back. I do think that something on the plane is a good idea (seat or CARES). They are just a little on the small side to be held in by only the lapbelt.

The RideSafer is a whole different dynamic. Since it sits low and back to the seat, it does very well in crash tests. I'm not sure how the side impact rates, to be honest. I feel like it is more restraint than a booster, though. It also has the option to use the top tether, even with the shoulder belt, which should add some protection. I guess I would put it somewhere between a booster and the Cargo.

[firsttimemommy]

Thank you so much!!!!!

Decisions decisions!!

I really need to pick the most cost effective route (this trip is costing me a fortune already) as long as everything is equal when it comes to safety. So I I think I will either:

1. use the CarGos (or Frontiers for that matter) for both of them in the plane and car (DD is 39 lbs fully clothed with shoes on). I do worry about the buckle issue you talked about with the CarGos, but the frontiers are not super user friendly when it comes to installation (at least in my car!!)

OR

2. I'll get the CARES and Ridesafer if I want to go the easier/less bulky route and try to sell them when I get back and recoup some of the costs.

If I go with option one, should I get the gogokidz or just strap them to my luggage?

Thanks to everyone for all their help - you guys are awesome! (as usual!)