Conflicted about my neighbors (long)

[trales]

I get along really well with all my neighbors except the house immediately to my left. The is a 1 acre wetland/ wood between there house and mine, so we don't have a lot of contact.

They have 6 dogs who bark all the time and occasionally escape. I don't mind dogs getting out, everyone's dog gets out once in awhile, even mine, but their dogs are mean and bite. Last week I was watering the lawn and the dog came running at me snapping and snarling, my dogs were in the house b/c they felt it was too hot to be out. I ran into the house and called the police who came out and talked to them and then me. The officer met the dog and said it was nice. They have 6. A few weeks before that I was walking by with the dogs and baby and this dog came running out and their son grabbed it. I thanked him and said "our dogs are friendly with other dogs, they won't hurt your dog" He replies, "my dog is not friendly with strangers or strange dogs." I shared this with the police. Forward to today. The dog came at me and chased me into my house as I was getting the mail. I took pictures and called the police again. I am waiting for an officer to come out.

I hate to call the police, my dog has been known to get out and go the river and be brought home by others, but this dog has me terrified to go outside and have DD in the front yard.

I should also mention that I am really scared of dogs (I know, I have two), I have been attacked twice in the last 15 years by strange dogs and once it landed me in the hospital. I am afraid this could be coloring my reaction.

I don't want to start a war with my neighbor, I have other issues with the number of horses they have (more than zoning allows) and the smell of the manure on the suburban lot. Our neighborhood is a mix of old 20-50 acre farms, old farmhouses on smaller lots (mine), and brand new modular colonial style homes on 2 acre plots (what they have).

Thanks for getting this far, am I right to keep calling the police. The dog has me really scared to go outside in the front or take a walk by their house. I used to enjoy my two mile walk everyday with DD and my dogs. I don't really want to talk to them personally, the last time my DH brought one of the dogs home she yelled at him for not being able to tell her where the dog escaped from and did not thank him.

Of course, my heart is still racing from being chased into my house, and I am shaking. My dogs were inside today b/c it was raining and they don't like the rain.

[LBW]

I don't think you should feel bad about calling the police. You neighbors should feel bad that their dog is terrifying you. They should also take steps to try to keep the dog on their property before it injures someone.

Does your town have a leash law or a fencing law? I'd ask the police. I'd also insist that they cite your neighbors so that the incidents you report are on record.

I have two dogs who do escape from our fenced in yard about 3-4 times per year. If they ever scared anyone, I would be beyond apologetic! So far, they've either come back on their own or we've found them ourselves. I can't imagine yelling at a person who went out of their way to return the dogs to us.

Sorry you have to deal with this.

[lizajane]

my dogs are returned to me by neighbors all the time. it is humiliating. my kids throw open the door and they run off. they will always come back on their own, though, unless a neighbor happens to stop them and bring them back. the neighbors have been MORE than kind. i am always very apologetic and grateful. my dogs are VERY sweet and lovable labs. the chocolate, who is the one who escapes most often, does NOT bark or growl or show his teeth ever at anyone. ever. the yellow will bark when she is protecting us and at dogs.

i can't imagine having a "wild" dog on the loose in our neighborhood with all our kids running around. i also can't imagine having horses on only 2 acres!!! i think you might need to write an honest letter to the neighbors stating that you are AFRAID of the dog and you fear for your small child. they may think you are annoyed, so they don't really care. i would be clear that you are afraid, whether they think the dog is scary or not. let them know you realize dogs get out sometimes, but this aggressive dog MUST be fenced ALWAYS to insure the safety of the kids, especially. or the police will have to take action.

[lorinick]

I don't think you should feel bad about calling the police. You neighbors should feel bad that their dog is terrifying you. They should also take steps to try to keep the dog on their property before it injures someone.

Does your town have a leash law or a fencing law? I'd ask the police. I'd also insist that they cite your neighbors so that the incidents you report are on record.

I have two dogs who do escape from our fenced in yard about 3-4 times per year. If they ever scared anyone, I would be beyond apologetic! So far, they've either come back on their own or we've found them ourselves. I can't imagine yelling at a person who went out of their way to return the dogs to us.

Sorry you have to deal with this.
I would keep it low keyed. Calling the police is okay. Filing charges I would say to really think about. That could make things much worse. They don't sound like there that nice of people. They may already be annoyed if you have called about their horses. Neighbor issues are sure tough. You and your husband should sit down and think about how to procecced with these matter. I'm sorry you have to be afraid to go outside or walk in your neighboorhood.

[WatchingThemGrow]

I think you're right in calling the police. I think I would've tried to talk with them in person, with DH, on a walk or something casually before that, but that may have been uncomfortable, impossible, or whatever. I have called neighbors before when their cat was jumping at our door, scratching and scaring our toddler. Our neighborhood listserv has a friendly pet reminder once a year or so.

And...similarly...I've currently got an email floating out there to a new next door neighbor whose dogs barked off and on for hours yesterday and for the month they've lived here. Almost every time we go out into the yard, they bark for the first 10-15 min. Annoying.

SIX dogs is quite a lot, I think. Do you think they feel a little overwhelmed with them?? And more horses than zoning allows? I wonder if they're mad because you called them out on irresponsible pet ownership?

You have a right to walk in your neighborhood and to your mailbox without being chased, right?

[MontrealMum]

I'm so sorry you're dealing with this. To not feel safe in your own front yard and walking to your mailbox is completely unacceptable.

I don't know how you ought to proceed since you're in a rural area and the rules may be different, or even non-existent regarding leash laws and dogs etc. But I would have no qualms as a parent doing everything necessary to keep my child safe from a biting and aggressive dog. I would not care about the neighbors' feelings, or about annoying them. I have known several children that were bitten by dogs (and badly injured) and it's very sad. Many of the owners expressed remorse over their dogs' actions - afterwards, when they were made to put the animal down. Nice, but too late.

Have you talked to your other neighbors about how they might be feeling about this particular house and their dogs? Maybe you can get a little group consensus going about what to do next. I'd check out the bylaws of your area as well. But in the meantime, I would probably keep calling the police and trying to keep some sort of record. Does your camera do short video clips? I know, not something you're thinking about when you're running for the house and trying to protect your child. But just a suggestion.

I do think that there is a huge difference between friendly dogs that escape (as many have described here) with nice, and apologetic owners and what you're describing. But if you're going to get hard-a*& on them, you might have to be more restrictive with your own dogs :( so that you aren't a target for aggression, since they seem to be the take-retribution-type.

And my evil twin is making my type this: my uncle lives in a similarly rural setting to what you're describing. Lots of animals wander into his yard, some pets, some not. Sometimes bears. He's a hunter and has several guns at home. I have heard him say on more than one occasion that he would not hesitate to shoot something dangerous or unknown in his yard when his 3 children were small. Not saying you should do that ;) but there's your redneck answer. I just wanted to add that I am not advocating gun violence, just wanted to put this example out there as what some parts of the country see as "acceptable" in this situation, and to highlight that your calling the police is certainly warranted, rather than taking the situation into your own hands. Not that your neighbors would really care - but it *could* be so much worse. Sounds like they don't care for their animals much though, so that sort of threat wouldn't mean much to them.

[BillK]

I'd get a can of personal defense pepper spray for the next time if it were me. There's no excuse to have mean dogs - and it's even more inexcusable to allow them to roam free.

[maestramommy]

I think you are right to keep calling the police. I myself wouldn't know what else to do, except maybe call animal control. Their dogs are escaping and chasing you on your property, which sounds like grounds for a complaint. If, god forbid, you ever got bitten, it should be documented the number of times you called.

[lowrioh]

I'm confused, have you called the zoning authority about the horses or are you just annoyed by them? Have any of your other neighbors had similar encounters with the dog?
I think you are totally justified in calling the police if you are afraid of their dog/s. Six dogs is a lot to cope with but letting a dog out that "is not friendly with strangers or strange dogs" is totally irresponsible. I agree with the PP it might be a good idea to sit down (when your heart rate has gotten back to normal) and write them a letter outlining the incidents and how you are afraid of the dog (not just annoyed). Have a friend read it over before you send it out to make sure that it seems calm, rational and expresses what you are trying to say in a non-emotional way. A letter would be a good way to document that you have raised the issue with the neighbor so that if more incidents occur you have something to give to the police.

I understand that you don't want to start a war with you neighbor, but you have the right to be in your yard, get your mail, take walks in your neighborhood and let you children out without a fear of being attacked by a dog. In the meantime, you might want to start carrying pepper spray with you when you go outside.

[trales]

Part of my conflict is the fact that our lab has gotten out in the past, about 3-4 times per year, he goes to the river, swims and comes back. He is also very friendly. I feel bad calling the police about something my dog does. I have also helped other neighbors get thier dogs home, this is the first time I have called the police about a dog. This dog gets out a few times and week and tries to attack. I never used to be home all day or outside, so it did not bother me. It has gone after other neighbors goats and chickens. They won't call the police, but shoot at it with rubber bullets or an air gun. There is no leash law, but you can shoot a dog that comes on your property aggressively (and we live within city limits:shrug::shrug:). I am anti-gun, so I would never do this.

We have tried to talk to them once, to introduce ourselves and say hello, it did not go well. This was before the dog and horse situation. They keep getting more dogs, they have 3 horse, 6 dogs and a lot of cats, every once in awhile the yougest boy comes around looking for a cat that got lost. Most cats around here get eaten by coyotes.

Half the time the dogs get out they are not home.

[cvanbrunt]

I think you should call the police every time you feel threatened. That way, if something ever happens, there is a record of the pattern of the dogs' and neighbors' behavior. If you have an animal control office, you might call them instead. In my experience, they respond more quickly and take concerns more seriously.

[JTsMom]

I would definitely keep calling. You have the right to feel safe on your own property! I dont think it's the same thing as a friendly dog getting out at all, so I wouldn't feel one bit hypocritical. They most likely chose to train the dog to be aggressive, or just don't care enough to teach him not to be, so they should go the extra mile to keep the dog in.

[trales]

I just spoke to the officer, who was much better than the one who came out last week. He offered to issue a summons and go to court and I would have to be a witness. I had DH on the phone and we decided to go with a warning this time, and next time there would be a summons.

I am going to keep pictures and document each event. DH is considering writing a letter to them. The officer assured me that I was right to call him and thought the pictures clearly showed it was not a friendly dog just coming to say hi.

I have called the city in the past about the horses since the smell is a little strong. They said they could deal with that without giving my name.

I do feel a little better, but I am still nervous.

I have to dig my bear spray out of the camping pile.

[gatorsmom]

Ugh, sorry you have to go through this. Our neighborhood has more than it's fair share of dogs roaming around when I'm out walking. Some of them snarl and bark and scare the crap out of me (especially since I walk with children in a stroller). I carry a small container of pepper spray with me for that reason. I refuse to let those dam* dogs ruin my walk. Oh, and I carry a long, metal tire airpump too- in case my tires run out of air, of course;) .

[trales]

I looked up our city ordinance and this is what it says.
466:28 Killing Dogs Legalized. – Any person may kill a dog that suddenly assaults the person while such person is peaceably walking or riding without the enclosure of its owner or keeper; and any person may kill a dog that is found out of the enclosure or immediate care of its owner or keeper worrying, wounding, or killing sheep, lambs, fowl, or other domestic animals.


466:31 Dogs a Menace, a Nuisance or Vicious.
II. Under this section, a dog is considered to be a nuisance, a menace, or vicious to persons or to property under any or all but not limited to the following conditions:
(e) If it growls, snaps at, runs after, or chases any person or persons not on the premises of the owner or keeper;

Not that I would ever consider killing an animal, but it definatly fits under the menace, nuisance and vicious catagory.

Thanks for all the reassurance.

[StantonHyde]

We have 2 giant Great Danes in our neighborhood with an idiot owner who cannot control them. They attacked my dog and I had $100 in vet bills. (thank God my dog was ok) I called animal control and the a$$hole owner said that my dog (12 yo Golden Retriever) attacked his dogs and they were just defending themselves!!! The animal control guy said he knew the owner was lying but there were no witnesses so that was it.

Lessons I learned:
1. Keep calling and documenting. If there is a history of calls, then the police can take action more quickly.

2. Write a note to all of your other neighbors telling them about the dog and encourage them to call. I sent out a neighborhood email about these dogs and was amazed at how many people emailed back to say the dogs had been aggressive to them--especially people coming to the next door neighbor's and they didn't even have dogs with them. People seem to think it is just them or their dog--no, it is the aggressive dogs.

3. Buy a big can of pepper spray--carry it with you at all times. Remember that what you need to do is to stop the dog before it gets to you. So you need to put out a cloud of spray when the dog is 15 feet away so that it hits the cloud at 10 feet. Spray in a wide pattern. I like bear spray too because it comes in a bigger container.

[cvanbrunt]

I like bear spray too because it comes in a bigger container.

Seriously, there is something called bear spray? And should you be living in a place where that is a necessity? :)

[kijip]

Seriously, there is something called bear spray? And should you be living in a place where that is a necessity? :)

Bear spray is for camping. Also, as suburbs have encroached into more rural/forested areas, there are suburbs with bears in/close to the back yards. It's a real habitat issue, because it's not like some of these bears have many places to go and if they become accustomed to trash foods and the like, it can get dangerous for the residents. My cousins have a house where they have a bear proof garbage system (though in their case they just live near wilderness, not in a sprawling burb.)

[StantonHyde]

As Katie said, the bear spray is for camping--backpacking in grizzly country in my case. We have coyotes and deer coming down from the foothills and an occasional confused moose and there was a cougar about a mile from city center in one of the canyons--but no bears so far!!

My brother was a wrangler on a dude ranch in REMOTE Montana wilderness. They had a beer fridge for the wranglers and they literally used an airplane grade seatbelt to latch/lock it shut and onto the porch every night so the bears didn't get it. (I know people who had a bear take the fridge off the porch, roll it along to get everything out, and step on the beer cans to get the beer out)

Unfortunately, "a fed bear is a dead bear" and that is an issue with more people living in bear habitat. I can say that I have backpacked throughout Yellowstone Park for about 10 years and I never saw a grizzly. I always kept a METICULOUS campsite and observed every rule in the book about letting them know you were there etc. But it worked--there just is a very small margin for error with Mother Nature.

[bubbaray]

Seriously, there is something called bear spray? And should you be living in a place where that is a necessity? :)


Uh, yeah. And I've actually run in a group where people carried it. Mainly for dogs, but also for any "wildlife" we encountered. I know a woman (from that same running group) who's dalmatian was attacked by 2 pitbulls. $4k vet bill later, her dog lived and she carries bear spray and a baseball bat when she walks her dog.

I seriously vote for bear spray AND a bat or similar.

[randomkid]

Do you have to call the police, or is there animal control in your area? We have these neighbors behind us who have a LARGE lab. They let their dog bark for hours and it would drive DH crazy. We live in a subdivision and I think nobody should have a dog that large in a house with no yard (their pool takes up the back yard). DH was finally fed up and called animal control.

Here's how it works here: You call or e-mail them, then they send a letter to the offending party. They come talk to you, then talk to the owners of the animal. It's all anonymous unless you file a formal complaint. The animal control officer asked me if I felt threatened by their dog. I explained that whenever we walk on their street, I cross to the other side of the road because that dog make me uncomfortable. He said that was enough. No animal should make you feel that way in your own neighborhood.

Now, your dog may get out and go swim in the river, but he isn't barking and chasing people into their homes, right? So, your dog is not doing the same as their dog. I would find out if there is animal control in your area and contact them. If I were you, I'd keep it anonymous. Sounds like they might be the type to seek retribution and shoot your dog if they saw it out. I know, my grandparents lived in the country and up there, if a strange dog just came onto your property, it was fair game. Many dogs get shot up there - broke my heart when my grandparents' sweet, gentle dog was shot in their own woods.

BTW, I just realized with this post that we don't hear that lab anymore. I guess they finally took it seriously after several complaints.

Good luck - you should never feel so threatened in your own yard.

[trales]

We don't have animal control in our town, the police rotate cleaning road kill off the roads and fish and game take care of hunting/ wildlife issues. I live in the state capital, but on the edge of thousands of acres of wilderness leading up to the White Mountain National Forest.

Since DD has started playing with our lab, he does not have as much energy so he has not escaped in months.

We have a bear here, but he only appears for bird seed in the spring and I see him occasionally in the fall on his way to the river. I keep the bear spray for hiking in the National Forest and I used to keep it for stray dogs when we lived on the seacoast.

Hopefully they will repair their fence and not let the dogs out when they are not home anymore.

[Ryemom]

sounds like you are doing all the things that you can do to be safe.

I think I'd invest in a fence instead of waiting for their response.