Are we more racist than we think?

[mommy111]

Just read this poll, what do you ladies think?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26803840
As a nation, are we closet racists? I wonder also how this breaks up along age lines, which the survey did not mention.

[wellyes]

I don't know any Democrat who would own up to being racist, but I know a number of people who say that Obama could never, ever win due to OTHER people that they know who are racist.

But honestly I don't think everyone who harbors racist views will refuse to vote for Obama. Someone who gets nervous in the presence of any black teenaged boy might very well vote for Obama since he is so far removed from negative stereotypes about black men.

[mytwosons]

Yes, I firmly believe we are more racist than we believe.

Actually, I think many people, on some level, are scared of anyone who is different from them, whether it be race, socio-economic status, any type of special need, etc.

[ellies mom]

I don't think most people are racist in that seething hate black people kind of way. Too me, racism is more of an active kind of thing. But I do think a lot of people have unexamined prejudices or biases. "Racist" is a loaded word and I think it makes the conversation more difficult. Either the person thinks, "I'm not out actively being racist, I'm good" and stops there without searching within themselves or they are put on the defensive and likewise all contemplation stops at that point. I prefer the term "prejudiced" because it isn't as loaded and it does invite people to look within themselves for some of the more subtle attitudes and beliefs that I think all of us have in one way or another (not just against black people but race/ethnicity, gender, class in general).

I'm not surprised that 1/3 of Democrats may not vote for a black person. I'm saddened but not surprised.

[mommy111]

I'm not surprised that 1/3 of Democrats may not vote for a black person. I'm saddened but not surprised.

That is the number that surprised me....we all tend to racially stereotype (my preferred term :)) to some extent, both negative and positive (the bright Asian student, the loving middle-aged Latino nanny), but I didn't think negative stereotypes would affect the vote so heavily especially amongst democrats given what democrats generally profess to stand for.
Makes me think of a comment that a mommy posted on this board in another discussion to the effect that Obama cannot get elected because he's black and a lot of people who say they support him now will vote McCain. Maybe she was right! I don't remember who that was but, if you're reading this, what do you think?

[ellies mom]

That is the number that surprised me....we all tend to racially stereotype (my preferred term :)) to some extent, both negative and positive (the bright Asian student, the loving middle-aged Latino nanny), but I didn't think negative stereotypes would affect the vote so heavily especially amongst democrats given what democrats generally profess to stand for.


Just like there are two types of Republicans, the "fiscal" conservatives and the "social" conservatives, I think there are two types of Democrats also. The blue collar union type people and the better educated (volvo driving, latte drinking) liberals. If you mostly hang out with the "liberals", you aren't going to hear about race being an issue. But, if you are most likely hanging out with the white blue collar worker types, I wouldn't be surprised if you do hear about it more. Mostly because they are more likely to feel "pitted against" people that aren't white. They are probably more likely to feel as though they are victims of affirmative action, that their jobs are more likely to be affected by immigration and jobs going overseas.

Personally, I think certain segments of our society benefit from the poor and lower working class groups being so segmented because if they are so busy distrusting each other, they aren't going to unite and demand more of the pie. One of the reasons I like Obama is that he wants to bring people together and it is too bad he hasn't done a better job of getting that message to the people that would benefit most by being united.

[kcandz]

What a great, insightful post. I think that is the most interesting thing I have read on any message board in a long time.

[kijip]

Yes. As a nation, as individuals, as sub-cultures. I've never really meet a person that will freely fess up to being racist, but I can't say I have ever met a totally non-racist person...even looking in the mirror. Racism is more complicated than merely disliking or holding bias against a group of people. There is a difference between what people know to be true and morally right and the inner workings of their minds and the lasting legacy of all of their experiences and learned notions about people that are different than them or different than how they grew up.

[mommy111]

Just like there are two types of Republicans, the "fiscal" conservatives and the "social" conservatives, I think there are two types of Democrats also. The blue collar union type people and the better educated (volvo driving, latte drinking) liberals. If you mostly hang out with the "liberals", you aren't going to hear about race being an issue. But, if you are most likely hanging out with the white blue collar worker types, I wouldn't be surprised if you do hear about it more. Mostly because they are more likely to feel "pitted against" people that aren't white. They are probably more likely to feel as though they are victims of affirmative action, that their jobs are more likely to be affected by immigration and jobs going overseas.

Personally, I think certain segments of our society benefit from the poor and lower working class groups being so segmented because if they are so busy distrusting each other, they aren't going to unite and demand more of the pie. One of the reasons I like Obama is that he wants to bring people together and it is too bad he hasn't done a better job of getting that message to the people that would benefit most by being united.

I understand the democratic demographic so much better because of that post.....thank you! I do tend to hang out with the 'latte liberals', and I think have been blind to the other demographics composing the party base.

[Globetrotter]

[quote=ellies mom]Just like there are two types of Republicans, the "fiscal" conservatives and the "social" conservatives, I think there are two types of Democrats also. The blue collar union type people and the better educated (volvo driving, latte drinking) liberals. If you mostly hang out with the "liberals", you aren't going to hear about race being an issue. But, if you are most likely hanging out with the white blue collar worker types, I wouldn't be surprised if you do hear about it more. Mostly because they are more likely to feel "pitted against" people that aren't white. They are probably more likely to feel as though they are victims of affirmative action, that their jobs are more likely to be affected by immigration and jobs going overseas.
quote]
:yeahthat: We live in a very diverse area where I think most of the younger people are raised to be fairly color-blind and the majority are well educated "liberals". There is something to be said about hanging out with people from other cultures and getting to know them as "people" rather than stereotypes. OTOH, our elderly neighbors have said some very racist things about people from other cultures, but I decided to forgive them because they are in their late 70s/80s... They are very friendly towards us and other non-white neighbors, so it's not a personal thing but based on stereotypes. If they were younger, I would be furious!

Once I was getting phone estimates for some yard work and this guy said he had done work in my neighborhood. Then he went on to deride people of my ethnicity who live here, not realizing I was of that ethnicity! It was very interesting and disturbing, like being a fly on the wall. Needless to say, I never called him back. I suspect that most people don't talk about it openly but there is distrust.

There is a fair amount of anti-Asian resentment here as the Asian community tends to be very well educated and therefore works in high-paying jobs, driving up real estate prices (well, not so much nowadays, though we are so far holding steady) and creating pressure cooker schools. There has been a huge "white flight" to escape all of this, though I have to say I don't blame people for wanting to flee the school system, but that's another story.

[kijip]

I think there are two types of Democrats also. The blue collar union type people and the better educated (volvo driving, latte drinking) liberals. If you mostly hang out with the "liberals", you aren't going to hear about race being an issue. But, if you are most likely hanging out with the white blue collar worker types, I wouldn't be surprised if you do hear about it more.

It is important to bear in mind that even if you don't hear about race as much from the liberal, highly educated set of the Democratic party does not mean that these people are not racist. I come from and interact with many flavors of Democrats (I come from working class, blue collar Irish Catholic unionized roots, grew up in poverty with a mother that never finished 6th grade, and am now a white collar, educated professional) and IMHO there is racism everywhere in the party, just like US culture as a whole.

[newmomto1]

Once I was getting phone estimates for some yard work and this guy said he had done work in my neighborhood. Then he went on to deride people of my ethnicity who live here, not realizing I was of that ethnicity! It was very interesting and disturbing, like being a fly on the wall.

Just want to say that I can TOTALLY relate to this situation!

I am Jewish, however I don't really "look" Jewish (as some people might characterize), & my maiden name wasn't a traditionally Jewish one. So, people don't always know that I am.

There have been SO MANY times in my life that I have heard derogatory comments, "jokes", etc., sometimes spoken right to my face. Many times from coworkers, even "friends".

Talk about being a fly on the wall...I've been a fly right in front of their faces & it's horrific

[wellyes]

While all of this is true, isn't it awesome that Obama is very likely going to win?

I'm 33.

My grandma was racist, though not of the angry type. She fervently and vocally believed that "colored" people were great at dancing, "Chinamen" were hard workers, "Mexicans" were lazy, and whites were normal.

My parents were very socially conscious and raised me to be as colorblind as possible, but I know their friends and family are a very mixed bag in terms of racism. I hear Mandingo jokes at every family reunion (if you don't know what that is, lucky you).

My friends and peers are, IMO, less racist than my parents' generation, having grown up in an entirely post Brown vs Board of Education / forced busing world.

Isn't it wonderful that our kids will (very likely) grow up with Obama as President?

[KBecks]

While all of this is true, isn't it awesome that Obama is very likely going to win?

You might be in for a surprise in November. Just be warned so it's not a total shock if McCain wins. ;)

[mommy111]

While all of this is true, isn't it awesome that Obama is very likely going to win?

Isn't it wonderful that our kids will (very likely) grow up with Obama as President?

I'm hoping that is true and that racial prejudice does not ding his numbers enough that he loses. If he lost on the issues, fair and good, but if he lost on race, I would be very, very sad (just as if Palin or HRC were standing for president and lost on gender, I'd be very, very sad :()

[niccig]

I'm hoping that is true and that racial prejudice does not ding his numbers enough that he loses. If he lost on the issues, fair and good, but if he lost on race, I would be very, very sad (just as if Palin or HRC were standing for president and lost on gender, I'd be very, very sad :()

:yeahthat::yeahthat::yeahthat::yeahthat:

[Globetrotter]

It is important to bear in mind that even if you don't hear about race as much from the liberal, highly educated set of the Democratic party does not mean that these people are not racist.

This is true. Most of us (myself included) have some stereotypes about others, whether or not we want to admit it to ourselves. However, I do make a conscious effort to overcome that.

Personally, I think it would be a beautiful thing if Obama won. It brings tears to my eyes just thinking that he made it this far, but I also admire HIM and agree with HIS positions on the issues. I wouldn't feel so excited if I didn't agree with him on the issues. For the same reason, I just can't get excited about the thought of a female VP when that VP goes against almost everything I believe in. Gender or race is not a factor for me, personally, when it comes to my vote. I know it does matter to a lot of people, though frankly I still cannot understand how it would overshadow the issues! That tells me the country still has a long way to go with race relations.

[psophia17]

There is a fair amount of anti-Asian resentment here as the Asian community tends to be very well educated and therefore works in high-paying jobs, driving up real estate prices (well, not so much nowadays, though we are so far holding steady) and creating pressure cooker schools. There has been a huge "white flight" to escape all of this, though I have to say I don't blame people for wanting to flee the school system, but that's another story.

Same here, although I think a great deal of the resentment towards the Asian community has to do with the crimes that are stereotypically Asian (counterfeiting, identity theft, the Triad, that sort of thing). I happen to have an Asian-sounding last name, and it's weird to note how people of all races react to seeing me, or my blond, blue-eyed children, when they were expecting someone Asian.

Would I ever label myself as racist? Well, the other day at work I was 99.9% sure I saw a shoplifter. I called security, and when asked for a description, I gave the man's height, weight, that he was bald, what he was wearing and carrying. They had to ask what race he was, it never occurred to me to tell them. I am quite proud of that fact. At the same time, I pay close attention when drivers near me on the road are Asian, because that way I am more ready to react when the car swerves into my lane.

[Laurel]

Edited b/c I really don't think we need to go there right now.

[Calmegja2]

This might be an important part of the study to look at, too. It might be even more of a factor than racism in the election. I know it's the pivotal point of my lifetime Dem support not happening this year. It's buried below the lead in the link:

Race is not the biggest factor driving Democrats and independents away from Obama. Doubts about his competency loom even larger, the poll indicates. More than a quarter of all Democrats expressed doubt that Obama can bring about the change they want, and they are likely to vote against him because of that