An open letter to the lady on the trail today

[firstbaby]

letting your massive dog walk far ahead of you on the trail in our neighborhood without a leash on him is RUDE. and against all the leash laws in our neighborhood / county.

I was out on a walk with my kids and this dog comes walking along the trail no owner in sight. The dog picks up his pace as he comes closer. DS1 starts to freak out, I was already holding DS2. I finally see the woman lagging pretty far behind the dog, not making any attempt to speed up or call her dog back. I calmy call out "Please put your dog on a leash". No response. DS1 goes into a total freak out crying and screaming - I reach down and scoop him up as the dog is trying to sniff him, etc. I could tell at that point that the dog is probably harmless, but I can't be positive. He's not my dog and I've never seen him before. The woman is walking up to us at that point and I LOST IT. I started yelling at her "you might know your dog is harmless but my children don't! The rules apply to YOU and you need to keep your dog on a LEASH". She says nothing, no apology, nothing. Keeps walking.

I am so angry still and this is hours later. GAH! DH has wanted me to bring pepper spray on walks before, but I'm not going to pepper spray some dog when it is the owner's fault for breaking the rules. Maybe I should pepper spray the owner - ha ha totally kidding.

[Melaine]

Things like that are SO scary when you have little ones. The may not seem to be a big deal to the dog owners, but it is downright scary to the rest of us. They shouldn't break the rules, but beyond that, I can't believe she didn't do anything when her dog approached you or even when you asked her to! That is just weird....

[happymomma]

It was so inconsiderate of her to walk the dog without the lease. Totally thoughtless. However, when she didn't even respond to your words, that was just plain rude. I would still be livid. But I am glad that you were there to protect your little ones.

[kristenk]

I think your DS1 and my DD would get along fabulously.

We had a similar experience close to a year ago. A woman was walking with her 2 dogs in the green belt behind our house while we were on the same greenbelt going to the park. Both dogs (golden retrieverish looking dogs) came bounding over to check us out. DD started shrieking. I picked her up. One dog continued to come over and jumped up on me so DD shrieked even more and tried to climb even higher, while the lady was putting one dog on its leash. I was trying to act so calm for DD, but I expected her to do something to call off the dog jumping up on me. (To make the situation more fun, I'm ridiculously allergic to dogs and avoid them at all costs just b/c I don't want to have to wash whatever body part or piece of clothing that comes in contact with them. But I try my best to ignore all of that when with DD so she sees that I'm not afraid of dogs.)

I was so angry at that lady. She apologized but didn't seem to get that her off-leash dog set us back *years* when it comes to DD's fear of dogs. Aaaaggghhhhh. Just writing about it infuriates me.:32:

I'm so sorry your DS had to go through that. :hug:

[StantonHyde]

A couple of things--it is rude not to control a dog around children. I walk in lots of off leash places and if someone is walking with a small child, I call my dog to me and hold him till they are past. Often, when I grab his collar, the parent says "oh he/she is ok with dogs" so I say ok and let my dog go. (he is not a jumpy or licky dog--just sniffs)but if they don't say anything, I hold till they are past. That is just being polite. And I have a small (60 lbs), elderly, Golden Retriever.

I am so SICK of idiots who say things like "oh my dog doesn't like other dogs'--then why is it off leash????? People with aggressive dogs tend to be stupid--they don't socialize the animals and think everybody else should see that their dog is playing. This is especially true for people with large dogs, breeds that tend to be aggressive--be extra careful.

On the flip side are people who walk on designated off leash dog trails who are upset that dogs are there or are freaked out by them. I also think that getting your child over a fear of dogs is VERY important. Dogs are everywhere and kids need to know how to ignore them or walk past them. Its the kids who scream and freak out who are more likely to get bitten because the dog freaks when the kid freaks.

I have had several incidents with my dog where I wish I had had pepper spray. And I don't care if I spray the dog instead of the owner--the owner will figure it out eventually. I just had to have $300 worth of vet work done 2 weeks ago because of some idiot who had his agressive dog off leash. I do always corral my kids if I don't like the looks of the dog. But my kids mostly ignore them and the dogs ignore the kids.

[neobunny]

I think you have every right to pepper spray a dog if it's off the leash & it comes too close to you or your kids. Too bad if the idiot owner gets mad. Tell them to call the cops if it makes them feel better. Then they can wonder why they get fined, or worse, they get the dog taken away. If a person wants to act like an idiot then they get treated like an idiot.

[MamaMolly]

OMG your story scared the sh!t or of me! I love dogs, DD adores them, but the thought of being approached by an unattended LARGE strange dog while out with DD is a very big fear of mine. I cannot come to grips with how incredibly rude and selfish that stupid owner is. She ought to be ashamed for putting her dog (and you, and your kids!!) at risk! IME of living in countries with packs of wild dogs and strays, the threat of a stick or even hauling your arm back like you've got a rock (even if you don't) is usually enough to get them to back off. I love animals, especially dogs, but I were in your place I think I'd have picked up the nearest stick or large rock way before that dog got near me. How were you supposed to know it wasn't a stray??

I totally, totally agree with your DH. You really should consider carrying pepper spray and don't be afraid to use it. It will not permanently hurt the dog and it and the owner will get a very valuable lesson in manners.

[cleo27]

I am so sorry that happened to you and your kids! That sounds so scary. I love dogs and have one, but it can be extremely scary to have an unknown dog approach you (and especially your kid!)

Hugs,

Cleo

[sste]

That is upsetting that the owner did not reply to you and that she had no control over the dog. This is a perennial issue if you live someplace where there is nowhere for dogs to run free (i.e., no dog park or dog friendly walking areas) - - inevitably the leash rules get broken and I can see the perspectives of both dog and human parents. For me, the dog touching the kids crosses a line even though its friendly.

I have to confess I am very guilty of letting my small dog off-leash in public places. He would NEVER EVER approach a child though - - not due to his good training but he has no attraction to children and avoids them or, when they ask, tolerates them petting him nicely enough. He mainly trots along beside us or sniffs shurbs. On the oppostite side of the coin, we have sometimes had children scream, cry, try to hit him, etc when he is ON LEASH or when he is over a dozen feet from them waddling along beside us.

If it makes you feel any better, big dogs are generally much safer than small dogs with kids. Not that that excuses the dog owner's behavior but just to warn you that we have so many kids approach our dog assuming that because he is little and cute he is harmless and in my experience more little dogs have feisty temperaments or legitimate fears about the kid falling on them with an unsteady walker . . .

ETA: On the pepper spray debate, if you absolutely felt you must use it, I would save that for a time when you felt your child was in imminent, serious physical danger from a dog. I agree with your point that its not fair to the dog, its not something you want to role model for your kids if it isn't a dangerous situation, and with anything like pepper spray there is a very significant risk of it accidentally spraying or affecting your DCs or you. If you want to scare off the dog before it approaches because you sense danger, it usually works to use very aggressive body language or to reach down and mime picking up a rock you are going to throw.

[ThreeofUs]

I *hate* owners like this. I was running along a river trail with dog and baby and had the same experience. I could have killed the woman - and she called ME a b*tch.

Some people.

[Ceepa]

We had a neighbor let her two med-large dogs jump on DS when he was fairly small. He was completely traumatized and it took a long time until he was OK being around any size dog.

[hbridge]

Just a warning to all of you who let your dogs run off-leash in a leash-law area...

I have a friend who told me how his LEASHED dog attacked an UNLEASHED dog who approached them. This happened on public land with a posted and well-known leash law. His dog doesn't like other dogs and showed it, but there was no way to move the stranger dog since he didn't have a leash. The owner was approaching and very angry, but there was nothing my friend could do... He only takes his dog to public areas with leash laws.

Unleashed dogs terrify me unless I know them. In our neighborhood most of the dogs run around off-leash, sometimes with the owner nowhere around. If I didn't know the dogs, I'd be terrified! You had every right to say something to the woman and you would have been in the right to do what you needed to do to protect yourself and your children. We have a VERY large, very scary looking dog across the street from us, he's a love, but for the first six months I was terrified to go outside when he was out. Of course DC loves all the animals in the neighborhood, but knows she needs to ask before she approaches any of them...

[tylersmama]

I have a friend who told me how his LEASHED dog attacked an UNLEASHED dog who approached them. This happened on public land with a posted and well-known leash law. His dog doesn't like other dogs and showed it, but there was no way to move the stranger dog since he didn't have a leash. The owner was approaching and very angry, but there was nothing my friend could do... He only takes his dog to public areas with leash laws.
:yeahthat: My dog is great. Really. But he's completely unpredictable around other dogs. I take him to daycare and he's fantastic, but he can be very territorial and very protective of DS and myself. I take him and DS (in the jogging stroller) running at least 2-3 times a week. It's desperately needed exercise for him as we live in a condo with no fenced in yard for him to run in. I keep him on a very short leash, and try to keep the stroller in between him and any other dogs. He does bark his head off every time he sees another dog, which is annoying, but harmless. One of the parks we frequently run in almost always has people letting their dogs off leash. Fine, your dog does well off-leash. Well, my dog doesn't want anything to do with your dog, which is why I keep him on such a short leash. But I can't do anything about it when your dog comes running up "just to say hi" so don't get snippy with me about my dog snarling and barking at yours. Oh yeah, and did you notice the toddler I have with me? The one that I REALLY don't want anywhere near a dog fight? Maybe you think I shouldn't take my dog out in public if he's going to act like that, but *I'M* the one who has my dog fully under control even if he is kind of loud and obnoxious! :32:

I live in a city where people treat their dogs like their own kids. And there are SO many dogs. I know the majority of owners are responsible, like me, but the ones who aren't really burn me up. Don't even get me started on the random people who walk their dogs through our condo complex and don't clean up their poop. Grr...

[MamaMolly]

...I have a friend who told me how his LEASHED dog attacked an UNLEASHED dog who approached them. This happened on public land with a posted and well-known leash law. His dog doesn't like other dogs and showed it, but there was no way to move the stranger dog since he didn't have a leash. The owner was approaching and very angry, but there was nothing my friend could do... He only takes his dog to public areas with leash laws.

My answer to the unleashed dog's owner is tough noogies. If he doesn't want his dog attacked then put it on a damn leash. It isn't just for the safety of others, it protects the dog, too.

I don't have a problem with the dog who stays with the owner, leash or not. I always ask before we approach a dog and have taught DD to do the same. I just wish some owners would return the kindness!

[firstbaby]

Thanks, everyone for your support. Two days later, I am still really angry about this. My issue at the time was two fold - I tried to stay calm for DS and tried to run through some quick planning in my mind for if the dog was not nice. DS likes dogs, but BIG dogs that are intimidating in size frighten him if he doesn't know them and I don't want him to fear dogs.

Our neighborhood has a fenced in "dog park" where people can meet and let their dogs run within that area. Which is empty almost all of the time. The problem is that people "know" their dogs are harmless and let them run free on the paved trails. YOU may know your dog is harmless, but the rules apply to everyone and I don't know your dog! Another issue we've had in our neighborhood is that young tweens are responsible for walking their big dogs on leashes but are not able to control the dog if they try to run free so there have been a couple of dog attacks while on a leash.

I know people have complained about it, but what can be done? It is not like they can put the police on the trail. But, I would expect in a neighborhood where we all could know each other, share the same air, etc for people to follow some sense of good judgement and common sense, KWIM? Especially when it comes to children's safety!

[ThreeofUs]

I know people have complained about it, but what can be done? It is not like they can put the police on the trail. But, I would expect in a neighborhood where we all could know each other, share the same air, etc for people to follow some sense of good judgement and common sense, KWIM? Especially when it comes to children's safety!

I believe you're right - and I'll bet there are quite a few people out there who feel the same way you do.

IIWM, I'd put on my "community organizer" hat and start talking to people in my area, people I meet walking dogs on leash, about the issue. I did that in my neighborhood, and what happened was that the people who live in my area (who mostly walk their dogs on leash, but certainly leash up when they see another dog coming) agreed. So we all have something nice but firm to say to people who walk their dogs off leash in our neighborhood.

Sure, the people who walk their dogs off leash get ticked, but I think we all feel like we're protecting ourselves, our dogs, and our kids from unwanted attention from these unleashed dogs.

Now, getting people to pick up after their dogs is another story.... ;)

[StantonHyde]

on the leash vs. off leash issue--you are absolutely right. If I see a dog walking on a leash in an area that is usually off leash, I call my dog and hold him until we are past. Dogs have a right to be walked and if they are on leash they are under control. Thus it is my fault if my dog gets bitten by an onleash dog.

[kristenk]

We went to the park's playground this morning. A great dane was off its leash trying to entice another dog (also off leash) to play with it. I don't think the owner even had a leash with her. At one point, she held the dog by its collar, but most of the time it was wandering around the park and playground. :32:

[jacksmomtobe]

As a dog owner it really ticks me off when people act irresponsibly like this. When having a dog off leash you must have it in sight and have the dog under control. I feel that you cannot assume that everyone likes dogs. Even if your dog is the nicest dog in the world the person may have had a bad dog experience and be scared of dogs. You need to err in the side of caution. Especially if kids are involved. When we went to a park with a playground I purposely kept my dog off the playground even if the kids were not there so that she would understand clearly that the area was off limits to her. Some dog owners are idiots. They make the rest of us look bad. Don't get me started on those who don't pick up their dogs poop. Or those who continue to come near my dog (while she is on leash since she no longer goes to off leash areas since we have a yard) when my dog is clearly showing that she does not want to meet your dog especially if I am with my kids. I feel so bad that your children went through this scary experience that could have been avoided if the owner was acting properly. You have every right to be mad.

[mommylamb]

I'm so sorry that happened to you. This is one of my pet peeves. We live in a community that has leash laws, and one of my neighbors regularly lets her dog off leash. A while back, DH watched as the dog came over and pooped on our lawn while my neighbor was sitting on her front step watching. She did not come over and pick it up. DH got really pissed, but he's a chicken and didn't do anything. I was off on maternity leave at the time, so I put DH in his baby bjorn and walked over and rang her doorbell (this is not a neighbor we had had much contact with in the past). I nicely informed her that my DH had witnessed her dog pooping on my lawn and asked her not to have him off leash and/or let him in my yard. I did not accuse her of watching it happen (though I knew she had). Her first response was oh, I didn't see him do that. A moment later she told me she didn't have a bag. She knew what had happened. And I think she knew I knew that she had just let it happened. We now call her dog **** woman.

ETA: I re-read my post...I meant that I put DS in his bjorn, not DH. I almost burst out laughing at work from the thought of me carrying DH around in a bjorn.

[JTsMom]

The dog poop issue is a big one for me. I can't wait to move for that very reason! The people in this complex are just awful about it, and totally brazen. Over the weekend, one of the worst offenders was letting his dog sniff around our patio, while I was standing, staring at him through the window!!!! Now that takes balls! When my stare turned into a dirty look he decided to move on.

The whole issue is just so disgusting! DS can't even play in our grass b/c of it. I've even seen poop on the sidewalk a couple of times!

[tylersmama]

Yep, same here. Lori. Drives me insane. The worst is when it snows and for some reason people think that they don't have to pick it up in the snow, then the snow melts and now you have frozen nasty dog crap laying in the middle of the sidewalk or the driveway. Argh! Disgusting! I have a dog...and I pick up his poop EVERY SINGLE TIME. It's not rocket science, people, seriously!