Careers in Academia vs Industry

[Sugar Magnolia]

I have another post about dh's disappointments with his career right now. He came home from a 7 day conference and is now unsure what he wants to do when he graduates (he is getting a PhD in Medicinal Chemistry). The plan was for him to go into industry.

But now he does not know if he is "cut out" for industry.

He wants to work in a lab.
Thats all he knows.
He is going in to talk with his adviser today. But I figured I would ask here to see what other mamas experiences are. He will be graduating in a year (yee haw), so we need to figure out what we want to do!
Experiences in both careers would be super helpful!
TIA!

[wellyes]

I have NO experience in that particular field, but I do know that in general academia is much more competitive than industry. So the choice really depends on his temperament and if he thrives in a more competitive environment vs one that offers more work-life balance.

[brittone2]

DH worked as a chemist in industry for 5 years and then decided to go back and pursue his PhD (analytical chemistry). Neither of us at this point in time has much interest in him hopping on the tenure track situation for academia. It is competitive, and I just think we both feel that our quality of life as a family could really potentially suffer (JMHO). THere are plenty of people that have good experiences w/ getting on a tenure track, and I know DH could totally do it, but I'm not sure either of us *wants* that since it can take a few years to actually get tenure.

Right now he's definitely leaning 95% toward a job in industry. I think he would do great in academia, but i'm just not willing to have him give up that much family time at this point in our lives.

[nellonello]

I graduated with a degree in Medical Technology and started my work in academia in a hospital lab performing clinical chemistry and clinical hematology analysis. I stayed there for 5 years and I got a bit frustrated as advancement and raises were not as much on merit as years served. In our lab worked with some lazy folks and saw them advance based on seniority. I then went into industry and have never looked back. I love working in industry and now work for a pharmaceutical company. I will say that there is less job stability in industry than in academia.

[willow33]

My dh has his PhD in Microbiology and Molecular Genetics. He is currently finishing up his post-doctoral fellowship in academia, but he plans to go into industry. Does your dh have to do a post-doc fellowship? I know for my dh it wasn't mandatory, but it will certainly help him get a better industry job.

Initially my dh wanted to stay in academia, but his view has changed in the last few years. The tenure track positions are really competitive and he has seen many of his professors have lots of trouble getting funding. He liked the idea of having his own lab and directing his own research, but he wasn't thrilled with the idea of teaching...just doesn't suit his personality. He seems really excited about getting a job in industry now though and hopefully it will happen by this summer. I'm excited for his salary to jump up as I'm sure you know how low the salaries are for grad students/post-docs. I guess that's the other plus about industry...salaries tend to be higher.

If you have any other questions feel free to post or send me a PM. I'd be happy to ask my dh his thoughts too.

Good luck!

[lowrioh]

Has your DH looked into working for the government? There are lots of research institutes/agencies that hire Medicinal Chemists...NIH, FDA, NCI (National Cancer Institute), FBI, CDC etc. There are also the National Labs and the research centers of the armed forces.
I've been working for the government as a chemist in a research laboratory environment since I finished my PhD.
In my experience, the atmosphere in the research labs is very similar to a academic institution except that there is less pressure. That and you have a much better work/life balance than both academia and industry.
The pay isn't as great as some industry but as a new PhD he should start around $87K in the DC area (pay is adjusted for your geographic location). There are also a lot of Post-Doc positions and IME they often lead to permanent government positions if they see that you are a good researcher. Government post-docs often pay better than academic ones too.
Another plus of working for the government right now is that they are hiring and you will have better job security. I have a lot of friends who work for the pharm industry and they are bailing out right and left.
PM me and I might be able to give you some more specific ideas.

[Sugar Magnolia]

Thanks for everyones thoughts.

Part of dh's indecision is most profs in his field start making 6 figures, you make tenure before you make full professor, and most profs do contract work for industry and the gov't (extra $).

I want him to be happy at the end of the day.

Keep your experiences coming!

[DrSally]

I have a cousin with a phd in chemistry that first worked in academia then industry. The money was way better in indurstry and he still gets to work in a lab (R&D).

ETA: It is true that they are laying off in in industry R&D

[MontrealMum]

Just a few random thoughts as I am familiar with academia in general, but not the hard sciences.

-academia is highly competitive, as mentioned above. There are continually hoops to jump through.
-it can require lots of moving around
-how is your DH's resume for conference presentations, articles, book reviews etc.? Any plans or tentative contracts to publish the dissertation when it's finished? I don't know how important this is in the hard sciences, but if he doesn't have any of this since he's been focussing on industry, this could be a real stumbling-block towards his getting a job, or at least, a tenure-track position.
-most academics make tenure before making full professor. In fact (you could likely google this or check it out on his profession's website) they usually make tenure as they move from assistant to associate professor
-funding is always a fun game, maybe it's better in the sciences? But I believe that academic scientists are expected to bring research dollars into their institutions.
-what is the % of people in his field that do a post-doc before looking for an academic position?

GL with your decision :) I'd give your DH's advisor's advice, and the advice you can get by checking out his professional organizations' a lot of weight. They often do studies about jobs, graduation rates and placement.

[american_mama]

DH is a professor in chemical engineering. One thing that hasn't been mentioned is how supportive his advisor is about helping him get into academia? My DH found his advisor's active support to be key in getting his career started. In contrast, friends of his suffered when their advisor didn't do much to facilitate connections to enter academia, and all of those friends ended up outside academia (in government reserach labs around Washington DC, as another poster mentioned).

PROS of academia for DH: pay for engineering is good (I assume the same for chemistry), good job security, field is in demand which put him in a good negotiating position when jobhunting and gives him some job mobility now, flexible schedule when you have time to take advantage of it, in many ways you are your on boss, people respect what he does, a lot of variety in what he does, just the right amount of travel

CONS: work is never-ending and highly stressful, there is always a ton to do, nature of academia is to be critical so takes a very thick skin, funding is hard to get, you can pour sweat and tears into funding proposals several times a year and still get no after no after no, have to play politics with your department, you have to work a ton with people (colleagues, students) even when it seems like your job should be about you, your lab, and your ideas

My father was a PhD bench chemist at a pharmaceutical company. He worked far, far less than my husband, although I wonder if a lot of that is generational.

DH did two postdocs after his PhD and really enjoyed both. That's when he did the most independent lab research and developed his expertise and confidence before becoming a full-blown professor. To us, the pay was fine.

Also, when I think of the lifetime perspective, I think DH will be completely happy with his decision to be a professor. He'll have been an important mentor to at least a few of his students, generated some new ideas in his field, earned a good living, and been able to travel, especially since science is a very international field. He's grown a lot as a writer and presenter already, and feels good about that. He loves being able to research what he thinks is interesting. He just would have felt so confined in industry.

Also about this:
>> most profs do contract work for industry and the gov't (extra $).
DH knows many older pros who do this, but he has not yet done so. I think it takes a lot of time and a certain personality to develop those relationships. You have to be a bit of an entrepeneur, marketer, and deal-maker.

[caheinz]

He really needs to think about what he wants to be doing.

In academia, there are teaching and mentoring components. Teaching won't be there in industry, and the mentoring will likely be different. Teaching takes a significant amount of time, especially the first time a course is taught. How much experience does your DH have in teaching? (And note that TAing is NOT teaching -- there's a huge jump between those two.) Does your DH enjoy teaching? (I'm in academia because I enjoy teaching. It wouldn't be a good fit if I didn't.)

There's a wide range of places even an academic can end up. Big research school, mid-range masters' school, undergrads-only campuses. Money, expectations, and what the expectations are for teaching, research, and service are going to vary among these.

Lab work is only part of academia. And a full professor (which is years and a promotion after tenure in all fields) doesn't usually spend all that much time in the lab at the bench... So if lab work is what he really wants, industry might be the better fit.

Also note that as the job market tightens, schools are going to insist on teaching experience and postdoctoral experience before they'll hire someone... Some fields moreso than others, but I think it's becoming more common, and not less.