WWYD? Need advice about my mom

[Mommy Of A Little Angel]

I don't normally get too personal here, but I need advise! I will try to keep this concise and have it make as much sense as possible, but I am a long-winded person so we will see!

My mom has been taking narcotic pain killers for years. She has had a few spine/back surgeries but "nothing helps". Now, I am not her, so I have no idea, but she also refuses to try other things (physical therapy, losing weight, etc) because it "just doesn't work". So, she is living her life out on narcotics. Fine, that's her choice. She also takes sleeping pills and anti-depressants (along with all kinds of other prescriptions). She functions as best a person taking all this can but she is losing her memory, forgetting things, and tends to say whatever comes to her mind.

I will not leave DD with her. I had a whole post on this in the b&tching section. She seems to forget this every single time I see her. She is constantly making plans or nagging me to leave. I have explained to her that there is no way. I have not made excuses or beat around the bush. She just doesn't get it. She thinks when baby #2 makes an appearance she will be watching DD for the day we are in the hospital. Umm, no! She also plans to come down a few months after to watch the baby. I can't tell her no enough. Every time it comes up, she gets defensive, says she wouldn't be stupid enough to take narcotics while watching DC (which is great, but she is addicted PLUS if she doesn't take them, won't she be in too much pain?) So, it's this fight we continue to have.

That on top of the fact that she is combative, defensive, and EVERYTHING hurts her feelings (she just cries over everything). She reinvents the past to make it sound amazing then INSISTS it happens that way. Don't even think to disagree because then you are saying she was a horrible mother. Oh, and dhe has no common sense anymore. She taught DD the "don't hit yourself game!"

I am done. I hate having her here because of the negativness. I hate the way she makes me feel. I hate that she tells me I am a disappointment one moment, then swears she never said it. I hate that DD has seen me fight with her. DH and I never fight so DD didn't know what to make of this. DH doesn't even want her in the house. She has already booked a flight back here in March (without asking, she never does!) She just kind of tells you she is coming, then acts all innocent like "that's alright, right? You aren't doing anything anyway!"

My brother and his wife have stopped talking to her. I want to do the same but I feel incredibly guilty. She is my mother after all. I just can't handle it anymore. She is the only person who can cause me to have migraines. There is no talking to her either. We tried last Christmas and she tells everyone she can about this intervention that we stages. Not even close but that's what she remembers.

I know this is rambling, but I seriously have no idea what to do anymore. I hate for DD not to have a relationship with her, but I am afraid at this point it is more harm then good. I know my mom is hurt by my brother not talking to her and can't understand it so I am sure it will be more the same. She honestly thinks my SIL has a mental defect (her words, not mine!) and that's why she doesn't like her.

[fivi2]

I think I responded in the BP, but I honestly think that you and I have the same mother! Absolutely everything you wrote, I could have written - the back pain, the narcotics, the rewriting history, the making everything someone else's fault, the selective listening, selective memory, the screaming, the crying - all of it!

I don't have any good advice, though. just sympathy. My sister and I have both gone through phases of not speaking to her. Even if she isn't taking the drugs, can she be trusted not to leave them where dc can get to them?

All you can do is what you are doing. (or not speak to her. it sounds like you aren't ready for that). Do not leave her alone with dc. She will get offended and tell everyone you know how awful you are and what an ungrateful daughter you are. But, she will do that anyway. It is all about her (in her mind). It is all about what you do to her, not about what is best for you or your children.

The only thing you can really change is how you react to her. I have tried to stop responding. I don't argue or give her a reaction (well, I try ;) ) I go about my business as though she isn't there - getting a sitter or whatever. She tags along like another child. She is not alone with my kids. I don't try to make her into what I think a mother should be - she can't be that. I live as though I don't have a mother - she is just some eccentric old aunt that we all ignore and put up with.

My sister can't do it. She gets the migraines and turns into a mess.

Oh we have tried talking seriously, writing letters, etc. She either pretends it didn't happen or acts like we were the crazy ones.

As far as dc and their relationship. Only you can tell when it crosses the line into more harm than good. As I said, my mother is not alone with mine. She talks on the phone, but I listen in. When she falls into her emotionally abusive pattern, I take the phone away immediately, no goodbye. If she does it too often, no phone for a while.

I loved the book Mothering Without a Map. It was great.

Sorry you have to go through this!

[Twoboos]

First and formost, HUGS to you. :hug: It is so difficult to go through something like this with your own mother! I couldn't not respond. Even if this is a long rambly probably pointless response!!

Your mom sounds like my SIL's mom. SIL is wonderful one minute, worst daughter ever the next. Her mom rewrites history, begs for SIL to help her (usually financially) and then is insulted if SIL offers or even worse offers limited help. She is so negative and there is nothing, NOTHING that SIL can do that is right in her own mom's eyes.

SIL has tried to limit her interactions w/her mom, but this just makes the mom mad/hurt, and the mom "cannot understand why" SIL would treat her this way. SIL is at the point of cutting off all communication because there is no happy medium, or limited time they can spend together before the mom jumps all over her. This woman is crazy, and I mean actually mentally ill, but everyone else has the problem not her.

I know SIL struggles with this alot. My bro and SIL do not have kids yet, but she always thinks about her children not having a "normal" grandma (my mom - who was just the opposite of hers! - passed away this fall) and her mom not seeing her children. There is tremendous guilt there.

(Boy, you thought you were longwinded?? :ROTFLMAO:) Anyway, one day we were talking and I just said - your mom is toxic and even if she is your mom, you can't have a person like that in your life. Yes, there are expectations about a mom but she is not filling them and she makes you miserable and if she was anyone else you wouldn't think twice about cutting her off.

The short version - just b/c she's your mom doesn't mean you have to tolerate her making you miserable with her skewed miserable agenda. I know, easier said than done since it's not my own mom!!

SIL has also been going to a therapist to try to help deal. (Even though her mom is CONVINCED it's the therapist causing all the problems! B/c it could never ever be her.)

I don't know, I hope it's not a hijack of your post. But you're really not alone in this situation. :hug: GOOD LUCK

BTW - just realized maybe your mom need to have her meds checked - maybe they are interacting badly?? Just a thought.

[maestramommy]

As to your mom, I saw your post in BP. :hug: I think the pp have spoken with much better BTDT. But I was thinking, if she's on all those meds, she must be under care of a doc. Can you talk to the doc about what's happening? Perhaps like pp said, the dosage needs to be adjusted, or there's a bad combo somewhere. That's easy to happen, if she's taking even a few.

[MamaMolly]

That on top of the fact that she is combative, defensive, and EVERYTHING hurts her feelings (she just cries over everything). She reinvents the past to make it sound amazing then INSISTS it happens that way. Don't even think to disagree because then you are saying she was a horrible mother. Oh, and dhe has no common sense anymore. .

This could be my mom :(. I'm so very sorry.

I'm really proud of you for realizing that you mom is not healthy and that there really isn't anything you can do to change her behaviors. You need to listen to your heart here. You say you want DD to have a relationship with your mom, but ask yourself 'why'? What is DD going to get from watching you and your mom fight? From spending 'quality time' with an addict? There is NO WAY someone who is addicted to all that medication is going to go cold turkey while visiting you. She may believe it when she says it, but she won't be able to stop. You wouldn't have a random drug addict come stay at your house, so give yourself permission to not host the one you are related to.

My parents are no gems either. Yes, we are supposed to honor our mother and father, but that doesn't mean we have to be emotional doormats, you know? My sister really struggles with her relationship with our dad. I've accepted him as he is, but she really keeps pinning her heart on him changing over and over and over. And is disappointed over and over and over. Mourn the parent you wish you had, and come to terms with the one you've got. And protect your kids from their bull$h!t.

Again, big hugs.

[fivi2]

As to your mom, I saw your post in BP. :hug: I think the pp have spoken with much better BTDT. But I was thinking, if she's on all those meds, she must be under care of a doc. Can you talk to the doc about what's happening? Perhaps like pp said, the dosage needs to be adjusted, or there's a bad combo somewhere. That's easy to happen, if she's taking even a few.

I am not OP and can't speak to her mother's situation, but I know that my mother goes to a variety of doctors and doesn't tell the others about them. She goes with back pain, migraines, fibromyalgia (that can't be spelled right, but I am too lazy to look it up), among other things. So, there is usually not one doctor who know everything in these cases. My mother reads about the drugs and mixes as she chooses. So trying to explain to her that the cocktail may be wrong usually gets nowhere. They are in this situation because they *know* what is best and everyone else is wrong. There is no arguing with that. Again, OP may be different, that is just the experience I have had.

[Mommy Of A Little Angel]

I am not OP and can't speak to her mother's situation, but I know that my mother goes to a variety of doctors and doesn't tell the others about them. She goes with back pain, migraines, fibromyalgia (that can't be spelled right, but I am too lazy to look it up), among other things. So, there is usually not one doctor who know everything in these cases. My mother reads about the drugs and mixes as she chooses. So trying to explain to her that the cocktail may be wrong usually gets nowhere. They are in this situation because they *know* what is best and everyone else is wrong. There is no arguing with that. Again, OP may be different, that is just the experience I have had.

Fivi2 - Yes, I think we may have the same mother. They are exactly alike - even with how they deal with doctors. She takes medication for everything under the sun. She also has every disease imaginable. She has COPD, chronic bronchitis, asthma, carpal tunnel, migraines, spina bifida (I swear she claims she has this!), everything and anything! Telling her that she can't take a sleeping pill, then wake up two hours later and take narcotics - all on top of the anti-depressants is met with resistance and "well my doctor says I can!" Right, all three of them who have no idea what the other is saying!

Honestly, she went to a psychologist and came out saying that the psychologist told her she was the sanest person she ever met!

[fivi2]

Fivi2 - Yes, I think we may have the same mother. They are exactly alike - even with how they deal with doctors. She takes medication for everything under the sun. She also has every disease imaginable. She has COPD, chronic bronchitis, asthma, carpal tunnel, migraines, spina bifida (I swear she claims she has this!), everything and anything! Telling her that she can't take a sleeping pill, then wake up two hours later and take narcotics - all on top of the anti-depressants is met with resistance and "well my doctor says I can!" Right, all three of them who have no idea what the other is saying!

Honestly, she went to a psychologist and came out saying that the psychologist told her she was the sanest person she ever met!

ooh - I forgot about the carpal tunnel and the chronic bronchitis - mine claims those too! and the anti-depressants and sleeping pills, and asthma. Mine was a smoker for many years, so I assumed that had something to do with the breathing issues... who knows! She hasn't tried spina bifida, though. That made me giggle a little, sorry :)

When my sister cut my mother out (for leaving narcotics where her toddler could get them), part of her big letter was that our mother had to see a psychologist before she could see her grandkids again. Our mother said that she had been to one who said she was fine and didn't need any help! The problem is that she is smart enough (at least back then, now she can't retain anything) to fool a psych, at least for a short period of time. Combine that with the rewriting history and blaming everyone else...

I may have to copy your post and show my sister (no user name or anything) because she always says there is no one else out there like our mother. You have no idea how eerily similar they sound! It is kind of freaky.

We have diagnosed my mother as being: bipolar, histrionic, narcissistic, addicted to drugs (hard to say how much of her behavior is from a lifetime of drug abuse and how much is mental instability), and lately, dementia.

Sorry, this is not about me, it is just weird how similar they are! All I can say is you have to take care of yourself and your family and try to end the emotional hold she has over you. and that is hard to do. I am not big on self-help books, but I do think Mothering without a Map was a good one. good luck!

eta: I think StantonHyde and dcmom2b3 both have some excellent advice!

[dcmom2b3]

:hug::hug: and more :hug::hug:

Couldn't read this and not post now, will come back later with more, but suffice it to say, I've got that mom too. And she's living with us now, expected home within the hour. . . .

:hug:

Ok. Back now. I love Rebecca's (Stanton Hyde) suggestions and strategies (I'm taking notes, btw). A couple of mine to share:

My mantra is "gentle, loving detatchment." She is who she is, but just because she's my mother doesn't mean that she gets to treat me badly.
So, like with my 2yr old, I choose my battles to enforce boundaries with mom, but I don't expect that it will make any impression on her. EVER.(unlike my hopes for the 2yr old). Now that I'm not invested in understanding or being understood by (or emotionally close to) my mom (all of which are fruitless and soul-sucking endeavors) it's easier to see and accept her for who she is (and isn't).


So, for example, when mom starts in on how she can watch the Bunny, I don't argue, at most I deflect, change the subject, etc. And hire a sitter/take her to daycare/stay home from work anyway. No arguments or discussion, just me singlemindedly doing what I know is best. If I'm not apologetic, her histrionics are fewer. And what she does throw at me, I manage to deflect. (My other mantra has to do with Teflon).

From one perspective, you could say that I've marginalized mom and her issues to such an extent that they're not issues for me any longer. I've stopped expecting my mother to meet my expectations. And that sounds sort of messed up. Until I consider that allowing mom to sap my spirit diminishes that which I can share with the Bunny, and that which I will need to enjoy life long after grandma is gone and Bunny is off living her own gloriously happy life. That modeling healthy boundaries with authority figures (grandma) is sending good messages about self-worth to Bunny -- nobody can treat you poorly and rely on status or love or familial bonds as an excuse.

In short, the buck stops here. I'm not going to make my daughter into a guilt-ridden neurotic mess or allow my mother to put my spirit on lockdown so that I become a miserable elderly lady who is a burden to my daughter.

It stops here.

[StantonHyde]

A couple of thoughts. My Dad has turned into a raging PITA since my mom died (he was just your basic emotionally-abusive narcissist before that!). Here are some things I have done:

1. I saw a therapist for about 6 mos after mom died to deal with my grief. I saw her for another YEAR to deal with my dad. (This is on top of the 6 years I spent in my 20s seeing therapists to "detoxify" his parenting affects). If you have not already seen a therapist about your mom, make an appointment. You need to reconcile the past behavior while developing a plan to respond to the current behavior.

2. The only person you can change is you. I choose to flat out ignore my father--walk out of the room while he is speaking etc. I also place very firm limits on topics of conversation (we no longer discuss money).

3. As a good friend said to me, "Don't go looking for milk in the hardware store." My brother still expects my father to be one. I gave that up a LONG time ago and it sounds like you have too.

4. My therapist posed a very interesting question--Trying to get the parent you want isn't going to work. So, what kind of daughter do you want to be? That helped me ALOT. I want to keep communication with my dad because I feel obligated to do so. I had to set limits--phone calls no more than weekly and physical visits no more than once a month. But so far I am able to make it work. But when it does not, then I will reexamine to see if I want to cut him off.

I grew up without either one of my grandfathers because they both died early. I had one grandma who I saw rarely. My one grandma was awesome. My children are going to know DH's mom and my dad. Maybe for another 10 years or so. But I think the argument of wanting kids to have their grandparents starts to wear thin when they are that toxic.

Big, big hugs--you are dealing with a narcissitic personality disorder and a drug addict. There just is no way to win this one. Just work with your therapist to see what works best for you and your DC (and your DH). Good luck.

[BabyMine]

I can somewhat help because I am also on those meds plus more. I have chronic conditions that require me the be on a lot of meds. The narcotics can bring on th emood swings. Hopefully she is seeing the right kinds of doctors and they all know the meds she is on. They have to keep adjusting my meds every now and then. I was in the medical field for awhile so I can spot some problems and tell my doctor before they get worse.

Some of the meds I tried did cause the memory and confusion problems. The best thing to do is what you are currently doing. Your first priority is your family and stability. It can take a toll on everyone. You want to "fix" her but you can't.

If you need anyone to talk to please feel free to pm me.

Hugs:grouphug:

[JTsMom]

I don't have any advice, but I couldn't read and not send a hug. :hug:

[DrSally]

..."That on top of the fact that she is combative, defensive, and EVERYTHING hurts her feelings (she just cries over everything). She reinvents the past to make it sound amazing then INSISTS it happens that way. Don't even think to disagree because then you are saying she was a horrible mother. Oh, and dhe has no common sense anymore. She taught DD the "don't hit yourself game!" "

I remember your BP post. I think she needs to have her meds/med combo reevaluated. I also wonder if this is the onset of some sort of dementia. Depression can come with dementia. Is this how she has always been or is this really a change (even if it's been gradual)?

ETA: I don't want to minimize the emotional effects on you and your family. I think the approach would be somewhat different if it were medical vs. personality driven. The first place I might start would be to rule out medical causes (and I agree that patients can get multiple scripts from multiple docs that have no idea of each other and many patients also decide on their own which meds to take, when and how much). If it's a borderline/narcissistic personality problem, ITA with the pp's eloquent posts. Keeping distance, setting boundaries, etc.


Molly had it right on: "Mourn the parent you wish you had, and come to terms with the one you've got. And protect your kids from their bull$h!t...."

Also, this is so wise from Mary Helen: "In short, the buck stops here. I'm not going to make my daughter into a guilt-ridden neurotic mess or allow my mother to put my spirit on lockdown so that I become a miserable elderly lady who is a burden to my daughter."
I actually think it's pretty healthy to "marginalize" your mom to the point that she's still in your life but not affecting you so deeply. Like Rebecca said, you can only change yourself/your reaction, and sometimes that's the best/only thing that you can do with the person/situation you have.

[Mommy Of A Little Angel]

Thank you all for your replies! It really helps to know that I am not the only one dealing with a situation like this. I agree that her meds probably need to be re-evaluated, though I am not sure she will care to hear that. I can only try right? I will definitely check out the suggested book. Thanks again for sharing your experiences and advice.