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StantonHyde
10-24-2009, 07:14 PM
We went to a Halloween Carnival at DS's school last night and a kid who was older (like 12 or so) came as Obama. He wore a suit----and he blackened his face. Not his hands or anything else. Just his face. He didn't have any other odd prop--he was just Obama.

My DH and I both paused. Isn't that sort of like "black face" or "dark face" or whatever it is that white performers used to do way back when? Now we live in Utah and the AA population of this state is less than 1%. There have honestly been cases when people have been stupid and unaware and said things they shouldn't have--about football players, or the economy, whatever. There are also cases when by any stretch of the imagination it was something racist and saying "I didn't know" just didn't cut it. (and of course there are things that are racist and were meant that way)

What would your take be on this costume? There are plenty of president masks that get worn so I don't necessarily mind that someone was going as a president for Halloween. I'm sure there were some great Clinton/cigar costumes in the day. It was the dark face that gave me pause.

And, as a card carrying liberal, I am BEYOND embarrassed to admit--what is it called? dark face, black face? And wasn't it done in shows in the 40s or 50s? And what was the context that made it so offensive? I need a quick history lesson here.

Thanks for giving me some perspective and a quick education!

MMMommy
10-24-2009, 07:26 PM
I've seen plenty of Obama masks (the kind that you buy and wear with a string around the head), but blackening one's face with makeup seems highly inappropriate and offensive. I'm surprised his parents allowed him to even leave the house like that.

Didn't Tim Danson cause controversy when he did the same thing at Whoopi Goldberg's Friar Club's roast?

Blatantly offensive, in my opinion.

wellyes
10-24-2009, 07:32 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackface

Blackface / minstral makeup. Full-on blackface would include exaggerated white or red lips too. Even without, it's unquestionably a racist and offensive portrayal, no matter what person of color is being "depicted".

randomkid
10-24-2009, 07:33 PM
It was called "Blackface" and I think the problem with it was that it was intended to be racist and usually made AAs look unintelligent and ridiculous. Basically, they were making fun of them. However, if you read this information (probably more than you ever wanted to know), it seems that some of it was because they used white actors to portray black characters. Of course, this was racist in itself because blacks were not allowed to act. The interesting thing to me in this article was that black actors also wore Blackface makeup. Seems they started phasing it out in the 1930s. Here's the link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackface

Now, for the kid - I'm not sure I would find it offensive. I'm guessing he wanted to go as Obama and didn't want to pay for a mask? No way to know for sure if he intended to be offensive or if he was just ignorant about it. I wouldn't expect a 12yo to know a thing in the world about blackface makeup and its connotations. FWIW, blackface makeup was not just painting the face black, but they would paint white or red around the mouth and I think eyes to emphasize the blackness and make the character look more clownish.

StantonHyde
10-24-2009, 08:12 PM
Thanks. I knew there was a reason I was having such a gut level reaction to this. He didn't have lips painted or anything--not even a wig. I am sure his parents let him leave the house because they have no clue either. Or they do and they think it is funny. sigh.

Cheburashka
10-24-2009, 08:18 PM
Well, I'm sure the kid didn't know it was racist, but unless the parents were extremely sheltered, I can't believe they wouldn't know that's racist. I've seen some of the Obama masks too, and I don't think they were all that expensive. Seems to me like you'd have to go more out of your way to find the paint than the mask. But idk.

BelleoftheBallFlagstaff
10-24-2009, 08:51 PM
I've seen plenty of Obama masks (the kind that you buy and wear with a string around the head), but blackening one's face with makeup seems highly inappropriate and offensive. I'm surprised his parents allowed him to even leave the house like that.

Didn't Tim Danson cause controversy when he did the same thing at Whoopi Goldberg's Friar Club's roast?

Blatantly offensive, in my opinion.

:yeahthat:

sunshine873
10-24-2009, 08:55 PM
I guess I'm a minority on this one. 1st of all, I've heard over and over how kids shouldn't wear masks - it's not safe, so I'm not surprised that he didn't have a mask. Beyond that, if he had just worn a suit & tie, would you have known he was Obama? As long as it's not done in full on blackface style (over-exaggerated, etc.) I guess I don't see the problem with a little coloring on the face...I mean, Obama is black, that's factual, right?

Sorry if I've offended anyone, I just wanted to give my 2 cents.

Sillygirl
10-24-2009, 09:00 PM
I think it's just impossible for people viewing the costume to overlook the historical weight of racism that blackface carries. I'm trying to think of a perfect analogy and failing. But just like Prince Harry in a Nazi uniform was offensive, no matter that we knew he wasn't a Nazi, blackface in the US is offensive, period. Off limits, can't be done.

hillview
10-24-2009, 09:10 PM
This is tough -- I was just talking with my hairdresser about this :)

So we have an african american president, people dress up as the president EVERY halloween. Are we at a place where pretending to be african american is ok -- since we have an african american president? Or is it still taboo? If you do make up to look more asian is that ok? Is that different? Is it different because of our american history of racism against african americans?

I get that black face was (is) offensive. I get that it still is due to the history. At some point, it seems like maybe it would be better if we felt collectively that it was ok if no racism was intended.

I am going to guess that the 12 year old maybe LOVES obama -- in that case it seems like it should be ok but maybe as a nation, it still isn't.

Rambling I know. It is complicated even though it seems like it shouldn't have to be anymore with Obama in office.
/hillary

trales
10-24-2009, 09:11 PM
:yeahthat: To Sillygirl.
I can't really think of any situation where it would be okay.

egoldber
10-24-2009, 09:15 PM
I think wearing an Obama mask is fine. Black face, no.

It is truly possible the kid simply did not know and many schools have prohibitions on kids wearing masks to Halloween parties, so he may have simply not thought.

trales
10-24-2009, 09:18 PM
I have been thinking about this. If a kid wants to be Reagan, Carter, Nixon, Clinton or Bush, he wears a mask, no matter what his ethnic background. An African American kid is not going to wear a suit, dress in white face and assume everyone knows he is Bush.

Dressing as Obama should be the same, you need to mask to be the guy, otherwise you are just a kid wearing blackface makeup. That is unacceptable.

hillview
10-24-2009, 09:20 PM
I have been thinking about this. If a kid wants to be Reagan, Carter, Nixon, Clinton or Bush, he wears a mask, no matter what his ethnic background. An African American kid is not going to wear a suit, dress in white face and assume everyone knows he is Bush.

Dressing as Obama should be the same, you need to mask to be the guy, otherwise you are just a kid wearing blackface makeup. That is unacceptable.

Very interesting and excellent point. I had not thought of it in this way.
/hillary

randomkid
10-24-2009, 09:22 PM
I think wearing an Obama mask is fine. Black face, no.

It is truly possible the kid simply did not know and many schools have prohibitions on kids wearing masks to Halloween parties, so he may have simply not thought.

I agree with this, but I'm not so sure a 12yo would necessarily know that painting his face might be offensive to some (referring to the "he simply may have not thought"). I didn't think about the fact that maybe masks weren't allowed. It could be that simple - he's a kid. As a PP said, maybe he loves Obama. A lot of kids do. If he had on traditional blackface makeup, then that would be racist. Painting his face brown, IDK.

egoldber
10-24-2009, 09:32 PM
Oops, I didn't finish that sentence. I meant to say he may not have thought about the possibility of it being offensive. Or even known the historical significance. Sarah had never seen or heard of black face until we read one of the later Little House books (maybe Little Town on the Prairie?) where some of the characters in the book put on a minstrel show. I had to explain what it was to her and that it was considered offensive today.

vonfirmath
10-24-2009, 10:27 PM
When dressing as an "Egyptian" character growing up, I only put makeup on my face, not on every bit of skin showing. The face is key to the character, the hands are not. And makeup on the hands is a lot harder to deal with, IMHO.

So I would not have jumped to the conclusion that this boy was trying to be racist/make fun of the President.

And I have seen people dress up as President George W Bush without a mask. They just use other ways of showing who they are. (A button with a W on it worked)

Toba
10-24-2009, 10:42 PM
I have been thinking about this. If a kid wants to be Reagan, Carter, Nixon, Clinton or Bush, he wears a mask, no matter what his ethnic background. An African American kid is not going to wear a suit, dress in white face and assume everyone knows he is Bush.

Dressing as Obama should be the same, you need to mask to be the guy, otherwise you are just a kid wearing blackface makeup. That is unacceptable.

Totally agree with this. Was thinking this and you said it perfectly.

Blackface = way politically incorrect (and just wrong), even in a predominately conservative area

There was just a big news story on a gossip site I go to about Harry Connick Jr. being outraged about a comedy skit that was done on an Australian TV show he was guesting on ... the all white group did their skit in blackface. This was one of the tamer articles: http://www.cnn.com/2009/SHOWBIZ/TV/10/08/harry.connick.blackface/index.html

wellyes
10-24-2009, 11:12 PM
OP, when you say he "blackened" his face, do you mean he wore makeup to approximate Obama's appearance? Obama, being biracial, is obviously pretty light-skinned.

If he'd truly blackened his face, with shoepolish or something, I would find that appallingly offensive. But if it was something like how, say, Natalie Woods wore body makeup to appear Puerto Rican in West Side Story - I could see that as being innocent.

♥ms.pacman♥
10-24-2009, 11:50 PM
I have been thinking about this. If a kid wants to be Reagan, Carter, Nixon, Clinton or Bush, he wears a mask, no matter what his ethnic background. An African American kid is not going to wear a suit, dress in white face and assume everyone knows he is Bush.

Dressing as Obama should be the same, you need to mask to be the guy, otherwise you are just a kid wearing blackface makeup. That is unacceptable.

:yeahthat: great points, I agree.

dcmom2b3
10-25-2009, 12:03 AM
My initial reaction is that this kid (and parents too, possibly) must think that the only black man in the US who wears a suit is Obama. B/c otherwise how would one be expected to "get" it? But that's just a knee-jerk response,

TwinFoxes
10-25-2009, 12:07 AM
But even if the 12 year old didn't know, what were his parents thinking? I'm sorry, darkening your face is offensive because of the history. It's amazing to me that people think it's ok. If I were part of the what, 3% or so black population of Utah I would have been pissed off to have my kids see that.

I think the Prince Harry analogy is a good one, but not perfect, but I'm not sure there's a perfect one.

If you really want to dress like Obama, wear "mom jeans" and a Sox jacket! ;)

TwinFoxes
10-25-2009, 12:08 AM
My initial reaction is that this kid (and parents too, possibly) must think that the only black man in the US who wears a suit is Obama. B/c otherwise how would one be expected to "get" it? But that's just a knee-jerk response,
Wow, we are on the same wavelength. I was going to include this point but didn't for brevity's sake.

ETA: maybe his costume was Eric Holder!

american_mama
10-25-2009, 12:46 AM
ETA: maybe his costume was Eric Holder!

Or Stedman Graham. They look alike.

And food for thought - I can't really imagine anyone darkening their skin to dress up as Michael Jackson, not even in his Thriller days when he was darker skinned. Why? I come up are two reasons for this: 1) Michael crossed race lines whereas Obama's race bothers a chunk of people and 2) there are many other props to use to show that you are dressing as Michael Jackson... the hair, the glove, the shades, the poses, the costumes. It's harder to find something costume-y to show that you are dressing as Obama. Still, if the only prop you can come up with is his skin - not his ears, his big smile, his graying hair, or something on your clothing - it does sort of suggest that that's the most salient thing you see in him and that, along with the racist connotations of blackface, are why it is bothersome.

StantonHyde
10-25-2009, 01:26 AM
These are all very good points. To answer some questions. The kid just had brownish/black face makeup on--not shoe polish etc. But it was just the circle of his face. And yes, there were no masks allowed. (It's not like he couldn't have come up with some other costume though, for the carnival and another for Halloween night--especially when all he had to do was cover his face in black crayon) I also know he was dressing up as Obama (vs. Stedman LOL) because he said so to someone else.

I can pretty well assure you that this kid did not love Obama. But I think that it really was one of those "I don't know" things.

I am really encouraged by all of your responses. One, because it validates my gut wrenching reaction to this costume. Two, I think I am going to write a letter to the principal (private school) to call her attention to the situation. And your points will help/get incoporated into that letter. I don't know who the kid was, but this is a TINY school so someone will. I am just going to pitch the idea of perhaps the Social Studies teacher could cover various race "issues" and maybe the upper school could have a conversation on sensitvity.

If I think about it, the only reason that I knew "blackface" existed was from my years living on the east coast. The west is weird. There are TONS of examples of what was done to Native Americans, and then Hispanic farm workers, Japanese in internment camps, and Chinese railroad workers. But AAs were not a fabric of society like in the east coast--Utah didn't see its first significant Caucasian settlement till 1847 and New Mexico wasn't a state till 1912. So beyond the Civil War, some Jim Crow laws and then the Civil Rights, kids here really don't learn about more of the fabric of racism with regards to AAs like you would on the East Coast. (I went K-6 on the East Coast and 7-12 in the west)

So I am going to give the benefit of the doubt--the kid didn't understand the full significance of what he was doing and neither did his parents. BUT I think it is then incumbant upon our school to do some education. sigh.

MamaMolly
10-25-2009, 08:07 AM
I have been thinking about this. If a kid wants to be Reagan, Carter, Nixon, Clinton or Bush, he wears a mask, no matter what his ethnic background. An African American kid is not going to wear a suit, dress in white face and assume everyone knows he is Bush.

Dressing as Obama should be the same, you need to mask to be the guy, otherwise you are just a kid wearing blackface makeup. That is unacceptable.

:yeahthat: I was just going to post the same thing. How would a student portray a white president? And let's stretch it further and say an AA student? Not with white makeup. Ergo, the blackface was at *best* a bad, bad lapse of judgement. Some things are taboo for a darn good reason.

And I don't think your political views are (ahem) coloring your view of the situation. I'm more of a righty than a lefty ;) and I'd be shocked and honestly a little horrified if I saw a student do this. Maybe it is more a regional thing? I grew up in the South East.

newnana
10-25-2009, 09:08 AM
Oh boy. Yep, inappropriate.

Last year my 3 year old DD desperately wanted to be Obama for Halloween. She loves him. She was adamant. It was inappropriate for so many reasons but her heart was in the right place. Even with her good intentions, it is just not okay. Especially because as another poster said, we don't think masks are safe. And they definitely didn't make them in the 3 YO size.

Nope. Not appropriate.

BabyMine
10-25-2009, 10:07 AM
If a 12y did want to be Obama becasue he likes him and masks aren't allowed what would be an appropriate costume?

alexsmommy
10-25-2009, 10:39 AM
My initial reaction is that this kid (and parents too, possibly) must think that the only black man in the US who wears a suit is Obama. B/c otherwise how would one be expected to "get" it? But that's just a knee-jerk response,

Yes, yes, yes. If a Caucasian child wore a suit during the Bush administration, even if he wore a Bush campaign button, would it be assumed he was dressing up as President Bush? No.

Honestly I've wondered b/w Michael Jackson and President Obama if I would suddenly see people with "black face" make-up this Halloween. NOT OK. I say that as an African-American. I anticipate having to discuss this with DS1 and explain why historically it is not ok and offensive.

DS1 is going as Anakin Skywalker this Halloween. I will not be painting his face to look Caucasian. In this case, the clothing will speak for itself, but if it didn't, they he'd use a mask and go as something different for school (no masks allowed).

I am hoping this was a case of ignorance. Please speak to the principal about it. Not all the children who live around there will remain in the west - perhaps this can be a lesson for all of the children so they do not grow up into adults who engage in offensive behavior.

wellyes
10-25-2009, 11:21 AM
If a 12y did want to be Obama becasue he likes him and masks aren't allowed what would be an appropriate costume?

Assuming, as OP said, the kid is not an Obama fan, there are ways to share your views w/o it being a caricature of his race: http://rlv.zcache.com/barack_obama_costume_tshirt-p235365212273493813qrdq_400.jpg

dcmom2b3
10-25-2009, 11:33 AM
If a 12y did want to be Obama becasue he likes him and masks aren't allowed what would be an appropriate costume?

IMO you'd need some external cue/context other than the mere color of his skin.

Fake ears? Wig? If he'd been made up to look like he was Barack Obama, and not just a white child with dark makeup? Group costume with parents/older siblings in dark suits with sunglasses and ear pieces as his "secret service" detail?

I know all of these options are more involved, but I think that's what's necessary when you're trying to look like a particular individual, esp. if it's trans-racial. Like me dressing up as Ted Kennedy (ugh, that's a bad visual).

Honestly, maybe it can't be done without a mask.