S/O car snob thread- Now I want a luxury car!-eta maybe not BMW!

[SnuggleBuggles]

eta- I just read an article that used EPA data to show the worst cars environmentally and 2 BMW models were in the top 5. :(
http://autos.yahoo.com/articles/autos_content_landing_pages/1159/americas-dirtiest-vehicles/

I feel like next time we go to look for a car I am going to swing by the BMW dealer and others because you were all very persuasive!

I am very interested to compare the ride for myself and decide what the best use of our money would be. i still think our family is like an Accord family but I have adopted a "never say never" attitude which I forgot when I posted my car snob thread yesterday. I was the real snob and now I feel like I should remember my own advice and be more willing to look at all options and not judge them from their brand.

Beth

[pinkmomagain]

If you go looking at luxury cars, save Lexus for last. You will be spoiled for life. When we go shopping for cars I always start with a very open mind and try lots of different cars at lots of different price points and then I end up with another Lexus.

I will say that BMW is a fun drive. DH had a 5 series and I always enjoyed driving it (that nice European stiffness and excellent seats)!

[egoldber]

You need to drive different types of cars. There are very different feels between different makes. They are not all alike and different cars tend to appeal to different people.

FWIW, we prefer the stiffer European car driving feel. Some people don't. It's not that one is better than the other, they are just different.

[wellyes]

Try Saab too, they're wicked cool.

[SammyeGail]

Try Saab too, they're wicked cool.

My Dad was a car mechanic, he got a deal on a used Saab-by owner, (about 9-10 years old) and was going to fix it up for my Mom. I was a teenager and he let me drive it around once, it was wicked cool!!

My Mom grew up a poor country girl and in no way wanted a Saab, (we were lower-mid middle class) lol, she hated where the key slot was-that was her excuse after Dad working on it 3 months.

Too bad he wasn't interested in letting me 'buy' it ;), I ended up with a Nissan Sentra. They did pay my car ins., I'm sure that was the issue, LOL!

[graciebellesmomma]

mmmmm, try the volvo xc90. totally feels like a racecar
in an suv! we love ours!

[kozachka]

Another vote for BMW. It's real fun to drive. I am currently driving DH's Land Cruiser and can't wait until we buy another car. It is destined to be a BMW. DH likes them, too.

[HannaAddict]

Try out the Mercedes diesels too, the SUVs and crossovers (GL, ML and R) are all built in the US but still fantastically engineered, great mileage for hauling a family or car pool, etc. They are now supposedly the "greenest" car out there, greener than a hybrid (the Bluetec engines) and diesel engines last a long, long time. I am just not that impressed with the hybrids from what I've read, the battery production and disposal issues, mileage isn't that great if you do any highway driving at all, and everyone I know who has Toyota Highlander Hybrid says they do not get close to the advertised mileage and would not buy them again (there are many in our neighborhood). For Mercedes, the family hauler models all have very different driving feels though, some sit higher, lower, etc. I love the Bluetooth and headlights, seriously, I love the lighting package headlights, they are amazing. The E Class diesel sedan is nice too.

[AnnieW625]

I feel like next time we go to look for a car I am going to swing by the BMW dealer and others because you were all very persuasive!

I am very interested to compare the ride for myself and decide what the best use of our money would be. i still think our family is like an Accord family but I have adopted a "never say never" attitude which I forgot when I posted my car snob thread yesterday. I was the real snob and now I feel like I should remember my own advice and be more willing to look at all options and not judge them from their brand.

Beth

that's us too. We never say never to anything. Before DH got laid off from his job in 2002 he was thinking of selling the Corolla and buying a BMW 325 or a Lexus IS 300. It might still be possible that we'll get a luxury brand certified pre owned for DH's next car, but we'll also have to take into account that the car might be DD's first car if we buy it when she is around 6 or 7 so Volvo S40/V50, Jetta Sportwagen, Honda Accord/Civic, Nissan Altima, or Toyota Camry/Corolla will most likely top the list.

[clc053103]

another lover here!! Nothing seems to ride like a BMW. We've had several and currently only have 1- decided to "buy american" in light of the economy, got a cadillac and while the car itself is a lot more fun inside, it will never drive like a BMW.

[KpbS]

If you go looking at luxury cars, save Lexus for last. You will be spoiled for life.

They are soooo nice. Didn't read all of the thread yesterday, but there really is a difference in quality of many higher end cars.

[ourbabygirl]

See, I actually don't like my Lexus IS250 and will be delighted to hand it back when my lease is up in April! We got a 'great' deal on the lease (an oxymoron, I know) and luckily it was only a 24 month lease, because I was pregnant w/DD when we got it and would never want such a tiny car again. The sporty suspension totally bugs us (it's *super* bouncy in the back seat), and there are just numerous things about it that I don't like. We *love* our Audi's (I used to have an A4, DH currently has an A6), and had a fun little red BMW convertible before DD was born, but since it was a 2-seater we sold it. It was a manual, though, which I've never learned how to drive, and was really impractical for the midwest, where we live. I know that people on this board think that snow tires are more important than AWD, but we love our AWD cars (part of why we got this Lexus), and will probably keep getting them (or 4 wheel drive). I also like Volkswagens, but my Jetta sounded like a diesel after a while. I love European cars but don't think they're practical for my lifestyle and the way the kids will probably bang them up over time.

[ChunkyNicksChunkyMom]

If you go looking at luxury cars, save Lexus for last. You will be spoiled for life. When we go shopping for cars I always start with a very open mind and try lots of different cars at lots of different price points and then I end up with another Lexus.

I will say that BMW is a fun drive. DH had a 5 series and I always enjoyed driving it (that nice European stiffness and excellent seats)!


Totally agree with this after two BMW's and one Rover the Lexus has by far the nicest ride.

[Piglet]

I don't need luxury, but I want the anti-minivan. My dream car these days is an Infiniti G35x. I want a lot of HP!

[bubbaray]

Totally agree with this after two BMW's and one Rover the Lexus has by far the nicest ride.


I think if you like the Lexus ride, you won't like the BMW ride. They are very different.

Its really apples and oranges. Beatles vs Rolling Stones. Cats vs dogs.

[ChunkyNicksChunkyMom]

Melissa, I have owned both and while I liked the BMWs very much and really wanted to buy the X5 because I preferred the exterior, the ride of the Lexus is like riding on air. I drive my cars for an average of ten years and I want to love what I am driving if I commit to it for that long.

[bubbaray]

That's my point. Many people don't like the sensation of driving a cloud, which is the best way I can think of to describe the Lexus (and to some degree Toyota) ride. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with it, but if you want to feel that zenlike "one with the road" driving feel, Lexus is NOT your ride.

I know lots of people who really love the Lexus ride. Others, not so much.

[ChunkyNicksChunkyMom]

That's my point. Many people don't like the sensation of driving a cloud, which is the best way I can think of to describe the Lexus (and to some degree Toyota) ride. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with it, but if you want to feel that zenlike "one with the road" driving feel, Lexus is NOT your ride.

I know lots of people who really love the Lexus ride. Others, not so much.



I am pretty sure I would not even recognize anything "Zenlike" if it hit me splat in the middle of my forehead. At least not with MY kids in the car :)

[luvmypeanut]

I would also have to say that sometimes the lower end models of luxury car brands don't drive as nicely as you would think. I have a GL550 and when it was in for service they gave me a bare-bones C-class loaner. I was surprised that it didn't have the solid feel that I've come to expect from MB. I was so happy to get my car back. In Japan, I have a Toyota Harrier, which is the equivalent of the Lexus RX, and it drives pretty nice.

I didn't read the other car snob thread but I'm a car person and DH is not. But he likes a nice ride and is willing to pay for it. I figure that if you can afford it and it brings you joy, why not buy what you want (that goes for real estate, clothing, etc.).

[AnnieW625]

I would also have to say that sometimes the lower end models of luxury car brands don't drive as nicely as you would think. I have a GL550 and when it was in for service they gave me a bare-bones C-class loaner. I was surprised that it didn't have the solid feel that I've come to expect from MB. I was so happy to get my car back. In Japan, I have a Toyota Harrier, which is the equivalent of the Lexus RX, and it drives pretty nice.

I didn't read the other car snob thread but I'm a car person and DH is not. But he likes a nice ride and is willing to pay for it. I figure that if you can afford it and it brings you joy, why not buy what you want (that goes for real estate, clothing, etc.).

Yeah I kind of felt that way about the BMW's interior. The leather was leatherette (whatever that was), and while I did like the wood look, everything else felt like my Honda, and I liked my Honda's real leather better. I haven't really been in a Mercedes C class except at the auto show a few years back and I remember thinking that the CLK coupe felt a lot interior wise like my Accord coupe, but just with very nice leather seating (now the engine would've blown the Accord of the water!)

Oh, and yeah the current IS back seat is tiny. My friend has one and I tell him it's the same size as our Corolla. He gets a little mad. I do like that it's sportier than the ES, which I was seriously considering a used one before I realized we really need an SUV, but it's very boring and doesn't even come with a manual tranny!

[wellyes]

That's my point. Many people don't like the sensation of driving a cloud, which is the best way I can think of to describe the Lexus (and to some degree Toyota) ride. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with it, but if you want to feel that zenlike "one with the road" driving feel, Lexus is NOT your ride.

That's such an interesting way of putting it, thanks - you've made me NEVER want a Lexus LOL. I like to be aware of the road when I'm driving. (Though not too much - DH races his Mazdaspeed3 & has an aftermarket racing suspension in it that I abhor.)

My favorite 'ride' is still from Subaru cars [not SUVs]. The boxster engine & suspension is apparently Porsche-esque. So I guess that means I want a Porsche in my fantasy world.

[egoldber]

Many people don't like the sensation of driving a cloud

Exactly. DH and I are like that. We don't like that feeling. Some people do. Different cars for different preferences. :)

[pastrygirl]

My husband loves Audi -- he's on his second one. I upgraded to a top-of-the-line Subaru Forester this year. It's the limited model with leather and a turbo. It feels SO luxurious to me, but without the luxury price tag. Even my car-snob husband loves it!

[amandabea]

eta- I just read an article that used EPA data to show the worst cars environmentally and 2 BMW models were in the top 5. :(
http://autos.yahoo.com/articles/autos_content_landing_pages/1159/americas-dirtiest-vehicles/


yes, but those models are not the ones you typically see on the road. the M class are the extreme sporty versions of their regular lines. they are probably also considered "gas guzzlers" because of the size of the engine. (I'm not a car person, DH is, so I don't know all the proper terminology).

[dcmom2b3]

eta- I just read an article that used EPA data to show the worst cars environmentally and 2 BMW models were in the top 5. :(
http://autos.yahoo.com/articles/autos_content_landing_pages/1159/americas-dirtiest-vehicles/



Well, those both are Motosport models (that's what the "M" stands for). They have 500 horsepower engines and $80K plus price tags. They're on par with the Mercedes AMG models that the article says were excluded from their testings and rankings, so I'd question the EPA's inclusion of the M cars.

I dunno, I guess what I'm trying to say is that both of these vehicles are borderline "exotic" performance sedans. And though I could be wrong Beth, I kinda get the sense that you're not in the market for that kind of vehicle! :)

If I am wrong, I definitely wanna meet you and spend some quality time at the racetrack in your hotrod! :D

[wellyes]

BMW M series are AWESOME racing cars but they're for a very niche market. Even though they are environmentally unfriendly, I think there is a place for them in the car world.

My DH has a similar (but much much much cheaper) scenario in that most Madza drivers have the Mazda3 but he has the Mazdaspeed3 - which looks identical but has crazy horsepower and it build for autocrossing. It's inefficient gas-wise and kinda uncomfortable for daily driving but on Saturdays he takes it around cones in a race course competitively for fun. Not a car worth getting for going to the grocery store and commuting.

[egoldber]

As the PP said, the M3, M5 and M6 are essentially racing cars that are "street legal". Not very many and not what most people are driving. :)

[dcmom2b3]

As the PP said, the M3, M5 and M6 are essentially racing cars that are "street legal". Not very many and not what most people are driving. :)


:yeahthat:

IIRC, the ones made for sale in the US have to be modified in some way so that the engines can't give full output/speed. Always wanted a European(unmodified) M car . . . .

[ourbabygirl]

I second the Audi nomination- we love them and have had them for years!

[SnuggleBuggles]

Good too know. Yes, not only is an $80K price tag out of reach but also probably not the car for me regardless. :)

I was wondering about Audis because lots of our friends bought them when we were younger. We have lost touch with those friends so no 1st hand feedback.

Beth

[michellerw]

That's my point. Many people don't like the sensation of driving a cloud, which is the best way I can think of to describe the Lexus (and to some degree Toyota) ride. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with it, but if you want to feel that zenlike "one with the road" driving feel, Lexus is NOT your ride.

This is definitely not my thing. I couldn't afford a true luxury car when I bought my car almost 8 years ago so I split the difference and ended up with a 2002 VW Passat. It's been a champ, 72k miles later it is paid off, it drives like a dream, I can feel the road, and it's safe safe safe. I love it to pieces but I'd like my next car to be a Volvo XC70 or XC90. I definitely like to feel the road, but I like my luxury amenities like heated seats, leather, etc.

Edited to add that I always thought the Audi A4 was a silly purchase -- many of the amenities in the Passat weren't even available in the A4 and it's essentially the same car. However, if you start going up in size (A6, A8, etc.) the Audi starts making sense. VW has made a real effort in recent years to hang on to their customers when they hit a critical point in their income/purchasing and the more luxe Passat as well as the introduction of the Phaeton and the SUVs like the Tiguan and the larger SUV (name of which escapes me) has been part of that effort. I haven't been entirely swayed by their efforts, but VW/Audi does build a nice car, but I'm really a Volvo girl. I just didn't like where the S40 was at in 2002 when I bought new.

[moonsky]

I don't want to offend anyone who loves Lexus. But I feel like it is just an upgraded Toyota. The same way I feel about Acura(upgraded Honda). I used Camry for years before switching to Mercedez. I didn't feel much different when sitting in Lexus in the showroom. Personally, I don't consider Lexus, Acura, or Infiniti luxury brands. Also, I have heard impressions that Lexus is more for older pps while BMW and Mercedez are for younger ones.

[SnuggleBuggles]

I don't want to offend anyone who loves Lexus. But I feel like it is just an upgraded Toyota. The same way I feel about Acura(upgraded Honda). I used Camry for years before switching to Mercedez. I didn't feel much different when sitting in Lexus in the showroom. Personally, I don't consider Lexus, Acura, or Infiniti luxury brands. Also, I have heard impressions that Lexus is more for older pps while BMW and Mercedez are for younger ones.

I brought this thread up t gh and those were his exact observations, re. the repackaging of regular cars as luxury cars. He wasn't sold on the higher cost compared to the features and services available. I tell ya, these threads have made for interesting discussions and thoughts for me!

Beth

[pinkmomagain]

This and the other have been such interesting threads! Love the different opinions. I think variety somewhat stems from things things like: what do you use your car for - commuting? towing the kids around? what are your driving conditions normally - city streets, highways, twisty mountain roads, suburbs? what kinds of things are most important - reliabililty? safety? cushy ride? kid friendly (cup holders, stowaway seating, entertainment)? reponsive drive? Dealerhip experience - at purchase? for service?

For me personally, my #1 criteria is reliability. Everytime I put the key in the ignition, I want the car to start. I don't want any warning/maintenance lights to come on (as long as I'm keeping up with scheduled maintenance). I don't want to get stuck anywhere -- especially with my kids. I also want a great dealership experience...don't want to be harassed or given the runaround at purchase time and want scheduled maintenance to be fast and easy. Since I am driving around town 80% of the time and 20% of the time on highways, with very straightforward driving conditions, cushy ride trumps superior handling. That's why Lexus works for me. I've never driven a Toyota...everytime I've walked into a Toyota dealer (probably about 4-5 times), I've walked out extremely frustrated.

[arivecchi]

I always wanted a BMW and have not been disappointed at all with mine. Awesome driving experience, so comfortable inside, lots of cool extras.... I feel like it is such a well built car. When I ride in my family's cars, I really feel and notice the difference. In 5 years, it has only needed the normal oil changes and engine maintenance. We drive with it in snow and rough terrain quite often and it handles it all well.

[SnuggleBuggles]

In 5 years, it has only needed the normal oil changes and engine maintenance.

Same with my Honda Civic. :) The things just keeps going and going... It's 10yo now so there have been a few bigger repairs but not in the first 5 years.

Beth

[wellyes]

I don't want to offend anyone who loves Lexus. But I feel like it is just an upgraded Toyota. The same way I feel about Acura(upgraded Honda). I used Camry for years before switching to Mercedez. I didn't feel much different when sitting in Lexus in the showroom. Personally, I don't consider Lexus, Acura, or Infiniti luxury brands. Also, I have heard impressions that Lexus is more for older pps while BMW and Mercedez are for younger ones..

Yes, Toyota makes Lexus. I don't really see a difference either except branding. I have never ever heard of Mercedes being for young people though. I do have one friend who drives the cheap version of the Mercedes (C class?) but overall I associate that brand with old people who wear hats.

[vludmilla]

I have never ever heard of Mercedes being for young people though. I do have one friend who drives the cheap version of the Mercedes (C class?) but overall I associate that brand with old people who wear hats.

Tee hee. Yes, I make the same association but that may be because my grandmother always drove Mercedes sedans when I was growing up. And she was the consummate old lady in a hat.

[ourbabygirl]

Funny! My dad's parents always drove Mercedes, too, but I do associate them with older, kind of stuffy (at times) people, though my grandparents weren't that way.
On the other hand, I associate Audi and BMW drivers as younger and hipper. And Volvo drivers as moms (my mom wanted one for so long, and loved the ones she had- always wagons or 'grocery getters,' as my boyfriend would say).
:)

[kozachka]

That's my point. Many people don't like the sensation of driving a cloud, which is the best way I can think of to describe the Lexus (and to some degree Toyota) ride. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with it, but if you want to feel that zenlike "one with the road" driving feel, Lexus is NOT your ride.

I know lots of people who really love the Lexus ride. Others, not so much.

I completely agree with bubbaray point above. I love the way BMW drives and think that Lexus offers too soft of a drive, which I might like when I am older. In my mind BMW is a younger and sportier car than Lexus or Mercedes.

[moonsky]

Tee hee. Yes, I make the same association but that may be because my grandmother always drove Mercedes sedans when I was growing up. And she was the consummate old lady in a hat.

Majority of my friends (in 20' and 30') drive either Mercedes or BMW. While their parents and grandparents drive Lexus LS.

[codex57]

Ahhh, a thread of my true passions.

DW and I are, well, let's call it 31 to make it simple. We love BMW. Had to trade ours in cuz the coupe couldn't fit an infant seat (sedan did... grrr). Now have a Lexus ES350.

We are definitely BMW fans. The drive is the perfect balance of sport and luxury. Across the line, they're great (in terms of drive feel). No other company can say that, altho Honda is the closest and Mazda is getting there.

Mercedes produced some awful crap the past several years. Only recently have the new models been better. I wanna wait a few more years to see how teh reliability is before I consider them again. My family, due to culture, has had a line of Mercedes. My dad taught me to drive in his S-class saying if I could drive that boat, I could drive anything. Still not a fan in general tho.

If you can afford a BMW or Mercedes, why buy an Audi? You only buy an Audi cuz it's pretty and to be different. Reliability of the major parts isn't as good as BMW or Merc. I frequent a LOT of car boards (well, not as much since DS was born) and there's just not enough reason IMO to buy an Audi.

And it's not cuz an Audi is a glorified VW. Badge engineering doesn't bother me much. As long as the underlying bit is good, adding some nicer bits only makes it better. "Luxury" as a definition is now hard to define. It used to mean power windows/doors and leather. You can get that stuff in a Civic or Corolla now.

If you've travelled the world, you've seen base Mercs being used as taxis. There's really nothing special btw a base Merc vs. a Honda/Toyota. That's why I'm fine with Acura and Lexus as luxury brands. The improved the interiors and other fancy options. Lexus, in particular, does a good job of separating itself from Toyota. Lexus models are built in Japan with tighter tolerances than Toyotas. It's those extra special attention to details that separates a true luxury car than a basic car with lotsa options.

That said, we only bought our Lexus because it shares a lot of parts with the Camry. It's cuz I have two BILs who are Toyota mechanics, including the head mechanic of the largest Toyota dealer in NorCal. That means there are lots of perks to owning a Toyota corp car. :) Otherwise, we woulda stayed with BMW.

I don't think age makes a person prefer one brand over another. It's typically sportiness. The Germans have firmer and sportier rides, so younger people tend to prefer them. However, Lexus got into the game with the IS model. We know quite a few people in our general age group who bought an IS (and would never consider an ES). Or the RX suv. The sporty Acura TL or TSX is also popular with the younger crowd. Same with the Infiniti G35/G37. BMW 3 series is a lot more popular than the Merc C-class cuz it's sportier. Audi tends to be more of a girl car cuz the powertrains are just too weak so the only thing you can say about it is it looks pretty. The S models are good, but those aren't exactly mainstream (and most people in that market would buy a BMW M or Merc AMG first; again you're just being different).

As people get older, they tend to value sportiness less. So, they move on away from BMW/Acura/Infiniti and more towards Lexus/Mercedes.

[ChunkyNicksChunkyMom]

Majority of my friends (in 20' and 30') drive either Mercedes or BMW. While their parents and grandparents drive Lexus LS.

This may be true for me. My BMW's were earlier cars, my Rover was in my thirties, maybe now the ride of the Lexus just feels nice to my older body.