Help! I'm a prisoner of my toddlers' bedtime routine!

[Naranjadia]

Okay, I know I've posted more questions about my children's sleep since they turned 2.5 than any other topic, but I'm coming back to the well. We seriously need help.

In order to keep the twins in their cribs (background: switched back to cribs from beds, worked for about a month, now they need to be in beds) we have been sitting in their room. Now they want us (usually me) in there until they fall asleep. Last night they "went to bed" at 7:30 and I was out of the room by 9:30. Aaaaah.

So now I know that we are going to have to change this routine, put them in bed, leave their room, and just keep putting them in bed until they fall asleep. The room is almost empty of stuff - just books, but we can strip it if need be.

But what's the best way of going about instituting this change, do you think?

And if you have other ideas, I'm all ears. The twins just turned 3.

[KpbS]

Are they still napping? I remember you were struggling with naps a few months ago?

[Naranjadia]

Thank you for remembering that. Yes - we went without naps for 3 weeks and they just were basket-cases, so they are back to having a nap - usually 1-1.5 hrs per day.

[Indianamom2]

Is the issue that the twins are leaving their room? If so, do you have a gate on the doorway? We had to resort to that somewhere around the 3-4 year old mark...and it's still there at 5.5. This happened after we carried her back up the stairs MANY, MANY times and finally just had had enough.

It was absolutely the only way she would (still will) stay in her room.

[Naranjadia]

We have a gate, as well as a latch on the outside of the door - we can keep them in there. But we can't keep them from getting out of bed, wrecking havoc, and hurting one another. They get so excited, being "naughty" that inevitably there is a child crying within 10 minutes.

[KpbS]

What about a sticker chart for a reward/prize? When DS1 was transitioning from napping (still napping but at the very end of naps) and going to bed much earlier w/o naps (from 8:45 moved up to 6:45 or 7 pm) a sticker chart helped him remember he needed to stay in bed and not get out. He earned 5 stickers in a row (or less if needed) and got a reward/prize.

It's a tricky time when they are outgrowing naps but still not there yet. It takes a while for their bodies to adjust w/o the naps. We did a rest time in place of naps for about 1-2 years where DS1 was in his room and playing/reading quietly. I know it is complicated with 2 :hug:

[Momof3Labs]

The inability to fall asleep quickly could be due to the new beds, or could be due to them not needing naps any longer. Unfortunately, it seems like kids give up their naps before they can make it all the way through the day, but taking that needed nap wreaks havoc on their bedtime. You may not get them to go to sleep earlier until they drop their nap.

[carolinamama]

At that age, we took away DS1's nap as he would stay awake until 10-11 pm if he napped. We have had tons of trouble with DS falling asleep since he likes to force himself to stay awake and sneak around upstairs on his own. What has worked best is to bathe each night and read stories for about 30-45 minutes to help him wind down and use a reward system. But they had to be instant rewards like staying in bed equalled a little prize in the morning - used those tubes of figures alot.

[Melaine]

Video camera, I'm telling you. You can make them think you are always watching!

[crl]

If they are still napping, they may not need to go to bed so early? How much total sleep are they getting if they fall asleep at 9:30?

Can you back out the room gradually? Go from being in the room to being by the door to being outside the door to being on the same floor in a different room. . . . all over the course of a few weeks.

Catherine

[maylips]

My DD is your twins' age - she still naps 1.5-2 hours/day and her bedtime is 8:00. So you may want to push that time back a little. But it sounds like the biggest problem with you guys is that they share a room and get each other riled up. I know it takes forever to get DD to bed if her cousins are visiting and they are all sharing a room.

So....I'm not sure how you can fix that unless you have an extra room to put one in, but maybe if there was at least something to block their view of each other?

[hillview]

DS2 is 2.5 and if he naps he goes to bed at 9 pm. That doesn't work for several reasons. So no nap and sleep btwn 6:30 and 7.
/hillary

[Roni]

Here's a different, perhaps nutty perspective. I'm still actively involved in my dds' bedtime ritual (they share a room at ages 6 & 9). Yes, it drives me nuts, sometimes, but there is also something special about that time. I read to them (or they read to me), we do prayers, practice spelling words, talk about their day, etc. Sometimes their true thoughts about something that happened that day come out then. I know that I have at least a shot of them opening up to me when they are older and really have stuff to talk about because of the routines and special times that we share now. (Middle school is coming next year!) I usually end up cuddling w/ my 6yo until she falls asleep. How much longer will she let me do that? My 9 yo likes her back scratched, but she doesn't always get it, & usually I leave before she's asleep. (They can go to sleep with out me, but it usually takes them longer. They now do most of the pre-bed getting-ready without me, though.)

I also have found (their whole lives this has been true) that they can't go to sleep if I put them to bed too early. (I have the same problem.)

If I'm really not in the mood to hang out too long in their room or if I have something to do, I leave and tell them I'll be back to check on them later. They are usually asleep by the time I come back.

What I'm trying to say is, sometimes it helps to "surrender" a little to the situation, not worry about what everyone else says it's supposed to be like, and realize that it is a small time in your life that you will be in this situation. It will get better. (It may not sound like it in my case, but it's so much better than when they were younger. I read so many books and listened to so many people tell me what I should or shouldn't do that I drove myself crazy. I'm much more at peace now with how things are.) I may be going crazy next year when there's a newborn added to the mix, but for now it's all okay. :)

If you can meet their needs now (whatever that means--staying in the room with them longer, perhaps), you can gradually pull back, using some of the suggestions that others have had. It you can adjust your feelings about it, realizing that this, too, will pass, it will help you so much. I hope that makes sense.

[Naranjadia]

Oh, thank you, thank you all. Tonight we tried a combo of suggestions. Melaine had mentioned the videocamera in a previous thread - and we didn't get one just because we can tell when they are out of bed without it. But the idea of just putting them back in bed each time they got out was something that we couldn't stick with last time and so we have vowed to do that this time.

We had also done reward charts before, but fell off that wagon. But we've re-instituted them. We also talked about how they were three now, yada yada yada - so we were going to do a big kids routine for bedtime. We discussed at dinner and they were fine with the routine then, but I knew it would be different when the head hit the pillow. We have a pretty elaborate bedtime routine, which was followed by howls of protest. They got out bed once, but cried for a good while. We went in to reassure them several times, during which they piled on the special requests. But then it all became quiet.... I am just crossing my fingers, but I think this may be a fluke night.

[fauve01]

The inability to fall asleep quickly could be due to the new beds, or could be due to them not needing naps any longer. Unfortunately, it seems like kids give up their naps before they can make it all the way through the day, but taking that needed nap wreaks havoc on their bedtime. You may not get them to go to sleep earlier until they drop their nap.

:yeahthat:
seems like it is time to power through without a nap and put them to bed earlier.

Anne

[Roni]

Oh, Kate, I don't know if you play music for them. I tried different music over the years, but when dd1 was 3 and dd2 was a newborn, The Wiggles came out with a CD called "Go to Sleep Jeff". That became an essential part of our night-time routine for years. If we were travelling, it had to come with us. I had almost forgotten about it. For some reason, the girls pulled it out the other night and decided to start listening to it again (even though they think they're too old for the Wiggles now). It's really soothing and has been known to even knock me out. Just a thought, if they need help calming down at night.

[gatorsmom]

Good luck! I am reading this thread and keeping my fingers crossed because my twins are about 9 months younger than yours and we just put crib tents in their beds. And that works great right now. But the toddler bed won't be far off and I'm already dreading them partying in their room. I had lots of problems trying to keep Gator in his room at night and I expect the same out of the twins. If I remember clearly what worked for Gator was if he refused to stay in his bed and kept getting out, I'd tell him the next time he would go back in his crib (which we had set up for the arrival of Cha Cha). If he continued geting out of bed we'd put him in the crib which he HATED once he had his big boy bed. A few nights of that and he stayed in his big boy bed.

[citymama]

Kate, I've read your post several times but have been too embarrassed to reply because I am the last person who can offer suggestions on this. I feel I should reply, if only to show solidarity. My 4 yr old still wants one of us in the room with her every single night in order to fall asleep. She has the most extended bedtime routine - she has successfully extended it, and we've been ineffective in setting limits, partly because it is a special time with her. Bath, change, story with dad, story with mom, takes books to her bed to look at (used to put her right to sleep, now she takes such an enormous pile or keeps sneaking out of bed to get more books that it's become an ineffective strategy). Then supposedly lights out and sleep, but she *must* have one of us (usually me) in the room with her or bedtime would drag on till midnight. I usually just take a book or magazine in with me and read on the glider while she falls asleep, so it isn't too awful, but there are days when I am sitting there for over an hour before I can be liberated. It totally takes away from time with DH in the evenings, esp. since DD rarely falls asleep before 10 pm.

I can't believe we let ourselves get into this mess, and we're not having much luck breaking out of it! Definitely a learning experience not to be repeated with baby #2. Good luck to you and let me know if you manage to break out of the shackles of the bedtime routine!

[nov04]

It definintely sounds like the naps need to go. We went through this with both girls, although not at the same time! :) Maybe you can gradually start shortening the naps very slowly? GL

[Naranjadia]

Oh, Kate, I don't know if you play music for them. I tried different music over the years, but when dd1 was 3 and dd2 was a newborn, The Wiggles came out with a CD called "Go to Sleep Jeff". That became an essential part of our night-time routine for years. If we were travelling, it had to come with us. I had almost forgotten about it. For some reason, the girls pulled it out the other night and decided to start listening to it again (even though they think they're too old for the Wiggles now). It's really soothing and has been known to even knock me out. Just a thought, if they need help calming down at night.

Funny you should mention music. There was one more outburst last night. I went in and was met with the usual barrage of requests. We do listen to lullabies, so I offered to play an Enya album, skirting all the special requests for another cup of water, etc, etc.

It took just as long last night as had I been in there, but I'm hoping that they will get accustomed to it soon.

About naps - we tried to get them adjusted to not napping for about 3 weeks, but they were just basket cases. Dark circles under their eyes, emotional after about 4 in the afternoon. We pushed up bed time, but they still seemed really sleep deprived. How long does that adjustment take?

[KpbS]

We pushed up bed time, but they still seemed really sleep deprived. How long does that adjustment take?

For us it probably took about 6 weeks total but after week 2 things were easier in general with the new routine. We also made sure DS1 got a good snack by 3:30 (energy!) and started dinner at 5 pm--so jammies at 6:20 and then toothbrushing, story, songs, lights out. HTH