Guidance and advice please? Serious subject matter.. [Archive]

Leeannpk

04-12-2010, 10:06 AM

I am so sorry :hug:.

I have two people in my life attempt suicide, though never a parent. I can relate to your feelings of anger and disgust. If you feel that you cannot offer sympathy or support at this time (and I can understand why you'd feel that way), then I think staying away for a while is the right thing to do and is not at all cold or callous. Send some flowers and take the time you need to figure out the best way to proceed. Lend you support to your mother's husband (if you feel you can), or by cleaning her house before she comes home or stocking the fridge.

Feel free to PM me if you want to vent. I understand.

sewarsh

04-12-2010, 10:07 AM

Honestly, I don't have much advice. I've known 2 people who have committed suicide and both were severly depressed and had been struggling with depression/anxiety their whole lives. It sounds like your mom needs some serious help, but she's only going to get it if she wants it.

On another hand, there are TONS of organizations/groups that deal with family members of those who commit suicide. They help you deal with anger, loss, etc. Maybe this is something you should seek to help you manage your emotions if and when you are ready.

I'm very sorry and I wish you and your family P&PT.

gordo

04-12-2010, 10:08 AM

arivecchi

04-12-2010, 10:24 AM

Hugs to you. It is so difficult to deal with a depressed family member. I echo others who have suggested some sort of support group. It might help you better understand her condition and will help you deal with your feelings as well. :hug:

JTsMom

04-12-2010, 10:26 AM

:hug: I'm so sorry. No advice here either I'm afraid. Just had to post some :hug:.

Karinyc

04-12-2010, 10:36 AM

Very sorry and hoping you can get the needed guidance & support during this time. IME, severe depression and a self-absorbed demeanor go hand in hand. Many times its coupled with anxiety. I agree that her actions (like the partying) is a way to self-medicate and avoid/deny her her feelings. I hope she gets the treatment she desperately needs. Support groups are very helpful.

ThreeofUs

04-12-2010, 10:38 AM

So sorry for you and your family. Sounds like your mom needs some help. ITA about support groups - they really worked for a member of my family.

Hugs to all of you!

lowrioh

04-12-2010, 10:40 AM

First of all, big hugs. I know how hard this must be for you.

My only advice is to see if there is there is a local meeting of Al-Anon in your area. It sounds like your mother is an addict and you can find a lot of support and people with experience at those meetings. You could probably benefit from talking to an addictions councilor too.

My MIL was an alcoholic, suffered from major depression, was extremely selfish and destructive to everyone around her. My DH agonized over his mother's condition and initially tried to "fix her" by offering support, tried to pressure her into rehab/counselling, and lived with her for a period of time so that he could randomly search the house and basically police her activities. In the end, none of it worked and he ended up in a deep depression and basically gave up on her. In the end, she alienated all of the people who loved her and ended up killing herself with a drug overdose this past fall (it isn't clear if it was an intentional overdose or not).

You need to protect yourself for the sake of you as well as that of your children/husband. I would do something like the PP suggested such as clean the house or send over a meal/s for her DH but I wouldn't feign sympathy since that is obviously the reaction she wants.
I would calmly have a discussion with her and explain that you LOVE her and care deeply about her but if she doesn't go and get serious help with her addiction/mental health issues that you can't involve her in your life. If you don't think that you can have a calm discussion with her, write her a letter.
My DH has tremendous guilt about what happened with his mother but therapy and Al-Anon meetings have helped him deal with it. It is a very difficult situation and there is no "right" way to deal with it.

I'll be thinking of you and sending positive thoughts your way.

BabyMine

04-12-2010, 10:41 AM

:hug: I am so sorry. I understand you are hurt, fustrated and that you don't want to visit her now. I hope that while she is there she gets a psych. consult to determine if there is any mental illness causing these behaviors. I don't think you are being cold. I think you are protecting yourself from what sounds like a difficult relationship with your mother.

TwinFoxes

04-12-2010, 10:53 AM

I'm very sorry. I just did a little googling, and found this brochure:

http://download.ncadi.samhsa.gov/ken/pdf/SVP-0159/SVP-0159.pdf

it gives information post-attempt. I don't know if it will answer your questions, or help you, but it might point you in the right direction. I'm so sorry. I hope this helps even a little. :hug:

Laurel

04-12-2010, 10:55 AM

Just more support. You need to take care of yourself right now, so do what will be the least upsetting to you. I understand the frustration of having a parent who is always the one needing caretaking.

The partying and the spending sound somewhat manic. Like, PP have suggested I am wondering about bipolar/depression. Perhaps this unfortunate incident will get her the services she needs to start appropriate meds and therapy. P & PT your way...

MommyofAmaya

04-12-2010, 11:16 AM

Edited for privacy reasons.

sunshine873

04-12-2010, 11:17 AM

It sounds like you've gotten some good advice, and since I haven't experienced anything like this, I don't have anything else to add.

I just wanted to reply and let you know that I'm so sorry you've been put in this situation. :grouphug: I'll be praying for you and your mom.

megs4413

04-12-2010, 11:19 AM

First off, I'm sorry for what you're going through.

My Dad has always had issues. We'll sum it up like that. He has never made what I would consider to be a "serious" attempt, but it's always a threat hanging around. Truthfully, I've all but cut off contact with him. We talk on the phone 3 or 4 times a year and see him once or twice (always in a public place). It's what's best *for me* and my family.

I can't save him. I can't live with the guilt of being responsible for his insanity, either. He's a grown man that knows he needs help and refuses to get it. It's just no longer my problem. That might sound cold to people, but that's how it has to be.

so my advice is if you don't want to visit her, don't visit her. if having her in your life is making your life too hard, then take her out of the equation. you're not responsible for her or her choices. JMO!

MommyofAmaya

04-12-2010, 11:20 AM

viba424

04-12-2010, 11:24 AM

I have had two people very close to me commit suicide, both men however. I have known several others more remotely that have done the same.

I might be looking at this from a slightly different point of view, so forgive me if I am being to analytical, but in my experience there are different shades of suicide/suicide attempts. There is the true and very isolated act of suicide where a person is intent on going all the way with no chance of survival - i.e. with a gun. Then there are other kinds that could possibly be more for extreme cries for help or even a means to hurt others in a way, where pills or some other method is used that may or may not result in death. Not to say that is not a suicide attempt, because it is, but I believe that may shed some light on a person's true intent.

I say this because when someone has a loved one who attempts suicide, probably what they worry most is "will they do this again"? If this is a question you are trying to answer about your mother, statistically speaking women are less likely to succeed at a more violent and final means of attempted suicide, if you will, than men. So if there is some good that can come from this, maybe now she will have a chance to get the help she needs given that this came so close for her.

One thing you have to realize is if they are going to do it there is nothing you can do to stop them. Some threaten like the PP said, but no matter what, if they are serious, believe me they arent going to tell you first. Just show the love that you can and hope your mom can get this out of her head now and get the help she needs.

boogiemomz

04-12-2010, 12:15 PM

how horrible. so sorry for your painful history with your mom and for the state of things now. no advice, just hugs and prayers for you and your family. :hug:

Globetrotter

04-12-2010, 12:46 PM

:hug: I am so sorry that you have to deal with all this.

It sounds like manic depression (bipolar illness) with the manic being the compulsive shopping, partying and other reckless behavior. It sucks :(

We have some family friends who have dealt with this, and the adult children hold a lot of anger towards their mom for what they see as wrecking their lives. It's normal for you to feel this way.

I have another friend who I suspect is bipolar, but she won't see a psychiatrist..

In both cases, I tried to tell the family that it's the illness talking (or doing things). They need medical help to get better because there is something wrong with their brain chemistry, and my friend's mom is relatively okay when she's on meds. I can say all this, but I know it must be so difficult to deal with it as a family member, and I can completely understand your frustration and anger. I know I would feel the same way..

Is she getting medical help? You could talk to her psych. or social worker for guidance and support groups for families of bipolar individuals.

elephantmeg

04-12-2010, 12:48 PM

I'm always torn with this too. It's never been a mom but my MIL and my paternal grandfather have both attempted suicide/felt like they wanted to commit suicide. At the hospital I'm sure psych will evaluate her and possibly/probably reccomend inpatient placement-even if she doesn't want it they can TDO (temporary detaining orders) and keep her if they feel she is a harm to herself or others. Then in a couple days she would have a hearing that would decide if she wanted to stay voluntarily or would need to stay regardless (IC involuntary commitment). That decision comes from the local magistrate. Hopefully she will get the help/medication she needs. In terms of visiting someone that is often a helpful decision to have with the psychiatrist. I wasn't as involved with my grandfather-I was much younger. But with my MIL even when she isn't accutely depressed/having issues she tends to thrive on people making a fuss over her which results in her having lots of medical issues which result in FIL taking care of everything/catering to her/enabling her. We (her kids) have pretty much stopped catering to her/gushing over her/helping when she is sick. She used to call us to pick her up from work cause she wasn't feeling well, etc. Now we leave it to FIL. But when she is well things are fine.

Anyways, hugs to you in this difficult time. I'm sorry you felt abandoned as a teen with the last episode-that must have been rough.

brittone2

04-12-2010, 01:21 PM

Holding you and your family in my thoughts.

StantonHyde

04-12-2010, 01:29 PM

You would be amazed at how many people have been in your shoes--you are not alone. And do not feel bad that you are not feeling sympathetic right now. My dad is a piece of work and I would be really pissed if he followed through with this threats--sympathy would not be my first response. And I work in a psych hospital, so I logically understand it, but I am worn out on sympathy.

So you are ok to feel how you feel. In fact, you need to concentrate on you right now. Your mom is in a safe place and, depending on how things go, she may go from a medicine floor to a psych floor/hospital for a few days. Anymore, people stay just until they are stabilized (insurance) and then they are discharged with follow up appointments for outpatient care. So she may not be there very long. Take this break while you can.

Try contacting the National Alliance for the Mentally Ill (NAMI) they run support groups specifically for family members of people with mental illness. They are a great group. Contact a therapist for yourself. You can ask your mom's social worker at the hospital for a referral if you don't know someone. I understand that it is hard to find time, but this is really key for you.

Since you like her husband, I think the idea of bringing him meals etc is a nice idea. But don't get too involved. Honestly, you cannot save your mom. She has to save herself. Keep tabs on how she is doing. She HAS to take her meds and she HAS to keep her therapy appointments. Nobody can make her do that. Her husband can help her but she is ultimately responsible.

Good luck with this and do your best to take care of you!

SnuggleBuggles

04-12-2010, 01:32 PM

I am really sorry you and your family are going through this.

Beth

ewpmsw

04-12-2010, 01:32 PM

I'm sorry to read that you and your family are going through such a painful time. :hug: I also thought her behavior sounded like some of the symptoms of bipolar disorder. Mental illness and substance often go hand-in-hand. Maybe this last incident will put your mother on the road to treatment. Whatever she decides, it might be helpful to you to talk to a therapist or counselor outside of or in addition to a support group. Talking it out with someone who isn't emotionally involved can be really beneficial, and sometimes all you need is a few visits to feel better. Do what you feel is best for yourself and your family. Sending you all P's and PT's.

elektra

04-12-2010, 01:40 PM

SO sorry. My mother went through this with her own mother. My grandmother was bipolar her whole adult life I think. She (my grandmother) also attempted suicide multiple times. My mom even spent some time in the foster care system during my grandmother's hospitalizations.
I think the support group is a great idea. It gives you the outlet to talk about YOU and YOUR feelings. Because that is going to be a different thing than dealing with/helping your mom. You will have to table a lot of the things you really want to tell her and work out with her for a later time, if you want to focus on helping her.

Indianamom2

04-12-2010, 01:56 PM

I have no advice or BTDT experience, but I just wanted to let you know that you and your family are in my thoughts and prayers. :grouphug:

Globetrotter

04-12-2010, 06:58 PM

oops, I didn't mean to imply that it's definitely bipolar illness. That is my guess, but whatever it IS, I am sure the psych. staff can connect YOU with a support group and/or therapist, if you would rather choose that path.

LexyLou

04-12-2010, 07:01 PM

:grouphug: I'm sorry you are going through this. You must be so torn and full of varying emotions.

My MIL is bi-polar and has a history of serious depression. I try so hard to be understanding and 90% of the time I am, but sometimes getting walked all over and then saying, "Oh but she has a mental illness" just doesn't cut it.

I don't blame you for feeling the way you are. I'm sure it was very hard being raised by her. You need to do what's best for you and if it's keeping your distance for the time being, then you should. Thinking of you.

hillview

04-12-2010, 07:14 PM

Hugs! So sorry you have to deal with this!

I would try to go to my own therapy session if possible. Maybe even a therapist who would let you bring Sebastian with you (I imagine one might given the circumstances). Sounds like a complex and horrible situation.

Hugs!
/hillary

elizabethkott

04-12-2010, 07:22 PM

I have no advice, but I just wanted to give you (((((hugs))))). I hope you find your way through this difficult time.

MommyofAmaya

04-12-2010, 08:10 PM

Thanks again for the guidance. In response to many of your posts, manic depression definitely seems like a reasonable assumption. She is without a doubt, a compulsive shopper. I never really connected that to her other issues.

urquie

04-12-2010, 08:12 PM

i'm so, so sorry. lot's of p&pt's coming your way. :hug: :hug:

Happy 2B mommy

04-12-2010, 08:17 PM

I am so sorry to hear all of this. My best advice would be to not go visit her just yet. Get in contact with the hospital social worker or the psychiatrist assigned to your mom. Talk to them about your feelings, where your mom is emotionally right now and I would ask their advice on the best time and way to approach your mom. Your mom obviously needs help and hopefully will get it, but it sounds like you also need a place to vent your frustrations and talk about how all of this is effecting you and your family. Just don't forget to take care of yourself through all of this.

I find this excellent advice. My mother also attempted suicide when I was a child and then threatened it again when I was in my 20's. Our relationship was quite strained and I found talking with the social worker/counselors helped me deal with my feelings toward her as well as prepare me for the nightmarish visits (she was extremely angry and hostile).

I am so sorry you are going through this. Please stay strong. I'll be thinking of you.

DrSally

04-12-2010, 08:18 PM

I'm sorry. I hope you can get the support *you* need to get through this.

LMPC

04-12-2010, 08:26 PM

I second what Dr Sally said! Let someone else take care of your mom...and you make sure that you get the support you need!! PT's coming your way!!

Fairy

04-12-2010, 08:43 PM

Chaunacey, I am so sorry. I haven't read thru the pages that I'm sure are filled with support for you, but I'm only just seeing this, and I wanted to give you ((((hugs)))). I'm so sorry.

:hug:

Melbel

04-12-2010, 09:11 PM

BTDT. I will send a PM. I am sorry you are going through this. :grouphug:

Doodlebug08

04-12-2010, 09:14 PM

No advise, just very sorry for your loss. Anger is a big part of the grieving process. Allow yourself whatever feelings you have.

jse107

04-12-2010, 09:15 PM

No further advice beyond what others have offered. Just wanted to send you some PT and a cyber-hug.

kozachka

04-13-2010, 01:25 AM

So sorry to hear you are dealing with this. :22: to you and your brother, and hope you find a way to deal with the situation.

MontrealMum

04-13-2010, 02:36 AM

I am so sorry you're going through this. I can't add anything productive, but just want to send :grouphug: to you and your family.

baymom

04-13-2010, 03:08 AM

So sorry that you are in this situation.... I have no advice, but wish you strength and send you :hug:

BelleoftheBallFlagstaff

04-13-2010, 02:42 PM

:grouphug: No BTDT just hugs. Do what you feel is right, do a gut check.

citymama

04-13-2010, 03:25 PM

Sending you P&PT - this must be so very hard on you. Sounds like her DH needs support too - maybe the two of you and your brother can use this incident to get her into some serious therapy and/or psychiatric care. Do what you need to do to keep yourself insulated from the pain and turmoil as well, as suicide/attempts are so very hard on close family members. Hugs to you.

WitMom

04-13-2010, 10:07 PM

My heart goes out to you. I can't imagine the mix of emotions you must be feeling. You'll be in my thoughts.

MommyofAmaya

04-13-2010, 11:08 PM

Deleted for privacy reasons.

kransden

04-13-2010, 11:14 PM

No advice, just a :hug: . These are very hard issues to deal with.

jenfromnj

04-13-2010, 11:20 PM

I am so sorry, P&PT that your mom is able to get whatever help she needs.

c&j04

04-13-2010, 11:25 PM

No advice, just hugs for you. Wishing you courage and comfort in the path you choose with this situation.

kijip

04-14-2010, 12:37 AM

I am so sorry. My mom's mom made a number of half hearted attempts and told my mother it was her fault (depressed and abusive, fun combo). So I understand your anger over it. It's hard also for a non-depressed person to get depression. I used to be very annoyed by my BIL and then after I had a bout with postpartum mood disorder I was like "oh, I understand how life is so much harder for him now".

I hope she can get the help she needs but remember too that it is NOT your job to take care of her, especially to your own detriment. You have every right to feel the way that you do and the only thing that will make her get help is her own decision to get help.

StantonHyde

04-14-2010, 10:14 PM

I appreciate all of your posts of support. As for an update, they released my mother today after MRI and CT scans came back normal with a list of outpatient psychiatric clinics. She plans to return to work on Thursday. Her husband says that she insists that it was accidental (an entire bottle of prescription pain pills after an evening of tequila) and is sticking to that story. She's not interested in treatment though he will try his best. It looks like the rest of our family will just pretend like nothing happened.

I'm still on the fence on how to proceed on my end as far as how to deal with her.

I am so sorry to see this. YOu are right--this was NOT an accident!! Interesting that the social workers did not make appointments for her. That's the usual standard--you leave with an appointment set up. BUT if the patient is clear that they will not keep the appointment, then they don't set one up.....

I can see why everyone will pretend it didn't happen---until she is willing to acknowledge what happened and get treatment, there isn't a lot you can do. I would talk to a therapist to process my feelings. Otherwise, I would protect myself by not discussing it with your family. I know that is passive--but there is nothing to gain by bringing up the elephant in the room when the elephant can't see themselves. Not that I have experience with this or anything.....

MommyofAmaya

04-15-2010, 10:44 AM

I am so sorry to see this. YOu are right--this was NOT an accident!! Interesting that the social workers did not make appointments for her. That's the usual standard--you leave with an appointment set up. BUT if the patient is clear that they will not keep the appointment, then they don't set one up.....

I can see why everyone will pretend it didn't happen---until she is willing to acknowledge what happened and get treatment, there isn't a lot you can do. I would talk to a therapist to process my feelings. Otherwise, I would protect myself by not discussing it with your family. I know that is passive--but there is nothing to gain by bringing up the elephant in the room when the elephant can't see themselves. Not that I have experience with this or anything.....

Apparently, the SW did not set up the appts, b/c my mother was intoxicated during the "attempt" and that made it less of a concern in her opinion.

It feels really strange being on the outside of this. I haven't spoken to my grandparents, who are coddling her, and we usually speak every other day... more during times of crisis. So far, I haven't gotten involved at all and have only received updates from my brother.

Apparently, he told her that she would no longer have any type of relationship if she didn't put off returning to work and get a diagnosis immediately. After he threw "a big fit" (his words), she reluctantly agreed to seek treatment. So, we'll see.