Which trades would you support if your children showed an interest?

[gatorsmom]

In the recent education thread there were parents who said that if their child showed an interest in a trade as a career, in some cases they would support that choice for a career for their child. I'm just curious which ones the parents here think could make a good career path for their children. I can think of only one example and that would be plumber. My friend's dad has his own plumbing business and was able to provide a very good living for his family in the small town I grew up in. But I can think of others that didn't turn out so well. Another friend's husband is a carpenter. He makes BEAUTIFUL furniture and fixtures in homes. But he has always struggled to find work.

So, just wondering which trades you'd support and which you'd discourage your kids from attempting.

[pb&j]

IMO, I'd support just about any trade. For one, you can outsource all kinds of "thinky" jobs, but you can't outsource HVAC installation and repair, plumbing, carpentry, etc. So I think there's potential for real job security. Also, I think that being a good businessperson, no matter if your business is consulting or yardwork, can lead to personal and financial success. Our handyman makes a good living because 1)he does good work and 2)he operates his business well - arrives on time, finishes on time, invoices promptly, returns calls, calls proactively when he knows his customers might have work for him. I think a lot of people who are self employed, whether they are self-employed in a trade or in a white collar job, succeed or fail not just on the actual work they're hired to do, but on the business sense and skills that they have.

I came across http://www.mikeroweworks.com/mikes-office/ and found it really interesting.

[lizzywednesday]

My uncles own their own landscaping businesses.
One of my great-grandfathers was an electrician; the other was a carpenter/cabinet-maker.
My brother Joe is an assistant groundskeeper/gardener for one of the state parks in my hometown.

I am not opposed to careers like this if it's what my child wants to do and it means they'll become a confident, self-supporting adult.

[katydid1971]

I feel we all have different gifts. I was just talking with my dad last night about how bad it is that they have eliminated a lot of vocational education in the schools. I truly hope my children go to college but if their gifts lie elsewhere I will fully support it.

[Twoboos]

Considering I just paid the electrician $80 to be here for 20mins, I would say electrician. :)

ETA: I would probably not recommend masonry. My dad was a mason and it took a LOT out of him. It's very physical and there is a high danger of exposure to all kinds of bad stuff. (Probably one of the things that contributed to his lung cancer.) And in snowy regions you don't get a lot of work in winter time.

[BabyBearsMom]

I would support most trades. I know people who have solid jobs and make a good living in all sorts of trades. I know mechanics, electricians, plumbers, carpenters and welders. Welders are in particularly high demand at the moment and a lot of big construction companies actually have to hire people from Puerto Rico and ship them in for jobs in order to have enough welders. I'm sure there are more but that is all I can think of off the top of my head.

[sste]

I think you can do well in a variety of trades if you own your own business and hire workers that you profit from . . . my uncle is a painter and although I don't think of that as a renumerative trade job he ran a good business and coupled it with real estate investing (and he could do his own painting and repairs on those houses).

If my child wanted to go into a trade though I think I might encourage them to consider working on the commercial rather than residential end and specializing. Maybe I am wrong about this but my hunch is that there are only a certain number of people that can do HVAC for example in large office buildings or that can fix elevators, etc. One thing that I bet will be emerging is a market for electricians who can deal with some of the new commercial "smart grid" initiaitives - - I think smart grid is only going to grow.

[ezcc]

I think those kinds of careers can be great, ESPECIALLY if you have the personality/drive to have your own business. I have a friend who owns her own salon, she does very well. Plumbers, electricians who have a couple of guys working for them can also do very, very well. Construction too. Any of those would be fine- I can't think of one that I wouldn't approve of actually- cabinetmaking, metal work some of those that fall into art/craft would probably be tougher to succeed in a bad economy, but I know people who have done very well in those types of things too.

[AnnieW625]

I'd love it if my girls would be hairdressers only because I am the most inept mom in doing hair (it's the only part of me that thinks having boys would've been easier:rotflmao:) and I hope they have more talent at it than I do. In all honesty though I'd like them to find a career they are happy with and they can support themselves at.

[Naranjadia]

I would support any trade. But especially those that our house is prone to needing. :D

I would also support any kind of mechanic, as long as it doesn't involve carnival rides.

[Gena]

I would support just about any trade, as long as it's legal and not against our faith/morals.

[brittone2]

My former neighbor was an HVAC person who worked on an industrial facility (pharmaceutical plant). He did quite well.

My father was a union employee for a telephone co. Those jobs are tougher to come by these days, but at the end of his career he was making more than most of my professionally degreed friends and family (including friends/family with PhDs, etc.)

My brother has worked in union cement/construction for decades. He is meticulous and could easily start his own business...he does some work on the side doing masonry, fireplaces, etc. for people. He worked on another brother's home in a very upscale neighborhood and was asked to do a ton of work, but turned most of it down. Masonry for driveway gates, fireplaces, paver stone, stamped concrete patios...etc. If it weren't for the healthcare costs I think he would have loved to start his own business.

BIL is a mechanic and does okay.

During summers home from college I worked in the HR dept of a large battery manufacturer, and there were machinists, mechanics, etc. who made decent salaries with excellent benefits, including profit sharing, 401K, excellent healthcare (including on site healthcare facilities). Physically demanding and lots of overtime, but for the right person, that might be a solid job.

I would support my child in pretty much any trade they saw as worthwhile. Like any career they show an interest in, I plan to discuss pros/cons...physical demands of the job in the case of trades, how to transition or come up with a plan for entrepreneurship if desired, discussion of the value of taking some business courses (or marketing, etc. if appropriate), etc. I can't think of anything I'd actively discourage...I just plan to discuss pros/cons of all scenarios (involving college/graduate/professional school, trades, etc.) with my children so they can better understand and think through their decisions.

If we felt our child was committed and working through a solid plan, we'd contribute "college" savings toward technical/trade schools or business startup down the road.

[smiles33]

I'm going to be honest and say that while I ultimately would support my girls in whatever decision they made, I would be disappointed if they didn't seek a white-collar career. My family lineage (4+ generations ago) is of peasants in a rural part of China and my parents have always instilled in me the value that life is much easier when you don't have to depend on your body/strength (which will peter out much faster than your intellectual prowess).

If they can put in a few years in the trade and then own their own small business, that would be ideal because they it's managing others and you are your own boss. That, quite frankly, is the best situation to be in as again, my parents have always reinforced that working for someone else means you're at their mercy even if you are an incredibly hard worker who produces a high quality output.

[boolady]

I would support my child in pretty much any trade they saw as worthwhile. Like any career they show an interest in, I plan to discuss pros/cons...physical demands of the job in the case of trades, how to transition or come up with a plan for entrepreneurship if desired, discussion of the value of taking some business courses (or marketing, etc. if appropriate), etc. I can't think of anything I'd actively discourage...I just plan to discuss pros/cons of all scenarios (involving college/graduate/professional school, trades, etc.) with my children so they can better understand and think through their decisions.

If we felt our child was committed and working through a solid plan, we'd contribute "college" savings toward technical/trade schools or business startup down the road.

:yeahthat: to all of this.

[gatorsmom]

i would also support any kind of mechanic, as long as it doesn't involve carnival rides.

:rotflmao:

[crl]

I wish schools still offered vo-tech education. I went to high school so long ago that my high school offered auto shop and various accounting and secretarial classes. I think that was way better than everyone is on essentially a college prep track, but not everyone is really going to college. Graduating with some real skills would be much better for many kids, I think.

I would support any legal trade for my kids, though I would encourage them to also develop some basic business skills so they could eventually run a small business in their trade. If my kids want to go to college I hope they do, but if not, that is okay with me and with dh. About the only things we would discourage are the military (both grandfathers are retired military, dh did 13 years. We appreciate and honor service, but it is not an easy life) and law school (both of us are lawyers).

Catherine

[ThreeofUs]

A little known fact is that, in many parts of the country, the higher-paid blue collar jobs go unfilled. Workers for electrical, phone, and other utility jobs, for example, often start at $40/hr. after a 6-month training period and their hourly rate can go over $100 with significant experience. The companies can't fill their open, often union-protected positions.

But the parents and guidance counselors of kids who would otherwise train for these careers (1) don't know about and (2) don't value the work. They'd rather their children get a 4-year degree - even if this means they will be un- or under-employed when they graduate.

I would definitely support my guys going after a career that would enable them to live the American Dream of middle class home-ownership and stable family life. But I must admit that I, also, would rather them have a college degree. Even if they go for the blue-collar training afterwards. ;)

[happymom]

I would certainly encourage my children to go to college. I want them to have options available to them. That said, I would have no problem with my child having a blue-collar job as long as they were safe and happy. I think a lot of people do not realize how lucrative blue collar jobs can be. I agree with 100% with PP's who said that its more about the business sense and work ethic than anything else. My DH is technically a blue collar worker- he is self-employed as an appliance repairman. He also sells and installs appliances. He is very talented and has a fabulous business sense. The appliance repairman that he trained by was making VERY good money, working only part-time. DH's business is still growing, but he makes a good living as well. My only concern with his field, and other jobs that involve physical labor, is how hard it will be for him when he is 50 or 60 yrs old. Right now, he has no problem moving a frig or laying under an oven etc. That may become difficult in coming years! But hopefully he'll make loads of money and retire young! :D

[sste]

I would definitely support my guys going after a career that would enable them to live the American Dream of middle class home-ownership and stable family life. But I must admit that I, also, would rather them have a college degree. Even if they go for the blue-collar training afterwards. ;)

I agree and posted something identical on the education thread. One thing that I have seen with my relatives in trade jobs is that they make good money but they sometimes seem to have some inferiority issues that they are not "educated." And in some cases this has caused them to hyper-focus a bit on money because that is what gives them social status compared to the many broke Ph.ds n my home state. Maybe this is just my difficult relatives?!? Or the fact that they live in areas populated overwhelmingly with college-educated people? I don't know.

I would want my DC to have whatever status and self-esteem boost comes from a four year college degree in our society . . . and then if they go into the trades with a four year degree in my experience it is then considered maverick-y and entrepenurial. I would want to try to help them avoid that inferiority complex thing I have seen.

[mommylamb]

I truly wish DH or I were handy at all. We're not, so that doesn't give DS much opportunity to learn.

Knowing a trade can be a wonderful thing. Last week, I was talking to a govt. relations person at one of the big defense contractors, and he was telling me that they will pay a master welder $70K a year down in Mississippi, but are really struggeling to find anyone with skills. That's a lot of money in Mississippi.

[vonfirmath]

If my child wanted to go into a trade though I think I might encourage them to consider working on the commercial rather than residential end and specializing. Maybe I am wrong about this but my hunch is that there are only a certain number of people that can do HVAC for example in large office buildings or that can fix elevators, etc. One thing that I bet will be emerging is a market for electricians who can deal with some of the new commercial "smart grid" initiaitives - - I think smart grid is only going to grow.

I work for a commercial Plumbing and HVAC company. And we have plenty of competition bidding these jobs! But we do win enough to stay in business.

Just from talk around here, it seems harder to find good plumbers than HVAC guys (our guys make their own duct, etc. So very skilled work. And HOT. I would not want to do it!)

[elektra]

I think you can do well in a variety of trades if you own your own business and hire workers that you profit from . . . my uncle is a painter and although I don't think of that as a renumerative trade job he ran a good business and coupled it with real estate investing (and he could do his own painting and repairs on those houses).

If my child wanted to go into a trade though I think I might encourage them to consider working on the commercial rather than residential end and specializing. Maybe I am wrong about this but my hunch is that there are only a certain number of people that can do HVAC for example in large office buildings or that can fix elevators, etc. One thing that I bet will be emerging is a market for electricians who can deal with some of the new commercial "smart grid" initiaitives - - I think smart grid is only going to grow.

I remember a friend I grew up with first told me her dad was a plumber. I pictured the whole "plumber crack" stereotype. Well, when her dad dropped her off in a business suit and a porsche, my idea of what a plumber was quickly changed! Turned out he was president of a commercial plumbing company. I remember that while we were still friends in college, his company got the contract for the new Getty Center/museum in Los Angeles.
Her parents were married at 16 and 17, (her mom got pregnant with her much older brother), neither had a college degree, and both her parents went on to be VERY successful in their respective careers of real estate and plumbing.
I'm wondering if they could do it all over again, if her dad wouldn't have started working as a plumber, and worked his way through college earning some kind of business degree though. He really did it the hard way, working his way all the way up.

[pinkmomagain]

Knowing my three (OK the youngest one is hard to tell yet), they have the potential to complete four years of college at least. My middle one is very creative (yet struggles in certain subjects) and is interested in art but also into cosmetics/nails. I've told her it would be fine to go into beauty after college...and if she wants to work behind the makeup counter through college, that would be great. I can also see her being a masseuse or some type of spa person....which I would be OK with, after completing college.

[bubbaray]

I know for a fact that there are a lot of plumbers and electricians who make more than lawyers here -- they also seem a lot happier than lawyers.

I do think it is still harder for women in the trades, but if my daughters wanted to go into a trade, I'd be OK with that.

[maestramommy]

Dh and I have seen a lot more young people in trades since we moved here. With the exception of plumber, it appears as though many people have multiple trades. For example, our first contractor also plowed snow in the winter. Our next contractor also plows snow AND does small scale tree removal and yard cleanup. He can build an entire house if you want, but for us he installed a door, and we're thinking of asking him about putting in wood or tile flooring next, maybe replacing our last toilet and redoing the tile in our bathroom. A handy man we inherited from the former owner of our house was working for a building company by them time we came along, but we just spoke to him and he is working for himself again. He also does small plumbing jobs.

But we have girls and all the people we know in trade are men. Probably for obvious reasons. I'm sure there are other trades out there, like cosmetology. Someone mentioned that this year there were many girls in the HS graduating class who were enrolled in beauty school (is that the right term anymore?). Whether that was because they really wanted to, or maybe couldn't afford college yet, I don't know. But around here it's just as respectable to be in trade as it is to be a white collar professional. I think Dh once said if our kids really wanted to go into a trade, he would probably be fine with it, as long as they showed true passion and ability. Well, I guess that would be the case for any career choice.

[brittone2]

I remember when DH and I bought our first house (modest, but nice) as two degreed professionals (I was still working at the time), we would often drive over to the next neighborhood over, which was a little nicer....bigger houses, larger lots. We often commented that there were a LOT of tradespeople/entrepreneurs in those homes. On a saturday morning you could drive through and there were quite a number of work vans, etc. there, belonging to the homeowners.

Granted, not everyone has that level of success as a tradesperson, but it made an impression in my mind. eta: I don't really romanticize the notion of them being tradespeople and the challenges that can come with that, but I still think it is a viable option that I would be open to discussing with them if they are interested.

[niccig]

My only concern with his field, and other jobs that involve physical labor, is how hard it will be for him when he is 50 or 60 yrs old. Right now, he has no problem moving a frig or laying under an oven etc. That may become difficult in coming years! But hopefully he'll make loads of money and retire young! :D

This is my concern too. My BIL has a trade (machinist, and worked in power stations doing repairs/shut downs) and did very well at it, but he saw colleagues in their 50's who physically were damaged from the work - guys with serious back problems, but had to keep doing the physical work as had no other options. He called it a "young man's game".

He's now late 30's and moved into management using all that work experience to manage teams that do the shut downs, and he's getting his degree and then MBA, as he can't move higher up unless he has a degree.

If DS wants to do a trade, I'll have him talk to my BIL about the physical difficulty of the work, and need to have long term plan to move into less physically demanding work as your body ages.

[momof2girls]

As long as they truly loved what they did, were good at it, and could make a living in which they were comfortable, anything goes.

[dogmom]

I would not support my daughter a trade involving a pole. ;)

[brittone2]

i would not support my daughter a trade involving a pole. ;)
:rotflmao:

[jenfromnj]

I know for a fact that there are a lot of plumbers and electricians who make more than lawyers here -- they also seem a lot happier than lawyers.

I agree with this 1000%!!! So many of my classmates in law school were there because they thought it was the best way to become wealthy. Now many of those people hate their jobs and sometimes work 24 hours per day, and have insanely high stress levels. Meanwhile, those we know who are skilled tradespeople make roughly the same salary (or more), but seem much happier with their jobs and overall work/life balance.


I remember when DH and I bought our first house (modest, but nice) as two degreed professionals (I was still working at the time), we would often drive over to the next neighborhood over, which was a little nicer....bigger houses, larger lots. We often commented that there were a LOT of tradespeople/entrepreneurs in those homes. On a saturday morning you could drive through and there were quite a number of work vans, etc. there, belonging to the homeowners.



In the same vein, I remember a former partner at my firm mentioning that her local exclusive prep school has been seeing a shift in the past 10 years or so from predominantly children of executives/lawyers/doctors, to many more children of electricians, plumbers, HVAC company owners, and the like.


This is my concern too. My BIL has a trade (machinist, and worked in power stations doing repairs/shut downs) and did very well at it, but he saw colleagues in their 50's who physically were damaged from the work - guys with serious back problems, but had to keep doing the physical work as had no other options. He called it a "young man's game".


This is a concern with certain trades, I agree. However, (a) many of the people we know who work/worked trade or union jobs are able to retire by the time they reach the age of being unable to work, since they've been paid so well and have/had such excellent benefits; and (b) unfortunately, so many of the lawyers I worked with have had heart attacks and other stress-related health issues by the time they're into their 50s, I unfortunately I think that many non-manual labor occupations have the aging factor, as well.

Also, to codex's point, DH's family is a long line of union workers/manual laborers, and many of them have moved beyond the "hands on" jobs by the time they get old enough to be feeling it-- for exmple, his grandfather and uncle worked as ironworker until past age 65, BUT they were shop foreman for the last 12-15 years, and just logged the tools in and out, sitting at a desk in a trailer. Not that everyone would have that kind of experience, but many trades/unions do have a hierarchy in place, where the older workers definitely get the more plum/less phyiscally demanding tasks.

[brittone2]

And there are (degree necessary) professions that are also physically demanding and can take a toll one's body. I'm most familiar with healthcare-being a nurse, physical therapist, etc. in certain settings can be *very* physically demanding. Generally there are options to move into less physically demanding aspects of the job (administration, dept head, etc.) but not everyone wants to go that route. Not exactly the same as many of the physical demands on tradespeople, but there are physically demanding jobs out there that are not in the trades.

[sste]

One of the reasons my DH will leave medicine at a reasonable retirement age is that his specialty is physically demanding and requires a fair amount of steadiness/hand eye and endurance that all starts to become harder in your sixties. He may be able to work in another specialty that he has training in . . . but I think he is just going to be exhausted and want to retire at 65 or so.

That said, I do think there are careers (roofer for example?) where the time trajectory is even shorter and I do think part of going into a trade is planning for that, ideally by owning your own business or by having a "back-up" skill or degree.

[niccig]

And there are (degree necessary) professions that are also physically demanding and can take a toll one's body. I'm most familiar with healthcare-being a nurse, physical therapist, etc. in certain settings can be *very* physically demanding. Generally there are options to move into less physically demanding aspects of the job (administration, dept head, etc.) but not everyone wants to go that route. Not exactly the same as many of the physical demands on tradespeople, but there are physically demanding jobs out there that are not in the trades.

No, not everyone wants to go into administration, but they do have the option as they have the degree - my MIL went into nursing administration. But from my BIL's experience in a very physically demanding job - hanging 100ft up in air repairing something, or my father as a mechanic - these are jobs that you can't always do in your 50s and there's not always the option to move into less physically work without something else, whether that is a degree or business skills to transition.

My BIL's brother was in same grade as me at HS, he went into same trade and suffers back problems at 37. He has no plan to move out of his physical work, whereas his older brother at 40 with same trade experience, is moving into something that has longer earning capability, earns more and is less physically demanding. But that's because my BIL pursued other opportunities. He didn't want to be 55 and doing punishing physical work as he had no other option to support his family.

My point is, that as we age, any work that is physically/mentally demanding will get more difficult. And it's smart to have a plan to transition to something, so you have options. DS can pursue a trade, but he'll be kidding himself if he thinks at 60 years old it will be just as easy to crawl under a house to replace pipes as it is at 18. If there is no pension/union benefits for the trade, DS will need to have a plan to support himself when he physically can't do the work. And the same goes for physically demanding work of nurses or PTs. Or even mentally demanding jobs such as high powered lawyers etc.

My DH has a degree, but in his area there are not many people over 57 doing the work - and not because of physical limitations. We know this, so we're planning for what we'll do when it happens. Part of that plan is my work doesn't have that age limitation, DH will transition into something else, and we need to save more now. If DS pursues a physically demanding job or one with shorter work life, then we'll be telling him to do the same.

[boolady]

And there are (degree necessary) professions that are also physically demanding and can take a toll one's body. I'm most familiar with healthcare-being a nurse, physical therapist, etc. in certain settings can be *very* physically demanding. Generally there are options to move into less physically demanding aspects of the job (administration, dept head, etc.) but not everyone wants to go that route. Not exactly the same as many of the physical demands on tradespeople, but there are physically demanding jobs out there that are not in the trades.

This is absolutely true. I also wonder about the respective health of people in careers that are mentally stressful vs. people in careers that are more physically demanding. While I know that neither is great, DH's job, which most would consider less "prestigious" than my job, is far more physically demanding. While he's physically tired, and sometimes stressed, he at least has the physical work he gets to do during the day as exercise as an outlet for his stress. I, on the other hand, am constantly stressed, and almost always at my desk. I actually think he'll be better off in the long run...the long-term effects of persistent stress are pretty well documented, and they're not good.

[codex57]

Mechanic is the only one that comes to mind at the moment. I'd have to think about the others.

Like others have mentioned, getting old is a big negative. With mechanics, I'm aware of an actual "out" to that. BIL is the shop foreman (head mechanic) at a major dealer in NorCal. With how cars are now, he said he hasn't turned a wrench in years. First time he did it in years, was when he helped change the oil in my car (another thing he hadn't done in years). He messes around with a computer all day diagnosing and testing. Any wrench turning is passed on to a lower level mechanic. He doesn't really have any interest in management (unless he finds out they pay a ton with job security, which I don't think they have). So, he can stay a "blue collar" employee but still no longer gets his hands dirty. And he's not even 40 yet.

[brittone2]

No, not everyone wants to go into administration, but they do have the option as they have the degree - my MIL went into nursing administration. But from my BIL's experience in a very physically demanding job - hanging 100ft up in air repairing something, or my father as a mechanic - these are jobs that you can't always do in your 50s and there's not always the option to move into less physically work without something else, whether that is a degree or business skills to transition.

My BIL's brother was in same grade as me at HS, he went into same trade and suffers back problems at 37. He has no plan to move out of his physical work, whereas his older brother at 40 with same trade experience, is moving into something that has longer earning capability, earns more and is less physically demanding. But that's because my BIL pursued other opportunities. He didn't want to be 55 and doing punishing physical work as he had no other option to support his family.

My point is, that as we age, any work that is physically demanding will get more difficult. And it's smart to have a plan to transition to something, so you have options. DS can pursue a trade, but I think he'll be kidding himself if he thinks at 60 years old it will be just as easy to crawl under a house to replace pipes as it is at 18.
That's why I stated the scenarios are not exactly the same. I just think it is important to recognize that there are physical challenges in professional/degreed jobs as well.

That's why we plan to be pro open dialogue about the pros and cons of any profession our children consider. That includes having discussions about taking on larger amounts of student debt to complete graduate school...that may mean not having the option to become a SAHP *if* DC eventually want that down the road for example. In an era when graduate degrees may be necessary for many jobs, I think it is important to consider what tradeoffs pursing a graduate degree (that is not fully funded) might bring, just as I would feel compelled for my child to have a long term plan about how to handle a physically demanding job in a trade.

I think it is important to consider how any profession might impact their lifestyle, stress on marriage, how flexible/inflexible it may be if they have children, student loan debt vs. income potential, how much they enjoy your job vs. earning power, likelihood job will be outsourced, etc. For those reasons, i really don't think I could ever push them toward something they weren't enthusiastically wanting to pursue. It is so much more complex than money or prestige...you can have a great degree from a prestigious graduate school but be loaded with student loan debt that makes it challenging to pursue other options in your life, or you might have an undergrad degree (fully paid for) and make enough to be content with a job that pays the bills but has low stress and good flexibility.

If they choose a trade, I'd want to be actively talking them through having a long term game plan..how will you handle aging in that job? Does it make sense to consider starting your own business? Can you talk to others in the field and find out what their overhead is, what it costs to own your own business in that trade (how realistic is that option for the given trade being considered? Might there be another trade that has lower overhead costs if you decide to start your own business?). I'd want them to be shadowing, apprenticing, working with a mentor, etc. before making any serious decisions, whether they pursue a trade or a PhD.

[codex57]

Also, to codex's point, DH's family is a long line of union workers/manual laborers, and many of them have moved beyond the "hands on" jobs by the time they get old enough to be feeling it-- for exmple, his grandfather and uncle worked as ironworker until past age 65, BUT they were shop foreman for the last 12-15 years, and just logged the tools in and out, sitting at a desk in a trailer. Not that everyone would have that kind of experience, but many trades/unions do have a hierarchy in place, where the older workers definitely get the more plum/less phyiscally demanding tasks.

That's the kind of trade I would approve of. It's just that in California, the only one I'm aware of, with enough continuous work, is longshoreman. Still, I've got relatives in the shipping business in other countries. Technology is really encroaching. It's already nearly impossible to get a longshoreman job here. By the time my kid gets old enough to apply, it could be far worse.

I'd rather my kids stay with me in CA. :D So, in CA, I'm not really aware of too many trades that fit that description. If my kid can find one and get in, shoot, I'd be all for that. Some of those long time longshoreman workers make as much as specialist doctors or partners in big law firms, but with really very little stress and even actual work (by my standards). Still, I know a few people who tried to get in and it seems harder to get in than getting into Harvard. Literally.

[niccig]

That's why we plan to be pro open dialogue about the pros and cons of any profession our children consider.

I agree with all that you said, especially the above. We plan to do the same with DS. I know that neither DH nor I thought through long term affects of the career we were choosing. We got lucky with DH's work from a financial point of view, but there is an impact on family time - it's not as bad as others in same industry, but that's because when DH turned 30, he decided to focus on a niche area that gives better work/life balance, and it's paid off now that we have DS.

We have enough people in our family/friends that have a number of different jobs to talk to DS about what the work is really like. And we'll find someone if we don't know anyone.

[brittone2]

I agree with all that you said, especially the above. We plan to do the same with DS. I know that neither DH nor I thought through long term affects of the career we were choosing. We got lucky with DH's work from a financial point of view, but there is an impact on family time - it's not as bad as others in same industry, but that's because when DH turned 30, he decided to focus on a niche area that gives better work/life balance, and it's paid off now that we have DS.

We have enough people in our family/friends that have a number of different jobs to talk to DS about what the work is really like. And we'll find someone if we don't know anyone.

It really is complicated, isn't it? It is tough to balance not pushing your child toward or away from a profession that grabs their heart with wanting them to know the pros and cons of said profession. And I know I would have scoffed if my parents suggested that I might want to be a SAHM some day, even though that's what I eventually chose to do. Yet I want my children to think through what the implications of their decisions might be when it comes to taking on significant debt, a stressful but prestigious/lucrative job, or a physically demanding trade. Sigh. Parenting isn't going to get any easier, is it?!

[karstmama]

another trade that you just don't think of is surveyor. during economic times when there is building, new highways, lots of real estate turnover, they make a good living & have lots of work. of course, not so much just now, but that's true of lots of jobs. i didn't know until my brother was working for a surveyor that you don't have to have finished high school to be eligible to take the certification exam.

and i'd absolutely support any trade, maybe with a bit of a press for some college classes along the way, maybe night school, in pursuit of a business or similar degree.

[codex57]

I took a Dale Carnegie course with a surveyor. As you mentioned, like any construction/real estate related job, it can have some real ups and downs in terms of how much work is available. That's what I'm not fond of.

[niccig]

It really is complicated, isn't it? It is tough to balance not pushing your child toward or away from a profession that grabs their heart with wanting them to know the pros and cons of said profession. And I know I would have scoffed if my parents suggested that I might want to be a SAHM some day, even though that's what I eventually chose to do. Yet I want my children to think through what the implications of their decisions might be when it comes to taking on significant debt, a stressful but prestigious/lucrative job, or a physically demanding trade. Sigh. Parenting isn't going to get any easier, is it?!

Some of those implications they will not understand at a young age. Like you, I never would have thought of a family friendly job when I was at college. But now, I'm hoping to be back in school, and one of my criteria was work/life balance. My older sister, no kids, told me I shouldn't use DS as criteria as one day he will be out of the house, and I'll still be working. She doesn't get that someone has to pick DS up from school/after care and it can never be DH because of his work. Yes, I could get a sitter to do pick up, and I'm going to have to do that on days I have late afternoon class, but *I* want to be able to get him as much as I can. I have a friend, who studied feminist studies at Harvard, and she's a SAHM as the reality of her DH's work is absolutely crazy work hours. A SAHD in our class was an engineer at the nearby NASA lab, and he stopped work as his wife is a Dr. and has crazy hours too. He's talking about becoming a math teacher.

So, we also need to teach our kids to be flexible and open to change as their life changes.

[niccig]

I took post OT for a bit.

To answer OP's questions, I would ecourage a trade if DS really wanted to do it, but he would need to be aware of possible limitations, dangerous work etc. Some professions (degree or not) are more dangerous than others, and I would want DS to know that. And I would encourage a long-term look at his life, but I would do that for any potential career (degree or non-degree).

I agree with Brittone that I think career guidance counselling is severly lacking, but I also know that even if told, some kids won't hear it anyways. I am all for internships, shadowing, trying to get DS to get some real-life experiences.

[gatorsmom]

I took post OT for a bit.


I agree with Brittone that I think career guidance counselling is severly lacking, but I also know that even if told, some kids won't hear it anyways. I am all for internships, shadowing, trying to get DS to get some real-life experiences.

I'm glad you took the post on a tangent. I was hoping this thread would get long and interesting. I've been thinking a lot about my 15yo nephew. He gets pitifully poor career or school guidance from his dad and his mom is pretty focused on herself so he's not getting anything there. Now that I live near him, I want to provide some direction, support, and help if he wants it. I know that his parents have no fund started for his future education. He comes from a long line of blue collar workers and I can see him going into something along those lines. I was really hoping this thread could give me some ideas for him to pursue and consider as he gets closer to graduating from high school.

Because I agree with your second point up there. Career guidance is terrible not only for high school students but college as well, imho. I could really have benefited from it and even though I sought it out, I feel like I wasn't given thorough or realistic advice.

[niccig]

I'm glad you took the post on a tangent. I was hoping this thread would get long and interesting. I've been thinking a lot about my 15yo nephew. He gets pitifully poor career or school guidance from his dad and his mom is pretty focused on herself so he's not getting anything there. Now that I live near him, I want to provide some direction, support, and help if he wants it. I know that his parents have no fund started for his future education. He comes from a long line of blue collar workers and I can see him going into something along those lines. I was really hoping this thread could give me some ideas for him to pursue and consider as he gets closer to graduating from high school.



Talk with him, maybe ask if he's thought about future plans and let him know he can talk to you. If he expresses interest in an area, see if you can find someone who can give him the career advice he needs.

My BIL, who I've been talking about, had no advice from his parents other than work on the family farm. He played high level field hockey, and one of the coaches got him a job as janitor at a large manufacturing comapny, and then helped him get an apprenticeship there. BIL has worked his way up, and he's good at his management job as he knows the work that is being done, and he knows when a contractor is trying to get away with shoddy work. He got head hunted for his current job, and tells a story of contractors who used to overly pad their quote by a ridiculous amount and it was never caught as previous person in his job thought it was reasonable amt of time/money to pay. BIL was able to tell contractor in great detail what's invovled in the job and how much $$/time was reasonable. Apparently there was a look of :47: on the contractors' faces, BIL wears a business suit and they thought he was another management person they could pull the wool over his eyes. He also won't have safety compromised, as he's worked on sites where it was, and he's fired contractors for not following OHS. He's got a good combination of work experience and self-taught business/finance. When he gets his MBA, he'll be able to go further if he wants, he's hit the ceiling for work without a degree.

He still thanks the field hockey coach for getting him the start as a janitor. But everything since then has been his own hard work. Just sharing this as BIL didn't get any of the help from family that other kids got, and it did make things more difficult, but someone else helped him get a start.

ETA. You're a great aunt to be worried about him.

[gatorsmom]

ETA. You're a great aunt to be worried about him.

Thank you. Somebody needs to be. :(