Top 10 Things Breastfeeding Advocates SHOULD and SHOULD STOP Say

[essnce629]

These are good and something to think about. I know IRL I'm pretty good about not saying any of the "stop saying" things and I tend to only bring up the issue when in a close group of friends or at our weekly playgroup. I would never approach a stranger and start spouting off things about breastfeeding or their baby!


Top 10 Things Breastfeeding Advocates Should Stop Saying
http://justwestofcrunchy.com/2011/05/27/top-10-things-breastfeeding-advocates-should-stop-saying/


Top 10 Things Breastfeeding Advocates SHOULD Say
http://justwestofcrunchy.com/2011/05/28/to-10-things-breastfeeding-advocates-should-say/

[lizzywednesday]

Thanks so much for posting those links! I really did enjoy the article ... and the comments section was so much more friendly than other comments sections I've read elsewhere online. Wonderful sharing of experiences and opinions.

It's also important for me, as a very loudmouthed "lactivist" myself, to remember how words can impact someone else both positively and negatively.

[TwinFoxes]

Wow, that was really great. Lots of excellent points made. I think sometimes when people become extremely "pro" anything they don't see how off putting their behavior/comments can be, and that they could end up turning people who would normally be on their side against them. I've seen a lot of the comments she posted under the "don't say" category on this very board. (not by you OP :) )

[elektra]

I think these are really good too.

In a recent thread about breastfeeding twins was the first time I have ever heard so much support for someone supplementing. And I know some people possibly give up on breastfeeding too easily but there are times where you really do need to supplement, and it seems like we hear a lot of the " Just take some fenugreek!” type of comments.

[infomama]

Thanks for sharing.

[Jo..]

Latia those links were awesome and made me feel warm. :)

I was worried that when I clicked them it would be another "you are a loser if you cannot breastfeed 100% URL".

I tried and tried and tried to give my son 100% breastmlkl but could not due to physical issues. I bought pumps, nursing systems, illegal supplements, drank mother's milk tea, took that maple syrup smelling stuff, ate oatmeal and drank water until I was sick. I sent almost one hundred despertate "HELP ME" pms to BBB BF advocates.

My son was admitted to ICU for severe dehydration and jaundice and had IVs in his head and bili lights for many days...maybe a weelk.

With child #2 (DD) I was much more lax...I gave her as much as I could, and supplemeted with formula. I felt good about what I gave her, and tried not to sweat the rest. But still, in the back of my mind I was failing my children.

I :love2: these links.

[Melaine]

Great links.

[arivecchi]

Thanks for sharing OP. That was an interesting read.

I have to point out though that I thought this "do" was incredibly condescending:

. “You used formula? That’s okay.”
I can already see the fingers hitting the keyboard to tell me that’s most certainly not okay. Again, bear with me: If we can’t accept what a mom has already done, we’re not helping her. If she’s used formula, it’s done. Giving her the space to talk about that freely and without judgment is the biggest favor we can do for her. If a mom has used formula in the past and we slap her with a knee-jerk judgment at the word ‘formula,’ we close the door to any further conversation (like how she might breastfeed her next baby, if she’s interested in discussing it). We don’t necessarily have to condone it, but at least meeting sans judgment is a must.

If I were to do a mommy drive-by, I would do it over something more important such as whether they use their car seat correctly so their baby does not die in a car accident.

I breastfed both kids for a bit and used formula as well. I know the facts and I came to the conclusion that my kids could thrive and do well on both.

I say live and let live. If you breastfeed, wonderful. If not, that's ok too.

[Jo..]

Thanks for sharing OP. That was an interesting read.

I was PASSIONATE about BF. No drop of formula would ever cross my chillds' lips.

I do not get people who formula feed from bith and don't even try. I would almost kill to have that ability, and so many people just don't use it. They are like Wonder Woman and they don't get it.

I do judge, I do. I cannot help it.

If you have spurting and sore breasts I envy you.

[Uno-Mom]

I liked the comment about marketing and formula:

I mean, if anybody feels self-righteous about the credulous people buying into formula marketing ... um... check your wallet. Got a Visa in there? Talk about a marketing machine!

Ok, now before I get self-righteous about avoiding formula (mostly) AND credit cards ... check my wallet ... Whoops! There's a Burger King receipt. Gross, unhealthy, waste of money. Marketing. Yup.

None of us are perfect at resisting advertising campaigns. We just do our very best to be aware and avoid the ones that personally offend us. Sad reality of our culture, I'm afraid. If you've figured out a solution-please let me know!

Anyway, I liked the links.

[wellyes]

I'll defend the lactivists a little. I think bfing or trying to bf in the first few months, with maybe a little supplementing, then weaning completely by 6 months is the standard American mom norm. How do we change that norm to encourage more moms to succeed -- both at first and at nursing longer? Dunno. The absolute wrong way is, of course, to guilt trip moms. No question. But what's the right way?

I think lactivists are demonized in pop culture. I was amazed to read a chapter in Tina Fey's new memoir attacking "teat nazis". Tina Fey is smart, relatable, self-deprectating but strong. I agree with just about everything she said in the memoir; but when she co-opted Limbaugh language (he of the "feminazis"), it really gave me pause. I suppose lists like the above are a step in the right direction.

(Full disclosure: I supplement, and don't feel guilty about it).

[kedss]

wellyes- I think we can only encourage by example-over the last few weeks, I've had to take my wee one out for several hours at a go, and I Bf'd wherever I went since she eats every half hour (maybe it just seems that way?) I do use formula for DH to feed her when I need a nap at night (a few times) mostly because I suck at pumping. I'm on the side of to each her own, but if someone gets in my face about it, they will wish they hadn't. ;)

[AnnieW625]

Thank you soo much for posting that. As someone who did both breast feed and formula feed it's a good read:thumbsup:


I think these are really good too.

In a recent thread about breastfeeding twins was the first time I have ever heard so much support for someone supplementing. And I know some people possibly give up on breastfeeding too easily but there are times where you really do need to supplement, and it seems like we hear a lot of the " Just take some fenugreek!” type of comments.

The only time I have ever heard lactovists be positive about formula feeding is when it is done for twins. For a mom to a single baby, don't even think about it. This was part of the issue I had with Kellymom.com forums when I was breast feeding DD1 and was reading posts about boosting supply or thinking about supplementing. I found the people there so darn rude I never even posted anything, and it really turned me off to lactivism.


. “You used formula? That’s okay.”
I can already see the fingers hitting the keyboard to tell me that’s most certainly not okay. Again, bear with me: If we can’t accept what a mom has already done, we’re not helping her. If she’s used formula, it’s done. Giving her the space to talk about that freely and without judgment is the biggest favor we can do for her. If a mom has used formula in the past and we slap her with a knee-jerk judgment at the word ‘formula,’ we close the door to any further conversation (like how she might breastfeed her next baby, if she’s interested in discussing it). We don’t necessarily have to condone it, but at least meeting sans judgment is a must.

If I were to do a mommy drive-by, I would do it over something more important such as whether they use their car seat correctly so their baby does not die in a car accident.

I breastfed both kids for a bit and used formula as well. I know the facts and I came to the conclusion that my kids could thrive and do well on both.

I say live and let live. If you breastfeed, wonderful. If not, that's ok too.
:yeahthat: The only drive bys I have done have been regarding car seats, strollers, or baby items. I wouldn't touch breast feeding with a 10 ft. pole. It's just my MO.


I liked the comment about marketing and formula:

I mean, if anybody feels self-righteous about the credulous people buying into formula marketing ... um... check your wallet. Got a Visa in there? Talk about a marketing machine!

Ok, now before I get self-righteous about avoiding formula (mostly) AND credit cards ... check my wallet ... Whoops! There's a Burger King receipt. Gross, unhealthy, waste of money. Marketing. Yup.

None of us are perfect at resisting advertising campaigns. We just do our very best to be aware and avoid the ones that personally offend us. Sad reality of our culture, I'm afraid. If you've figured out a solution-please let me know!

Anyway, I liked the links.

So true. The main goal of the mass media is to provide buyers for products; it doesn't matter if it's a burger, vitamins, or formula. If it's bought it's means that whatever media used to market it is working.


I'll defend the lactivists a little. I think bfing or trying to bf in the first few months, with maybe a little supplementing, then weaning completely by 6 months is the standard American mom norm. How do we change that norm to encourage more moms to succeed -- both at first and at nursing longer? Dunno. The absolute wrong way is, of course, to guilt trip moms. No question. But what's the right way?

then honestly why do they need to feel that they need to change this? What's wrong with someone only breast feeding for 6 months or less? If that's their goal then let them have their goal. I mean if Mom A feels better breastfeeding and it costs a lot less than that's cool, but I am sure Mom B is no dummy and knows that formula can cost between $14 and $25 per can so that's just her choice. In both situations both babies are getting fed, and for the most part will be just as healthy and will grow at the same rate.


I think lactivists are demonized in pop culture. I was amazed to read a chapter in Tina Fey's new memoir attacking "teat nazis". Tina Fey is smart, relatable, self-deprectating but strong. I agree with just about everything she said in the memoir; but when she co-opted Limbaugh language (he of the "feminazis"), it really gave me pause. I suppose lists like the above are a step in the right direction.

I am going to go out on a limb and say that lactivists are "demonized" because how they go about stating that every woman should breast feed. IMHO if someone presents breastfeeding in a simple manner (like my HMO) and gives 10 tips on how to make breastfeeding better and does it in a simple manner I think that is great and there is no need for that lactivist to feel demonized. However those who are just jumping down others throats to get their point across should really think about their delivery or expect that they might feel demonized if they don't.

[wellyes]

then honestly why do they need to feel that they need to change this? What's wrong with someone only breast feeding for 6 months or less? If that's their goal then let them have their goal. I mean if Mom A feels better breastfeeding and it costs a lot less than that's cool, but I am sure Mom B is no dummy and knows that formula can cost between $14 and $25 per can so that's just her choice. In both situations both babies are getting fed, and for the most part will be just as healthy and will grow at the same rate.

There's nothing wrong with someone breastfeeding 6 months or less. I'd never, ever say anything negative to a mom about that. I don't think anything bad about a mom who makes that choice.

But as a whole, it would be better if more babies nursed, and for longer. I don't think it's awful or mean to say that. It's the same thing as saying that as a whole, we'd be better off with a lower obesity rate in the US. I say that as someone who is part of the 70% of the US population who is overweight. As a whole, we'd be better off if we slept more. I say that as someone who's constantly tired. Encouraging breastfeeding is a reasonable public health goal.

[kijip]

But as a whole, it would be better if more babies nursed, and for longer. I don't think it's awful or mean to say that. It's the same thing as saying that as a whole, we'd be better off with a lower obesity rate in the US. Encouraging breastfeeding is a reasonable public health goal.

I totally agree with this (and I say this as someone who had a horrible time breastfeeding my older son- we tried EVERYTHING to no avail but then had a fine nursing experience with my younger son) but I think it gets framed by many lactivists as individual choices only when the rates of breastfeeding are so low in large part because of our economic system and significant cultural pressures. Those don't change just because one person makes a choice to breastfeed. Those change because people take action that is focused on political, economic and social change.

[ashleybama24]

Great link..thank you for posting. I exclusively bf-Ed DS1 and was one of the ONLY moms I know that did it for a year. Everyone else hit 6 months and stopped. People always commented I was crazy for going to 16 months especially when I found out I was pregnant. I wanted to do it for 18 months but DS self weaned. I was a little glad to have a break before #2.

While I think bf-ing is beneficial for mothers and babies alike I understand it isn't possible for everyone. What I get frustrated and sad about is the people that refuse to even try for one day and ask for the shot to stop milk production as soon as they deliver. Or these teen moms that formula feed because WIC provides it for free...hardly seems fair. Especially when I pumped at work for 6 months in a dirty concrete room with bugs, a water leak and no fridge. Or in my car in the parking lot.

[SnuggleBuggles]

There's nothing wrong with someone breastfeeding 6 months or less. I'd never, ever say anything negative to a mom about that. I don't think anything bad about a mom who makes that choice.

But as a whole, it would be better if more babies nursed, and for longer. I don't think it's awful or mean to say that. It's the same thing as saying that as a whole, we'd be better off with a lower obesity rate in the US. I say that as someone who is part of the 70% of the US population who is overweight. As a whole, we'd be better off if we slept more. I say that as someone who's constantly tired. Encouraging breastfeeding is a reasonable public health goal.

:yeahthat:

I also think that we do need to try and make a change on this. I think that the culture needs to show that nursing an older baby is acceptable- it isn't gross or weird. People get hung up on things like if baby has teeth then they must be too old to nurse.

Honestly, 6m is when things get so easy with nursing and so many people ddon't make it far enough to see how easy and convenient it can be. Getting people to shift their mindset about nursing 6+ months would really be great. Nursing isn't just for newborns.

Beth

[egoldber]

then honestly why do they need to feel that they need to change this?

Two main reasons. On average, breastfed babies are healthier. Just like not being obese is healthier and eating more vegetables is healthier. It's a public health issue. Regardless of anyone's individual circumstances, as a society we would be healthier if babies were breastfed longer.

The other thing many people do not know is that breastfeeding is one of the very few things that women have active control over that decreases their personal chances of breast cancer.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12133652


It is estimated that the cumulative incidence of breast cancer in developed countries would be reduced by more than half, from 6.3 to 2.7 per 100 women by age 70, if women had the average number of births and lifetime duration of breastfeeding that had been prevalent in developing countries until recently. Breastfeeding could account for almost two-thirds of this estimated reduction in breast cancer incidence.

[Naranjadia]

I thought this was an excellent point from the article:

"Unless she’s asking, and only if you have her whole history, it’s probably best to keep quiet with opinions – opinions! – on what might have saved her breastfeeding relationship."

My twins were carried by a surrogate. Around the time of their birth, a number of people "encouraged" me to follow the drug protocol to induce lactation. I just had to demure, or if I knew them well enough, tell them I was on a number of non-optional medications that would be terrible to pass through breast-milk. Most backed off, though I did have a few "advisors" who were more insistent. I wondered, do I need to show you my complete medical records in order to convince you?

As it happened, our super-awesome surrogate mom pumped for about 8 months and shipped us her milk. It was enough to supplement the kids' formula every day.

[bisous]

I think this is GREAT. If the goal is truly to increase breastfeeding in this country, THIS is the tactic to take. It drives me nuts when mamas degrade those who use nursing covers. I'm a modest person and I like covering up and breastfed both kids to 18 months! Isn't that the goal??

[Uno-Mom]

I thought this was an excellent point from the article:

"Unless she’s asking, and only if you have her whole history, it’s probably best to keep quiet with opinions – opinions! – on what might have saved her breastfeeding relationship."

My twins were carried by a surrogate. Around the time of their birth, a number of people "encouraged" me to follow the drug protocol to induce lactation. I just had to demure, or if I knew them well enough, tell them I was on a number of non-optional medications that would be terrible to pass through breast-milk. Most backed off, though I did have a few "advisors" who were more insistent. I wondered, do I need to show you my complete medical records in order to convince you?

As it happened, our super-awesome surrogate mom pumped for about 8 months and shipped us her milk. It was enough to supplement the kids' formula every day.

Oh my - what an amazing story! I'm just blown away by your surrogate's willingness to do that! And your point about having to "present an entire medical hx" is a good one, too.

I have a sleeping disorder and I take a PRN sleep med. It happens to be one that's considered *less* unsafe to use during pregnancy and while nursing. Because my sleep disorder can make me so ill if untreated, I chose to use my med during pregnancy (as little as possible). I also chose to use it (as little as possible) while nursing.

It could have been different. If I'd had to totally give up my med during pregancy for the safety of my child, I would have. But... my ability to live intelligently, do my work, function would have been severely compromised. I probably would have chosen to go back on my medication over breastfeeding and it would have broken my heart. But I would have been barely functioning without it and although I believe in the benefits of BFing ... I believe having a functioning parent is more important.

I'm pretty open about sharing that story, but not to everybody. And when I do share it, I know that some people might judge me for choosing to stay on that med at all. This is why I, personally, love to be encourage friends to BF but I am ALWAYS gentle.

[vonfirmath]

I think these are really good too.

In a recent thread about breastfeeding twins was the first time I have ever heard so much support for someone supplementing. And I know some people possibly give up on breastfeeding too easily but there are times where you really do need to supplement, and it seems like we hear a lot of the " Just take some fenugreek!” type of comments.

I cried when my MIL did NOT condemn me for supplementing with my son. I thought I was doing something SO terrible -- then come to find out she formula fed BOTH her kids -- and didn't care how I fed her grandson as long as he was fed. My sister nursed all three of her babies. My mom nursed us. I wanted breastfeeding to work SO bad. but it didn't. My son was losing weight despite fenugreek, oatmeal, everything except doperidome (which we were unwilling to do) being at the breast everytime he cried -- he'd come OFF the breast and acted as hungry as if he'd just started! And then we paid for a lactation consultant, only to discover there was a reason for that. He was spending more energy trying to extract milk from me as he was getting from the session. We never figured out the supply thing. But we were able to keep DS out of the hospital by feeding him by bottle and having me pump when he fed -- then supplementing with formula for what I could not extract from myself.

[Melaine]

As it happened, our super-awesome surrogate mom pumped for about 8 months and shipped us her milk. It was enough to supplement the kids' formula every day.

:applause: What an amazing gift she gave you! I'm in awe of her!

[♥ms.pacman♥]

great links, thanks for sharing!!

[Gracemom]

Love these suggestions. Naranjadia - thank you so much for sharing! It's so true how sometimes you feel like you need to share your entire medical history with someone who thinks they are being helpful. It is so personal. I don't want to describe my flat nipples to just anyone. :rotflmao: Also, I have known women who have survived sexual abuse who have a hard time breastfeeding. And of course, that is not something they will be open about most of the time. You never know what a mom has been through. If you have never been in her shoes, just listen and let her know she is doing the best she can!

[Melaine]

This is really interesting, and maybe it IS because I had twins, but I never felt pressure to breast feed from anyone but myself. Perhaps some strong encouragement from my mom, but she is extremely health conscious and EBF all four of her kids so that was understandable. Never felt any judgment when I gave up pumping at four months old, except judgment from myself because I wanted BFing to work so badly. Almost to the point that I sacrificed my own sanity in relentless pursuit of a BFing relationship that could not be formed.

I did have a frustrating moment with my BF recently when we were talking about BFing. She was able to exclusively BF her (full-term) twins for over a year. She said something about next time hopefully I could breast feed because I would sort of know what to do from the beginning. I got the idea that she thought I just didn't learn how and when met with challenge, gave up.

I explained that I had gone to two LCs for several dozen visits, and had help from multiple doctors and several experienced BFing mothers. We tried EVERY position possible, stripped babies down, wet washcloth to wake them, etc. etc. We weighed before and after to see what they were getting. We tried nipple guards, etc. I literally tried every day all day for four months to get my children to nurse. Every day I failed. She was shocked, she had no idea I had done all that. The truth is, her twins came right home, she started BFing and it was a piece of cake. Her children also did NOT have colic and reflux as mine both did.

I guess she assumed it was just too hard logistically (which it is) so I quit? I was surprised because she is typically SO sensitive to others and very understanding but she just didn't realize what kind of challenges some people have with this.

The truth is, if you (or your child) do not struggle with BFing then you do not understand what it is like. Struggling for literally weeks to just get a baby to latch is physical and emotional torture. It is so unfair to put so much time, money, effort and tears into something so important to you and feel like no matter what you give, it isn't enough. I realize I got totally off-topic here, but all that to say that I agree not to judge moms who gave up, because you just don't know the ins and outs of the situation. HOWEVER, I still think as a society we need to continue to educate those who don't even try or do not want to breastfeed, because it is absolutely the healthiest choice and needs to become more the norm in our country. I think there is still a significant group of women in this country who truly don't believe or understand the benefits and to those women and their children, we should still reach out.

[mommylamb]

I thought these were really excellent links! Thanks for posting




I have to point out though that I thought this "do" was incredibly condescending:

. “You used formula? That’s okay.”


A- I can see why you thought this, though I didn't find it condescending. But, I'll tell you what I did find condescending. My lactivist FB "friend" who once wrote on her status "Mothers who formula feed love their children too." :barf: You know who I'm talking about. She is constantly posting breastfeeding stuff on FB that is very judgmental of women who don't exclusively BF. She does say things like "Formula is poison." It's really awful. I've often thought about blocking her posts, but then I'm sometimes entertained by her oddities.




I think lactivists are demonized in pop culture. I was amazed to read a chapter in Tina Fey's new memoir attacking "teat nazis". Tina Fey is smart, relatable, self-deprectating but strong. I agree with just about everything she said in the memoir; but when she co-opted Limbaugh language (he of the "feminazis"), it really gave me pause. I suppose lists like the above are a step in the right direction.

I think some of the people we all think of as lactivists deserve the bad reputation they get in society. As I said above, I know someone who says all of the things on the "do not say" list. But, I totally agree that "teat nazis" is a terrible term. And not just because of co-opting Limbaugh. I just don't think anyone should refer to someone as a nazi other than an actual nazi. Hitler imagery is way over done and it's offensive to make that comparison when a lactivist-- no matter how offensive-- is NOT a nazi.