Tips on dealing with uninterested GPs?

[bubbaray]

So, I've posted in the BP on many occasions about the ILs and how completely uninterested they are in my girls. I'm over it. DH, OTOH, is not and gets very sad and angry about the situation. BIL has completely cut off the ILs from the cousins for this reason. Initially DH was upset at BIL, but now says he completely understands.

DH doesn't want to completely cut off the ILs b/c the girls have no other GPs (my parents died when I was a child). I get that. But, the situation has deteriorated and I think it is actually negatively impacting the girls at this point. They spent the week there this past week and it was a huge bust. Sigh.

Ideas? They leave in a couple of weeks for Germany and are (supposedly) coming back mid-December with the plan to spend Christmas with us. I actually hope they do NOT spend it with us. They don't celebrate Christmas except in a gift sense, and they constantly criticize us that we spoil the girls too much, so they over compensate by getting them pretty much nothing or dollar store crap. They are extremely wealthy, so $$ isn't the issue.

Thoughts?

[hillview]

Can you construct specific times for interaction and make it a "tradition" so for example ILs b'days or a holiday or 2 that isn't super important to you (Christmas would be off the list for me) and keep it to that? That way you can control the situation and at the same time you aren't cutting them off completely?

If you think it is impacting your kids I think it is reasonable to limit and control the interactions.

I do this with MIL -- once a year for 5 days and we stay in a hotel. I leave when it is getting unreasonable (with the kids). DH spends more time with MIL and I take the boys to lunch or something like that.

HUGS it SUCKS and I am so sorry!
/hillary

[m448]

we have issues with that to varying degrees. Really what will help your DH is to realize he cannot control his parents and that it's up to HIS parents to step up to the plate and make the effort. If they won't then the your responsibility (you and DH) is to set healthy boundaries that don't allow the gp's choices to hurt your children, manipulate them or yank their chains.

If the gp's don't see the value of cultivating relationships with their grandkids then that's their loss. And really, I've seen how amazing it is to let go of that and how in my life both growing up and now as the parent other people (extended family, friends) fill the need for love and relationship.

Most of all it sucks they don't man up and it stinks for your DH and the kids but I think your BIL realized this a while ago.

[bubbaray]

Thanks ladies.

Its complicated. BIL cut the ties b/c the ILs wouldn't grandparent *his* way, to his expectations (which, IMO, were high/unrealistic).

DH's expectations are IMO realistic, esp. as he saw the fallout with BILs situation.

Yes, DH knows he needs to set boundaries. He is actually talking about him going to a counsellor to help with this. His family does not talk about any.thing. So, its hard for him.

I really do think that DD#1 in particular is figuring it out and it upsets her. That is when my momma-bear instincts kick in and I just want the ILs out of our lives. DH, though, sees what has happened with BIL and doesn't want that for our girls. So, he needs to find a balance, yet I'm not sure there is balance to be found, KWIM?

[gatorsmom]

I really do think that DD#1 in particular is figuring it out and it upsets her. That is when my momma-bear instincts kick in and I just want the ILs out of our lives. DH, though, sees what has happened with BIL and doesn't want that for our girls. So, he needs to find a balance, yet I'm not sure there is balance to be found, KWIM?

I hear you on the mama bear instinct kicking in. I feel mine coming out just reading your situation!

I dont' have any great advice for you other than to encourage get-togethers whenever you can and hope for the best. Do you know anything about the ILs' parents? Were they loving, affectionate people? They may explain why your ILs seem unloving. Maybe they are just uncomfortable getting close to people.

As for your DD catching on to this, I really dont' think it hurts anyone to stretch the truth a bit. My mom did this with her father who was fairly unloving toward the youngest grandchildren. I can't remember him ever smiling at me or saying one word other than, "You kids quit slamming that screendoor!" But when we weren't around him, she'd tell us stories about how he was just tired that day, or he was asking about us recently, etc. she'd tell us stories from her childhood about what a nice guy he was. I have no idea if they true but she was trying to make us like him and help us feel like he cared about us. It made me feel better. Looking back, I understand that his mother was he11 on wheels and he probably couldn't express affection. But that wasn't something I could have understood and forgiven him for as a child.

[randomkid]

I feel for your girls and your DH, but I completely understand. DH's mom died when the girls were very young (2yo and 4yo) and all that was left was his Dad and both of his grandmothers. XW's parents are crazy and mean, so the girls didn't see them much and really did not enjoy spending time with them. Enter DH's Aunt (his Mom's sister). She kind of became a surrogate grandmother to the girls and DH was glad for that because he had had issues with this part of the family in the past and he felt they had made amends. We started dating and really tried to cultivate the relationship with this aunt. The girls loved her and she was good to them, but would say some nasty things on occasion. It came time for our wedding and this aunt pulled another crappy stunt and was very hateful - long story that is irrelevant, but was related to our wedding and put us in a real bind. That was it for DH. He was done with her. He had this history that I hadn't lived and I didn't want to give up, but when he explained everything to me, I understood. I still didn't like it, but it made sense as we were concerned that she would hurt the girls and we didn't want to expose them to her negativity anymore. They asked about her for a long time, esp the youngest, and we would just explain that it wasn't working out to spend time with her right now.

DH would still take the girls to visit his maternal Grandmother and after a couple of years he started asking his grandmother to let his aunt know he was bringing the girls over if she wanted to see them, mostly because the girls kept asking to see her. He actually decided to try again and the aunt would never come over when they were there. That was very hurtful to the girls, so he just gave up entirely. As they got a little older, DH explained it to them. He had to remind them that he did try to take them to see her and she didn't respond. It was hard because it hurt them a lot that she didn't seem interested anymore and they still missed her, but they understood. DH's grandmother passed away last year so we don't see that part of the family at all now and it really is still sad to me. FIL passed away 2 years ago and DH doesn't have much family. I'd love for the girls to have a relationship with more family, but not at the expense of them getting hurt. It's just not worth it in the end. So, we cut ourselves off completely. DH did try to call his uncle (his Mom's brother) once and never got a call back. The only family he sees is the husband of this aunt that wronged us and that is only because he is a really nice, decent guy. He has an auto repair shop and DH can go there to see him without having to see any other family. DD only knew her great Grammy and misses her now that she is gone, but she really hasn't even met the rest of the family. DD is so sensitive that there is no way I am going to put her through the same thing the girls went through.

I think the easiest thing to do is to limit the girls' time with the ILs since they are not healthy for the girls and possibly stop seeing them altogether if they simply are not interested. In the end, it has been easier for our girls to not see that family at all rather than to be repeatedly hurt by a toxic, uninterested relative.

[WatchingThemGrow]

I'm so sorry the week was a bust. What happened? Did your DH stay with them there?
Just asking b/c you know I've sought help for disinterested GPs on the board as well. Wonder if we (BBB) can target/offer suggestions for their behaviors that are "off."

[m448]

Re: your BIL obviously I don't know him nor do I know the specifics of the situation but I will say that as the person who has had to set some very strong boundaries with certain people in my family sometimes they seem harsh to outsiders and unnecessary. I'm willing to look that way in order to keep healthy boundaries though.

[jenfromnj]

I am in something like your situation with both sets of DS's grandparents, so I can sympathize. Do your ILs just not enjoy children generally? From what you said re: your BIL and his children, it seems not to just be your girls that they aren't very interested in.

One thought--do you think it would be at all worthwhile to encourage your girls to cultivate a common interest with their GPs? Do they enjoy golf, sewing, biking, whatever? I ask because my ILs sometimes spend time with DS, but more as passive observers who sit on a chair and watch TV while kind of watching DS, rather than actually interacting with him. But I've seen that as their their GC get older, FIL enjoys taking them fishing, for example, and it's something for them to talk about, a sort of common ground. I know that might not be the most practical solution, though.

I also think (and I know this may not be the majority opinion) that it's better to have no relationship with someone who isn't willing to give at least a minimal amount of love and effort to the relationship, than to be continually disappointed and upset by such a person, even if that person is family. I know it's more difficult in your case since your DDs are old enough to really get what's going on, and they already have an established relationship with DDs, as distant or dysfunctional as it may be.


Re: your BIL obviously I don't know him nor do I know the specifics of the situation but I will say that as the person who has had to set some very strong boundaries with certain people in my family sometimes they seem harsh to outsiders and unnecessary. I'm willing to look that way in order to keep healthy boundaries though.

I also agree with this. I am estranged from my parents, and I know that some people do not truly understand it and I'm sure some have passed judgment. But without knowing every detail of a relationship, and all the things that have been said, done, seen and lied about over a lifetime, it's very hard to accurately judge whether someone is making the "right" or appropriate decision in these cases.

[maestramommy]

re: the gift giving, can your Dh tell his parents your kids really don't need gifts, so you can avoid the crap? couch it in terms like they can just watch your girls enjoy opening their gifts, but don't feel like they must bring their own gifts. It sounds like your girls get enough, maybe nothing would be better than dollar store crap. My kids are still too young to notice, but your girls are older, and they probably would notice.

It's good your Dh is going to see a counselor about this. I don't have any advice, but I think pp have given good suggestions. :hug:

[bubbaray]

Re: your BIL obviously I don't know him nor do I know the specifics of the situation but I will say that as the person who has had to set some very strong boundaries with certain people in my family sometimes they seem harsh to outsiders and unnecessary. I'm willing to look that way in order to keep healthy boundaries though.

Hmmm, with normal people, I'd agree with this. BIL/SIL are pieces of work, however, and their reasons for cutting contact were "retribution". Its a long story, but it had nothing to do with boundaries re the children (though it conveniently helped that issue for them).


Do your ILs just not enjoy children generally? .

FIL didn't have a great childhood and was not a good father to DH/BIL, so hmmm, no, I don't think he enjoys children. sMIL likes *her* grandsons, seems irritated by my girls (though more interested than FIL).



One thought--do you think it would be at all worthwhile to encourage your girls to cultivate a common interest with their GPs? Do they enjoy golf, sewing, biking, whatever?

We have tried this. FILs expectations, in particular, are unrealistic. My DD#1 is 7 and rocks single black diamond ski runs at Whistler. But, no, she can't (yet) ski a double black at Whistler and that irritates FIL. WTF? She's 7, jerk. He never compliments her on that or anything (I mean, come on, even DH wasn't skiing blacks at Whistler at 7). I've tried to get the girls to do stuff that sMIL likes, though I'm not sure exactly what she *does* like, other than b!tching about BIL/SIL.


re: the gift giving, can your Dh tell his parents your kids really don't need gifts,

Well, I think this is the problem. They judge DH and I and think we buy them too much stuff, so they will compensate by giving them nothing. And the girls notice, particularly DD#1 (her love language = gifts). Its hard to describe the situation.

For example, FIL and sMIL will take the girls to a TOY store, buy toys for sMIL's other grandsons and buy nothing for my girls. Nada. Not even a trinket. Now, don't get me wrong, my girls don't actually *need* toys, but I think its pretty mean to take children to a specialty toy store and buy them nothing -- especially if you are buying for other children and money is not an issue. I dunno, its hard to type out that story without it sounding greedy. Its not about that. I spotted this behavior a while back and now even DH is noticing it.

Sigh. It just sucks.

[jenfromnj]

Hmmm, with normal people, I'd agree with this. BIL/SIL are pieces of work, however, and their reasons for cutting contact were "retribution". Its a long story, but it had nothing to do with boundaries re the children (though it conveniently helped that issue for them).



FIL didn't have a great childhood and was not a good father to DH/BIL, so hmmm, no, I don't think he enjoys children. sMIL likes *her* grandsons, seems irritated by my girls (though more interested than FIL).




We have tried this. FILs expectations, in particular, are unrealistic. My DD#1 is 7 and rocks single black diamond ski runs at Whistler. But, no, she can't (yet) ski a double black at Whistler and that irritates FIL. WTF? She's 7, jerk. He never compliments her on that or anything (I mean, come on, even DH wasn't skiing blacks at Whistler at 7). I've tried to get the girls to do stuff that sMIL likes, though I'm not sure exactly what she *does* like, other than b!tching about BIL/SIL.



Well, I think this is the problem. They judge DH and I and think we buy them too much stuff, so they will compensate by giving them nothing. And the girls notice, particularly DD#1 (her love language = gifts). Its hard to describe the situation.

For example, FIL and sMIL will take the girls to a TOY store, buy toys for sMIL's other grandsons and buy nothing for my girls. Nada. Not even a trinket. Now, don't get me wrong, my girls don't actually *need* toys, but I think its pretty mean to take children to a specialty toy store and buy them nothing -- especially if you are buying for other children and money is not an issue. I dunno, its hard to type out that story without it sounding greedy. Its not about that. I spotted this behavior a while back and now even DH is noticing it.

Sigh. It just sucks.

OK, from your response to the comments above, it really does seem like they aren't very nice grandparents. Not even simply uninterested, but not very nice at all! And the fact that sMIL is so different toward her own bio grandchildren, makes it so much worse somehow, IMO--not to sound harsh, and I'm sorry if I do, but it almost seems as if she's decided that your DDs just aren't worth the effort. (I know how that feels, and it does suck in a huge way. I feel for my DS in that he totally lost the grandparent lottery.)

It seems so mean to take a grandchild you rarely see, to a toy store, and buy toys for your OTHER grandchildren, while they get nothing, even though you have the means to get them something. Ouch. We have a similar issue here, where their other grandchildren get a ton of expensive holiday gifts, while DS does not. This year I fear he will be old enough to really notice at 2.5, and I am already laying down the law with DH that this will NOT go down in DS's presence--if those jerks want to be so inequitable, that's their perogative, I suppose, but my kid is not going to have to sit there on Christmas and see the inequity.

And your FILs expectations of your DD seem so outrageous! I can imagine having a grandparent like that could do a number on a child's self-esteem. It's a shame that they can't even find it in their hearts to share the joy of something they love to do, but have to ruin it with being jerks.

From everything you've said, I think that limited to no contact with them might be the best, safest route. Not prohibiting contact necessarily, if that's not something you and YH are comfortable with, but I would not go out of my way, nor make it easy for them to spend time with your DDs. It really does stink, but at this point, it seems like the best thing you can do is to just make sure your daughters aren't continually hurt or made to feel worthless/bad/unimportant by them.

I'm sorry, and I hope things work out as well as they can.

[Seitvonzu]

uck. i don't like that toy store story one little bit.... no i don't i don't care if your girls ARE spoiled...that's just mean. it's plain favoritism and your kids are getting old enough to notice. it's amazing to me when GROWN ups act like the spoiled brats! ick. :( (i know what you mean about these sort of examples sounding greedy, but i totally *get it* -- i have SO many stories that sound like this about my inlaws)

we have a little bit of that favoritism issue going on in our own family, but not to that degree. i don't think i'd cut off contact completely, but i don't think i'd be sending my child(ren) to visit without me. that would be my boundry. they are welcome to visit (when it's a good time for my family), and we would make an effort occasionally to see them (not very often, but sometimes, IF we were welcome....if not, we would not)....but i wouldn't send my kiddo for a solo visit! no way! *hugs* mama!

[bubbaray]

Thanks ladies. Thanks for understanding the toy store thing. It sounds so petty and DH and I are sure that the ILs would totally take it as petty -- but, honestly, its just MEAN.

[m448]

on my phone but the toy story thing is heartbreaking and absolutely the type of thing to set a boundary on. Your kids notice and the gps do not deserve to trample over their feelings in the name of "blood relations". like someone else mentioned better less/no contact than mistreatment and wasted second chances.

[hillview]

Thanks ladies. Thanks for understanding the toy store thing. It sounds so petty and DH and I are sure that the ILs would totally take it as petty -- but, honestly, its just MEAN.

That is beyond mean. I would not put my kids in that situation. If that is who they are (aka it is not an unusual situation) I'd limit interactions.

[bubbaray]

Thank you so much. These people make me crazy and I'm constantly wondering if my judgment is clouded b/c I just don't like them, KWIM?

[maestramommy]

Well, I think this is the problem. They judge DH and I and think we buy them too much stuff, so they will compensate by giving them nothing. And the girls notice, particularly DD#1 (her love language = gifts). Its hard to describe the situation.

For example, FIL and sMIL will take the girls to a TOY store, buy toys for sMIL's other grandsons and buy nothing for my girls. Nada. Not even a trinket. Now, don't get me wrong, my girls don't actually *need* toys, but I think its pretty mean to take children to a specialty toy store and buy them nothing -- especially if you are buying for other children and money is not an issue. I dunno, its hard to type out that story without it sounding greedy. Its not about that. I spotted this behavior a while back and now even DH is noticing it.

Sigh. It just sucks.

Okay, that just sounds nasty. You know, like they're doing it out of spite. I mean, if they think you and your Dh buy too much, then just buy nothing! don't bring them on the toy store trips! Why go out of their way to put your kids down. It's just mean. and petty. Ugh.

[hillview]

Thank you so much. These people make me crazy and I'm constantly wondering if my judgment is clouded b/c I just don't like them, KWIM?

I know what you mean and it is not you it is them. They have issues. It is almost like the toy experience it to teach them a lesson etc. Nasty complicated stuff. Limit what you can IMO. Sorry that is a real stinker.

[SpaceGal]

Those GPs are awful. That toy store crap I wouldn't put up with. Spoiled or not you don't do that. It's one thing if they took them and didn't buy anything for anyone...but to buy for other kids and not the two they bring that's me. And you aren't coming off as greedy...they are screwed up. Like my mom doesn't find toys practical so on her own she won't buy too many toys. But she will take them when she visits...and if we go and don't see anything special no one gets anything...it's an all or nothing. They sound like awful awful spiteful mean people. I'd keep your kids from them just because they'd just feel bitter over time and why let them feel that way. Not for nothing what kid doesn't equate love with gifts...that's how most kids are.

Yeah I have to say when I find that the GPs don't care I don't bother to try to get them to be involved. If their hearts are not in developing a relationship with the kids then oh well. You only get what you give. And it's not about the gifts...just the time and attention. DH and his parents haven't spoken for 2.5 years now. Prior to that, they only called on bdays and holidays. No cards nothing. My FIL doesn't even really know DS2's name...so I just gave up. Just a gesture of kindness, thought or something. WE have friends or even DH's former clients that think about our kids more than his parents do. We have long given up trying to get them involved...it takes two, and oh well.

Sadly my kids only have my mom to be the grandparent. It's been an up and down road. But in the end she does show them she cares and they like talking to her on the phone and ask her when will she see them and what not. She's not the most kid-friendly person but she tries and I've learned to accept that. I'm sure over time she'll find her way and the kids will figure out how they want to have a relationship with her....that's something for them to forge together. We're just here to support and make sure that the kids are ok.

[kozachka]

Thanks ladies. Thanks for understanding the toy store thing. It sounds so petty and DH and I are sure that the ILs would totally take it as petty -- but, honestly, its just MEAN.

:yeahthat: Totally mean, and something that an older child would remember for the rest of his/her life. It's one thing not to approve of spending a lot of money on toys, it's another to buy toys for one set of grandkids and not the other, and bring the 'spoiled' ones along. If they think that your kids don't need any more toys (I think that's why they did not buy them any), then why bring them to the store? Just go there yourself, without kids, and buy for the other grandkids. Or better yet do it online, so that packages/bags don't even make it home. Mean, mean, mean... I am getting upset for your DC just reading your posts! I'd feel like biting ILs heads off. And WTF with FIL and black diamond not being enough?

[randomkid]

Just getting back to this and the toy store thing is just awful. See? This is exactly why we cut off relations with DH's aunt and the rest of that side of the family. DSDs didn't even want anything other than to see her and spend time with her and she didn't show up. DH would tell the girls that he invited their aunt over to Grandma's house when they were there because they would always ask if they could see her when they were going to visit Grandma. To have their aunt repeatedly not show up I'm sure made the girls feel like she didn't care about them at all. We were done with them getting hurt over and over so we gave up. It was hard on them at first, but in the long run, they are better for it. They didn't have to suffer the disappointment and heartache in a fresh new way all the time. The old heartache is still there, but the sting is not. I think it totally sucks when adults are deliberately mean and passive aggressive towards kids because all the kids want is to be loved.

[dogmom]

Thank you so much. These people make me crazy and I'm constantly wondering if my judgment is clouded b/c I just don't like them, KWIM?

Oh no, you are not crazy. The toy store thing makes me want to go over their house and dopes slap them. Really, that's just mean, petty and borderline abusive.

[sste]

Your judgment is fine. They are dysfunctional ogres.

That said, if your girls and your DH want to maintain some ties with them, do the GPs have ANY strength to play to? Any setting they are good or at least OK in?

Obviously them taking the girls places alone is out as they are untrustworthy, shopping is clearly hot-button, as is skiing. They aren't giving you alot to work with. But, is there some setting that you think they might do OK in? Do they have any interpersonal strengths or good qualities you can capitalize on?

[ShanaMama]

Thanks ladies. Thanks for understanding the toy store thing. It sounds so petty and DH and I are sure that the ILs would totally take it as petty -- but, honestly, its just MEAN.

No, it's really not petty. Who does that? Unless they are trying to be cruel then what exactly are they thinking?
My kids have limited contact with both sets of grandparents cuz DH & I each have issues with our respective parents. My kids love all of their grandparents & I think that's a pretty good outcome. Since my kids are not being raised by their grandparents, the issues that bother us aren't apparent to my kids. I am hesitant to leave my children there unsupervised but not because I am afraid for their safety.
I don't speak badly of the gparents to my kids. I figure they will pick up on the nuttiness as it becomes apparent to them & just not enjoy spending time with those people (& therefore choose not to). In my case things are much more sublte than yours.