S/O Dual career families - spouse and work travel

[BabbyO]

If you both work FT and your careers/salaries have approximately equal importance, how often does your spouse travel for work?

DH just informed me that he has another work trip that he has to book in the next month or so. This will be his 4th scheduled trip for the year.

It used to be that he had 1 wk/yr. This week was/is total h3ll on me because I WOTH FT and my boss has become less flexible AND I have a 1 hr commute each way AND we had to start daycare at a center that doesn't allow the kids to be there more than 10 hrs AND I have to be in the office each day for 9 hrs because I'm pumping. So if you do the math, I can't possibly make it all work. It is further complicated by the fact that I can only take vacation days in 1/2 day increments and I don't have much vacation time to begin with because the kids were crazy sick this year after we started at daycare.

We have family that is an hour away...but everyone works FT so I can't get help from them really.

I'm just sick of the number of trips and I know it is good for DH because he is getting more responsibility, but I just don't know how to do this anymore. He still makes less than me, but he is in a position of higher authority and has more room to grow in his position.

I couldn't even finish the conversation with him about this newest trip because I was so angry and frustrated and I just wanted to cry at the thought of yet another week where I'll be receiving passive aggressive hostile stares from my boss...and dealing with 2 kids 3 or under on my own while trying to make all the pieces fit together nicely.

Sorry, I don't mean to whine. I guess I'm just wondering if I'm being unreasonable in wishing that he didn't have this much travel. FWIW - for the first 8 yrs he didn't travel at all. I've travelled 2x in 4 years and both times were under 1 week.

[khalloc]

DH and I both work FT. DH makes about 3x what I make and he travels quite a bit. My job is 37.5 hours a week. When he is gone the added challenge I have to my workday is that I have to wait with DD for the bus, which means I get to work 20-30 late. I guess I try to make that up on my lunch break, but not always. My boss is super nice and has never mentioned it.

[mommylamb]

I'm so sorry. That sounds like an awful situation. How do you make that work?? Any family in the area who can help out? Besides for how difficult that is with the travel, I'm angry for you that your office is requiring you to be there for 9 hrs every day because you're pumping. I mean, do they pay attention to how often other people take breaks for whatever it is they're doing? I'm pumping at work too right now, and I can't even imagine how difficult it would be if I had to abide by those rules.

To answer your question, I'm fortunate in that my DH doesn't have to travel for work (or hasn't yet in his current job. He has been there since September.). I travel for work from time to time, though most of the time the trips are short-- either long day trips or overnight one night. Once a year, I travel for 5-7 days for our big annual meeting. It's coming up in August and I'm dreading it, especially because I'm breastfeeding. I'm trying to make it as short as possible (5 days away) and hopefully DS2 will still want to breastfeed when I get back. DH will be home with DS2 while I'm away, but my parents are taking DS1 with them while I'm gone.

[niccig]

No experience with the travel, but could you see if one of the day care staff would be willing to pick up some extra hours that week by taking the kids home? Next semester I'll have classes that finish at 7pm and DS's aftercare closes at 6pm. I talked with the director of aftercare and she thinks one of the counsellors or even her will be interested in taking DS home and I pay them privately.

Just a thought.

[BabbyO]

I'm so sorry. That sounds like an awful situation. How do you make that work?? Any family in the area who can help out? Besides for how difficult that is with the travel, I'm angry for you that your office is requiring you to be there for 9 hrs every day because you're pumping. I mean, do they pay attention to how often other people take breaks for whatever it is they're doing? I'm pumping at work too right now, and I can't even imagine how difficult it would be if I had to abide by those rules.

To answer your question, I'm fortunate in that my DH doesn't have to travel for work (or hasn't yet in his current job. He has been there since September.). I travel for work from time to time, though most of the time the trips are short-- either long day trips or overnight one night. Once a year, I travel for 5-7 days for our big annual meeting. It's coming up in August and I'm dreading it, especially because I'm breastfeeding. I'm trying to make it as short as possible (5 days away) and hopefully DS2 will still want to breastfeed when I get back. DH will be home with DS2 while I'm away, but my parents are taking DS1 with them while I'm gone.

I can't explain the change that has occurred here. It isn't the place I started working at - a very family friendly employer. Quite frankly, for some reason I have to abide by all the rules to a T but none of the other employees really have to. I won't go into what all led to this but lets just say a crazy insane set of circumstances beyond my control led to me having a microscope on me for everything. Just last week, I counted 3 days where 2 other people in my exact position were in after 8:30, gone before 5 and took at least a 1/2 hr lunch. I pump 3x/day for 20-30 min and take my computer into the office I pump in and work, but I have to be here 9 hrs.

The last time DH was gone daycare was pretty understanding and allowed the kids to be there for more than 10 hrs...but we thought it was the only time it was going to happen this year. Now I'm looking at 3 more times.

Our closest family is an hour away...and they work FT, too. I'll figure something out. Last time I asked to work from home for 1 day and it was like I'd asked my boss to send me on a paid vacation...

[codex57]

Changed divisions, so now it looks like about 4 weeks out of the year.

[#2ontheway]

If you are being held to a different standard than your colleagues due to pumping, that sounds a bit like discrimination based on sex.

[rin]

Can you hire someone to do either the morning routine or the evening routine for you?

About 5 years ago, before I had kids, one of my friends' husbands regularly had to travel out of the country for up to 3 weeks for work. She worked full-time as well, and when he was out of town they would pay me (well, actually we traded labor, so he did a bunch of yard work projects for us) to come feed the kids breakfast, get them dressed, and drive them to daycare. I think it was about 2 hours/day; not sure what I would've charged cash but imagine that something like that might make your life so, so much more bearable when he's gone.

Could you ask around to see if anyone has any recommendations for a part-time occasional nanny?

[♥ms.pacman♥]

If you are being held to a different standard than your colleagues due to pumping, that sounds a bit like discrimination based on sex.

:yeahthat:

i dont' get why you have to be there 9 hours if you are WORKING during your pumping sessions. that makes no sense at all!!

i think you mentioned you are in engineering? what field? I am an EE and i've always been a bit wary about returning to FT work, which i hope to do in the next year or so. Part of the reason i stayed a SAHM for so long is that engineering is not very nursing-friendly (no private offices, mostly cubicles..mostly male dominated, etc etc).

my DH travels for work a lot (usually 1 week a month, but lately it's gonna be more like 3 weeks/month), we have no family in town to help... but i currently SAH, so it's a different situation (though many days i long to sit in a office all day instead of dealing with non-napping cranky kiddos :bag). I do plan on returning to work soon and i'm guessign it will be other challenges when DH travels, especially getting 2 kids ready and out to the door on time, etc.

[AnnieW625]

DH maybe 2 weeks a year, and that is a lot and if he does it is never two weeks in a row. I think last year he was gone a week total. We are both blessed to have that option.

For me I don't ever have to travel.

[twowhat?]

DH and I make within 15K of each other (he makes more). We both travel, averaging 1-2 times a month. I just started this new job (that has a greater travel requirement) so it's going to be a bit of a juggling act. But I am fortunate in that I work from home, so no commute other than daycare drop-off/pickup, and my travel is typically 1 or 2 nights.

The 9 hrs because you are pumping is some serious bullsh*t and I might actually make a stink about that - I mean they are already giving you stink-eye for pumping, which is ridiculous. YES you can work while you pump and should not be forced to stay at work longer. Is there a way you could politely ask to telecommute on the days your DH travels? Or at least shorten your workday and then make up the hours after the kids are in bed? That just sounds awful:( The idea PP had about paying someone at the daycare for extra hours is a good one too - it just doesn't sound workable without some sort of hired help, or your boss's willingness to be more flexible.

[kozachka]

DH is gone out of the country about 50% of the time. Typically he is gone for 4-5 weeks, and then is here for the same amount of time. When DH is not here, I am in charge of everything to do with DS and the house except serious cooking (DH cooks and freezes soups and main courses, I take care of pasta/ rice/ vegetable sides). I do not travel for work, and am not on the clock at work. As long as job gets done I have quite a bit of flexibility as to when I come and go and when I get my work done. Some people might give me an evil eye when I walk in way past 9:00 am but nobody blinks an eye when I leave at 5:15 pm to pick DS from after-school care by 6:00 pm. I do catch up on work after DS gets asleep and regularly send out emails/documents at 11 pm.

I am not going to lie, even though I have a super-flexible job, it is a struggle with all the activities, therapy appointments and school events, but I just made peace with the fact that we'd be late/miss some of those. It took time to figure out our schedule, and get good aftershool care coverage (center + babysitters for when I run late), and DS even got kicked out from on school center for me picking him late (by a few mins) more than allowed in the contract, i.e. 4 times per school year. I am trying to figure out what to do next career-wise and the fact that DH travels this much is totally limiting my choices, so I resent this set-up, but try not to think about it.

In your situation, you have the following options, or a combination of thereof:
- Get help with kids
- Work less hours in the office
- Not have DH travel and limit his upward mobility
- Get another job/move departments/bosses

Either way, there will be tradeoffs, and/or costs involved. I know it's not easy, but you simply can not manage under the set of circumstances you outlined.

[dhano923]

I only travel for 3-4 days a year, for an annual convention. DH travels fairly often, like 9-10 weeks a year. Usually they are 2-4 day domestic trips, but he occasionally has to go international for 10-14 days at a time. I'm lucky that I have a great job with flexibility to come in a little late or leave a little early with no problem. I usually let them know when DH is traveling so they know I may have to adjust my schedule a bit. The kids' child care is on the schools' lot, which is very helpful. A couple times I've asked my SIL to pick up the kids when I couldn't get to the school before child care closed.

[elektra]

DH does maybe 6 trips a year ranging from 4-7 days. I do 4 work trips a year for 3-4 days. He also does not participate in any of the morning or evening childcare routines on a regular basis, as he often gets home right as they are going to bed.
I have to say that the first two years of DS's life (when DD was age 2-4) were a complete drain on me, literally and figuratively. I hung in there BF and pumping for 10 months, but it was very hard to manage everything and that is without a commute. And DH has since gotten a promotion, and I guess his career comes first, but during DS's infancy, I actually made more money and our jobs were more equal.

It has gotten a lot better though as the kids have gotten older and I have gotten more used to the routine.

That sucks that you have that additional job stress though. I had stress as well but I was able to work from home and it just make things much more manageable.

[citymama]

The question should be: how often do you and your spouse travel for work? The months of April and May this year, one of us was gone every week (mostly DH; I did two trips, he did 6!). We obviously have to coordinate work travel schedules and DH is TERRIBLE about realizing more than 5 days ahead of time that he has a trip. And oh, he needs to book air travel, and wow, direct flights are now how much? Argh. That drives me nuts. We have an unspoken pact of making sure we never spend more than 3 days/nights away at a stretch, and we turn down all international travel. (I turned down Sydney and Berlin this year, something that would never have happened pre-kids!). I suspect the int'l travel part will change as the kids grow older, which will bring a whole new set of challenges.

It has fluctuated wildly, but I try and do no more than a trip a month, and usually it works out to about 5-6 trips per year. DH might do twice that number.

[arivecchi]

Op, have you looked into an occasional/emergency sitter? You can search for one at care.com. That's what I am doing now that the kids are in daycare. You could also ask the daycare teachers if they want to do some extra hours as PP suggested and have the teacher bring your kids home at the end of the day. Should not be that expensive. I will be paying $10 an hour for 2 kids.

[janine]

I agree with the others that the staying later to make up for pumping time is odd and not the norm at all. Businesses are now required to give access to lactation rooms and create an environment that promotes it. The whole point is to encourage women to stick it out in the work force (and for other reasons too of course) and to make things easier. Why is it any different than the person who pops out for a cigarette, coffee, fresh air? Pumping should also be something that is private -- it would really bother me (and I am still pumping at work but winding down) if everyone knew my business and was keeping tabs on how long I was pumping for.

Anyway, I remember you mentioning this before so clearly it's an issue - you need to raise it with HR. Although re-reading your post I think it's a combination of things going on and you have been stretched/frustrated with this set up (commuting, working, daycare) for some time. I think you probably need to confront it and talk to DH about options because something has to give...it should be getting easier now, not harder.

[ha98ed14]

It used to be that he had 1 wk/yr. This week was/is total h3ll on me because I WOTH FT and my boss has become less flexible AND I have a 1 hr commute each way AND we had to start daycare at a center that doesn't allow the kids to be there more than 10 hrs AND I have to be in the office each day for 9 hrs because I'm pumping. So if you do the math, I can't possibly make it all work. It is further complicated by the fact that I can only take vacation days in 1/2 day increments and I don't have much vacation time to begin with because the kids were crazy sick this year after we started at daycare.
...
I'm just sick of the number of trips and I know it is good for DH because he is getting more responsibility, but I just don't know how to do this anymore. He still makes less than me, but he is in a position of higher authority and has more room to grow in his position.



I can't explain the change that has occurred here. It isn't the place I started working at - a very family friendly employer. Quite frankly, for some reason I have to abide by all the rules to a T but none of the other employees really have to. I won't go into what all led to this but lets just say a crazy insane set of circumstances beyond my control led to me having a microscope on me for everything.

First off, big hugs. I can only imagine how hard this is on you. You've articulated very well why the status quo is not working; the next step is deciding if you want to push for change. This change could mean a change of position/employers for you and/or DH and/or a renegotiation with DH about how things need to be. There are costs to "rocking the boat" at work and at home, but there are also costs, mostly borne by you, to not changing something. If somethin's gotta give, you may have to give it a little shove.

I don't know what those crazy circumstances were turned your boss into a jackhole, but from your description, I anticipate that if anything like that ever happened again, you would be out of a job and since you make more, that would be the worst news.

One's decision to push for change (or not) can depend a lot of personality, how confrontational you are. Because you said, "I don't mean to whine..." It makes me think that you are not likely to complain, but given the situation you describe, *NOW* if the time to complain. If you have not done so already, I would encourage you to both look for a new job AND have a conversation with DH about the reality he seems to be missing (Hello, McFly?).

If you have already done everything possible, then this post may come off as insulting, and if that the case, I apologize. I'm writing this from a perspective that some people, women in particular, just take the beating so others don't have to suffer, but it its so clear you are suffering, and it shouldn't always be you bearing the brunt.

[daisysmom]

For work, my husband probably takes about 20 trips a year (two a month, mostly). Sometimes just overnight 1-2 nights, sometimes longer. And then with the added care of his parents (overnight probably 10 nights so far this year), I am resentful.

But honestly, I see that it really can't be changed. His work puts that expecation on him, so there is no way out. And the combination of how he was raised (family values) and the drama/manipulation that his parents put on him now also requrie him to "choose them" for overnights to get their affairs in order. So my resentment to him really just ups the ante and makes the situation worse. I still do it, honestly, but I am getting better at realizing that this isn't his "choice" truly, and I can't change that, or change him.

So like others have recommended here, I am trying to change my situation and build in more extra care (like having evening sitters built in) or letting our routine those nights slip (we have picnics, no veggies, just have more fun and less structure, no baths, etc.). But it is what it is. I have given up thinking that it was going to change the way I wished it would.

[FTMLuc]

DH job is to travel. He is gone for 4-6 day stretches with 2-3 days at home in between. To make matters worse, his home base is in a different city, so that eats into his days off as well, b/c sometimes he has to leave 1 day earlier if he has early morning start. Therefore, I single parent about 80% of the time. I am grateful that my job does not require me to travel, but I have a 38 mile commute each way, which on a good day is about 60-70 minutes, but those are few and far between. This week, it has been 2 hours each way. What is helping us is having daycare close to my work. It totally stinks that DD spends 3+ hours in the car each day, but as of right now we don’t have any other choice. It gives me peace of mind having her close, especially is she gets sick at daycare or there is an accident (she is a fearless little monkey), I am able to be there in 10 min vs 1+ hours. It also stinks that if I am sick, I can’t just send DD to daycare and stay home to recover, b/c if I am making a trek to drop her off, might as well go to work. Of course this is not ideal, but is has worked so far. I am also going to talk to my boss today to see if can shift my hours by 1 hour, to start at 7 AM to bypass some of the traffic craziness. I am feeling guilty doing it, b/c I’ll have to wake up DD before 6 am, but it is better then getting home at 7 pm after 2+ hour ride. At least we’ll try it for a few weeks and see how it works. I am very lucky that my boss used to be Mr. Mom after he retired from the Air Force, so he is very understanding (Our office has won the boss lottery with him in charge and we all would follow him into the fire).
Although we both have family nearby, it is not much help during workweek with childcare. On my side everyone works FT+ jobs, and FIL is not capable of taking care of DD. We have been thinking about moving closer to work, but are priced out of the towns around my work. Our hope is to move next year, not as close as I’d like, but at least 10-15 miles closer.

Like you I cannot quit my job b/c I am the main breadwinner in the family making more than 2x what DH will make this year. I also love what I do, I just wish I has a 10 min. commute.

When I am single parenting, I do bare minimum of housework, just for DD and I to get by. Laundry can wait until the weekend. DH does all the cleaning on his days off.

[egoldber]

DH travels regularly. Several week long trips per year and many more 1-3 day trips throughout the year. We also have no family in the area.

One of the things that was most stressful about my previous job was that I could not work a full day and be able to do both pick up and drop off. I used a lot of my vacation time or I worked extra on other days to make up the time. I looked for a different job after 2 years because it wasn't sustainable. I now have a much shorter commute and can do drop off and pick up and work a full day. Soooo much less stressful. I also have more flexibility now to work from home.

[BabbyO]

Thank you for all the input. I have been looking for a new job, but just have not gotten any response - probably because I'm limiting my search to 30 min from home and focusing on jobs in our community.

As for the job situation, our HR dept is deplorable and I feel like the entire situation stems from me rocking the boat. I was transferred under a different manager and after 2 mo I couldn't take it anymore. He kept changing the rules on me making it impossible for me to do anything right. I complained and then was transferred under 2 different managers - as in I work for 2 people. One is local and my original boss. The other is in another state. My original boss is the one who is making things really tough. Despite working for him for 2+ years all of the sudden nothing I do is right. I know the 2nd guy I worked for had a lot of bad things to say about me and shared that with my original boss. So now I'm under a microscope. Ironically I pumped for 12 mo with DS1 and never had a single complaint. 2 years later, right before my MA leave I was told by HR that I need to be in the office extra time to account for the time that I pump and that there were concerns about the amount of time I spent pumping when I pumped for DS1. Really??? They waited 2 years to bring it up??? I don't know why it is different than those that take smoke breaks, etc...but in their eyes it is. Also, I've been met with resistance to me working from home when DH was out of town last time.

I know that the solution is to get out of this situation...but I'm just not having any luck so far.

I will have to see if I can get some help for when the DH is out of town. I may have a few leads since college is out.

As for DH...he does understand the pressure that is put on me...and he does try to carry as much of the burden as he can. For example, he took DS1 to the DR twice this week...1 for an ear infection/office visit and again this morning for a 2+ hr allergy appt. He let me take DS2 to his 9 mo well child check because he knows it interrups my day less since we can get 7:15 am appts. He's just crazy busy now, too....and work is being very demanding for him with the added travel.

[Philly Mom]

Have you thought about talking to a lawyer? They are treating you in a deplorable manner and I can imagine how horrid it is to go work for them every day, especially when you have added family responsibilities.

As for the original question, my DH commutes 1.5 hours each way, and leaves before I get up, and travels occassionally (two trips so far this year). This week he left Monday morning before I got up and will be back tonight. During his busiest time, however, I imagine he will stay closer to his job with my parents (they are only 15 mins from his job, my dad works in the same office complex). His busy time lasts about two months straight and there may be other occasional weeks that are so busy he will stay with my parents as well. To be honest, I am not sure how we will do it. I will guess I will have a mother's helper come a couple nights a week and/or help with pick up from daycare.

[BabbyO]

Have you thought about talking to a lawyer? They are treating you in a deplorable manner and I can imagine how horrid it is to go work for them every day, especially when you have added family responsibilities.

I have and everytime I think about it I feel like it would turn into a big "he said, she said" p!ssing match that I don't really want to be a part of. I just don't want that poison in my life. Furthermore, I feel like something like that would seal the deal on my career. What firm/employer would want to hire me after something like that. They would rationalize that I'm just trying to "play the woman card." Especially in this field and in this relatively rural area.

If I felt like going to HR would help I would...but seriously if I bring my concerns up it is clear who complained...I'm the only female around here pumping...and one of the few females around her - the only one in our dept. I said "Complained" for a reason...that is how it would be viewed. Also, I really feel like all of this came about after I asked to be transferred from boss #2

I appreciate all the thoughts....I could use some mojo to make it through DH's trips and in finding a job that is a better fit...so if anyone can spare some...I'd really appreciate it!

[twowhat?]

Sending lots of mojo that you'll soon be able to find a job with a better fit!

[♥ms.pacman♥]

I have and everytime I think about it I feel like it would turn into a big "he said, she said" p!ssing match that I don't really want to be a part of. I just don't want that poison in my life. Furthermore, I feel like something like that would seal the deal on my career. What firm/employer would want to hire me after something like that. They would rationalize that I'm just trying to "play the woman card." Especially in this field and in this relatively rural area.

If I felt like going to HR would help I would...but seriously if I bring my concerns up it is clear who complained...I'm the only female around here pumping...and one of the few females around her - the only one in our dept. I said "Complained" for a reason...that is how it would be viewed. Also, I really feel like all of this came about after I asked to be transferred from boss #2

I appreciate all the thoughts....I could use some mojo to make it through DH's trips and in finding a job that is a better fit...so if anyone can spare some...I'd really appreciate it!

wow, your job current situation sounds so miserable and stressful. sending you tons of mojo that you find something better!!

and i hear you on feeling like your'e under a microscope..engineering is incredibly male-dominated and there's a lot of favoritism (and the opposite, scapegoating, blaming everything on one person, etc). It's difficult to find a family-friendly place that doesn't always look down on you to take time kid-related stuff, bc most of the employees are male and those who have kids often have wives who SAH who take care of everything. The last boss i had, seemed to hate me and a few others, but totally favored this other employee (male) and acted like he could do no wrong. This was BEFORE i had kids and even then it was miserable.. i think i spent every evening b*tching to DH about it before I quit because we decided to move.

[BabbyO]

wow, your job current situation sounds so miserable and stressful. sending you tons of mojo that you find something better!!

and i hear you on feeling like your'e under a microscope..engineering is incredibly male-dominated and there's a lot of favoritism (and the opposite, scapegoating, blaming everything on one person, etc). It's difficult to find a family-friendly place that doesn't always look down on you to take time kid-related stuff, bc most of the employees are male and those who have kids often have wives who SAH who take care of everything. The last boss i had, seemed to hate me and a few others, but totally favored this other employee (male) and acted like he could do no wrong. This was BEFORE i had kids and even then it was miserable.. i think i spent every evening b*tching to DH about it before I quit because we decided to move.

Wow, you hit the nail on the head. Everyone thinks my boss would be more understanding because he has 5 kids...but you're right his wife is a SAHM. Everyone in my dept either has a SAH wife or doesn't have kids....

They certainly don't understand that I'm not only a WOHM, but also the primary bread winner....

As for DH, he's told me to quit several times, but we really can't afford it. There is no way we could cover the bills...and we certainly don't have enough in savings to cover an extended period of unemployment.

[belovedgandp]

I sincerely am sending you lots of good thoughts to get the help you need for the coming trip and a better overall situation.

I just had to share that while not in your situation I totally get what you are saying. I am now a SAHM, but was an engineer and it is a different world. Balancing any other commitments or having priorities that aren't "I'm cool at my job" is frustrating. DH is a software developer and has worked at places that range from super supportive to impossible. Even with me as a SAHM supporting him there were places that truly did not acknowledge his need to see his wife, kids, or have outside interests. For being "professionals" there were several clock watching directors more concerned about hours than results.

[BabbyO]

I sincerely am sending you lots of good thoughts to get the help you need for the coming trip and a better overall situation.

I just had to share that while not in your situation I totally get what you are saying. I am now a SAHM, but was an engineer and it is a different world. Balancing any other commitments or having priorities that aren't "I'm cool at my job" is frustrating. DH is a software developer and has worked at places that range from super supportive to impossible. Even with me as a SAHM supporting him there were places that truly did not acknowledge his need to see his wife, kids, or have outside interests. For being "professionals" there were several clock watching directors more concerned about hours than results.

Thanks for the support. I had no idea how tough this field was on a family. I never minded "putting in my time" and going the extra mile working until 8, 9 10 pm before I had kids...but I spent almost 8 years "putting in my time," now I want to be able to see my kiddos at least 2 hrs/day. Besides, the constant clock watching and hostile environment isn't making me more productive...

[hillview]

I travel about 40% of the time a year (mainly Q1 and q4) DH travels 60% of the time. We make it work. It has been this way since we met so not a new change sort of thing.

[hillview]

PS It sounds like a nanny or some extra help would be great -- is that possible?