How to have a friendly "discussion" with ILs

[theamazingtrace]

Long story short. Left 2 kids in the care of my ILs. They proceed to invite 4 cousins over (whom they frequently babysit). We find out that FIL and MIL drove my 2 kids (7, 6) and 2 of the cousins to the market in their sedan (5 seats), without any carseat/boosters. My petite kids are used to riding in a marathon and frontier. FIL has already been ticketed for driving said 4 cousins in his car. I was appalled and obviously want to say something. There is somewhat of a language/cultural barrier (which usually limits the depth of our conversation), but what would you say/how would you address this? I'm thinking ILs will be more receptive to me than DH, which is why i'm thinking of being the one to address it. TIA.

[roseyloxs]

I am not sure how friendly I would be. He has already received a ticket so he is aware that it is highly illegal and yet he did it again.

I think I would thank them for watching the kids but be firm that they are not allowed to ride in a car without a car seat. For the future I think I would just install seats into their cars every time you have them babysit or switch cars with them so they have the car seats.

[AngB]

Honestly, I would personally tell them flat out that their unsafe decision was unacceptable and that our kids would no longer be left in their care because of their poor judgment. Considering that this is not the first time they've done this (granted, not with your kids, but with kids nonetheless), tells me they don't get it and likely aren't going to no matter what you say. Even getting a ticket for it didn't make them get it. I would wager a guess that the only thing that is going to make them get it is someone getting injured or killed in an accident- which is not a risk I'd be willing to take.

[HannaAddict]

Honestly, I would personally tell them flat out that their unsafe decision was unacceptable and that our kids would no longer be left in their care because of their poor judgment. Considering that this is not the first time they've done this (granted, not with your kids, but with kids nonetheless), tells me they don't get it and likely aren't going to no matter what you say. Even getting a ticket for it didn't make them get it. I would wager a guess that the only thing that is going to make them get it is someone getting injured or killed in an accident- which is not a risk I'd be willing to take.

All of the above. They have been ticketed by a cop and still did it?? They would not have unsupervised time for a long time. This isn't a harmless preference or parenting "style" choice of too much TV, this is a matter of life a d death. I would be very polite but firm, strong and no nonsense. I'm sorry this happened, my kids would have been very upset at no seats and I think my oldest would have flat out refused - he is my rules guy and cautious.

[TwinFoxes]

All of the above. They have been ticketed by a cop and still did it?? They would not have unsupervised time for a long time. This isn't a harmless preference or parenting "style" choice of too much TV, this is a matter of life a d death. I would be very polite but firm, strong and no nonsense. I'm sorry this happened, my kids would have been very upset at no seats and I think my oldest would have flat out refused - he is my rules guy and cautious.

:yeahthat: "Friendly" would not have crossed my mind! Apparently neither you nor the police can convince him to use car seats. I'd be very upset.

[curiousgeorge]

Gosh. What a nightmare. Sorry to hear you are dealing with this. I just couldn't feel good about leaving my kids in the care of people like that again, whether or not they are relatives.

If I'm reading it correctly, not only did they not have car seats for anyone, they didn't even have seatbelts for everyone if it was a five-passenger car with six passengers in it, right?

For me, it would be a very short conversation and probably not very friendly. Something like, "Thanks for watching the kids, but it isn't happening again anytime soon due to your complete lack of judgment." For me, safety is non-negotiable.

[♥ms.pacman♥]

All of the above. They have been ticketed by a cop and still did it?? They would not have unsupervised time for a long time. This isn't a harmless preference or parenting "style" choice of too much TV, this is a matter of life a d death. I would be very polite but firm, strong and no nonsense. I'm sorry this happened, my kids would have been very upset at no seats and I think my oldest would have flat out refused - he is my rules guy and cautious.

:yeahthat:

that is crazy that even after a cop ticketing them they still continued to do it. and as someone else mentioned, the sedan has only 5 seats, so someone went without a seatbelt even! i would not just be "polite" if it were me.

[123LuckyMom]

I agree with roseylox. I believe in preserving personal relationships, so I would not flat out refuse to let my children be in their care again. I would, however, make absolutely sure that you install seats into their car every time your DC stay with them, whether or not they are planning an outing. Show them how to buckle the seats, and remind them that it is the law. You don't want them to be arrested for child endangerment and thrown into jail. (Okay, so maybe that wouldn't happen, but in my mind, it should, and it couldn't hurt for them to think there might be dire consequences to THEM, since they don't seem to accept that there could be dire consequences for the kids.). What happens with the cousins is up to their parents. Also, I would be clear that if the children do ride without their seats again, you will have to limit their visits so that there is no chance for car travel. Good luck! It's soooo hard when people just refuse to grasp that there are real dangers associated with their behavior!

[brittone2]

I would not leave the children unsupervised in their care from here on out, and if they ask why I'd tell them that the carseat issue (X2) was a deal breaker.

[arivecchi]

I would not leave the children unsupervised in their care from here on out, and if they ask why I'd tell them that the carseat issue (X2) was a deal breaker.:yeahthat: Not worth the risk - whether we are talking about family or not.

[hellokitty]

Honestly, I would personally tell them flat out that their unsafe decision was unacceptable and that our kids would no longer be left in their care because of their poor judgment. Considering that this is not the first time they've done this (granted, not with your kids, but with kids nonetheless), tells me they don't get it and likely aren't going to no matter what you say. Even getting a ticket for it didn't make them get it. I would wager a guess that the only thing that is going to make them get it is someone getting injured or killed in an accident- which is not a risk I'd be willing to take.

This. I could totally imagine my parents doing this. Even after getting ticketed. They act like they don't understand why I won't let my kids stay with them and it's because I don't trust my dad not to pull this sort of stunt and to top it off he is a really bad driver I don't even feel safe as a passenger in his car. He believes that he is always right (and he is a Ped, you'd think he knew better, but he no, he will argue against me, just for the sake of arguing). I would have no problems pulling babysitting privileges all together. If fil is that reckless, this is a red flag to me that he has poor decision making skills. I wouldn't want to put my children at risk again. They may promise they won't do it again. However, I would not believe them. Hey did it twice and that's only the times they wee CAUGHT doing it! It is not too harsh to tell them they are no longer allowed to watch the children alone.

Is there some dementia going on or is this just how they are? With my dad, it's just the way he is. However, I think for most ppl if they are normally good decision makers, then maybe this is a sign of early dementia. Also, don't confront them. Have your dh do the talking. Otherwise they will blame you for this and I hope your dh stands up for you and agrees that this isn't some minor issue. Make sure he is on the same page, so his parents don't convince him that you guys are making a big deal out of nothing.

[gatorsmom]

I would not leave the children unsupervised in their care from here on out, and if they ask why I'd tell them that the carseat issue (X2) was a deal breaker.


:yeahthat: I think you have to be firm. If they want to see the kids, they will have to come over to your house to visit. No more of dropping the kids off at their house because they cannot be trusted to transport the children safely.

I think if you showed them a few YouTube videos of crash test dummies and showed them some articles about what happens to kids when they are unrestrained in the car, they might get it.

[theamazingtrace]

Thanks for the input. My SIL is *much* less safety-conscious when it comes to carseats/boosters, so i'm assuming that they were just doing what they normally do with the cousins. When we dropped them off, the understanding was that they were going swimming in the pool (which also made me nervous, but that's another thread). The trip to the market must've been spontaneous, or they just failed to inform us of their plans to take the kids out. And yes, they transported 12 yr old niece in the front, FIL drove, and DD7, DD6, DN5 and MIL sat in the back. No idea how seatbelts were used. Really blows my mind because MIL is super paranoid/high strung about certain safety issues yet completely clueless about others.

[boilermakermom]

For me, it would be a very short conversation and probably not very friendly. Something like, "Thanks for watching the kids, but it isn't happening again anytime soon due to your complete lack of judgment." For me, safety is non-negotiable.

Exactly. Safety is a huge issue with me. If they can't or won't follow the rules on this, then I can only imagine what other things they would find acceptable. Watching the kids would not be an option.

[speo]

This is mostly a deal breaker for me also.

But I am wondering if you explicitly told them to not drive the kids around? If I told them and they still drove, then I would definitely not let them babysit. But if you knew that they like to drive kids around and didn't tell them not to then maybe it was all normal to them, safety issues aside. Would they follow your instructions if you told them that they absolutely cannot drive the kids under any circumstances? I guess if they would follow that and they otherwise were safe I would *consider* letting them still watch the kids. These would be the thoughts I would have if I were in your situation. It is hard!

[Giantbear]

This would not be a friendly discussion if it were me, it would be very graphic with pictures and threats. I will not tolerate such blatant disregard for my child's safety. When my parents or in-laws watch dd, we leave them a car with a car seat to use in emergency or i put the car seat in their car.

[NJ_Mom2011]

When my parents or in-laws watch dd, we leave them a car with a car seat to use in emergency or i put the car seat in their car.

I am with Giantbear. People can be so lazy, but if you provided the child seat pre-installed, it probably won't happen again.

The truth of the matter here: your in-laws are showing extremely poor and dangerous judgment, and other foolish behavior probably is occuring. This is a difficult situation, but you are in the right, and your issue is not minor. Stay strong, and don't feel bad about hurt feelings, as your instincts are right, and you as mother hen need to do what's needed for your little ones.

I am not a big fan of getting your husband involved, as for me, this message is too important to be watered down. If you are considered the heavy, well, is that such a bad thing when the issue is your children's safety? I could live with that reputation. This dustup will probably give you good training when your kids are teenagers, and you have to say no to all the crazy things that teens dream of.

[AnnieW625]

Honestly, I would personally tell them flat out that their unsafe decision was unacceptable and that our kids would no longer be left in their care because of their poor judgment. Considering that this is not the first time they've done this (granted, not with your kids, but with kids nonetheless), tells me they don't get it and likely aren't going to no matter what you say. Even getting a ticket for it didn't make them get it. I would wager a guess that the only thing that is going to make them get it is someone getting injured or killed in an accident- which is not a risk I'd be willing to take.

:yeahthat: I also think that if you are going to leave your kids with your ILs that the carseats are installed in their cars before you leave. Good luck!

[brittone2]

I understand the idea of installing the seats as eliminating an obstacle to the ILs using them, but I guess that's assuming they'd use them properly. Straps not twisted, buckles at the correct level, etc. If they aren't concerned about carseat use after a traffic stop and now the fallout from the most recent incident, I would be hesitant to trust that they have an interest in using the seats correctly. Certainly being in a seat is a good thing, but if they've brushed off seat use after a traffic stop, would you be confident they'll bother to use the seats appropriately? My parents are well-meaning, and we always install the seats in their car, but it took a few times of me having to gently remind them that the straps can't be twisted, etc. when they first started taking the kids places without us. This was long ago in their grandparenting journey though...they are with it now :) They care, but it just wasn't something they were really tuned into. They are receptive and are good about it now. My DS1 and DD would also remind them if they did have DS2's straps twisted. But someone who doesn't see the point of a carseat may not be all that diligent about using the seats appropriately.

[kbud]

After seeing the ages of the kids and the fact that there is a cultural differences, not to mention the SIL not much into safety I would work on educating them.

Leave them with seats (even boosters at that age) and show them how to use them. Communicate with them that the kids must ride in the seats at all times.

I don't think of it as such a big deal as many of the pp given the circumstances. Preserving family relations and grandparent bonds are very important as is safety. I honestly think they are many in law issues due to moms not giving in-laws and chance.

A friendly discussion with specif details to be followed in the future are what is needed. If that doesn't work well then maybe another path is needed.

[crl]

See, I'd assume that even if you installed carseats, they would take them out to fit all the kids. I would not bother with a conversation at all because I don't see what good it would do--not like talking with them would change my min and it would probaby be ugly. I just wouldn't let them have the kids alone again.

Catherine

[brittone2]

After seeing the ages of the kids and the fact that there is a cultural differences, not to mention the SIL not much into safety I would work on educating them.

Leave them with seats (even boosters at that age) and show them how to use them. Communicate with them that the kids must ride in the seats at all times.

I don't think of it as such a big deal as many of the pp given the circumstances. Preserving family relations and grandparent bonds are very important as is safety. I honestly think they are many in law issues due to moms not giving in-laws and chance.

A friendly discussion with specif details to be followed in the future are what is needed. If that doesn't work well then maybe another path is needed.

I think some people just won't be educated on certain things though. ILs are bright people but have suggested several times we just throw the kids in their Suburban to drive 2 miles to the local diner for breakfast sans carseats. The diner is on a highway, not that it matters really. FIL is very stubborn and even though he understands physics quite well, I suspect he would still be tempted to do whatever he wanted if he thought we wouldn't find out...like "oh those silly parents today..." even if we educated him on carseat safety. It took about 5 years for them to stop asking why DS1 and later DD do ERF. They will ask and ask, but not because they want to know. It is a passive aggressive dig. No amount of information or answering satisfies them. Thankfully now with DS2 they don't ask any longer ;) but I'm sure they *still* grumble about it privately about 7 years after we had the discussion to begin with, kwim? My parents have asked things like that through the years, but when we answer, they get it, and they take in the info and then drop the topic. ILs not so much.

I guess I'm biased as a result. My parents had to be brought up to speed on certain things...they have other grandchildren, but my brothers and SILs have a completely different attitude toward carseat/booster use, those grandkids are older and were raised under different safety standards, etc. My parents are receptive, they listen, they adjust and will do what we ask. MIL is now fairly receptive (she watches my nephews and has learned to work with BIL/SIL's requests), but FIL is very "my way or the highway." Education with him isn't the obstacle. YOu could explain, send links, etc. He's a smart man, but he'd dig in his heels just to prove a point about how he's going to do it his way anyway, kwim? (eta: that's one thing when it comes to sneaking a kid extra cookies...(almost a grandparent privilege if there aren't food allergies or other concerns...) but another thing when it comes to carseat safety, IMO).

[kbud]

I think some people just won't be educated on certain things though. ILs are bright people but have suggested several times we just throw the kids in their Suburban to drive 2 miles to the local diner for breakfast sans carseats. The diner is on a highway, not that it matters really. FIL is very stubborn and even though he understands physics quite well, I suspect he would still be tempted to do whatever he wanted if he thought we wouldn't find out...like "oh those silly parents today..." even if we educated him on carseat safety. It took about 5 years for them to stop asking why DS1 and later DD do ERF. They will ask and ask, but not because they want to know. It is a passive aggressive dig. No amount of information or answering satisfies them. Thankfully now with DS2 they don't ask any longer ;) but I'm sure they *still* grumble about it privately about 7 years after we had the discussion to begin with, kwim? My parents have asked things like that through the years, but when we answer, they get it, and they take in the info and then drop the topic. ILs not so much.

I guess I'm biased as a result. My parents had to be brought up to speed on certain things...they have other grandchildren, but my brothers and SILs have a completely different attitude toward carseat/booster use, those grandkids are older and were raised under different safety standards, etc. My parents are receptive, they listen, they adjust and will do what we ask. MIL is now fairly receptive (she watches my nephews and has learned to work with BIL/SIL's requests), but FIL is very "my way or the highway." Education with him isn't the obstacle. YOu could explain, send links, etc. He's a smart man, but he'd dig in his heels just to prove a point about how he's going to do it his way anyway, kwim? (eta: that's one thing when it comes to sneaking a kid extra cookies...(almost a grandparent privilege if there aren't food allergies or other concerns...) but another thing when it comes to carseat safety, IMO).


Well if her in-laws won't be educated then that is different. Since she wants to have a discussion with them this leads me to believe that there is a chance they will. Granted he got a ticket already but that didn't come from DIL. Maybe they didn't know her views.

Like I said, if it still happens then another route needs to be taken.

[MommyofAmaya]

After seeing the ages of the kids and the fact that there is a cultural differences, not to mention the SIL not much into safety I would work on educating them.

Leave them with seats (even boosters at that age) and show them how to use them. Communicate with them that the kids must ride in the seats at all times.

I don't think of it as such a big deal as many of the pp given the circumstances. Preserving family relations and grandparent bonds are very important as is safety. I honestly think they are many in law issues due to moms not giving in-laws and chance.

A friendly discussion with specif details to be followed in the future are what is needed. If that doesn't work well then maybe another path is needed.

:yeahthat: It sounds like they enjoy having their grandkids over and doing activities with them. I wouldn't necessarily burn that bridge at this point. I would install carseats (or at 5&6, thow in some boosters) in case of emergencies and keep them out of the pool though.

[o_mom]

Leave them with seats (even boosters at that age) and show them how to use them. Communicate with them that the kids must ride in the seats at all times.





I would install carseats (or at 5&6, thow in some boosters) in case of emergencies and keep them out of the pool though.

Even if OP had left seats and even if they were boosters the kids could use themselves, there were still more passengers than seat belts. That means that either two kids used the same seat belt (very dangerous) or someone was unbuckled completely. OP's kids being in boosters will not protect them from an unrestrained passenger and it is unlikely to keep the ILs from taking more passengers than they have room for.

The fact is that the ILs know it is unsafe, they know it is illegal and they still chose to do it. There were obvious alternatives to transporting the kids unsafely (leave one adult at home with some kids, where were the other two cousins?, etc.) - this was not an emergency where they had to evacuate immediately. I think telling them that they cannot transport the children at all is perfectly reasonable. I would also have no problem telling my children that they are NOT to ride with ILs and they are to call me if ILs want to take them somewhere.

I actually think that drawing a firm line now (no transporting the kids) can save an even bigger conflict later where OP has to completely end unsupervised contact because they piled six people into the car again and were miffed because "they used the boosters like you asked" even though they were still unsafe.

[Cuckoomamma]

I highly recommend having your dh handle the conversation.

Our issue was food allergies. ILs fed dd something she was allergic to. I called them and spoke with them and then passed dh the phone. They've never spoken with us again, and it's been almost 6 years now.

Anyone can look at the situation now and say that they had a strange reaction. However, at the time we had zero idea that they would behave that way. It was completely out of the blue, and I'd never confronted them on anything before. They didn't deny what they'd done and FIL just calmly told dh that they never wanted to see any of us again. They sold their house (lived across the street) and moved to be near BIL. Ironically, BIL's children now have food allergies. Even that still hasn't prompted ILs to apologize or ever see our girls again.

Just saying...if things go completely down hill, it's much better if your dh handles that final conversation with his parents.

[MommyofAmaya]

I actually think that drawing a firm line now (no transporting the kids) can save an even bigger conflict later where OP has to completely end unsupervised contact because they piled six people into the car again and were miffed because "they used the boosters like you asked" even though they were still unsafe.

My suggestion was to give them the boosters for emergencies only (like on the way to to hospital for example) but to prohibit transportation otherwise instead of completely ending unsupervised contact now as some PPs have suggested.

I can totally see this going the way of Cuckoomamma's scenario, which must be a difficult one to deal with. :hug: We too have a strained relationship with the IL's these days and DH is always the messenger.

[crl]

I highly recommend having your dh handle the conversation.

Our issue was food allergies. ILs fed dd something she was allergic to. I called them and spoke with them and then passed dh the phone. They've never spoken with us again, and it's been almost 6 years now.

Anyone can look at the situation now and say that they had a strange reaction. However, at the time we had zero idea that they would behave that way. It was completely out of the blue, and I'd never confronted them on anything before. They didn't deny what they'd done and FIL just calmly told dh that they never wanted to see any of us again. They sold their house (lived across the street) and moved to be near BIL. Ironically, BIL's children now have food allergies. Even that still hasn't prompted ILs to apologize or ever see our girls again.

Just saying...if things go completely down hill, it's much better if your dh handles that final conversation with his parents.

How horrible for everyone. :hug: Our outcome was not so dramatic, but our issue was also food allergies.

My MIL tried to give ds pudding, while he was allergic to milk. He refused saying he was allergic. She tried to insist it would be okay. Dh was nearby and had to intervene. This was after me making a big effort to bring lots of safe foods for ds to eat to their house. Plus MIL is a nurse. I insisted to dh that she never be left alone with ds again. We did not bother talking with the ILs about it because I did not think that would change her behavior and the conversation would not have gone well. Instead I made it impossible for her to feed ds foods he was allergic to by preventing her from being alone with him.

And I would take the exact same tactic here. Just block the possibility of any repeats.

Catherine

[o_mom]

My suggestion was to give them the boosters for emergencies only (like on the way to to hospital for example) but to prohibit transportation otherwise instead of completely ending unsupervised contact now as some PPs have suggested.

I can totally see this going the way of Cuckoomamma's scenario, which must be a difficult one to deal with. :hug: We too have a strained relationship with the IL's these days and DH is always the messenger.

I get that, but I still think that even leaving them boosters gives them tacit permission to use them for whatever they think is "emergency". Given that they thought a trip to the market when they could have left one adult home with some of the kids was urgent enough to take them without seats, I don't know that I would trust their judgement. IMO, if there is an emergency that needs to go to the hospital right away, you call 911 and take an ambulance. Most anything else can wait 30-60 min for a parent to come and transport them properly. Unless OP is really out of reach/hours away during the time the ILs have them, there are very few situations I can fathom that would require them to transport the kids.

I hope it doesn't go the way of Cuckoomamma's scenario either. That is really tough. :(

[AngB]

How much education does it take to know not to put 4 people in a backseat meant for 3? For me, that's the bigger isssue than the lack of carseats. They should have known better, whether SIL cares or not, they already got a ticket for it. They got a ticket for it because it's unsafe. If getting a ticket for it wasn't enough to make them think twice before putting too many kids at once in the car, I really doubt there is much you can say to stop them from doing it again. (Why couldn't one of them had stayed home with some of the kids-then there would have at least been a seatbelt per person?)

When I was in high school, I rode in the back of a car (a small sedan) with easily 6 people crammed into the back. It was a very short distance and extremely uncomfortable and even then we were well aware that it was not safe and if we were in an accident, someone would likely be extremely injured or even killed. I was only a freshman but I knew that much. Luckily it was uneventful. It's one thing when you make those decisions to compromise your own safety, but when you are compromising the safety of someone else's kids, and you are old enough to know better, and you've had "warnings" for this issue before from a police officer, it's completely unacceptable.

The car seats aren't really my issue with the age of the kids (not that it wouldn't have been nice if they'd used them, but if that was "all", I'd be willing to have a "friendly discussion" and give them another chance.) If they were 1 and 2, that's another story. I don't see how giving them car seats is going to help when they evidently regularly cram too many people into the car when they could have easily had MIL stay home and then at least have 3 kids in the back and 1 in the front, seat belts for everyone. Unless you want to buy them a car where they can safely fit 5 kids at once, and provide them car seats, then I wouldn't chance it. (Actually, even then, I'd have some concerns about their judgment overall.)

[eh613c]

I highly recommend having your dh handle the conversation.

Our issue was food allergies. ILs fed dd something she was allergic to. I called them and spoke with them and then passed dh the phone. They've never spoken with us again, and it's been almost 6 years now.

Anyone can look at the situation now and say that they had a strange reaction. However, at the time we had zero idea that they would behave that way. It was completely out of the blue, and I'd never confronted them on anything before. They didn't deny what they'd done and FIL just calmly told dh that they never wanted to see any of us again. They sold their house (lived across the street) and moved to be near BIL. Ironically, BIL's children now have food allergies. Even that still hasn't prompted ILs to apologize or ever see our girls again.

Just saying...if things go completely down hill, it's much better if your dh handles that final conversation with his parents.

I agree that you should talk to your ILs but also have your DH talk to them last. I'm curious, how did your DH react when he heard about this incident? Is he not upset/bothered/angry too? Would he react differently if it was your side of the family that did this?

[NJ_Mom2011]

What doesn't bode well is that the in-laws were cavalier about the ticket from the cop, which suggests that they don't take warnings or directions from others seriously. If it weren't for that, I wouldn't be too worked up about the other actions, chocking it to people who are overly stuck in the past. Road safety re. children has altered radically in the last 30 years, and for the in-laws, they are just not keeping up with the times. I guess that I am revealing my age, but I remember in the 1970s, it was not too uncommon for some cars not to have seat belts. I remember piling several children in the back seat too. My father-in-law in the 1980s apparently put my husband as a child in his pickup truck, and then went on the highway with him, not even bothering with some rope. Crazy things occurred many decades ago, and mentally, the in-laws are thinking in those ways. But now, they have had sufficient warnings that the old ways can't be done anymore.

OP has reasonable concerns, and if she isn't headed, then the in-laws can't be left with the children unsupervised. I don't think she has much choice here.

[nmosur]

You mentioned cultural and language barriers - could it be they really didn't really understand why they got the ticket in the fist place. I know a few parents who just blow off my concerns of how important car seats are and think I am crazy to insist that my six year old DD has to use a car seat (no booster as yet). I remember traveling from one city to another with my friends and their less than a year old baby about 15 years back - the baby rode on her mom's lap in the backseat for the whole trip.

[Kira's Mommy]

My parents and my ILs could easily have done the same thing. I strongly believe it's a cultural thing. People STILL don't use car seats in my home country, most believe that "baby is safer in mommy's arms". Forget car seats, people think seat belts are for wussies.

No amount of education will help, in my parents' case. It's the "I raised you without car seats and helmets and you're fine" argument. Moreover, it's the "the whole country X rides without car seats and they're fine" argument.

I know that my mom lets DD eat candy and watch TV when I'm not around even though I asked her not to do that. If I state my car seat rules, I'm not sure she'd listen. If I install the seat in the car, she'd use it but no car seat - no problem. To her it's like candy - no big deal.

Let DH handle the conversation. He knows his parents better.

[theamazingtrace]

just a quick update...

so DH got the story from DDs when he picked them up. Apparently there were only 5 people in the car, but DDs did not have carseats/boosters. There was one seat in the car (for 3 yr old nephew), but they put DN in it, since she was the youngest. I was relieved that the situation wasn't as bad as I thought, but as a result, DH and I have agreed that anytime we leave the kids with ILs, we will install the seats in their car, regardless of whether they have plans to leave the house. When I dropped DDs off that day, I observed the 4 kids exit the car with ILs, so I wouldn't put doing it again past them (does that make sense?). It's unfortunate that the kids won't be spending as much time with the grandparents (without me or DH there, that is), but i know I need to stand firm on this, given the ILs poor judgment when it comes to safety.

thanks for all your input!

[newnana]

I've posted our experience with this on the boards before, but with my IL's, even installing the car seat isn't enough, we still had to have the discussion. There is not a cultural difference for us.

DD was almost one when I went to get her out of grandma's car. DD was in her seat (miraculously) but NOT buckled in. I flipped my chit.

I love that you are going to install the car seats/boosters. I think it's a great idea. Now that DD is older, I wouldn't have to worry about the discussion because she would flip out if she wasn't correctly secured and I've had it a thousand times with both sets of grandparents. It sounds like your kids are the same way.

Good luck!