Is this stealing?

[anonomom]

DD was disciplined at school today for "stealing." Nothing serious -- just got her discipline status downgraded, but she's very upset about the idea that she stole something and I'm trying to figure out how to explain it to her.

Apparently, they used sequins or some such shiny thing today in art class. At the end of class, DD picked a few of the spilled sequins, showed them to some classmates and put them in her coat pocket. Whether it's actually the case or nor, DD believed that the spilled sequins would be vacuumed up and discarded. The classmates told the teacher what she'd done, and the teacher confronted DD. DD showed them what she'd taken and they told her that what she did was stealing.

I take no issue at all with the fact that DD was disciplined -- the teachers have a right to run their class and for all I know, they've been told before not to take art leftovers. But I'm not sure that what she did amounts to stealing. So far, I've told her that I know she didn't think she was doing anything wrong, but if those are the rules then she needs to follow them regardless. She quickly picked up on the fact that I didn't confirm that she stole. Not sure how I communicate to her that while I might not see what she did as stealing, it's not my opinion that matters in the classroom.

[wolverine2]

DD was disciplined at school today for "stealing." Nothing serious -- just got her discipline status downgraded, but she's very upset about the idea that she stole something and I'm trying to figure out how to explain it to her.

Apparently, they used sequins or some such shiny thing today in art class. At the end of class, DD picked a few of the spilled sequins, showed them to some classmates and put them in her coat pocket. Whether it's actually the case or nor, DD believed that the spilled sequins would be vacuumed up and discarded. The classmates told the teacher what she'd done, and the teacher confronted DD. DD showed them what she'd taken and they told her that what she did was stealing.

I take no issue at all with the fact that DD was disciplined -- the teachers have a right to run their class and for all I know, they've been told before not to take art leftovers. But I'm not sure that what she did amounts to stealing. So far, I've told her that I know she didn't think she was doing anything wrong, but if those are the rules then she needs to follow them regardless. She quickly picked up on the fact that I didn't confirm that she stole. Not sure how I communicate to her that while I might not see what she did as stealing, it's not my opinion that matters in the classroom.

No, I wouldn't consider that stealing- unfortunate that they used that word.

[elektra]

"Stealing" seems kind of harsh for art supplies that have fallen on the floor.
Without knowing the exact scenario, and assuming that the teacher really does need these extra art supplies to reuse, even though they seemed like they were discarded to your DD, I feel like the teacher should have just told your DD that they actually still need to reuse those, so it's not ok to take them home, and she should please return them to wherever they originated. End of story- no biggie.

Maybe that is how it went down?


I can see myself telling DD that it doesn't really seem like stealing to me, but if they need to reuse the stuff, I can see why the teacher wants it returned so all the kids can use them for next time. I would tell her not to worry about it and that now she knows for next time.

[Pennylane]

I don't think for a minute she was trying to be sneaky about it but technically it is stealing. I had a similar thing happen to my DS at school except his was for cheating. I freaked out when his daily report had cheating written on it. He was so upset and said all he did was ask a girl to explain a problem to him that he was not understanding. She showed him how to solve it and the teacher overheard. So she told him he was cheating. He did not think it was a big deal since he just didn't understand the question. I emailed the teacher and told her that he was very upset and that we had spoken to him and explained that he could only ask the teacher for help in the future.

Ann

[larig]

I wouldn't consider it stealing--recycling, yes.

[wellyes]

Maybe her definition of spilled is more generous than the teacher's.

I would allow the school to do as they see fit but would not punish at home. Which sounds exactly like what you did. I think you're handling it just right, and don't worry too much about her feeling vindicated by your words. You have conveyed that she has to follow the teacher's rules at school which is exactly right.

[swissair81]

I would be more concerned that she seems to be in a class full of tattletales- and not even for something important. Although I would also be concerned that she has a teacher that is so harsh and black/white seeing.

[mommylamb]

I would want to talk to the teacher about it and find out what happened from the teacher's perspective. If it went down the way your daughter says it went down, I'd be pretty pissed at that teacher for handling it that way. That sounds like a tiny mix up. No need to go accusing the child of doing something nefarious unless there's more to it than that.

[♥ms.pacman♥]

It is not stealing in my book and honestly I'd be shocked if my kid got told they were stealing. Sure, if it was something like a pair of scissors or a bottle of glue, or if it was taken from another student's project..but sequins that fell on the floor? Gimme a break. It would have been one thing to take her aside point out to her that we shouldn't take stuff from the art room, no matter how little and even if it fell on the floor, but to label it "stealing" is going a bit too far, IMO.

The other thing that would annoy me more than the supposed stealing is that her friends tattled on her for this.

[anonomom]

I would be more concerned that she seems to be in a class full of tattletales- and not even for something important. Although I would also be concerned that she has a teacher that is so harsh and black/white seeing.

FWIW, this reaction seems quite atypical for DD's teacher, who has thus far struck me as both reasonable and merciful. Good point about the tattletales, though. That hadn't occurred to me.

[amldaley]

Sorry if I missed this above but are we talking two or three sequins from the floor or a pinch full from the table?

Either way, it is harsh to say that to a child but I do think they how and where of it may make a difference.

Technically, yes, I guess it is stealing b/c the sequins were being taken for other than their intended purpose but good gracious, that may be a hard concept for a kid to understand!

[anonomom]

Sorry if I missed this above but are we talking two or three sequins from the floor or a pinch full from the table?

Either way, it is harsh to say that to a child but I do think they how and where of it may make a difference.

Technically, yes, I guess it is stealing b/c the sequins were being taken for other than their intended purpose but good gracious, that may be a hard concept for a kid to understand!

Looked through her pockets, and I can report that there are two sequins, snowflake shaped. DD says she picked them up off the floor.

[Corie]

Last year, my son brought home a couple of snowflake sequins
because he knew that his big sister would like them. :) I didn't
think anything about it! And I still don't!

[Octobermommy]

Oh my goodness, my dd would be in jail if taking 2 sequins that fell on the floor is stealing. My kids always pick up goodies that they pick up from the ground.

Not even remotely stealing. I might mention it to the teacher if my dd was very upset.

[swissair81]

I'm super aware of when my kids take things that don't belong to them, and that would seriously not even show up on my radar.

[happymom]

That is definitely an overreaction. All the teacher had to say was "Honey, we're not allowed to bring home art supplies even if they were on the floor". Why make a child feel so bad when she was doing something totally innocently? That would really bother me.

[ett]

2 sequins from the floor is not stealing. I can't imagine the teacher having the time to pick up every little piece of art item from the floor. Most likely they would have been vacuumed up.

[hellokitty]

That's not stealing, esp if it was a supply that was going to be vacuumed up and tossed anyway. I'd be annoyed at the girl that tattled on her and the teacher for only looking at it from the tattler's perspective.

[sntm]

I think use of the word stealing is excessive and counter productive. It's like the boy who cried wolf. It's not going to make her more careful in the future, it's going to degrade the term.

[HannaAddict]

Looked through her pockets, and I can report that there are two sequins, snowflake shaped. DD says she picked them up off the floor.

I thought they made her give them back, that might not be how many there were. I think stealing is too harsh, unless they have been specifically told not to take the purloined sequins or other art supplies. Kids are tattle tales, goes with the territory so nothing unusual there at all or to be concerned about. That the kids told makes me think there was a rule in place.

[hbridge]

NOT Stealing if that's the whole story. This spoken by the mother who had her child ask permission before taking a pebble from the school playground :).

[Beth24]

Sounds ridiculous. I would be really pissed off if my child was treated that way and would schedule a meeting with the teacher immediately. It sounds like your DD was shamed and if it happened in front of the class I would consider pursuing it further, especially if after you get all the facts, it happened as described by your DD. That is just not an appropriate way to discipline a child.

[cuca_]

Kids are tattle tales, goes with the territory so nothing unusual there at all or to be concerned about. That the kids told makes me think there was a rule in place.

:yeahthat: I think it is normal for kids that age to tell when there is a rule in place and they see another kid breaking it. If the teacher had previously been emphatic about not taking art supplies, this might have prompted the tattling. I think stealing is definitely harsh, however, I would also consider the probability that the teacher did not directly accuse her of stealing, but maybe said that her actions could be considered stealing in trying to explain why it was not ok to take the sequins. Not ideal, but better than an accusation. You could always email the teacher and just ask her what happened and explain that your DD was upset.

[anonomom]

I don't think there was any intention on the teacher's part to shame DD in front of the class.

Anyway, we were at school for book fair tonight and I mentioned to the teacher that DD was pretty upset. She said that it's a general rule that anything you pick up goes in its place and not your pocket to take home, and that they need to enforce it even if that particular item's "place" is the trash can (and she acknowledged that's where the sequins were headed). While I'm not thrilled with how it was enforced here, I can understand that they have a bright-line rule. And DD seems very willing to move past it.

[KDsMommy]

Glad to hear DD is none the worse for wear. I can understand the hard and fast rule they have in place.

I definitely would not call that stealing though.

[happymom]

Glad to hear DD is none the worse for wear. I can understand the hard and fast rule they have in place.

I definitely would not call that stealing though.

:yeahthat:

[123LuckyMom]

I'm very glad your DD is okay. I think the teacher's rule is just fine, but the word "stealing" is very harsh. I would not have been happy with that word.

[amldaley]

I don't think there was any intention on the teacher's part to shame DD in front of the class.

Anyway, we were at school for book fair tonight and I mentioned to the teacher that DD was pretty upset. She said that it's a general rule that anything you pick up goes in its place and not your pocket to take home, and that they need to enforce it even if that particular item's "place" is the trash can (and she acknowledged that's where the sequins were headed). While I'm not thrilled with how it was enforced here, I can understand that they have a bright-line rule. And DD seems very willing to move past it.

Aww... poor kid. At least you know she's not wasteful! Glad she is so resilient!

[Kungjo]

Seems a bit harsh to call that stealing. I think that if they had a problem with her taking it, then they could have gently explain the situation to her. To call it stealing seems over the top.

I would be annoyed with the teacher for this.