Serious name conflict, anyone?

[boogiemomz]

So, we found out yesterday that this baby is a boy. :D :bighand:

We are so excited for DD to have a little brother. But. I've always known that naming a boy would be a big conflict for us. DH's family has a boy-naming tradition that goes back at least the last 3-4 generations that is EXTREMELY limiting. Not a particular name, but an "alliterative" tradition with a very, very difficult letter. DH is first generation American, and in the country where his father came from, it was a much more common letter in general, for names and other words. But not here. DH basically has the only name of that letter that I could stomach, and my nephew has the same name. So I don't want a repeat of that one again. In short, I just really, really don't want to do it. Really don't. Don't even want to do the middle name of that letter. Just feels kind of ridiculous to me. I literally tell people what the tradition is and they invariably laugh out loud, thinking I'm joking. Sigh.

Anyway, DH and I agreed leaving the u/s yesterday that we would table the naming convo for a good while, which felt good, I want to just process the news of it being a boy, without getting into the stress of it all just yet. Good plan, right?

Yet, now the news isn't even 24 hours old and it's already in my face. ILs are visiting this week (a whole BP all to itself), so when we got home from the appointment, we told MIL, FIL, SIL, and DD the news that it was a baby brother. Within 5 min, MIL said "Are you going to come up with a (our favorite letter) name? I think you must." She chuckled, but it was that kind of "I'm joking but not really joking at all" tone. To his credit, DH shut her right down. But I was livid. I so just wanted to pretend for a while that this was going to be nothing but sweet and wonderful and planning would be simply fun and joyful. But there it is. I hate to admit it, but it kind of soured the news for me. Now it just represents this huge, looming conflict to me. NOT how it should be.

DH knows how I feel, and admits the comment was out of line. We're still not going to talk about it for a while. But I'm ruminating. How do I approach this? Anyone BTDT with a name conflict? I don't think he should get to decide and overrule me on something I sincerely hate just because he's the guy and he has the family tradition. ALL our kids will have his last name (which is a mouthful by itself). DD's first name is his grandmother's name (not bitter about that, I love it. But still.). We will be going his way on the circ debate because it's important to him. Don't I get a say in anything??? My dad is terminally ill, and I love his name. Haven't told DH this, but I would love to use his name. Don't I get a turn to honor someone, if I want it? Doesn't it matter that observing this tradition would require me to name MY son something I truly don't like? Can't we at least try to find something that is meaningful for both of us, that we both like? I feel like a non-factor. So frustrated. :(

[liamsmom]

Sorry, that sucks. I don't have any BTDT, but I'd suggest keeping a short list of names that you like, including your father's name. Then when it's time to discuss names you'll have some concrete suggestions. Maybe you guys can compromise and fulfill your DH's family tradition with a middle name? Does your DH like his name or the tradition? Or does he just feel obligated?

If it makes you feel better, my DH wants to name a DD Wednesday. Not necessarily after Wednesday Addams--he just thinks it's a nice name. And he's weirdly insistent. I'm really hoping we're having another boy so we can avoid that.

[sarahsthreads]

First of all, congrats on the boy! How exciting!

Second of all, that's tough, and I feel for you. DH's family also has a naming tradition for boys that goes back equally far, but he's always been adamant that we would not be following it, even with the first two before we knew gender. (His tradition is that the firstborn son is given the same first name as dad, but different middle names.) I'm actually the one pushing hard for us to at least use that name as a middle name, because I feel like not using it at all would be breaking *too* much with tradition. He's not even thrilled with the idea of doing that, but I'm worried he'll regret it down the line. It's not so important to me that I'm going to insist, though. :shrug:

And of course, now I'm dying to know what the letter is... ;)

I think...I think that you have a long time to talk about it. I don't think either parent should ever be forced to use a name they don't like. I also think that it's possible to compromise, even when there's a well-established naming tradition involved. I mean, this may be a little extreme, but one of my friends' families has a tradition where the eldest son is given a name with specific initials...say "MPL". (Not the actual initials, just an example.) They couldn't agree on an "M" name they liked, so their son was given the name "M P____ L____" and he goes by his middle name, "P____". The only time he ever uses the "M" is on official government documents. They stuck with just the initial so nobody would actually call him an "M" name that they didn't like. (Like I said, a bit odd, but if you really feel obligated to honor this tradition and don't like any of the names that start with the right letter, it's at least one way to work around it.)

And as a last resort, I keep reminding DH that I have final say on that birth certificate. I think technically I'm the only one who has to sign it...of course, if he'd stop throwing out non-names just to get under my skin I'd stop threatening that!

Sarah :)

[TwoBees]

Congrats on your little blue bundle-to-be!

Could you use the family tradition for your son's middle name? Or could you choose a name that has the same or a similar meaning, but does not start with the same letter? A a derivation of the name the starts with a different letter? I'm thinking along the lines of Ivan and John, William/Liam, or Kristoph/Christopher.

I completely understand your position. We have a somewhat similar dilemma...we would like to honor a particular male relative, but I am having difficulty findings names that I like that are similar, have the same meaning, or start with the same letter. Ultimately, you and your DH have the final say, no matter what your MIL says or thinks (easier said than done, I know).

[specialp]

I know this is his family tradition, but has DH been clear that he wants to follow the tradition? Or have you guys just agreed to not talk about it for now?

[123LuckyMom]

Congratulations!!!

I have no BTDT except that in our family, the tradition is to use the first letter of the name of a (deceased) person you want to honor. My dad's name started with a letter we didn't want to use-- like you-- so we used his last name as the middle name for DS, and with DD, we used the meaning of his last name as the meaning for her first name. The letters of her names honored her great and great great grandmothers.

Is there any way you could choose a name that doesn't start with the letter but, when transliterated into the language of your DH's culture, would? I'm thinking about the way a G will often sound like an H in Spanish.

Also, the first name, middle name trick where you only ever use the middle name has been done many times before. You could use your DH's first name and then choose a wonderful middle name and call him by it.

You could just not follow the tradition, too. Your DH sounds like he's willing to stand up and defend that decision. If that's the case, just stand your ground. It's really making the decision that's the hard part! If it were me, I'd follow the tradition but with my own twist. I'm a sucker for tradition, though.

[SnuggleBuggles]

That's why I never share that stuff ahead of time...everyone has an opinion! Just do what you like and don't say anything til the baby is here. That's how I'd handle it. ah- didn't read well enough. I think that you could tell dh that it's your turn to pick. Maybe stick with the tradition for the middle name instead. I know that isn't the correct thing to do from a cultural POV though

[BabyBearsMom]

I would tell my DH that it would be meaningful to me to name the baby for your father since he is ill. It would be very difficult for him to argue with that. Option B is you can always put the BBB on the job to come up with a name with the special letter. Maybe all of our brains together could come up with something good?

[psimpson3-5]

My DH is a JR. I'm pretty sure the ILs and DH wanted DS to be a third. I'm not too keen on that. I think it gets confusing as the child gets older. Nonetheless, DH knew that I was very close to my father who passed in 2004. DH didn't really argue when we decided on DS's name. We picked a first name we both agreed on and DS's middle name is the same as my father's. I think DH just knew deep down that it was important to me and there was no way I would budge on it.

ETA: If you feel strongly about using your father's name, I would just suggest explaining yourself calmly to your DH and his family. I hope that they can understand.

[megs4413]

my DH and I had a terrible time naming our kids together. In my case, though, there wasn't a name I was willing to fight for so I just let it go and let DH have his way the last two times.

In your case, however, I think you should just talk to your husband and let him know that you really want to use your Dad's name. I might be wiling to compromise (if i were you) and do your dad's name and then a middle name of your DH's choosing. I probably wouldn't budge on the first name, though, unless you are comfortable with using your Dh's first choice first name and then using your Dad's name as middle and maybe calling DS by your Dad's name. I wouldn't bend on this or wait on it, if i were you. You don't need the stress. Just be honest with your Dh, he should understand.

[boogiemomz]

I know this is his family tradition, but has DH been clear that he wants to follow the tradition? Or have you guys just agreed to not talk about it for now?

Pretty sure he would like to follow the tradition. It came up with DD before we knew she was a girl. It was the kind of thing where I knew about the tradition from the beginning but couldn't possibly imagine that he would want to stick with it (it's that bad). We certainly never talked about it before marriage as a "making sure we're on the same page about this" type thing. Then when he seemed disappointed that I might not want to if DD was a boy. I was floored.

So, the shutting down his mom thing was more about him avoiding the conversation/conflict in the moment, knowing I would see red hearing her say that, than it was about having no intention of keeping the tradition. I know he will still want to. But it's the kind of thing I don't know if I could get used to, if I'm completely honest. There are NO names, and I mean NONE, with this letter that I would be okay with, especially as a first name (especially paired with our last name of the same letter)--it's the kind of thing where you can think of one, maybe two names that are actually names that begin with this letter, DH/DN have one of them, and any others just get weirder and weirder. FIL and his father both have very eastern European sounding names that no one has ever heard of. The possibility of a translation or similar meaning name is interesting, I'll have to explore that. The middle name thing would even feel like a huge compromise to me, and is more than I would be entirely comfortable/happy with. Maybe that's what will happen, especially if I thought it meant I could have my pick of first names. Perhaps that could be my condition/compromise--we can use this letter for a middle name IF I get to choose the first name, no questions asked. It just feels so icky.

[TxCat]

It will have been 4 years by the time your son arrives since you and your DH have discussed this - I'd maybe start from the perspective that its possible your DH's opinion or stance on this issue could have softened in 4 years.

The second thing that came to mind is that you mentioned in previous threads that you and your DH are having some communication/interpersonal issues right now and that your DH responds poorly to anything that comes off as criticism. In that case, I would frame this discussion very carefully to increase your chances of getting what you want and to keep everyone happy. If you are fairly certain that you want your son to have your father's name, I would start from that angle - something like it would mean so much to you over the years to give your son that name, and it would be a wonderful and appreciated gesture to your father/family. I think if you frame it more as how giving your son a certain name will give you so much happiness, rather than attacking the names/tradition in your DH's family or framing it as a ultimatum as you did in your last post, you'll be more likely to get what you want.

I'm also curious what letter this is.

[Philly Mom]

It will have been 4 years by the time your son arrives since you and your DH have discussed this - I'd maybe start from the perspective that its possible your DH's opinion or stance on this issue could have softened in 4 years.

The second thing that came to mind is that you mentioned in previous threads that you and your DH are having some communication/interpersonal issues right now and that your DH responds poorly to anything that comes off as criticism. In that case, I would frame this discussion very carefully to increase your chances of getting what you want and to keep everyone happy. If you are fairly certain that you want your son to have your father's name, I would start from that angle - something like it would mean so much to you over the years to give your son that name, and it would be a wonderful and appreciated gesture to your father/family. I think if you frame it more as how giving your son a certain name will give you so much happiness, rather than attacking the names/tradition in your DH's family or framing it as a ultimatum as you did in your last post, you'll be more likely to get what you want.

I'm also curious what letter this is.

I agree completely. Very well said.

[candaceb]

One of my friends needed to name her daughter an "I" name after her husband's mother who passed away a few years earlier. Isabelle had already been taken by a niece and that is the only "normal" name that starts with I. So they ended up making up a name - Ilyssa. Not ideal but the best they could do.

Whatever you do, please don't name him intending to call him by his middle name. That has been a nightmare for me since I was about 14.

[KpbS]

Perhaps that could be my condition/compromise--we can use this letter for a middle name IF I get to choose the first name, no questions asked. It just feels so icky.

This is actually what I would be hoping for as a best case scenario (short of your DH abandoning the tradition all together!). Your Dad's name/s, your DH's name (Xavier? Yuri? Zakhar?) and his last name.

I agree with putting the conversation off at LEAST until the IL have left town. Congratulations on your little guy! Boys are wonderful! :)
:grouphug:

[KpbS]

Also, it's really common in the part of the US where I live for boys to be named a first name that they do not go by or be called a name that is completely different from their first and middle names. Think William Jacob going by Jake or Marcus Allen going by Chris. :shrug:

[MamaMolly]

I don't know, I think your MIL might have done you a favor. Pissing off a Pregasauris is a BAAAAAAAAAD idea, and it sounds like your DH is in the mood to smooth things over with you. And since he's already chosen YOUR side in this issue...well the rest just stands to reason! :)

FWIW I think you get naming rights on this kid for all the reasons you listed. And I totally get the naming of a boy issue, if either of mine had been a boy we'd have had a very similar conflict. DH is XYZ the third. It is the assumption on HIS side of the family that we'd name a son XYZ the 4th. SO.NOT.HAPPENING. Stick to your guns. They'll get over it or they'll have something pretty minor to gripe about for the rest of your life. What ever. Name the baby what you like.

[specialp]

It will have been 4 years by the time your son arrives since you and your DH have discussed this - I'd maybe start from the perspective that its possible your DH's opinion or stance on this issue could have softened in 4 years.

The second thing that came to mind is that you mentioned in previous threads that you and your DH are having some communication/interpersonal issues right now and that your DH responds poorly to anything that comes off as criticism. In that case, I would frame this discussion very carefully to increase your chances of getting what you want and to keep everyone happy. If you are fairly certain that you want your son to have your father's name, I would start from that angle - something like it would mean so much to you over the years to give your son that name, and it would be a wonderful and appreciated gesture to your father/family. I think if you frame it more as how giving your son a certain name will give you so much happiness, rather than attacking the names/tradition in your DH's family or framing it as a ultimatum as you did in your last post, you'll be more likely to get what you want.

I'm also curious what letter this is.

Could not agree more. You are already dealing with a lot here and while it is fine to table it for now, I do think sooner rather than later when you are calm. I would worry about putting it off until you've actually had the baby boy! You need to frame it in a positive light of how much it would mean to you and to honor your father and not an attack on his family tradition. You might not like the compromises - using it as a name you don't like as a first but calling him by your middle name OR using your first name and his middle name - but bring those to the table to show your respect for his tradition. No one is ever *perfectly* happy in a compromise!

Congratulations on your baby boy! Don't let this spoil it. Boys are so much fun ... no matter what their name is!

[queenmama]

First off, congrats on the boy! I love boys and would desperately love another! They're so much fun!

Second, tell us the letter. Seriously. I can't stand not knowing! haha!

I highly suggest writing in to Swistle and "Ask the Name Lady" and Appellation Mountain... You might be surprised at what we Name Enthusiasts can come up with.

I do agree that some compromise should be reached. I don't abide by the idea that a son MUST carry a name from the father's side, considering most males carry the paternal surname already.

I wish you the best! And more congratulations on your son!

Lara

[sariana]

IMO each parent has veto power. Neither should get to choose the name if the other is not on board. It is YOUR child too. And it is HIS child too.

[AshleyAnn]

Ugh that sucks. My first husband's family has a similar tradition and I hated it. I secretly prayed for a girl because I didn't want to go along with it.

Maybe tabling the name discussion between you and DH is a mistake. It gives you more time to make discussions / fight it out. ExDH and I could not agree and we ended up with a nameless baby for several days. Its easier for other people to put their opinions in when you're feeling desperate for a name


ETA: if we all agree not to throw out name suggestions can we know what letter it is?

[boogiemomz]

Ugh that sucks. My first husband's family has a similar tradition and I hated it. I secretly prayed for a girl because I didn't want to go along with it.

Maybe tabling the name discussion between you and DH is a mistake. It gives you more time to make discussions / fight it out. ExDH and I could not agree and we ended up with a nameless baby for several days. Its easier for other people to put their opinions in when you're feeling desperate for a name


ETA: if we all agree not to throw out name suggestions can we know what letter it is?

I'm not withholding the letter to avoid suggestions, but because it feels so identifiable. Everyone I've ever told this story to remembers it forever! I'll send PMs to anyone who asks. :)

And we certainly weren't planning to avoid the discussion until baby is born. We just wanted to sit with the news and enjoy it for a little while (like, a few weeks) before opening that can of worms. I told DH leaving the appointment that I agree we don't need to talk about it right now, but I wanted to make a plan/schedule for when we WILL talk about it. As in, we have agreed to have the discussion by the time I'm 25 weeks, or something.

[kristenk]

Add me to the letter PM list! I'm guessing it's an X, Y or Z name because those seem the hardest and most limited.

I wonder if it would be possible to modify the naming tradition to something that you're happy with, your DH is happy with and future generations will find easier to deal with? Current tradition is boy names start with XYZ. Any way to switch to boy middle name starts with same letter as dad's first name? So, your DS would get a middle name of XYZ, but a first name with a different letter. Your grandson would get a middle name that started with the same letter as your DS's first name. I don't know. Just throwing something out there. And it seems as if starting a different tradition might go over better than disregarding the idea of a tradition in naming. Maybe?

[alootikki]

I agree with everyone who said that you get an automatic veto. You are the one carrying this child, will go through labor to give birth to him, etc! And I also think that if it was that important to your husband, he would have brought it up earlier, no?

Could you give DS an "unofficial" name that starts with that letter, and let your Inlaws call him that as a nickname?

And I'm also so curious about what this letter is - please PM me!

[spannaz]

Agree with previous posters about you getting veto power. BOTH parents should get a say and should love the name. My DH's family has a tradition where first born sons get the middle name William. Thank goodness I like the name (even wanted to use as a first name but that was not allowed lol), but we ended up with a girl this time around.

I hope for your sake your DH will realize that you need to love the name your son will have for the rest of his life. My vote is to make your husbands name LO's middle name since that's the only name with that letter that you like. And maybe that will start a new tradition within your family of using that middle name for first born sons?

I am super curious about the letter and tradition as well so please pm me :). You mentioned Eastern Europe and being Polish myself I could only imagine the traditional names I'd be left with if we decided to try a Polish name (especially with an obscure letter such as W or Z).

Can't wait to hear about the tradition and letter.

Good luck!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - now Free (http://tapatalk.com/m/)

[Philly Mom]

Add me to those who are curious about the letter. :)

[kdeunc]

Would love to know the letter too! :)

I think you both have to agree on a name. There is no way I could name a child something I hate. Good luck avoiding the conversation for a while and congratulations on your baby boy!

[sariana]

I'd like a PM too. I can't think of any letter with only one viable name, so I'm intrigued!

I also was thinking maybe X and Xavier, which made me start to think about things like using Alexander and having Xander as a nickname to get the X in there. Maybe something like that is possible with the actual letter/name?

[basil]

I think Q or U would be really hard too. PM me!

[boogiemomz]

So, it's honestly not even about the names themselves. There are a handful (okay, maybe 2) names that start with this letter that wouldn't be atrocious... IF our name was Nelson or Jones. But it's not just that I don't particularly love the names (which I don't), it's more that they just sound completely absurd with our last name. To me, it would be totally apparent that we contrived a name for the sole purpose of maintaining the tradition. And that just seems ridiculous to me. This name will ultimately be about DS. Him, as an individual. Not some family or some ancestor or some tradition someone started 100 years ago. HIM. I think he deserves a name that is dignified and respectable and HIS OWN that he can feel good about and be proud of. It just feels to me that giving him a name to follow this tradition would be like exploiting him to gratify his ancestors. Don't know if that makes sense, but it's kind of how I feel.

As for "starting a new tradition," if we're going to do that I'd rather start the tradition of naming your child whatever the He!! you want without any input from anyone! But that's just my take. I just don't like all the pressure of "everyone did this before you so now it's your job to uphold it and not screw it up." Especially since the legacy has completely nothing to do with one of the two parents.

[sariana]

It's a good thing you didn't marry Prince William.:D

I happen to agree with you, BTW.

[american_mama]

My only experience is about our son, third and last child. I didn't want to find out gender (for the first and last time), didn't want to circumcise if it was a boy, and wanted my choice for middle name. DH wanted the opposite on all fronts and was kind of a jerk about it during pregnancy, at one point saying didn't he get a say on anything, much like you. Choosing DH's middle name was our compromise and I think a good one. And after DS' birth, it all felt like ancient history. So, compromise on something, repeat the compromise often and expect that baby's birth will overshadow everything for a good long while. As for in-laws, not sure what to say, but have DH run interference.

[boogiemomz]

It's a good thing you didn't marry Prince William.:D

I happen to agree with you, BTW.

:ROTFLMAO: Yes, I suppose it is. Though I do like all the names they were (presumably) being pressured to use. :) And maybe the other perks would make up for it, I dunno. ;)

Also, thanks. :)

[Multimama]

I am also curious about the letter! :)

But is there any chance you could invent a name that you could be happy with? Inventing names is a big trend in America, so you would fit right in. We have friends who needed a name that worked in the DH's native language and in the country they live in now. There is pretty much only one name that meets those criteria and as a result practically every boy whose parents are from country A who now live in country B have chosen that name for their child. Our friends didn't want to do that for their child, choosing a name so predictable and clearly identifiable as part of a certain heritage. So what they did was invent a name. They picked a name that sounded like it could be a name in both languages, but actually isn't a common/real name in either language.

Or is there any way to do a kreativ spelling to get a name you'd be happy with? Say the letter is Y and you don't want to name your child Yves. Could you name them Yoshua instead of Joshua or something like that?

I love naming traditions and would love to find a way to make it work and make everyone happy. But if there really isn't anything then I think you have a right to veto, but I would probably try to compromise by using your DH's name as the middle name or something like that. (Who cares if it's your nephew's name too. IMO your DH has a right to pass on his name to his own kid.)

[123LuckyMom]

So, it's honestly not even about the names themselves. There are a handful (okay, maybe 2) names that start with this letter that wouldn't be atrocious... IF our name was Nelson or Jones. But it's not just that I don't particularly love the names (which I don't), it's more that they just sound completely absurd with our last name. To me, it would be totally apparent that we contrived a name for the sole purpose of maintaining the tradition. And that just seems ridiculous to me. This name will ultimately be about DS. Him, as an individual. Not some family or some ancestor or some tradition someone started 100 years ago. HIM. I think he deserves a name that is dignified and respectable and HIS OWN that he can feel good about and be proud of. It just feels to me that giving him a name to follow this tradition would be like exploiting him to gratify his ancestors. Don't know if that makes sense, but it's kind of how I feel.

I'm guessing the letter is a U. I'm super curious!

In any case, you have every right to feel the way you do, but I respectfully disagree. Nobody is solely their own person. Nobody could or would be here or be who they are without the choices, good or bad, that their ancestors made. We all come from long lineages, whether we choose to know about them and draw from those stories or not. In most of our cases, we are a culmination of everything our ancestors ever could have dreamed about. Whether they were toiling in the fields or to the manor born, they would be amazed by us and how we live. They would be proud to have had a part in bringing us to be. It's not that we owe them, per se, but I, personally, think it's nice to honor them. I hope you can find a way to do that AND to have a name that you like!

[boogiemomz]

I am also curious about the letter! :)

But is there any chance you could invent a name that you could be happy with? Inventing names is a big trend in America, so you would fit right in. We have friends who needed a name that worked in the DH's native language and in the country they live in now. There is pretty much only one name that meets those criteria and as a result practically every boy whose parents are from country A who now live in country B have chosen that name for their child. Our friends didn't want to do that for their child, choosing a name so predictable and clearly identifiable as part of a certain heritage. So what they did was invent a name. They picked a name that sounded like it could be a name in both languages, but actually isn't a common/real name in either language.

Or is there any way to do a kreativ spelling to get a name you'd be happy with? Say the letter is Y and you don't want to name your child Yves. Could you name them Yoshua instead of Joshua or something like that?

I love naming traditions and would love to find a way to make it work and make everyone happy. But if there really isn't anything then I think you have a right to veto, but I would probably try to compromise by using your DH's name as the middle name or something like that. (Who cares if it's your nephew's name too. IMO your DH has a right to pass on his name to his own kid.)

See, this is what I'm talking about, bending ourselves into a pretzel simply for the sake of upholding the tradition. I'm not into invented names at all, independent of DH's family tradition. I like simple, classic, timeless names. When you start changing spellings or coming up with invented names just to stick to the pattern, it becomes more about the name than it is about the individual carrying it, IMO. I know some people think tradition should win out no matter what, but I'm not one of those people. As for my it also being my nephew's name, I care. I already have to designate which (DH/DN name) I'm talking about all the time, and I don't want to just add to that hassle. And I guess I think DH is passing his name onto his son. And his daughter. And any other children we have. We all have his last name, no questions asked. Why should he have automatic "rights" beyond that?

[boogiemomz]

I'm guessing the letter is a U. I'm super curious!

In any case, you have every right to feel the way you do, but I respectfully disagree. Nobody is solely their own person. Nobody could or would be here or be who they are without the choices, good or bad, that their ancestors made. We all come from long lineages, whether we choose to know about them and draw from those stories or not. In most of our cases, we are a culmination of everything our ancestors ever could have dreamed about. Whether they were toiling in the fields or to the manor born, they would be amazed by us and how we live. They would be proud to have had a part in bringing us to be. It's not that we owe them, per se, but I, personally, think it's nice to honor them. I hope you can find a way to do that AND to have a name that you like!

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but I do think that expectations of how this must be done can go overboard in terms of what is reasonable, and beyond that point it just gets too difficult (and can be to the detriment of the child carrying the name, if it's too far out there). The expectation of his family, at least if we keep with the current pattern, has no flexibility, no leeway. And I just think it's unreasonable. I don't think giving a child a name that both his parents choose for him is, in and of itself, dishonoring to family. I feel like anyone can come up with a theoretical example of a crazy tradition that, after a point, becomes too difficult and impractical to uphold.

[Philly Mom]

I couldn't respond to your PM (mailbox is full), but I think you are right even if you may be able to find a name that you like enough. I personally think you should get to honor your family too, and if naming him after your dad or with the same letter as your dad's name does that, than I think that is a persuasive argument. Names are a two way street (even though they create lots of stress).

[123LuckyMom]

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but I do think that expectations of how this must be done can go overboard in terms of what is reasonable, and beyond that point it just gets too difficult (and can be to the detriment of the child carrying the name, if it's too far out there). The expectation of his family, at least if we keep with the current pattern, has no flexibility, no leeway. And I just think it's unreasonable. I don't think giving a child a name that both his parents choose for him is, in and of itself, dishonoring to family. I feel like anyone can come up with a theoretical example of a crazy tradition that, after a point, becomes too difficult and impractical to uphold.

Okay. I do certainly agree that choosing not to follow the tradition is not DIShonoring to anyone! It's all in the intent and the reasoning. That was why I originally suggested being creative and trying to honor the spirit rather than the letter (pun intended) of the tradition. If you don't want to, though, just don't.

I do also think it's important that your side of the family be honored, and the children will have your husband's last name, which automatically connects them to that side. That will have to satisfy your in laws.

[georgiegirl]

I think both parents have to be on board when it comes to naming kids. dH would have loved for DS2 to be named after him, but I was adamantly opposed. He's from Eastern Europe too, from a country where babies are routinely named after grandparents and the middle name is a variation of dads name. I had no desire to follow that tradition, especially since it is exceedingly patriarchal. Our kids' middle name is my maiden name. We did not name the kids after anyone, although the name we picked for DS2 happens to be my maternal grandfathers name (deceased, but I never had a close relationship with him.). We just happened to like the name, and it was kind of strange telling my mom DS's name. ( oddly enough DH's name is the same as my paternal grandfather, who is also deceased but I was much closer with.)

I'm guessing the letter is V.

[megs4413]

Not trying to be snarky at all, but I think people who believe BOTH parents have to agree on the name have never had genuine trouble finding a name. There is NO way around one of the couple "winning" out if each member of the couple has basically chosen a different name. How do you get around that? In my case, my DH was DEAD set on a name. What was I supposed to do? Scream at him until he compromised with me? it doesn't work like that. If someone really, really wants a name and won't consider another one, something has to give. it just does. Sometimes one parent gets to name the kid what they want and the other one doesn't. Personally, I chose to let my DH "win" because it was much more important to him than it was to me, but if it had been as important to me as it is to OP, I would have forced my DH into my name choice because at the end of the day the MOM gets to fill out the birth certificate. there are plenty of rational/logical arguments for why a Mom should have the final say (she's the one who goes through pregnancy/delivery, she's the one who will breastfeed or dry up, the father in many cases is already passing on his surname, etc) and I don't think it's 'wrong' for her to assert that right. It maybe "unfair," but LIFE is unfair. Women having to bear the brunt of childbirth is unfair.

[specialp]

I don't think both parents have to agree/love the name, but I do think both should have veto power so that at a bare minimum, one doesn't end up with a name he/she absolutely hates. In both cases, DH and I, after all of our vetoing this name or that one for whatever reason, narrowed our choices down to 2 - we both liked the options, but I had my favorite and the other one was his favorite. I "won" both times for various reasons, but our children didn't end up with a name that DH hated.

Good luck, OP. I completely understand and I hope you and DH are able to reach a name you both like.

[Multimama]

And I guess I think DH is passing his name onto his son. And his daughter. And any other children we have. We all have his last name, no questions asked. Why should he have automatic "rights" beyond that?

I agree.

I love naming traditions, like I said, so I'd try to find a way to make it work. But it sounds like you just really deeply don't want to name your son using this tradition and I think that's fair and should be respected. FWIW I still remember exactly where we were when DH informed me that the name I had picked out for our first boy, a name that I loved, was not a name he wanted at all. I didn't expect that! I still sometimes feel sad about not getting to use that name, but we found other names, names that we both love, and I am glad we worked to find a compromise. I don't feel that his veto meant that I didn't get a say, so hopefully your husband won't either.

Perhaps it's time to watch the episode of Friends where Rachel and Ross discuss names. It always cheers me up. :)

Ross: What about Darwin?
Rachel: Ross, why do you hate our child?

[georgiegirl]

Not trying to be snarky at all, but I think people who believe BOTH parents have to agree on the name have never had genuine trouble finding a name. .

I completely disagree. We didn't decide until DS2 was 36 hours old and we wanted to leave the hospital. Naming was a huge ordeal. But we both went in with a flexible attitude that we couldn't be dead set on one particular name. That's just not fair. If one of us was "meh" about a name, it was off the list. We spent hours and hours looking at thousands of names. We were both respectful and not stubborn because we realized it wouldn't be fair to impose a specific name. We went to the hospital with 5 names on a short list. My favorite name wasn't on the list because DH didn't like it, and the same wad true for him. We both pledged to be open about names, and in the end we were both satisfied with our choice. DH was the one who put the name we picked on the list, but after meeting DS, I think that name suited him best...better than my favorite name.

I think both parents need to have an open mind and be willing to compromise.

[sntm]

DF wanted DS2 to be the IV, but I thought it was confusing enough with him and his father. We compromised by giving DS2 the same middle name.

[Simon]

I think you've gotten some good advice. We had great difficulty choosing names here, but didn't bother following any family traditions. IIWY, I'd spend the next few weeks considering what are absolute deal breakers for you and what compromise can you live with. Then you can approach a conversation with Dh on those terms. I understand not wanting to use the limited names available to you as a FN and think honoring your Dad makes a nice connection.

IF you end up deciding you're willing to compromise, you could always use the first initial as a stand alone and then give a MN that you love (your dad's name) or vice versa . So it would be something like "V. Robert Lastname" or "Alexander U. Lastname" where the initial doesn't stand for anything. Another compromise might be giving two middle names.

[queenmama]

Sometimes one parent gets to name the kid what they want and the other one doesn't. Personally, I chose to let my DH "win" because it was much more important to him than it was to me, but if it had been as important to me as it is to OP, I would have forced my DH into my name choice because at the end of the day the MOM gets to fill out the birth certificate. there are plenty of rational/logical arguments for why a Mom should have the final say (she's the one who goes through pregnancy/delivery, she's the one who will breastfeed or dry up, the father in many cases is already passing on his surname, etc) and I don't think it's 'wrong' for her to assert that right. It maybe "unfair," but LIFE is unfair. Women having to bear the brunt of childbirth is unfair.

Wow. You may have given into your DH but it has clearly made you bitter.

A baby is made and raised by both parents, in most cases, and both parents have equal say in baby's care and upbringing. Mama doesn't get to exert power over Papa simply because she is the one who carries, delivers, and feeds Baby. That's not how it works, or not how it should work, anyway.

I do see your point of view. I delivered two big babies without painkillers, nursed them both through mastitis and milk blebs (that's nipple blisters, people. Blisters. On my nipples. Yeah.), change 99% of diapers, and DH has been on night shifts for both of their first years. In other words, I have done a helluva lot more work than DH. But that doesn't give me the right to "force DH into my name choice" or pick their school or pierce DD's ears or make any other huge decisions without my partner's input. No way.

With regard to the OP, this is a special circumstance. There are tens of thousands of names to choose from but she is most certainly boxed in by this challenging initial (times two!). Otherwise -- and for almost all other families -- nobody should get ultimate say in Baby's name. There's no reason for forcing your partner to call his or her child a name he or she hates.

Lara

[jbbhb]

Look at it this way, if you stop the tradition now, you'll be saving your son and future daughter-in-law from being in the same place you are now ;)

Good luck with whatever you decide.

[boogiemomz]

I completely disagree. We didn't decide until DS2 was 36 hours old and we wanted to leave the hospital. Naming was a huge ordeal. But we both went in with a flexible attitude that we couldn't be dead set on one particular name. That's just not fair. If one of us was "meh" about a name, it was off the list. We spent hours and hours looking at thousands of names. We were both respectful and not stubborn because we realized it wouldn't be fair to impose a specific name. We went to the hospital with 5 names on a short list. My favorite name wasn't on the list because DH didn't like it, and the same wad true for him. We both pledged to be open about names, and in the end we were both satisfied with our choice. DH was the one who put the name we picked on the list, but after meeting DS, I think that name suited him best...better than my favorite name.

I think both parents need to have an open mind and be willing to compromise.

This, exactly. I think there is a fundamental difference between being dead set ON a name and dead set AGAINST a name. I think the first is just unfair, and the second is totally fair game and should be respected. If I dislike a certain name, I am still open to discussion about ANY other name. If I INSIST that one name is the only one I'm willing to use, it's game over, no discussion. That's where I feel like we're falling in the argument, and that's where I think veto power is totally fair and necessary. I don't disagree with Megs that ultimately, someone sort of "wins" and the other doesn't get exactly what he/she wanted, but like georgiegirl, as long as you have a list of names that either party would be at least okay with, no one is devastated by the outcome. And each partner needs to bring flexibility and open-mindedness to the table for that to be possible. We had the exact same thing happen with DD, we had a short list of names we were both willing to "try on" her, and my absolute favorite didn't win, but the name she ended up with is completely perfect for her and I'm so glad she ended up with that one instead of my original first choice. So, everybody wins.

And, to clarify, I am certainly not 100% decided and focused on my dad's name. It's one that I like, and it would please me to honor him in that way, but it would be one on a long list that I would be willing to consider. If DH said he absolutely hated that name (which would piss me off, considering the circumstances) I would still feel compelled to honor that and take it off the table, because I think that's how you have to play this. I just wish he would afford me the same right.

[MSWR0319]

I'm just now seeing this post. We had a similar problem when naming DS1. DH's family has always named their son's the same first name and then a different middle name, then the child either goes by the middle name or some nickname of the original name. I didn't like this at all. I am a firm believer that you name the child what you want it called. DH didn't really want to name DS that either, but was too afraid to speak up. We came to a compromise that we picked our own first name and then we used the "family" first name as a middle name. I was ok with this because it was DH's first name. Not thrilled, but ok with it. Plus it kept the inlaws quiet. I don't think FIL was totally thrilled, but he said he was happy that DS had his name so I guess it wasn't too big of a problem. Could you do something like that and use your Dh's name as a middle name??

[swissair81]

I have one son among my girly clan. He is named for my father who passed away when I was 6. It wasn't even a question. When he was born and named, I wanted to use a specific nickname- a diminutive of what my father was called and DH hated it in a big way. We fought about it for a month and then he spoke to someone he respects who told him to get over himself. He did and nearly 5 years later, he doesn't even remember that he objected to it. Of course, he chose the names for 3 out of 4 girls, mostly because I don't have many girls names. Our second DD is a family name that we share and our 3rd and 4th daughters are named after family members of his.

[kara97210]

I'm curious about the initial too. Echoing what a lot of PPs have said, maybe you can come up with a new naming tradition that takes both of your preferences into account. We have good friends who had a similar situation (her husband is "first name, last name, IV") and she was under a lot of pressure to name their DS the fifth. She really, really didn't love the name so they came up with a name they both love that references the tradition (Quincy), he's 12 now and even her MIL loves the name.

My husband and I went many rounds on DS' name and looking back I wonder why. In fact, the midle name that I insisted on is the one name my kids have that I would change. Most of the names we were discussing would have ended up being great, the name DS wanted probably would have even been better than the one I wanted.

[Tondi G]

I am so curious about the initial too... would you please share or PM me as well! :)

I always feel terrible for people who have trouble naming their children ... it should be an enjoyable experience to sit down and look at name books or websites and imagine your little one with that name and share with your husband (and be able to laugh about the funny ones). I hope you and your husband can open the naming up for discussion .. yes Mama you should have a say!

[boogiemomz]

Wow, thanks for all the discussion everybody. I'm sort of chuckling that we've all been dissecting the argument and ranting and raving and I haven't even had the conversation with him yet (since finding out about DS this week, I mean). But I assure you, I know him, and this WILL be an issue. To the PP who pointed out that, by dropping it now, we'll ultimately be saving DS from the same naming dilemma when the time comes, I have made that case to DH, and he doesn't buy it, think DS would be proud to carry a name that maintains the tradition and would want to keep it up with his own son. I suppose that's possible, but DH is adamant that it doesn't matter at all what anyone else thinks and we shouldn't care (and DS won't either). I think he's a little naive. :) I've been doing some research and have a LONG list of names that I like, including my dad's, so hopefully I will be well enough prepared when the time comes to talk about it and maybe he will like something on my list. Fingers crossed. Perhaps we will compromise with the mn idea, even though I really don't want to do that either, I might be willing to concede that if I get a fn I like.

If I missed your request for a PM, just PM me, I cleared out my message box so there should be space in there. Thanks!

[ZeeBaby]

I have four first/middle names and a last name. My mom is a devout catholic and she had a tradition that we all have Mary in our names, plus my patron saint and honoring a relative. Having all those names has never really bothered me. I have always been known by one of my middle names. I didn't even know I had the other names until I got my first passport. All this to say, you can honor your husband's tradition and still get to call your son what you like. Assuming of course that he would be on board with such a compromise. Now at 40+ I am thinking of doing a legal name change. Still not 100% sure I even want to change what has worked for 40+ years, but I am considering mg options.

[boogiemomz]

I have four first/middle names and a last name. My mom is a devout catholic and she had a tradition that we all have Mary in our names, plus my patron saint and honoring a relative. Having all those names has never really bothered me. I have always been known by one of my middle names. I didn't even know I had the other names until I got my first passport. All this to say, you can honor your husband's tradition and still get to call your son what you like. Assuming of course that he would be on board with such a compromise. Now at 40+ I am thinking of doing a legal name change. Still not 100% sure I even want to change what has worked for 40+ years, but I am considering mg options.

I'm glad you have been happy with your name, at least until now, I understand it's pretty common to include those things in a catholic name, at least the name of the patron saint, is that right? But that of course is one of my main concerns, that he would grow up disliking his name, even as an adult (we all go through phases as kids of wanting a different name, but I'm talking about growing up just to continue disliking it). My dad had a given name that he absolutely hated and was ashamed of--a childish nickname for a more formal name, but the nn was his given name. He is a well established professional, and people always assume his name is the more formal version, but it's not, and it's been a source of embarrassment his whole life. He ended up getting it legally changed, but not all the way to the formal name, so it still comes up. (It's the equivalent of this, just with a different name: His given name was Nicky, but he's always gone by "Nick," so he legally changed it to "Nick" but people still assume his name would be Nicholas, but it's not.) I would hate for my son to be in a position of wanting to legally change his name as an adult.

[ZeeBaby]

I actually don't dislike any of my names. I wanted to do the name change to have my middle name I have always used be my legal first name.

[boogiemomz]

I actually don't dislike any of my names. I wanted to do the name change to have my middle name I have always used be my legal first name.

Oh, gotcha. Sort of similar to what my dad did, except he did dislike his name. Glad that wasn't the case for you!

[Blue Hydrangea]

Is there anyway to incorporate the traditional name into a choice that you're happy about? And I'm thinking very broadly, for example, if there is a family tradition of naming the son "Hugh", but you hate that option, what about going with Matthew? Completely different name, but it ends with the sound of "hugh", thereby nodding to tradition. I don't know if that is an option for your letter (I'll pm you!) but maybe something like that could be an acceptable compromise?