Please help me parent my mouthy but sensitive 4 yo

[YouAreTheFocus]

DS will turn 4 at the end of the month. Over the last few months he has become rather ornery/mouthy/challenging. On top of it he is very sensitive. This is the first real ongoing behavioral challenge we've had to deal with and we are floundering!

Mouthiness: He is responding to EVERYTHING in a very loud, forceful, negative manner. So if I say "Ok DS, time to go potty" he will respond "NO! I DON'T HAVE TO GO POTTY! I AM NEVER GOING POTTY!" This is often accompanied by dropping to the ground or laying face down on the couch (he doesn't have a tantrum really, just makes his proclamation and then "hides"). If I ask again, he will say (very slowly, like I speak another language) "I ALREADY TOLD YOU, I....AM....NOT....GO...ING...POTTY!!" Now, I can actually get him to do XYZ in a fairly timely manner (by throwing out a natural consequence or just saying "1"), but I need help in curbing this gut/physical reaction to our requests. He will make these snap responses with other adults & his teachers at preschool as well as us at home. I am tired of having him scream in my face and I am tired of being embarrassed by how he is responding to other adults.

We have tried a variety of responses to try to curb this behavior. We have tried "I can't understand you when you talk like that, can you say that again?" or "We don't talk/yell at people like that, could you say it in a nicer way?" Also his teacher suggested showing him that when you yell, people move away, and when you talk softer, it draws people closer. This is all fine for getting him to try again in the moment, but there is no carry over to the next time. And if I ever say something in a more forceful tone, like "DS! Don't talk to me like that!" he will bury his head in a pillow and start sobbing "Mama, why are you talking bad to me?" Oy vey. I will add that I was (and still am) pretty sensitive, my Mom was a huge yeller and made me cry all.the.time. I really make a point of never yelling at DS, I don't want him to grow up with that. But his sensitivity reaches new levels, and it can make correcting him very challenging.

Is there something I can do/say to put an end to this behavior? Is this common for 3-4 yos? I don't know how much more yelling I can take (him yelling at me!).

[Snow mom]

I don't have any advice but thought I'd bump this up for you because I'd love to know how to rein in my 4.5 yo as well. She's become a caricature of herself and it's so frustrating. She goes form very happy to very sad to very mad to very affectionate to very energetic and it's all too much. Hoping she's going to outgrow this.

[goldenpig]

Oh I feel for you--my 3.5 year old DS is also a sensitive yeller! He shouts all the time but if you reprimand him for it he starts crying. I don't know that I can solve your issue...my kids are horrible at listening to us too so I will watch this thread for tips. But sometimes what works for getting the kids to do something is instead of just telling them to do something, I ask, "Do you want to go potty now or in 5 minutes?" They always pick 5 minutes, and then when it's time they (sometimes) do it with less of a fight. Or giving them a choice--"We are going out, so do you want to put on your brown shoes or blue shoes?" "Do you want to go potty upstairs or downstairs?" "Do you want to wash your hands in the bathroom or the kitchen?"

[AngelaS]

Have you tried giving him a warning that in a few minutes he's going to have to change what he's doing? "Ds, in two minutes, we are going to take a break front the Legos and go potty and then we will come back and play more Legos. ".

Even now with my big kids, I give them two or five minute warnings before we leave or I need them to do something or whatever.

[janine]

Oh my, I thought I was alone with my sensitive yeller (or non-compliar). My DD's eyes will welt up, so the DH is out for the count and I'm left being the bad guy. I have powered through, and then later talk to her when she's calm about the why's. Or I give choices, "you must do xxx, would you rather do A or B to get it done." At that age and with school and bigger kid issues around the corner, I figure she unfortunately needs to have a thicker skin and also know how listen.

[123LuckyMom]

My DS is also very sensitive, but we are doing our best not to let the yelling habit develop. You've got the most important piece down which is that you not yell or lose your cool in those moments or otherwise. We all yell sometimes, of course, but I feel strongly that we can't ask our kids to behave in ways we can't behave ourselves.

On that note, I would try to talk to your DS about it when he's calm. Sit down with a sheet of paper and a pen and say, "DS, we have a problem. I know you don't always want to do the things I ask, and I understand that. When you yell at me, though, it hurts my feelings and (whatever it makes you feel or do). What can we do to stop the yelling? I'll write down your ideas. First, what can you do?" If an idea comes up that will not work, tell him that won't work for you and why. After you talk about his behavior, ask for ideas about your behavior. Maybe if you have him notice before the transition it would help him. Maybe if you gave him choices it would help.

In any case, put that piece of paper up somewhere accessible. Check in every few hours or so to see if the ideas are working. If they are, the list gets a star (or a sticker). The idea is to have success, so you might start out really small, like "DS, I'm about to ask you to use the potty, and if I ask the way we said I should on the list, and if you do what you said you should do, we can give ourselves a star!" This may be slow going for a while, but success breeds success! Also, you are both working together to find a way of communicating that works for you both.

Have you taught your son any calming down techniques? That might be helpful. Also, give him some words to say that are not yelling but still let him express himself. "Mommy, Please may I play for two more minutes first?" for example. Compassion goes a long way, too. I know it can be super irritating, but when he protests, be understanding. "Oh, DS, I know you didn't want to leave the house, but we have to go to the doctor. I'm so sorry that it's making you upset. It can be hard to leave your toys to go do something that's not as fun, but when we get back, you can play some more." It's work, that's for sure, but the more you do it at first, the less you will have to do it later, because your DS will know you understand and care about his feelings, and he'll become better able to say these kinds of things to himself.

Good luck! This is hard! I definitely think, though, that if you find a way to let him express himself without the yelling, the yelling will disappear.

[hillview]

DS2 is like this. It has gotten better since he turned 6!!

ETA I agree talking too much doesn't work. I've started a finger pointing to his room when he mis behaves, gets out of the yelling argument he otherwise wants to have. I also work on the "In our family we use nice words with inside voice" and then for DS2 I have to MODEL that for him.

[daisyd]

We started having this issue when DS1 turned 4. We still do to a certain extent. Changing my approach to his meltdowns has helped. Initially I'd yell making me feel *horrible*. Now I take a time out and recoup before I address the issue. It's helping that I'm a lot less stressed and I'm not perpetually chasing a deadline.

[carolinacool]

I'm right there with you. My 3.5-year-old has been on a holy tear the last few weeks. It's really difficult. I will say, DS is not sensitive. When I do lose my temper and snap, he just stares at me and continues to yell "no" or even worse, smirk, which drives me batty. I think 123LuckyMom has good advice, but none of it works with my son. He tunes me out after the first couple of sentences - believe me, I've tried. Too much talking and too much explaining gets nowhere with him.

We are having him evaluated through day care because his speech is a little behind. I think he could express himself more fully, we would have fewer meltdowns. But I also think he just has a really strong personality and just doesn't shift gears because he doesn't want to. He's a lot like DH in that way.

[YouAreTheFocus]

Thank you all for your comments, there is a lot here for me to think about and try!


DS2 is like this. It has gotten better since he turned 6!!

ETA I agree talking too much doesn't work. I've started a finger pointing to his room when he mis behaves, gets out of the yelling argument he otherwise wants to have. I also work on the "In our family we use nice words with inside voice" and then for DS2 I have to MODEL that for him.

Oh good god don't tell me I have 2 more years of this! :)

I have definitely fallen into a trap with the talking to much, b/c oftentimes he just gets on a roll and won't let it drop (this REALLY drives me nuts). It's like he has to have a comeback to everything we say and we can't get out of it. I just wasn't sure if 3 going on 4 was too young for the "go to your room"? Also a lot of times this is during a transition and I just want to be able to move on to what we need to be doing next. So I just say "1" and then he'll move. But then I guess that's why I am in this situation--I just patch it over in the moment and there's no long term/lasting impact for him!


My DS is also very sensitive, but we are doing our best not to let the yelling habit develop. You've got the most important piece down which is that you not yell or lose your cool in those moments or otherwise. We all yell sometimes, of course, but I feel strongly that we can't ask our kids to behave in ways we can't behave ourselves.

On that note, I would try to talk to your DS about it when he's calm. Sit down with a sheet of paper and a pen and say, "DS, we have a problem. I know you don't always want to do the things I ask, and I understand that. When you yell at me, though, it hurts my feelings and (whatever it makes you feel or do). What can we do to stop the yelling? I'll write down your ideas. First, what can you do?" If an idea comes up that will not work, tell him that won't work for you and why. After you talk about his behavior, ask for ideas about your behavior. Maybe if you have him notice before the transition it would help him. Maybe if you gave him choices it would help.

In any case, put that piece of paper up somewhere accessible. Check in every few hours or so to see if the ideas are working. If they are, the list gets a star (or a sticker). The idea is to have success, so you might start out really small, like "DS, I'm about to ask you to use the potty, and if I ask the way we said I should on the list, and if you do what you said you should do, we can give ourselves a star!" This may be slow going for a while, but success breeds success! Also, you are both working together to find a way of communicating that works for you both.

Have you taught your son any calming down techniques? That might be helpful. Also, give him some words to say that are not yelling but still let him express himself. "Mommy, Please may I play for two more minutes first?" for example. Compassion goes a long way, too. I know it can be super irritating, but when he protests, be understanding. "Oh, DS, I know you didn't want to leave the house, but we have to go to the doctor. I'm so sorry that it's making you upset. It can be hard to leave your toys to go do something that's not as fun, but when we get back, you can play some more." It's work, that's for sure, but the more you do it at first, the less you will have to do it later, because your DS will know you understand and care about his feelings, and he'll become better able to say these kinds of things to himself.

Good luck! This is hard! I definitely think, though, that if you find a way to let him express himself without the yelling, the yelling will disappear.

I really like the idea of coming up with a list together, and then working together to succeed (especially wording things in a manner to set him up for success). The only problem I'll have is he'll be an absolute puddle if he misses a star. I can see myself manipulating every interaction so he always gets a star. *I* will need a thicker skin!

IRT to calming techniques, they have done a good job of teaching that at preschool. If he is on the verge of tears, I can often tell him to breathe/calm down and stave it off. He recently had a cold, and had a fit about something and was getting to the welling up part and I told him "Please calm down DS, it will make you feel so much worse if you cry when you have a cold" and he actually did his deep breathing and didn't cry! I was pretty surprised! But if he's in yelling mode, the calming doesn't work--it seems to offend him and make him angrier.

The goal for sure is for him to express himself in a normal tone of voice. At this point it isn't even about what he's saying--I understand he's not going to agree and obey 100% of the time. I can deal with that. I just don't want him screaming his initial response at anyone who attempts to give him direction.


Have you tried giving him a warning that in a few minutes he's going to have to change what he's doing? "Ds, in two minutes, we are going to take a break front the Legos and go potty and then we will come back and play more Legos. ".

Even now with my big kids, I give them two or five minute warnings before we leave or I need them to do something or whatever.

This is something I need to be more consistent with, it does help during transitions. Sometimes I've said "you can play for 5 more minutes, then it's time to get ready for bed" and he'll accept/acknowledge that, and then I'll say "ok, now that you know that, you won't get upset when I say the time's up, right?" and he'll agree and then not get upset. I feel like a magician when this works!

In a similar vein, I need to try doing choices more, as Goldenpig suggested. We haven't really tried that at all, and I can see it being helpful in situations where the 5 min warning method doesn't apply.