Chicken Pox, Shingles and Vax Question

[mommylamb]

In light of our recent discussion on vaccines here, I was talking to my MIL about this. She is 71 years old and is visiting us from England right now. Obviously, she's of the generation that saw a lot of these diseases first hand, and she is very pro vaccine, though she herself hasn't gotten many vaccines because they weren't around when she was a kid.

In the course of our conversation, she told me that she has never had chicken pox. I assume that if you make it to 71 years old and you've never gotten CP and you haven't been vaccinated for it that you are probably one of those people who has a natural immunity. And I know she has been around CP because DH got it when he was 21, and he lived with her at the time. However, I wonder if she should still ask her doctor about getting the vaccine just in case. I can't even imagine how awful that would be to get CP at her age.

She has had the shingles vaccine (and I'm pretty sure you can't get shingles unless you've already had CP/the vax at some point in your life, so I'm not sure if the shingles vax was even necessary for her). Does anyone know if the shingles vax also protects against chicken pox, or if she would specifically need the varicella vaccine?

[basil]

Wikipedia says it's the same vaccine in a larger dose, so she wouldn't need it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shingles_vaccine

Chances are though that she at some point had a very mild case of chicken pox that went unnoticed/undiagnosed, maybe when she was very young.

[mommylamb]

Wikipedia says it's the same vaccine in a larger dose, so she wouldn't need it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shingles_vaccine



Good to know. Thanks!

[brittone2]

Maybe a titer? I had the varicella vax in high school after a titer confirmed I never had chicken pox.

The reason I am thinking she should ask her MD is that I recall some info that older folks don't always have enough of an immune response to the vaccine exposure for shingles. I know a few years ago there was some data regarding the older folks in the targeted range for the shingles vax not necessarily getting stellar protection (like 80+ yo might not get the same immune response to it vs. a 60 yo). I haven't looked at the info in a while but you might want to have her talk to her physician about that aspect of it.

edited to fix grammar typo

[mommylamb]

That's a good point. I am going to suggest that she ask her doctor about it regardless. I have no idea how normal it is to do titers in England. She is on the NHS, and doesn't have private supplementary insurance, so I'm not sure what is covered and what's not. I would be surprised if NHS covers titers. It doesn't even cover the flu vaccine unless you are one of the more at risk populations (which she is, as a senior, so she does get the flu vax). When I was lived there, I didn't get the flu vax because I wasn't one of the covered populations, and I got the flu that year. It was the only year I didn't get vaccinated for it and it knocked me out for a couple of weeks. There are wonderful things about single payer systems, but this isn't one of them.

[brittone2]

That's a good point. I am going to suggest that she ask her doctor about it regardless. I have no idea how normal it is to do titers in England. She is on the NHS, and doesn't have private supplementary insurance, so I'm not sure what is covered and what's not. I would be surprised if NHS covers titers. It doesn't even cover the flu vaccine unless you are one of the more at risk populations (which she is, as a senior, so she does get the flu vax). When I was lived there, I didn't get the flu vax because I wasn't one of the covered populations, and I got the flu that year. It was the only year I didn't get vaccinated for it and it knocked me out for a couple of weeks. There are wonderful things about single payer systems, but this isn't one of them.

Yeah, I don't think here in the US titers are covered all that frequently, and under NHS, I would assume it would be OOP.

[MaiseyDog]

Wikipedia says it's the same vaccine in a larger dose, so she wouldn't need it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shingles_vaccine

The shingles vaccine is the same as the chicken pox vaccine but at a higher dose. If she has had the shingles vaccine she is covered.

[egoldber]

Chances are though that she at some point had a very mild case of chicken pox that went unnoticed/undiagnosed, maybe when she was very young.

I never had the chicken pox and there was no vax when I was school age. When I was in my late 20s and wanted to start trying to get pregnant, my OB did a titer and I had natural immunity. So most likely I had an extremely mild case. I think this must be pretty common?

[citymama]

I'm a 41 year old who has never had CP and my sister hasn't either. We believe my 71 year old dad hasn't either, although he can't remember. My sister and I have both been around kids/adults with CP. We both had titers done, tested negative, and received the CP vax and booster. Then when I was considering getting pg with DD2, my OB took another titer, and it tested negative for antibodies again - as if I hadn't had the vax. So I took another vax and booster and guess what - still no antibodies. Maybe we have natural immunity, but I really don't want to get CP as an adult. It is terrible to get as an adult. She should get the titer and CP vax for sure - but just make sure she is with you long enough to get the booster (I think a month later).

My poor 70 yr old mom recently had shingles and it was absolutely hellacious and she is still in pain months later. I wish she had been vaxed.

[mommylamb]

I'm a 41 year old who has never had CP and my sister hasn't either. We believe my 71 year old dad hasn't either, although he can't remember. My sister and I have both been around kids/adults with CP. We both had titers done, tested negative, and received the CP vax and booster. Then when I was considering getting pg with DD2, my OB took another titer, and it tested negative for antibodies again - as if I hadn't had the vax. So I took another vax and booster and guess what - still no antibodies. Maybe we have natural immunity, but I really don't want to get CP as an adult. It is terrible to get as an adult. She should get the titer and CP vax for sure - but just make sure she is with you long enough to get the booster (I think a month later).

My poor 70 yr old mom recently had shingles and it was absolutely hellacious and she is still in pain months later. I wish she had been vaxed.

If she does anything, it won't be until after she gets back to the UK. She doesn't have insurance in the US anyway (of course), and she will only be here until Tuesday.

It is terrible to get it as an adult. DH got it when he was 21 and he said it was one of the most miserable experiences of his life. Oddly, he also had shingles about 10 years ago (he was in his mid 30s at the time), but it wasn't a bad case. In fact, we didn't even realize what it was. He had a rash on one side of his abdomen, and was achy and felt some pain, but he thought he had pulled a muscle badly and we didn't connect the rash with the pain. Neither of us knew anything about shingles at the time, other than it was some old person disease in our minds. Anyway, he went in to see a dermatologist about the rash, and the derm took one look at it and told him he had shingles, but he was almost done with it and there was nothing he could do at that point other than wait it out.

[egoldber]

DH got it when he was 21 and he said it was one of the most miserable experiences of his life. Oddly, he also had shingles about 10 years ago (he was in his mid 30s at the time), but it wasn't a bad case.

Some people are just more likely to get recurrent shingles. I have a friend whose mother gets shingles every few years despite getting the shingles vax. The shingles vax reduces the likelihood of recurrence shingles by about 60%.

[mackmama]

Not sure re the shingles issues -- but my 78yo MIL recently got the chicken pox vaccine for the first time (after being tested to see if she already had antibodies for it- which she didn't).

[mommylamb]

Some people are just more likely to get recurrent shingles. I have a friend whose mother gets shingles every few years despite getting the shingles vax. The shingles vax reduces the likelihood of recurrence shingles by about 60%.

DH hasn't had the shingles vax. We never would have thought to do it at his age. He got shingles itself. That was about 10 years ago and he hasn't had it again since. Maybe he should get the vax.


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[KLD313]

DH hasn't had the shingles vax. We never would have thought to do it at his age. He got shingles itself. That was about 10 years ago and he hasn't had it again since. Maybe he should get the vax.


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I'm wondering if I should get it as well. I had shingles in my early 20's and it was so bad I wanted to die. I never want to go through that again.