Do you think online friendships are as 'real' as in real life friendships?

[magnoliaparadise]

I ask this question because I am on a FB board and someone shared that they were in deep grief that a FB friend had just died. The person noted that she had never met the FB friend in person, but had known her for 20 years and was one of her closest friends. She said that she felt that she couldn't share her grief with her IRL friends because they wouldn't understand.

The interesting thing to me was the outpouring of (lovely) support, and how many posters noted how close they are to their online friends. Many said that online friendships were better because they could be more honest.

I did offer my condolences, and they were sincere, but a part of me thought: Online friends are not better. IRL friends ARE more gratifying. For me, at least, there is something about TALKING to a real live human being or SEEING and TOUCHING a real life human being that just feels different. Last week, at a conference, a neuropsych person said something like 'the good brain chemicals that get released in being with another person aren't released through texting or emails or FB. Good chemicals are only released through the evolutionary way of being in front of someone'. That really hit home because... that's how it feels to me. FB brings lots of communication with people, and certainly amazing resource referrals and empathy, but not in the way that talking or being in person with someone brings me joy.

Do you think online friendships whom you have never met are as good as IRL friendships? (I understand this is a difficult question because the intensity and strength of each individual friendship, whether online or IRL, varies).

[magnoliaparadise]

OP again. I am separating the post above with this 'response' post (or addendum) so that the post wasn't too long and so that people don't feel obliged to read it. So don't read if you don't want (of course).

I have so many thoughts about this... and it goes to the core of my ambivalence about online boards and online groups that I'm on... on the one hand, I really do feel like I can reach out to 'like minded' people over specific topics and they totally get it (since they are self selected in the group). And I do think sometimes there is more honesty and less 'little talk' online. And I do connect more 'personally' with FB people since our identities our shared.

On the other hand... I feel like the strength of my IRL set of friends right now are probably weaker than they have been at any time of my life. It's really sad to me and something I miss a lot. I do have IRL friends that are solid, and I think that many would think of me as very close, but for many, I just don't talk to them all that much (or email/text for that matter) and I miss the closeness. I have friends whom I love so much and really, we each only text each other every few months; Texts just don't do it for me as a 'catching up' formula. Or we email and say 'let's talk', but 15 years and counting, we just don't talk.

I wonder if the number of IRL friendships might be waning and why?
Maybe it's because many of us are online and our focus is dispersed.
Or maybe it's just because I have children and really can't see/talk by phone to everybody in person like I used to - and same with them.
Or maybe it's because people pick up and move now more and more now and friends are scattered around so it's harder to keep in touch.
Or maybe it's me and I'm just really bad at keeping in touch or sustaining IRL friendships in the way I want. Or that I'm somehow not a good friend.

Honestly, I don't know!

[dogmom]

The simple answer is no, online is not as "real" as IRL, but it's not because they are more or less satisfying. I think it's because they are simpler and less messy. If I have some blow out with someone online or find out they aren't as interesting, it's a lot easier to drop them without guilt. Heck, I can just hit a button to "unfriend" them. If I find out some parent of my child's friend who I thought was cool turns out to be a screaming racist I don't have a magic button to push to never see them in the pick up line ever again. I have a few really good friends, we have been through ups and downs and somehow preserve what we mean to each other. I am not saying one can't have real bonds with people online or that they can fill a need. I think it is really an apples and oranges comparison. There are a few online relationships that have really helped me during specific times. For example, if I'm up all night with a colicky baby someone I met from this board who has gone through the exact same thing might be exactly what I need for a few months and we can support each other. But when the kids get older we might not have much to bond over. Of course I do think this mimics real life. People that I like hanging out with at my kids soccer games I don't have much to do with no that my DS isn't playing sports and their son is a all about sports. Sort of sad, but for me it's important to an honest accounting of what role we actually play in each other's life. My DH has a much different experience than me. He's had a group of friends since right after high school he is still friends with over 30 years later. They are MUCH different people than him and he's the one that calls them idiots most of the time, but he's still friends with them. Of course they are a bunch of guys and spend all their time talking about D&D and video games. He comes back form spending 12 hours with them and I ask, "How is so and so doing? How's the new job?" And he is "I don't know, we didn't talk about that." It's now a standing joke. Of course the one guy I actually really like is the only one he will call and have an hour long conversation with. I think different people have different approaches to relationships and no one way is the right or wrong way. I will say, however, that I recently ditched FB entirely and I find myself making more of an effort to find and get together with people I really like IRL. Some of it is I'm older, the kids are older, and it's easier to get together with people. I can also see the empty nest coming down the pike in 5 years. I think FB and time on boards like these can give the illusion of connection that can get you by in the short term, but it can be like a sugar laden dessert that doesn't fill one up long term.

[candaceb]

No, I don't think that online-only friendships are the same. However, they can provide support at a time when you really need it due to specific circumstances.
Magnolia - I "knew" you from another board at a different time in life. On that board, I connected with a woman who was on bedrest at the same time as I was. We each ended up losing our sons. None of her IRL friends were supporting her while she was on bedrest or after he died. I have never spoken to her on the phone, but if I ever go to the place where she lives across the country, I would try to meet her. We haven't emailed in years and I noticed last year I didn't get a Christmas card, but that friendship was there when I needed it.
I have another friend who I met on a cooking board and is one of my closest friends. By luck, I moved to a place about 1.5 hours away from her a year or so after we connected online, and I met her IRL shortly after that. We spoke on the phone for an hour yesterday. I'm flying to Boston for her daughter's Bat Mitzvah in December. So that friendship has crossed over and I no longer consider her to be an online friend. We call each other our "chosen sisters" because we each have an actual sister who sucks.
I also have a whole network of friends that formed on that same cooking board in 2001. A group of about 100 moved to a secret facebook group. I have met about 20 of them IRL over the years. We call ourselves "the hive". If I need an opinion on something, I know where to get it. When I was having marital troubles, I turned to the board and got all kinds of advice. We support each other. One member lives financially precariously due to a decision to adopt 2 kids out of foster care as a single woman, and then one kid has special needs that make it hard for her to have a full time job. She was robbed in the middle of the night a couple of months ago and the thieves took all of their electronics, including her phone, her car key to her new car that she finally got after months of ubering, and her kids' kindles. I organized a drive, and we sent her $600 to replace her phone and have her car key reprogrammed (so the thieves couldn't come back for the car) and we sent each kid a $100 amazon gift card so they could replace their things that were taken. We definitely have friendships and support, but not the same as the one woman who I talk to on the phone regularly.

[magnoliaparadise]

No, I don't think that online-only friendships are the same. However, they can provide support at a time when you really need it due to specific circumstances.
Magnolia - I "knew" you from another board at a different time in life. On that board, I connected with a woman who was on bedrest at the same time as I was. We each ended up losing our sons. None of her IRL friends were supporting her while she was on bedrest or after he died. I have never spoken to her on the phone, but if I ever go to the place where she lives across the country, I would try to meet her. We haven't emailed in years and I noticed last year I didn't get a Christmas card, but that friendship was there when I needed it.
I have another friend who I met on a cooking board and is one of my closest friends. By luck, I moved to a place about 1.5 hours away from her a year or so after we connected online, and I met her IRL shortly after that. We spoke on the phone for an hour yesterday. I'm flying to Boston for her daughter's Bat Mitzvah in December. So that friendship has crossed over and I no longer consider her to be an online friend. We call each other our "chosen sisters" because we each have an actual sister who sucks.
I also have a whole network of friends that formed on that same cooking board in 2001. A group of about 100 moved to a secret facebook group. I have met about 20 of them IRL over the years. We call ourselves "the hive". If I need an opinion on something, I know where to get it. When I was having marital troubles, I turned to the board and got all kinds of advice. We support each other. One member lives financially precariously due to a decision to adopt 2 kids out of foster care as a single woman, and then one kid has special needs that make it hard for her to have a full time job. She was robbed in the middle of the night a couple of months ago and the thieves took all of their electronics, including her phone, her car key to her new car that she finally got after months of ubering, and her kids' kindles. I organized a drive, and we sent her $600 to replace her phone and have her car key reprogrammed (so the thieves couldn't come back for the car) and we sent each kid a $100 amazon gift card so they could replace their things that were taken. We definitely have friendships and support, but not the same as the one woman who I talk to on the phone regularly.

I'm sorry for your loss. I hope that you had a lot of support.

About the cooking group, what an amazing online group you are in. That's so COOL!!!! I'm envious!!!! That sounds like SUCH a fantastic group!!

It also makes me a wee bit sad thinking of all these great groups and possibilities that are now more shut off because while I was doing something else, they were forming and are now secret. I am in two secret groups, but it still feels sad to think that I might have missed out on some great groups that, like mine, splintered off, if that makes sense.

And... I didn't know we 'knew' each other in another group?... My BBB box is all full up and I have some weird mental block to going back and reading and deleting realllllly old messages, but I want to pm you to find out which group it is.

I have been on many boards and groups in my past, mainly local ones in different areas, many for child related stuff, single parenthood, some losing weight/eating healthy ones, a donor one, and a big fertility related one.

I had fertility issues for many years and those peeps helped me a ton. I lost touch with so many of them - some of them I pm'd all the time and really felt so helped and healed by.

I actually used to be more active on my groups before I just got into too many and now mainly just do BBB.

[magnoliaparadise]

The simple answer is no, online is not as "real" as IRL, but it's not because they are more or less satisfying. I think it's because they are simpler and less messy. If I have some blow out with someone online or find out they aren't as interesting, it's a lot easier to drop them without guilt. Heck, I can just hit a button to "unfriend" them. If I find out some parent of my child's friend who I thought was cool turns out to be a screaming racist I don't have a magic button to push to never see them in the pick up line ever again. I have a few really good friends, we have been through ups and downs and somehow preserve what we mean to each other. I am not saying one can't have real bonds with people online or that they can fill a need. I think it is really an apples and oranges comparison. There are a few online relationships that have really helped me during specific times. For example, if I'm up all night with a colicky baby someone I met from this board who has gone through the exact same thing might be exactly what I need for a few months and we can support each other. But when the kids get older we might not have much to bond over. Of course I do think this mimics real life. People that I like hanging out with at my kids soccer games I don't have much to do with no that my DS isn't playing sports and their son is a all about sports. Sort of sad, but for me it's important to an honest accounting of what role we actually play in each other's life. My DH has a much different experience than me. He's had a group of friends since right after high school he is still friends with over 30 years later. They are MUCH different people than him and he's the one that calls them idiots most of the time, but he's still friends with them. Of course they are a bunch of guys and spend all their time talking about D&D and video games. He comes back form spending 12 hours with them and I ask, "How is so and so doing? How's the new job?" And he is "I don't know, we didn't talk about that." It's now a standing joke. Of course the one guy I actually really like is the only one he will call and have an hour long conversation with. I think different people have different approaches to relationships and no one way is the right or wrong way. I will say, however, that I recently ditched FB entirely and I find myself making more of an effort to find and get together with people I really like IRL. Some of it is I'm older, the kids are older, and it's easier to get together with people. I can also see the empty nest coming down the pike in 5 years. I think FB and time on boards like these can give the illusion of connection that can get you by in the short term, but it can be like a sugar laden dessert that doesn't fill one up long term.

I'm of the same mind about FB. I do use it and really appreciate it, but notice that going online makes me feel more isolated, not less. I think the studies are kind of all over the map on that. I'm impressed that you just went cold turkey off of it.

And I, too, feel the empty nest feelings, even though my kid is 8 years away! I know that's a long way away, but I already see that she wants (never mind needs) me less, sometimes asking me to not come with her places, etc so she can have more independence. Which is all great, don't get my wrong. But I can see from my friends' kids that this is just the beginning... So... perhaps that is why I'm searching for my IRL friendships, or sustaining older friendships, too.

And I agree completely with what you said about the 'drop the person' on FB factor. I have a friend and she wrote something unusual politically on her FB page (unusual because it somehow angered both liberals and conservatives) and I got into this 'thing' with the guy who was politically very different than me. We went back and forth for way too much time and finally agreed to disagree (not in a kind way, I am sad to say) and then it was... done. I realized HOW relieved I was to just have that non-relationship done, knowing that I would never have to see that guy's name again. I was angry at myself for wasting so much time arguing with him (as I'm sure he was with me), but SO happy at the clean-ending. I was literally grateful. That doesn't happen so easily in real life, you're right.

[candaceb]

And... I didn't know we 'knew' each other in another group?... My BBB box is all full up and I have some weird mental block to going back and reading and deleting realllllly old messages, but I want to pm you to find out which group it is.

I have been on many boards and groups in my past, mainly local ones in different areas, many for child related stuff, single parenthood, some losing weight/eating healthy ones, a donor one, and a big fertility related one.

I had fertility issues for many years and those peeps helped me a ton. I lost touch with so many of them - some of them I pm'd all the time and really felt so helped and healed by.

It was the big fertility related group that no longer exists

[Green_Tea]

I have several online friends that I am very, very close with. Many I have met, some I have not. I do not consider our friendship to be any less "real", just different. We have been through a lot together!

[MontrealMum]

Yes, I do think they can be as "real". Different, but real.

I'm part of a very tight knit online group. Some I've met, others I haven't. Not once upon meeting one have I thought, gee, you're really not who I thought you'd be!

Although I have IRL friends who are wonderful, they don't always share the same educational background, values, or aspirations that I do, and they're not always in the same stage of life (raising kids) that I am. These women provide a very real support for me that I can't get always from IRL friends whose life circumstances are different. :hug5:

[Kindra178]

I have several online friends that I am very, very close with. Many I have met, some I have not. I do not consider our friendship to be any less "real", just different. We have been through a lot together!

Yes to this! Very real, just different! I like how their perspective comes from different places in the country/Canada.


Sent from my iPhone using Baby Bargains (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=87652)

[AnnieW625]

I have several online friends that I am very, very close with. Many I have met, some I have not. I do not consider our friendship to be any less "real", just different. We have been through a lot together!

Yes to this! I have been part of an online makeup forum for almost 20 years that is now exclusively a private FB group, but I have met some of the members in person and others I have not. I even became close friends with one after we realized we went to SDSU at the same time and somehow never had a class together even though our majors over lapped a bunch. It did make explaining how we met to her then BF (now DH) easier. As a group we have been though marriages, divorces, infertility, loss of pregnancy, babies being born, military deployments of women and or their spouses, and death of members together. We are a family. We have seen a few of the members become successful beauty bloggers as well and one I can say I have known online since she was in college and had no idea makeup and fashion would be her life and that she would successful at it.

Kind of the same applies to people on this forum as well. I never would’ve gotten through the loss of baby 2 without the members who were here in 2009. I have met a few members here as well.

[basil]

I have an online friend that I "met" in 2000 in an AOL IM chat room I want to when I was procrastinating studying in college. I don't think I'll ever meet that friend IRL, but for 18 years we've been in contact every few months. Some years more than others. It's not not real, but different than my IRL friends. For whatever reason, IRL, my friends at any given stage in life are pretty much situational..like we work the same place or have kids the same age, etc. This is different because we have nothing physical in common, but still a bond. I don't talk about it, pretty much ever.

[wendibird22]

Yes, but I guess my "online" FB friends are a bit different than those that most of you describe. I have met many of them through work. They have or at one point had the same career as me and we know of each other through that commonality. Some have been speakers, vendors, or other interested parties at conferences for that profession. So I have met them but never established an IRL friendship because we all work across the country. But I have become very connected with a subset of them in the way we have gotten to know each other over FB. When I see these people 1x a year it's like a high school reunion with my best friends. But I don't consider them IRL friends though because we don't see each other the other 51 weeks a year and we don't speak on the phone. I know without a doubt if something horrible happened to me that a large portion of these individuals would be there for me and my family in a heartbeat.

[TwinFoxes]

I have online only friends who mean the world to me. I can’t imagine not being friends with them.

It’s fine that you don’t feel that way, but people are different.

I think you should try taking friendships as they are. I may be confusing you with another poster, but I feel like you’ve bemoaned losing a friend a few times. Maybe more flexible friendship “rules” (for lack of a better term) will help. It’s fine with me if I don’t physically meet someone, or years go by without talking on the phone. Texting back and forth is fine by me! I know I can depend on my friends, and we support and care for each other. That’s more important than face to face meetings (although those are great too!)

[bisous]

I guess I’ll be the dissenter. I have made some connections online over the years that have been valuable to me but it is most definitely not on the level of my IRL friendships. Don’t get me wrong! I value my associates in various FB groups and boards very much but it isn’t even close to the same for me.

[Globetrotter]

I have bonded with people on this board and a couple others, And I’ve even made a couple of irl BFFs from those connections.
However, the one That has the strongest connections is a group of moms whose kids are all born the same month. We have been in touch since they were born and have gone through so many life events together, Including cheating husbands, death of one of the kids, illness, teen pregnsncy, drug use, and of course all the joyous life milestones.. We know everything about each other and tell each other things we don’t even tell our Irl friends. I have met several over the years, even though they live all over the world, and I consider them good friends.

Like a PP said, in some ways it is less complicated since they don’t live nearby and we don’t have the day-to-day misunderstandings that might occur otherwise. For the past several years, it has moved to a secret FB page and we don’t share as often as we used to, but when they were growing up it was a daily part of my life. We are regular FB friends too so we get to see updates that way.

[lizzywednesday]

I ask this question because I am on a FB board and someone shared that they were in deep grief that a FB friend had just died. The person noted that she had never met the FB friend in person, but had known her for 20 years and was one of her closest friends. She said that she felt that she couldn't share her grief with her IRL friends because they wouldn't understand.

...

Do you think online friendships whom you have never met are as good as IRL friendships? (I understand this is a difficult question because the intensity and strength of each individual friendship, whether online or IRL, varies).

Yes, they are, especially for those of us who are more introverted or who do not have IRL friends nearby.

I have been participating in message board culture since the early aughts. While it's true that I have had the good fortune to have met a fair few of my online friends, there are quite a few others who I feel a certain kind of closeness to that is incomprehensible to many of my IRL friends ... and more than a few family members. These are fulfilling relationships into which I have put a lot of time & effort, and I would not be the kind of person I am today without those treasured friends.

They die, they stop participating in or outgrow the board, the board goes dead, whatever, but don't tell me my online friends aren't "real" friends.

[smilequeen]

It's different but to me, yes, it's real. I'm honestly quite introverted and don't really open up to people as much face to face. Online lets me relax a little more and be more open. I'm honestly really thankful to have the ability to create and maintain online relationships. I love the friends I have that I see regularly as well, but my personality does keep me a bit more reserved there...save for the friends I've had since highschool and college.

[erosenst]

It was the big fertility related group that no longer exists

Ok - now I'm curious - were your user names the same? (Mine was not...)

And to answer OPs question - the board referenced above is the only one where I was ever very active, but I was VERY active 10-15 years ago. I have met several of my 'friends' from that board and now consider them IRL friends; there are a few more that I haven't met (yet) but still consider to be friends although not as close, and we keep up via FB. A couple of the ones I've met have crossed into 'good friends' territory, and are no different than my other friends who don't live in the same city I do. Depending on the event/issue/occasion - they may be one of the first I reach out to to talk about it.

[candaceb]

Ok - now I'm curious - were your user names the same? (Mine was not...)



I'm pretty sure I had the same name there, and magnolia had one letter that was different.

[mackmama]

I guess I’ll be the dissenter. I have made some connections online over the years that have been valuable to me but it is most definitely not on the level of my IRL friendships. Don’t get me wrong! I value my associates in various FB groups and boards very much but it isn’t even close to the same for me.

I agree with this.

[vonfirmath]

No, I don't think that online-only friendships are the same. However, they can provide support at a time when you really need it due to specific circumstances.
Magnolia - I "knew" you from another board at a different time in life. On that board, I connected with a woman who was on bedrest at the same time as I was. We each ended up losing our sons. None of her IRL friends were supporting her while she was on bedrest or after he died. I have never spoken to her on the phone, but if I ever go to the place where she lives across the country, I would try to meet her. We haven't emailed in years and I noticed last year I didn't get a Christmas card, but that friendship was there when I needed it.
I have another friend who I met on a cooking board and is one of my closest friends. By luck, I moved to a place about 1.5 hours away from her a year or so after we connected online, and I met her IRL shortly after that. We spoke on the phone for an hour yesterday. I'm flying to Boston for her daughter's Bat Mitzvah in December. So that friendship has crossed over and I no longer consider her to be an online friend. We call each other our "chosen sisters" because we each have an actual sister who sucks.
I also have a whole network of friends that formed on that same cooking board in 2001. A group of about 100 moved to a secret facebook group. I have met about 20 of them IRL over the years. We call ourselves "the hive". If I need an opinion on something, I know where to get it. When I was having marital troubles, I turned to the board and got all kinds of advice. We support each other. One member lives financially precariously due to a decision to adopt 2 kids out of foster care as a single woman, and then one kid has special needs that make it hard for her to have a full time job. She was robbed in the middle of the night a couple of months ago and the thieves took all of their electronics, including her phone, her car key to her new car that she finally got after months of ubering, and her kids' kindles. I organized a drive, and we sent her $600 to replace her phone and have her car key reprogrammed (so the thieves couldn't come back for the car) and we sent each kid a $100 amazon gift card so they could replace their things that were taken. We definitely have friendships and support, but not the same as the one woman who I talk to on the phone regularly.

I'm still best friends with someone I met online back in 1991.
It is harder to keep a friendship going at a distance.

We only knew each other online for a couple of years. Then I moved to Washington and we were roommates for a time before I got my own place. But we still talk, and when I go to visit I make time to see her, etc.

[american_mama]

she had never met the FB friend in person, but had known her for 20 years and was one of her closest friends. She said that she felt that she couldn't share her grief with her IRL friends because they wouldn't understand.

The interesting thing to me was the outpouring of (lovely) support, and how many posters noted how close they are to their online friends. Many said that online friendships were better because they could be more honest.

I did offer my condolences, and they were sincere, but a part of me thought: Online friends are not better. IRL friends ARE more gratifying.

Hmm, I used to describe people on this board as "internet friends" but I meant that as both descriptor and qualifier. We were friends only in the context of this board, even though I did meet people in person, including locally, a few times. I found that I admired people greatly on the board for their wit, knowledge, writing style and common perspectives as me.... but that in person, those commonalities did not rise to the surface. Maybe we were shy to know each other well online, but have the reservations of meeting each other in person as strangers.

I have not made other online friends. I participated in on cloth diaper board for years, but kind of made a point to not pay attention to user names or make personal connections. My FB friends are small (70ish people) and all people I know from real life. A few are people I haven't seen since high school or neighbors from years ago who have since moved out of state, and I know them more know through FB because they post frequently and very openly about parts of their lives. So I feel like I know their lives and am interested in what they have to say, but don't really feel a personal connection to them.

I think online friends can seem better, but that it's probably a deception. You can read a lot into what somebody writes to make the humor or connection a little greater than it is. You ignore or don't know irritating things that show up in real life - a voice, a definition of personal space, etc. You can deal with someone very much on your terms rather than the give and take, good and bad times of IRL> I am sometimes more honest in what I write, but that's a deception..... for instance, in real life, I talk very little about sex, but I am a little freer with that online. But the real me who does not feel comfortable talking to adult friends about about sexual lives, so if I am doing it in writing, I am being a little false (not in my thoughts on it, but in my comfort level discussing it).

Was your friend on FB for 20 years with this person? I didn't think FB was anywhere near that old.

As for friendships today, yes, I think as a society our IRL friendships are waning. We are busy with working, commuting, managing relationships and daily life with those kind of pressures. We have a lot of options for leisure, much of it which can be done solo but feel social, so we can turn to those rather than IRL. I think these factors are so common it has very little to do with being a good or bad friend.

I have one friend who moved across the country about 4 years ago. She started writing long, personal updates via email to a select group of a dozen friends. SHe wrote these updates 1-3 times a year and they were pretty honest about the good and the bad, well-written and a pleasure to read even when the topic was less positive. This has helped me stay connected to her and I appreciate the small group emails.

YOu didn't mention this, but another thing that happens in long distance relationships is that sometimes one person initiates the phone calls in a relationship and it doesn't mean the receiver isn't interested. I have been on both sides of this, as the perpetual caller and perpetual receiver with various people. It's just how it works out sometimes, and if the conversation is good and you enjoy each other, don't sweat who is always making or not making the phone calls.