Dd has extreme arm tingling

[JustMe]

Sigh, dd called me today when school was almost out to pick her up as she began experiencing extreme arm tingling, dizzyiness, and some feelings of weakness to the point she was in tears. I brought her to urgent care where her blood pressure, pulse, and blood sugar were normal. She recently had bloodwork and that was all normal. We were released from urgent care and told to just to to the ER if anything gets worse or we feel we need to and schedule with her pediatrician. Her ped. is on vacation this week and we can't get in until next Friday. We could get in with another dr, but I don't know that it makes sense to see someone who does not know her as well if "urgent" things have been ruled out.

Dd has had a seizure and 2 syncopes in the past; she has also had an MRI. She does have anxiety, but is adamant that is not what is going on here. As a therapist, I know there are some overlaps here, but I think at this point we need to continue to rule out medical causes.

Any thoughts on what to do or what to look into?

[mom2binsd]

If she has had some anxiety and something like a pinched nerve is causing the pain it could be contributing factor. Did urgent care do a tox screen? How are the symptoms now? If it's not better in the am, at least go see a ped from her ped's practice, they will have her records at least.

When DD who is the same age was in the ER last year, the toxicology screen was one of the first things they did, it's almost routine according to my ER nurse friend, with high school kids as they want to rule out any type of medication/drug in the system (not saying your DD took anything, but kids are exposed to all kinds of things at school and have read about kids thinking it's fun to put something in another kids food etc.) They even asked DD if someone gave her any "candy" at school. In her case it was dehydration and low blood sugar from not eating and drinking while doing 2 a day swim practices.

[Snow mom]

My first thought was anxiety or even her autonomic nervous system messing with her. With your autonomic nervous system you don't have to feel panicked for your body to put out a response. I was recently stung by a wasp and passed out. I didn't feel panicked about anything going on until I got dizzy and short of breath. And even then it was more of a "this isn't good" thought. But my body was somehow in a panic even though there was nothing serious going on medically. Anyway, not saying that you shouldn't rule out other causes but what you describe sounds really familiar to my recent experience.

ETA: Before I passed out the first thing that happened is I got dizzy. I was going to call someone and between the dizziness and tingling/numb hands I dropped my phone. I also had some tightness in my chest and shortness of breath. And then I was on the ground with the phone next to me. Best advice I got in the ER was if you feel like you might pass out get down on the ground. That will save you from hitting something on the way down.

[KpbS]

Has she had a change in any medication (forgotten doses? discontinuation?) recently?

[Myira]

What about something like a B12 deficiency? Do you know what her levels have been if she has been tested in the past?

I hope you get answers soon and it turns out to be something simple.


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[JustMe]

What about something like a B12 deficiency? Do you know what her levels have been if she has been tested in the past?

I hope you get answers soon and it turns out to be something simple.


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This actually is a concern of mine, but her ped has pooh-poohed this and we have not gotten testing in the past. Dd does have MTHFR gene mutation and we are vegetarians (although she eats lots of eggs and does dairy). What do I say to back up my concern about this?

-She does not take medication
-They did not do a tox screen, which surprised me as we have had to go to the ER/Urgent care for other reasons and they are always doing tox screens and pregnancy tests. I am not concerned about this. I understand it is always a possibility, but she has had some of these symptoms at home and for, she did not eat anything from anyone else today, and for various other reasons, I feel fine not considering this possibility.
-Anxiety could be the culprit, but how do you know when to stop ruling out medical causes. Dd swears this is not how she experiences anxiety and panic, but I am well aware it could still be anxiety.
-I wondered about a pinched nerve because that came up when I googled. How does that get diagnosed?
-The urgent care place was able to see her records (same company as her pediatrician's place; just different location) and talked about things based on the records. We have had things go okay by seeing another ped. when our ped was not available and also not okay in terms of the referrals made, so if she feels fine tomorrow I tend to lean towards wanting to wait to see her ped. I also can e-mail her ped and she will likely see it by Tuesday when they say she is back from vacation.

Thanks!
-

[marymoo86]

POTS? Was that ruled out?

[JustMe]

POTS? Was that ruled out?

I did worry about POTS, but today I was able to get her in while having symptoms and her blood pressure was perfect; not too high, not too low. It did not change while we were there.

[JustMe]

I really think its a B-12 deficiency, but her ped is not going to be helpful with that. I don't have faith in any of the local naturopaths (tried a couple for myself for other reasons) so if anyone has any ideas about how to get this accurately tested let me know! Thanks!

[essnce629]

I really think its a B-12 deficiency, but her ped is not going to be helpful with that. I don't have faith in any of the local naturopaths (tried a couple for myself for other reasons) so if anyone has any ideas about how to get this accurately tested let me know! Thanks!Honestly, I would just tell my doctor I wanted B-12 testing and she would order it. I have a homozygous MTHFR mutation but my B-12 level always tests abnormally high even though I've never taken supplements.

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[marymoo86]

I did worry about POTS, but today I was able to get her in while having symptoms and her blood pressure was perfect; not too high, not too low. It did not change while we were there.

Tingling could also indicate magnesium deficiency issues and since there's not a good source of B vitamins, Retinol, Copper, I would be concerned about mineral status. You can address mag deficiency but needs these cofactors to be utilized correctly.

Have you had a hair mineral analysis done? I wonder about heavy metal toxicity given the MTHFR complications (not knowing the specifics, throwing it out there). I think the onset of the syncope issues were after HPV vax? That has a very high level of Aluminum and wonder if she is having issues related to that? Sorry if off base but since you mentioned MTHFR this is the firs thing to come to mind hence the POTS question.

[JustMe]

-essnce629, do you do anything for your MTHFR/B related issues? That is a whole long story for us. Dd and I are not biologically related, but she is homozygous and I am heterozygous, but with a family hx of early heart attacks. I have been to numerous naturopaths for myself,hoping to find a good one that I would then bring dd to, but they have all been unhelpful.

marymoo86, how would I get such a hair test done? I do think you may be going in the right direction. I thought POTS myself, and I was thrilled to be able to get her into a dr yesterday when she was having symptoms as I thought for sure her blood pressure would be low; but it was not. Yes, she had a syncope/seizure 3 weeks after having the HPV vaccine and that was the first sign of any of this.

[mom2binsd]

It sounds like more of a sudden onset, which makes me think of an injury etc. I had some numbness and tingling that persisted until I was adjusted by a chiropractor.

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[marymoo86]

-essnce629, do you do anything for your MTHFR/B related issues? That is a whole long story for us. Dd and I are not biologically related, but she is homozygous and I am heterozygous, but with a family hx of early heart attacks. I have been to numerous naturopaths for myself,hoping to find a good one that I would then bring dd to, but they have all been unhelpful.

marymoo86, how would I get such a hair test done? I do think you may be going in the right direction. I thought POTS myself, and I was thrilled to be able to get her into a dr yesterday when she was having symptoms as I thought for sure her blood pressure would be low; but it was not. Yes, she had a syncope/seizure 3 weeks after having the HPV vaccine and that was the first sign of any of this.

You can order yourself or if your doctor agrees - can as well. Most are none to savvy on balancing minerals or impact of imbalance. Your naturopath maybe be useful here or you can do directly:

https://www.evenbetternow.com/proddetail.php?prod=Hair-Analysis-Basic-Report

If you want a further deep dive into mineral status:

https://www.ultawellness.com/Shop/Items/Item/MAG-Vit-A-D-Mag-RBC-Zinc-Iron-Ferritin

https://requestatest.com/mag-zinc-copper-panel-with-iron-panel-plus-vitamin-a-and-vitamin-d-test

[Melaine]

So my very first stop would be chiro. That being said, chiropractic does not help my tingling.

I have had tingling, buzzing, paresthesia sensations for almost 14 years. Sometimes it's in a new place, other times I have months of repetitive tingling in the same spot.

I DO have MTHFR. I also have done a hair analysis twice one about 13 years ago and once last year. I definitely have lots of mineral balance issues and metal toxicity. I have also been low iron, low b-12, and low magnesium but none of the supplements from those have resolved my paresthesia. Sometimes it will go away for some months, then return. It might be feeling like a hair is touching my hand for a few weeks, then it will switch to tingling more like when you hit your funny bone, sometimes it feels like an actual vibrating cell phone under skin. I had one place on the back of my leg that was tingling or vibrating every few seconds to every few minutes persistently without relief for over a year. I would wear leggings or socks to try to distract myself from feeling it. I had a long time where I felt like a hair on my scalp was laying the wrong way. Sometimes I get localized goosebumps without cause also.

I have had an MRI, totally normal.

I have severe anxiety and my doctors seem to mostly agree that that is probably my root cause. I did have relief for the most part over the summer when I was excercising daily. I also had relief years ago when I went on Prozac (but from what I've read, it would have silenced the sensations even if they were from a different root cause). My integrative doctor believes my anxiety is rooted in some of my metal toxicity so I am using a product right now to detox. I am definitely noticing a lot of improvements after three months on TRS detox spray.

It's my personal opinion that the symptoms you are describing could be from anxiety. Anxiety is such a tricky thing, even when I am not experiencing stress directly, I often suffer from symptoms. I have actually had horrible tingling over the last 4 days and do feel better today after two doses of a B complex.

Let us know what you figure out please!

[SnuggleBuggles]

I had a pinched nerve after a blood draw. But, aside from tingling and some numbness, I didn't have dizziness or such.

[BunnyBee]

Did she see a neurologist for the seizures? That could be a focal onset seizure. Tingling, numbness, almost paralyzing weakness. They changed the names of everything, and I can’t remember what the other names are...

[JustMe]

So much great info, thanks!
I could believe any or all of thosr suggested are at fault.
-a blood draw causing a pinched nerve,? I didn't know that was a thing,.as my dad would say, but she did have a good draw a couple of days before the symptoms started.
-anxiety, could be the root cause (or is there a different root cause of the anxiety?
-she was discharged from her neurologist a couple of years ago as her symptoms stabilized and she was not having any new ones, but I'm guessing it's likely we will end up back there.
I forgot if I said this earlier come up but she now has an appointment with another doctor in her pediatricians practice tomorrow afternoon so we'll see how that goes

Thanks!

[dogmom]

Just FYI to anyone reading this, there is a thing called thoracic outlet syndrome I've seen go on for a while before getting diagnosed property. Presentation is usually hand numbness (mostly one side) with should/neck pain at times. I've also seen it present as clots in the arm. We see in fast growing adolescents, and is more common in tall an thin people? Not sure about the last bit, but 90% of the patients I see have that body type. There is also pectoralis minor syndrome, which can go with it.

[chlobo]

There are companies where you can order the tests yourself. Not sure if its available in your state. http://ultawellness.com. In our state, this company uses Quest, which is the same lab a lot of doctors use.

[JustMe]

Thanks everyone! We went to the other dr in her pediatrician's practice (the ped is on vacation until next week) and it was very frustrating. The dr refused my request for B vitamin testing, stating that its not something they do. I get their perspective to some point, as they just don't believe that is an issue. However, she had no other answers for me and, initially with a smile on her face, told me no other follow up was necessary (again bp was normal, she did a basic exam, including some basic ped. neurological stuff, etc). I persisted about how dd initially had some B vitamin deficiency symptoms and they seem to be increasing. She did say she would talk to our ped.and get back to us. Big suggestion was to add a multivitamin. Ummn, not enough right now.

I have no issue with doing the independent testing for B vitamin deficiency and paying for it, as it looks reasonable enough. The only problem is I can't seem to find a test for methylmalonic acid, which seems important, as according to what I read this is how the deficiency sometimes first shows up.

ETA: oops, never mind I was able to find a test for the methylmaconic acid. Those of you who know about B vitamin deficiency, would these be the tests you would want?
B 12
Folate
Methylmalonic acid

Looks like I can get the above for $167 from ultawellness

(I do see the suggestions about other toxicity or vitamin/mineral deficiencies, but I feel this is a good place to start unless I can do it all at a reasonable price). Thanks)

[petesgirl]

I really think its a B-12 deficiency, but her ped is not going to be helpful with that. I don't have faith in any of the local naturopaths (tried a couple for myself for other reasons) so if anyone has any ideas about how to get this accurately tested let me know! Thanks!

Haven't read all the responses but can you have an urgent care Dr order it, or take her to your Dr, for the test. Seriously, it is very likely she has a B12 deficiency being vegetarian and that tingling is exactly what the deficiency causes. I've just been through this in the past year and supplementing with B12 will make her feel so much better. The deficiency can also cause vision problems, has she complained of that at all?

[KpbS]

She also could start eating some meats and see if there is a resolution of the symptoms. Barring an allergy, this plus adding a multivitamin is the most cost effective, quickest ways to resolve the problem.

[Gracemom]

I'm really sorry she's dealing with this. I don't understand why doctors won't order a simple blood test if we are willing to pay for it. I had tingling in my hands and my doctor said it was stress. I kept having it so I went to a nurse practitioner who did the blood work and I had b12 deficiency (I'm not vegetarian but I don't care for much meat). Sublingual tablets made me feel so much better. I have more energy and less anxiety too.

[TwinFoxes]

I'm really surprise they refused to test for a B12 deficiency. I'm not sure I've ever had a request for a routine test turned down. I mean, I'm not requesting MRIs or anything.

I bet if you went to like at Target clinic they would either do it, or write the order for a test.

[JustMe]

Sigh, it is both positive and frustrating to see the responses about how other doctors would easily order a b vitamin test. I know her developmental pediatrician, who is a separate doctor, would order it for us and even likely suspect the same as I do, but he is on family medical leave for an unknown amount of time.

My Dr. can't see her as we have different types of insurance. I don't believe we have a Target clinic.

I am very inactive on Facebook, and the only local group I am part of is a parents of children with special needs group, so I am going to post on there and see if anyone has any ideas about how I can get a doctor to order this. Otherwise, I guess I just pay for it which is not the end of the world. I just do want to make sure it is a reputable lab, and that is the issue.

[hbridge]

Call the developmental pediatrician and get in with whoever is seeing his/her patients. Explain what is happening and that, while your child's doctor is not available, she needs to see someone ASAP. If there is no one taking on the doctor's patients while he/she is on leave, you need to find a new developmental pediatrician with doctors that are on call when they cannot be available.

Getting tests for vitamin deficiencies should NOT be this hard!

Sending hugs!

[JustMe]

Call the developmental pediatrician and get in with whoever is seeing his/her patients. Explain what is happening and that, while your child's doctor is not available, she needs to see someone ASAP. If there is no one taking on the doctor's patients while he/she is on leave, you need to find a new developmental pediatrician with doctors that are on call when they cannot be available.

Sending hugs!

Thanks! I may try that, but in the past I have been less than pleased with the other developmental peds. in the practice. Ours is known to be awesome, and is a favorite with special needs parents, so he is not so easily switched out for, even for a visit. I may call them and see what they say on Monday. Other option is she is saw a gastroendocrinologist for the first time a couple of weeks ago and we are not scheduled to see her again until mid-Nov (more from a caseload management point of view than anything else), but I may try calling her office and seeing what they say as well.

[TwinFoxes]

I don't believe we have a Target clinic.



You should check, there may be one near you. Or check CVS. Anyplace that has a drop in clinic.

[dogmom]

OK, I hesitated to post this several responses back, but decided to go for it. Please don’t shoot the messenger.

The reason many physicians don’t test for vit B is the tests have poor correlation to symptoms, so really not useful. Severe Vit B deficiency has a different presentation and clinical background than your DD. (She’s not a heavy duty alcoholic.) Add to this vitamin B tends to veer off into quackery territory fairly quickly. So it’s an area many PCPs tread lightly in. Here’s an article that I think is fairly balanced and has the basic stuff right.
https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/vitamin-b12-the-energy-panacea/

Please remember, when looking for information on the internet there are many people in the “natural” world that eventual want to sell you something and they are even slimier than “big pharma”. For example, don’t believe anything from than multi-armed octopus named Mercola. I’m not saying diet doesn’t matter, or alternative therapies are bad, just there’s a lot of quasi stuff overstating the facts, often to eventually make money.

Am I saying don’t give B vitamins to your daughter? Nope. But you don’t need some expensive test that doesn’t correlate well to symptoms. Change her diet and/or add vitamins and see if it helps. There are also other medical conditions it could be I would be happy to talk to you in private about.

[JustMe]

OK, I hesitated to post this several responses back, but decided to go for it. Please don’t shoot the messenger.

The reason many physicians don’t test for vit B is the tests have poor correlation to symptoms, so really not useful. Severe Vit B deficiency has a different presentation and clinical background than your DD. (She’s not a heavy duty alcoholic.) Add to this vitamin B tends to veer off into quackery territory fairly quickly. So it’s an area many PCPs tread lightly in. Here’s an article that I think is fairly balanced and has the basic stuff right.
https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/vitamin-b12-the-energy-panacea/

Please remember, when looking for information on the internet there are many people in the “natural” world that eventual want to sell you something and they are even slimier than “big pharma”. For example, don’t believe anything from than multi-armed octopus named Mercola. I’m not saying diet doesn’t matter, or alternative therapies are bad, just there’s a lot of quasi stuff overstating the facts, often to eventually make money.

Am I saying don’t give B vitamins to your daughter? Nope. But you don’t need some expensive test that doesn’t correlate well to symptoms. Change her diet and/or add vitamins and see if it helps. There are also other medical conditions it could be I would be happy to talk to you in private about.

Firstly, as a general comment, the summary from her ped. visit was just posted on the on-line chart. It says the presenting symptoms were dizzyness and ringing in her ears (very minor and brief). No mention of the extreme tingling that was the major symptom, that had her in tears, and that she has had to a lesser degree before.


Thank you for your post. I have no problem with an opposing view and was expecting one sooner. . Her developmental ped. wondered if B vitamins were an issue, as well but was okay with waiting on it a couple of years ago.

I read the article you posted. She actually is being evaluated for some of the conditions that are mentioned as being responsible for deficiency including gastritis and H. pylori infection. She is seeing a specialist (gastro-endocrinoloist, I believe, sorry for the spelling), but that person has limited availabiity so dd had her first appt a couple of weeks ago, had some tests done, and does not have her follow-up appt until mid-November. I actually am concerned about a possible link between her current intestinal/digestive issues and a deficiency; this is actually a part of the reason I wonder about a deficiency. So, according to the article you posted, I actually think she does meet the clinical presentation. I also want to point out that she is adopted from another country, I have no family medical history, and that combined with the intestinal issues make me feel that, while she is not an alcoholic nor an older adult, she actually is a part of an at-risk population. In fact, her ped, has actually been quick to order other tests in the past since we do not have family history.

The test is not expensive. I disagree with just giving B vitamins, as if she is not absorbing them, or if she has enough in her system that would not be indicated. The article you posted actually warns against supplementation without knowing it is caused for. As far as her diet, she does eat plenty of eggs. As a life-long vegetarian she is not going to start eating meat, especially as an experiment.

I am not convinced this is the answer, it just seems very important to rule out. Dogmom, I hesitate to ask what else you think it could be, as I don't want to get more concerned, and there is also a lot of medical history here that I have mentioned but not spelled out.

I am considering e-mailing my ped, at the very least to clarify her symptoms which are not described in the chart, but think it is likely a waste of time. FWIW, she is very parent-friendly in general so I get that this seems to be something some doctors just do not take as credible. Actually after writing this, I do plan to e-mail her as she needs to know the correct symptoms and I want it on record how strongly I feel about this. However, I will also try to contact the gastro-ent.'s office to get a message into her. I am not going to bother with the developmental ped's office or finding a walk-in clinic, etc, but if I am unsuccessful with the above, I will just pay for the test to get the answers I need.

[Kindra178]

I would absolutely email your ped to note that the chart didn’t mention her main concerning symptom. I am generally pro doctor and pro conventional medicine (for the most part), but the fact that the main issue wasn’t even mentioned is insane.

What does the doctor think she should do? I feel like you weren’t given any answers which means that you need a second visit.

These open charts are an amazing development in modern medicine. I recently had an eye doctor appt with a doctor who was covering for my regular doctor. The doctor spent 5 minutes with me and I left feeling super frustrated. She wrote in her chart “I gave the patient a lot of options but she isn’t happy with any of them.” No mention in the chart what the options were! To this day, I have no idea. She further concluded that “patient is developing presbyopia.” True, but that wasn’t my complaint!




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[Myira]

I am generally pro doctor and pro conventional medicine (for the most part), but the fact that the main issue wasn’t even mentioned is insane.

What does the doctor think she should do? I feel like you weren’t given any answers which means that you need a second visit.

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This is so true, OP you and your DD need answers. I don’t understand how these doctors can just ignore her main symptoms and not investigate or direct you to someone that can.



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[Melbel]

The cluster of symptoms has me thinking Lyme and Bartonella, either or both of which could explain all the symptoms you describe (fainting, weakness, dizziness, tingling, seizures, neuropathy, gastritis type symptoms, anxiety, tinnitus, etc.). Scroll to the patient tool kit here for step by step guidance on testing, finding a doctor etc.: https://projectlyme.org/elisa/#1556736062789-6f7446b4-d17c It is not unusual for patients/parents to see a dozen doctors to get an accurate diagnosis. It took us about a year to figure things out so that we could finally turn things around.

For Bartonella, lab testing tends to be insensitive due to strain variation. Galaxy Diagnostics, affiliated with NC State, is known to have more sensitive testing either for (1) antibodies for two most common strains (quintana and henselae) or (2) PCR testing up to 3 times in a row to increase the sensitivity. Does your DD have any marks on her back? Stripe like marks have been associated with Bartonella (noting research is ongoing on the correlation).

These infections can cause POTS. A simple way to evaluate for POTS is to do BP and HR measurements lying down, sitting up (after a couple minutes), then standing up (after a couple minutes). Drops in BP and increases in HR (>= 30 beats/minute comparing lying down to standing up) suggest POTS. Keep in mind that POTS is just one type of dysautonomia; there are many more (i.e. a child developed neurally mediated hypotension with his Lyme/Bartonella).

For B12, we also have MTHFR mutations. Normal blood tests showed very high levels, but more detailed testing (Genova ONA, Great Plains OAT) showed poor absorption. My homocysteine levels were also very high. Seeking Health Active B12 with L-5-MTHF helped significantly.

Have there been any recent vaccinations? Concussions?

[NCGrandma]

These open charts are an amazing development in modern medicine. I recently had an eye doctor appt with a doctor who was covering for my regular doctor. The doctor spent 5 minutes with me and I left feeling super frustrated. She wrote in her chart “I gave the patient a lot of options but she isn’t happy with any of them.” No mention in the chart what the options were! To this day, I have no idea. She further concluded that “patient is developing presbyopia.” True, but that wasn’t my complaint!

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In general, I think patient access to their med record via "MyChart"-type apps or websites is on balance positive. Both major health systems in this area have had this for a while, and I’ve noticed that the software vendor keeps adding more and more features (or in some cases, the health system decides to opt in). The app/site used here sounds more structured than what Kindra describes—those kinds of notes are never included in what the patient sees, although there is a lot of info about diagnosis, treatment etc as well as lab tests, procedures, preventive services etc. I check mine often, which I recommend because one time someone apparently checked the wrong box resulting in an incorrect diagnosis of diabetes plus "overdue" reminders for all the lab tests etc etc I "should" have had. Fortunately my physician was able to get the med records folks to fix everything.


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[JustMe]

Thanks for the continued replies. Melbel, to answer your questions, I did wonder about POTS and had them check bp and heartrate standing and sitting; they were all fine. She had a seizure/concussion about 2.5 years ago with was 3 weeks after she had an HPV vaccine. She has no stripes or marks.

I e-mailed her ped. I tried not to be confrontational (although it may be taken that way) and stated that I am concerned about the extreme tingling which was not even mentioned on the Mychart summary I received, that I am concerned her symptoms may be related to each other, that I am glad we are seeing the gastro-endocrinologist but we do not see her again until mid-November, that I do think she needs to be tested for B vitamin deficiencies, and that we left the other peds' visit with no diagnosis or follow up plan. We will see if I get fired. (Hopefully not; this has been our ped for 15 years and I would at least like the choice of deciding if we need a new one).

[Melbel]

Thanks for the continued replies. Melbel, to answer your questions, I did wonder about POTS and had them check bp and heartrate standing and sitting; they were all fine. She had a seizure/concussion about 2.5 years ago with was 3 weeks after she had an HPV vaccine. She has no stripes or marks.

Kids with underlying infections can crash after vaccinations. Some of the adjuvants (polysorbate 80 in particular) and make the blood brain barrier more permeable perhaps allowing the infections to reach the central nervous system. Concussions are likewise known to compromise the blood brain barrier. I would definitely consider underlying infections as part of the differential diagnosis, preferably with a knowledgeable provider. If you want to chat offline, I messaged you my email address. You may want to repeat the BP/HR tests at different times of the day or when she seems to be more symptomatic. There are other forms of dysautonomia that may present differently. Given the variety of symptoms, it seems there may be a systemic root cause. For us, things continued to get much worse with more serious symptoms until we finally figured out our cause. You will need to be your child's advocate, even when they try to dismiss things as somatization or all in her head. It is important for your DD to know that you believe her and will not give up on her.

Not everyone has the Bartonella marks, but it would be a red flag if present. Some only develop the marks during the actual treatment for Bartonella.

She may also be experiencing ongoing impact of a vaccine injury?

see, e.g. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5406435/

[JustMe]

She may also be experiencing ongoing impact of a vaccine injury?

see, e.g. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5406435/

I've been concerned that the HPV vaccine caused her seizure or syncope that led to her concussion and created a whole host of other problems. as I said, that happened only three weeks after the HPV vaccine and she never had anything like that before. Not sure what I can do about that though. That was her first HPV vaccine and I did not allow her to have the follow up vaccines for HPV. She has had other vaccines with no issues, I really have no way of knowing if that did it or not.