Quarantine/Screentime/Balance/Discipline HELP

[Melaine]

I'm sure there are others dealing with the same struggles and I'd really like for anyone to weigh in. This is going to be a BP by the end of it and some of this is not new but just magnified by the COVID situation.

I'm really struggling with 8 year old DS. He is diagnosed ADD. He is also dealing with chronic health issues that make him frequently tired and not 100%. Interestingly, these complaints seem to disappear when he is doing the things he wants to do. (Please note: I'm certain he does have discomfort per the doctor and he really seems to be low energy. We're addressing it as best we can. But it does seem to strike him mostly when asked to do things he doesn't want to do.)

We homeschool, however, we have a two day per week hybrid set up. He does great at school thanks to understanding teachers who are excellent and engaging. We had Zoom classes and assignments during quarantine so for the most part it went ok. We have definitely had struggles but the schedule was what he was used to and he was pretty much compliant.

Several major issues right now: he wakes up early STILL. Changes in bedtime do not help him, he wakes up before 6 without fail. So he is up and "bored" starting then. Our rule is no screen time until 2 pm, which leaves a LOT of the day to fill. The girls are 13 now and honestly do not want to play with him and I don't blame them. Frankly, he is extremely rigid and is not fun to play with most of the time. I try to engage him in tasks and creativity and for the most part I fail. He doesn't want to cook or bake or do art or play most of the games I suggest. Yesterday we went out to pick up sticks and I'm quite certain he picked up one the entire time and then it got too hot for me to persist. (I also have chronic health issues which has been part of the struggle. Major exhaustion and anxiety and sometimes I just. cannot. with. him.)

He listens to audio books or reads and will play independently for only bits and pieces of the day. I have school assignments for him and try to find fun things but he is very resistant. He complains and drags his feet. He is frankly lazy along with easily overwhelmed. He is very smart and a voracious reader although without the library open it has been hard to get him to read. His interest seems to have narrowed in the last 6 months and our big stash of books isn't very appealing to him currently. He is definitely an extrovert so isolation has been crushingly hard. Zoom has not filled the void for him.

I work a couple hours in the morning (freelance) and then it's like if he is not getting some kind of screen time he needs my constant supervision. If i give in and turn on the tv, he will have watched two hours while I work and the girls aren't even awake then the day is stretching forward with no relief. I have to follow up on the most basic tasks like telling him to brush his teeth three times and then still he will forget to put his toothbrush away. He needs more chores but he is terrible at tasks and takes advantage of my frustration.

I have thought about giving him a list to earn screen time but I think the normal load (like what I've seen on pinterest) he will blow through very quickly and then want screen time way too early and then it's still like HOURS to fill in the day.

It has been hard because not only have we been pretty strictly quarantined but we haven't had a car for 2 months. So no driving to the trails or anywhere. We should get our car back shortly, we just bought a second car for DH so at least we can drive to my mom's house for a pool. We thought about joining the local pool but DD is still having skin reactions to chlorine and DS just got an ear infection so we need to work out some kind of serious ear plug solution. And we have spent a lot of time in our yard this spring (unseasonably cool spring for us) but now it is HOT. Like 90's and humid hot.

Also, everyone is going back to regular life here and it's so hard to be stuck at home STILL. Ya'll, I can't take this. PLEASE GIVE ME SOME IDEAS.

[jgenie]

My DS2 is similar to your DS. He is an avid reader and not having access to our libraries has been a major blow for us. DS2 has transitioned to kindle books since the quarantine began. Previously he would only use a kindle when we traveled but now uses it exclusively. I have an ancient kindle I’ll happily send your way if you’re interested. The key for us is basic kindles - if DS2 had access to a fire or read on an iPad he would get distracted by other things. I bought summer workbooks for both my DC to work on this summer. They have to do 5 pages of math, 3 pages from a different book and 15 minutes of Duolingo to get access to screens. Getting DS2 to do the pages is like pull8ng teeth. I finally told him I wasn’t policing him anymore. He has to finish his pages before 3:00 when we head to the Pool or he won’t get screens after swim. I have tried to engage him in cooking or organizing with DS1 and I but he isn’t usually interested. I’ve just left him to do his own thing which is generally just hanging out on the couch with his kindle. If the day is nice I will make him go outside. He will often take his kindle out with him but then will find something outside to occupy himself. I started the summer with DC helping with chores but it’s so much quicker and easier for me to do it So we’ve fallen back on that. This is our 4th week of summer with 8 weeks to go. Good luck - the days are long when you can’t go out and do your usual out8ngs!

[SnuggleBuggles]

You won't like my answer. But it is to loosen up on your hard 2pm rule. My ds2's brain hasn't rotted away yet and there have been way too many screens since this all began. ;)
Does he have any friends that he could connect with via an online game (there are plenty of decent games they can connect with- ds2 and his friends play Mario Maker and Animal Crossing on Switch together). If he craves that connection with others then it is a worthwhile investment at this stage too! He's happy and occupied.
So, yeah, I am in favor of throwing screens and money at the problem. :) These aren't normal times. It's ok for things not to be perfect.

[DualvansMommy]

My 9 year old is an extrovert and really miss playing/seeing his friends plus just to play soccer too. So not having both has been very hard on him.

I’m trying to understand your 2pm rule? What does that do for you? All i read is that it adds more stress to YOU. If library was a big part of your DS’s life, get w basic kindle cuz that is a great workaround with libraries being out of commission.

We’re living hard times now. I think the lack of seeing friends and all is affecting your son, so snuggles made good suggestion. Let him play with his friends online. Especially if you’re not wanting for go out for health reasons which is understandable. For my extrovert DS1 who got his headphones with mic to play with his friend as his birthday gift earlier this month, it’s a godsend! Ironically it motivates him to do his afternoon chores and more eager to go out with me to the pool/walk the dog and hit the park when he knows he can talk to his friends online helps a lot. Your son needs that something to look forward to.


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[gatorsmom]

I’m not sure you will like my answer either. My son sounds a LOT like yours. Can’t pay attention to anything longer than a few minutes, causes drama with siblings just to get an argument going or get a rise out of someone, hates anything monotonous like a chore chart or a to-do list, loves video games, is frequently bored, bored, bored. DS3 was exactly like that and still is when he doesn’t take his ADHD meds. He was 8yo when we decided to put him on medication and it has changed his life and our family. On the meds he is considerate, focused, gets straight a’s and has friends. Off meds he is rude, scattered, constantly bugging his siblings, struggles in school and no one wants to play with him. It took about 6 months to figure out what meds worked for him but finally settled on Concerta. It’s not perfect, but he and our family are so much happier with him on it.

In the meantime for you, you gotta make screen time available for him only after his chores, classes, etc are done. Warn him that if he doesn’t do what he’s suppose to, hide them for a day or 2. If your son loves them as much as mine does, he will start to follow the rules very quickly. Mine will do pretty much anything to get his video games and screen time back. In order to play games with friends each evening, he has house chores, online classes, and an hour of exercise to do. Even though it’s hard to enforce sometimes, threatening taking away video games has been an excellent carrot for DS3.

[carolinamama]

I use screentime as a motivator for my kids to complete a few tasks - reading, household chore, some outside time and some creative play time. If not, they would probably do nothing else! But we have really loosened up since everything is so different. I would encourage your DS to use video games as a chance to socialize with friends and not stress too much. We are all just trying to get through these days, including the kids.

We do a weekly outing where we can hike and the kids can get out in the woods away from people. We find places with streams or rivers so make the Carolina heat bearable. It's been so good for everyone's mental health and then I don't worry on the off days abut all the screen time.

[ezcc]

My 8 year old spends a good chunk of his day playing online (mostly fortnite) with his best friend who lives in another state. I honestly think this is fine and even good for him (he has older siblings who are teens and do play with him some but I can't really expect them to want to play with him all day). He gets to be creative, work things out with his friend, chat with a peer. I do make him get off from time to time, but keeping him offline until 2pm would be a huge challenge for me because I would need to find ways to help him fill his time. I'm more likely to make him get off in the afternoon once I am more caught up with stuff and can engage with him or the teens are up and around and can play something outside with him. I especially would try and loosen up first thing in the morning- maybe give him an hour or two to keep him out of your hair for a bit?

[bisous]

I’m not sure you will like my answer either. My son sounds a LOT like yours. Can’t pay attention to anything longer than a few minutes, causes drama with siblings just to get an argument going or get a rise out of someone, hates anything monotonous like a chore chart or a mask to-do list, loves video games, is frequently bored, bored, bored. DS3 was exactly like that and still is when he doesn’t take his ADHD meds. He was 8yo when we decided to put him on medication and it has changed his life and our family. On the meds he is considerate, focused, gets straight a’s and has friends. Off meds he is rude, scattered, constantly bugging his siblings, struggles in school and no one wants to play with him. It took about 6 months to figure out what meds worked for him but finally settled on Concerta. It’s not perfect, but he and our family are so much happier with him on it.

In the meantime for you, you gotta make screen time a natural consequence for him doing his chores, classes, etc. If he doesn’t do what he’s suppose to, hide them for a day or 2. If your son loves them as much as mine does, he will start to follow the rules very quickly. Mine will do pretty much anything to get his video games and screen time back. In order to play games with friends each evening, he has house chores, online classes, and an hour of exercise to do. Even though it’s hard to enforce sometimes, threatening taking away video games has been an excellent carrot for DS3.

I agree with all of this. I have an 8yo that sounds very much like yours!

I parent with a lot of structure. It’s helpful because I have a lot of very high energy kids, a small house and a job!! My kids have things they have to complete every day and a few daily activities that provide structure and comfort (like daily read aloud time and daily quiet time). We don’t do screens until 4:30 (though each kid can have some time coding on scratch each day prior to that 30 minutes).

Another thing—can you task your girls with spending a certain amount of time with him each day? Maybe they could do a board game together? It might not be their favorite but it will be good for you, good for them and good for your family. It can be part of their daily list.

Good luck—I get it!!

[bisous]

I also like the advice of the kindle. I don’t think that’s the same as screen time and reading is wonderful.

Having a car will help too I’m sure!!

[PunkyBoo]

My DS2 is also very similar. And I'm working from home full time since early April. The most important thing I've been reminding myself is that we have all been living through trauma. This has been traumatic. For all of us. But to a young child who doesn't have the perspective and experience in the world, they can't find the words to express how they feel. Stress. Fear. Restlessness. Anxiety. Fatigue. Unknowns. We all need to be gentler with ourselves AND our loved ones. Especially the kids.

So I've let things go. I don't hound the kids. I let them watch TV and play games on their devices. I HAVE to in order to get my work done. But I also created something I'm calling Camp Mom. I made a poster split into 6 categories, each a behavior/trait I feel are important for my kids to be working on. Under each category are post it notes with ideas of things to do to independently accomplish that category. They both have to do one thing under each category before they can play video games. They pick which activities they feel like doing and when. They can come up with their own ideas too. They can't tell me they're bored because there are plenty of things on the poster they can do. I try to take breaks when I can and participate with them. Here are the categories I chose: Creating (I googled "crafts for boys" and came up with some interesting stuff, or they can draw or write or make up a game, etc); Cooperating (play a game together, do an activity together- the goal here is that they cooperate and don't argue or get competitive); Moving (outside exercise ideas, but if it's too hot, we have a few indoor exercise/movement ideas, or water fights outside, swim, or worst case, WiiU Sports inside-if they're moving their bodies I don't care that it's a video game); Helping (these are chores. If there isn't anything I really need them to do, they can meet this by cooking dinner one night. They pick the recipe and the night, I'll be their sous chef. My goal with this is life skills. Yesterday my DS2 volunteered to sweep the front walk because he knows dad is tired and stressed out and would have had to do it after work-i was very proud of DS2!); Thinking ( using their brains, reading, puzzles, researching a place or thing online and writing about it or do a poster board about it); and Sharing (doing random acts of kindness, calling a grandparent or other relative, sending someone a letter, giving or mailing someone one of the crafts they made). It's not a perfect system and we get varying degrees of success each day, but so far we're all much happier with them having the independence to pick how they use their time.

ETA my boys are 5 years apart. I'm "making" them both participate with this. It's good for both of their characters to do these things and help each other.

[dogmom]

Another maybe ease up in the 2 on rule. I think it would be better to break it up into 2 chunks maybe? I know I don’t have ADD, but when I was in the fill thick off the Covid ICU surge I couldn’t real a magazine article well enough a book. I’ve got a whole libel Sims Mobile house because that’s all my brain could handle, mindless clicking on pink stars.

Also, not all games are equal. Is there something he likes to play that has a little social interaction? Are kids still on Minecraft servers? Sorry, that was 6-9 years ago for us, so out of touch. What is he interested in? My DS spend years doing Magic the Gathering Card Game. By 8 he was starting to venture into D&D and he is having an online game with his friends via web camera today.

[bisous]

My DS2 is also very similar. And I'm working from home full time since early April. The most important thing I've been reminding myself is that we have all been living through trauma. This has been traumatic. For all of us. But to a young child who doesn't have the perspective and experience in the world, they can't find the words to express how they feel. Stress. Fear. Restlessness. Anxiety. Fatigue. Unknowns. We all need to be gentler with ourselves AND our loved ones. Especially the kids.

So I've let things go. I don't hound the kids. I let them watch TV and play games on their devices. I HAVE to in order to get my work done. But I also created something I'm calling Camp Mom. I made a poster split into 6 categories, each a behavior/trait I feel are important for my kids to be working on. Under each category are post it notes with ideas of things to do to independently accomplish that category. They both have to do one thing under each category before they can play video games. They pick which activities they feel like doing and when. They can come up with their own ideas too. They can't tell me they're bored because there are plenty of things on the poster they can do. I try to take breaks when I can and participate with them. Here are the categories I chose: Creating (I googled "crafts for boys" and came up with some interesting stuff, or they can draw or write or make up a game, etc); Cooperating (play a game together, do an activity together- the goal here is that they cooperate and don't argue or get competitive); Moving (outside exercise ideas, but if it's too hot, we have a few indoor exercise/movement ideas, or water fights outside, swim, or worst case, WiiU Sports inside-if they're moving their bodies I don't care that it's a video game); Helping (these are chores. If there isn't anything I really need them to do, they can meet this by cooking dinner one night. They pick the recipe and the night, I'll be their sous chef. My goal with this is life skills. Yesterday my DS2 volunteered to sweep the front walk because he knows dad is tired and stressed out and would have had to do it after work-i was very proud of DS2!); Thinking ( using their brains, reading, puzzles, researching a place or thing online and writing about it or do a poster board about it); and Sharing (doing random acts of kindness, calling a grandparent or other relative, sending someone a letter, giving or mailing someone one of the crafts they made). It's not a perfect system and we get varying degrees of success each day, but so far we're all much happier with them having the independence to pick how they use their time.

ETA my boys are 5 years apart. I'm "making" them both participate with this. It's good for both of their characters to do these things and help each other.

Thanks so much for sharing this. This is so helpful! I made a screen shot of your post!!

[petesgirl]

I get it. My oldest sounds very similar to your son. And my own health issues (MS) play a huge part in what I'm able to do each day. I have loosened screen time rules for the summer. I'm not particularly happy about it, and in the fall I plan to scale way back but right now my health combined with not as much for the kids to do (summer camps and such) is making it our new reality.

[PunkyBoo]

Thanks so much for sharing this. This is so helpful! I made a screen shot of your post!!I'm glad it helps in any way! Here's a photo of my poster- it's on the back of a construction plan sheet from DH's work, stuck to a glass door, so the black markings are reading through. I can switch out/add/subtract post it notes as we go. Some days require more encouragement than others, but I'm too busy with work to hound them. Fortunately they're seeing that doing all these things feels good to them, so they're more inclined to keep doing them. DS2 has discovered that he can't sleep if he doesn't do any moving, then he feels cruddy the next day. Now he WANTS to go outside and burn off energy. Also we've figured out that we all enjoy perler beads and model magic creations so I've stocked up on those -cheaper than day camp!https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200630/93ffcb5cad93489ebdfdcc6d1aa498ce.jpg

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[sf333]

I haven’t read the other responses so this may have been mentioned already but...my 12 yo DS sounds almost exactly like yours (however, he doesn’t like reading). What helped us was medication. It took years of trial and error and his behavior wasn’t truly impacted in a significant way until last year...and we started trying medications around 8. When we FINALLY found the right ones, however, everything changed. He stopped sneaking foods, stopped getting up so early, stopped picking fights with everyone around him and on and on. If medication is something you are willing to try, it might be worth a shot.

Also, re: screen time, we also don’t allow it, for the most part, until after dinner. We are lucky to live in an area that is conducive to being outdoors and my kids have each other. Yes, I hear complaints of being bored but they’ll live through that. It forces them to find other means of entertainment.

Lastly, hugs to you. I know how challenging kids like our sons can be in typical times. The pandemic has just heightened everything and it’s exhausting. I hope others give you ideas that help.

[Liziz]

I also have an 8 year old and a lot of this sounds familiar to how our quarantined summer has been going, too. We were okay during the learn-from-home because we had a pretty strict schedule, but when summer started it got rough. I thought about just being more relaxed about screen time, but I've realized that my kids don't function well with lots of screen time -- they're much more crabby and short-fused, and pure miserable as soon as the screens go off. So I didn't want to go that route. Instead, I've really adopted an attitude of "it's okay to be bored" and "it's not my job to keep you engaged all the time". I absolutely take time in the day to do things with my kids, but some days it's not a lot. I do what I need to do, I invite my kids to participate (if they can) or to hang out quietly near me, or they can make the choice to do something else. If they complain they're bored, I acknowledge what they said but then just move on. I ignore when they sit around and mope. It has been really freeing for me to not feel like I need to make sure they're busy and engaged all day. As the summer has progressed (we've been out since the first week of May), it's really improved. My younger DD is getting way better at independent play. My 8 yo DD is slower to adapt to this, and she definitely spends time sitting there sighing and making it clear to me she's bored. But she's also gotten a lot better about doing things independently, too, or being willing to join in with what I'm doing (like weeding the garden, something she wouldn't do on her own!)

ETA: I should also add that I'm generally the person that does not buy things for my kids if it's not Christmas/birthday, etc. I never buy books "just because" as we're avid library patrons. However, during this quarantine I have absolutely relaxed my rules on that. I did digital books for the kids as much as possible, but I also just ordered several chapter books for DD (8), as she was like your DS -- her interests changed and she just wasn't in to some of the books at home. I figured money spent so she'd enjoy reading was well worth it, and I don't regret it. I've also bought a few kits that I knew the kids would be interested in "just because", and some outdoor toys, just to change up the scenery for them a bit.

[Kestrel]

When this all hit, DH and I sat down with DS (11yo) and made a huge list of things he can do. Split into inside things and outside things (we're in Washington state, lots of drizzle weather days). Then, when he complains he's bored, we tell him to check the list and see if something sounds good.
I agree with Liziz, he's going to be bored sometimes, and that's not my fault, or his. Sometimes, all he needs is a reminder of things he can do if he's bored, sometimes he comes up with his own ideas and we add them to his "list.

Does he do creative thing like lego, k'nex, models? Anything artsy like drawing, modeling clay, coloring? Dot-to-dot, word search, puzzles? Maybe you can designate some "quiet time", before 9am, for example?

[Melaine]

Thanks to all of ya'll, I am going to be giving these responses a lot of thought. It's honestly not the screen time I'm opposed to, per se, it's just that his attitude seems to go in the toilet when he is given free rein. For me setting strict parameters has been the easiest solution but I'm definitely willing to experiment. He needs a schedule so maybe a time slot of screen time in the morning, and then a slot in the afternoon would help.