What do you guys thiink of the teachers strikes going on in Wisconsin?

[larig]

I'm considered pretty right wing politically, but I completely disagree with union busting. Virtually EVERYONE who works for a living and is not royalty or landed gentry should thank their lucky stars that unions changed the shape of the Industrial Revolution. Things that we consider "normal" working conditions (paid vacation, workplace safety, child labor laws etc) did NOT exist prior to unions forming.

I done management side collective bargaining "against" a VERY powerful union in a highly adversarial labor and economic context. We negotiated a fair deal that everyone at the table could live with and averted a nasty strike. It CAN be done.

it's about fairness for me.

[bubbaray]

That article on the rule of 92 is insane. I don't want my children being taught by a 71 year old teacher, especially a 71 year old teacher who is essentially forced by crazy pension rules to keep working!

[arivecchi]

The safety of your job and benefits should not be based on who you vote for.

I think this is the crux of the issue.

[larig]

That article on the rule of 92 is insane. I don't want my children being taught by a 71 year old teacher, especially a 71 year old teacher who is essentially forced by crazy pension rules to keep working!

I know, this is another reason I may not go back to teaching after I finish my PhD. I've taken almost 10 years off for school and kid. Illinois (where my pension is) has huge pension problems too.

[citymama]

Larig, you said it very well in your original post, as did a few others (crl, bubbaray, ray7694). This is all about union busting not the budget. this is about gutting workers rights.

The argument that unions are no longer needed is sort of like arguing we're in a post-feminist or post-racial world and so no longer need feminists or civil rights leaders. Don't believe it.

[larig]

The argument that unions are no longer needed is sort of like arguing we're in a post-feminist or post-racial world and so no longer need feminists or civil rights leaders. Don't believe it.

well said.

[ellies mom]

The argument that unions are no longer needed is sort of like arguing we're in a post-feminist or post-racial world and so no longer need feminists or civil rights leaders. Don't believe it.

Exactly, the only reason we don't "need" unions is because we still have them. Without them, it wouldn't take long for us to need them again.

[SnuggleBuggles]

Exactly, the only reason we don't "need" unions is because we still have them. Without them, it wouldn't take long for us to need them again.

Really? I just don't buy that. What more do unions want also? Do they want more compensation, benefits, different conditions? Truly curious what they are still out there trying to get, Like I said, I really am glad for the things unions achieved in the past but I do not see the current need for them.

Dh's job and industry aren't union. He has vacation, reasonable hours, benefits...he does not have a pension but I don't think a lot of people have that luxury nowadays.

Beth

[crl]

Really? I just don't buy that. What more do unions want also? Do they want more compensation, benefits, different conditions? Truly curious what they are still out there trying to get, Like I said, I really am glad for the things unions achieved in the past but I do not see the current need for them.

Dh's job and industry aren't union. He has vacation, reasonable hours, benefits...he does not have a pension but I don't think a lot of people have that luxury nowadays.

Beth

I worked for the federal government. The only reason I had a 40 hour work week was our union. When I went on temporary assignment to another agency that was not unionized, my boss actually called and said, you can only have her if she works a 40 hour week because I'm not taking her back with a million comp hours at the end of the year. And the people who worked at that other, non-unionized, agency permanently? They worked waaaayyy more than 40, most of them around 60 hours a week. So, yeah, my union was directly and absolutely responsible for my reasonable work hours.

Catherine

[boolady]

Dh's job and industry aren't union. He has vacation, reasonable hours, benefits...he does not have a pension but I don't think a lot of people have that luxury nowadays.

Beth

I am always curious why a pension is considered such a luxury, when I am forced to contribute almost 10% of my paycheck to mine. I have no ability to opt out, and given my state's gross mismanagement of the pension fund, including borrowing billions for non-pension related things, I might. The pension fund in my state is due to run out in 2017, largely because the billions borrowed several governors ago was never paid back from what is largely workers' money. I would just as soon take my 10% and save it on my own...then at least I know it will be there.

Are there pension systems that people aren't forced to contribute to? I am not saying that to be snarky, I don't know. I just talk to many people who seem to think that it's a free perk of being a public employee, but it's far from free.