Update in #15 - Use of voice to text software in school

[mikeys_mom]

Handwriting has always been difficult for DS. His thoughts flow much quicker than he could ever write and that frustrates him. He learned how to type over the summer and has a computer in school. We were hoping that the typing would be quicker than handwriting and improve his ability to get his thoughts on paper. Unfortunately, it has not been as successful as we expected. While he can type faster than he can write, he is still often resistant to type out his thoughts. He much prefers for someone to scribe for him. He's in grade 4 and this is no longer realistic.

His teachers have now suggested that we perhaps consider using voice to text dictation software. That was really our last resort and we worry about it becoming too much of a crutch. However, at the same time, we acknowledge that because DS has ASD, his mind works differently and processes information differently than us and that means we need to be open to alternatives.

Our goal is to get him to express his thoughts coherently on paper. I know from having scribed for him that he really can't come up with an idea and then put together a sentence in his mind and write it. He needs to just let his thoughts flow out in a stream-of-consciousness format and then go back and edit. The dictation software would really fill that need. Yet, DH and I keep coming back to thinking about what life skills he needs and we don't want to set him up with this crutch if it's not necessary.

Has anyone used this type of software with their child? What was your experience?
The one recommended to us is Dragon. It is free on the ipad so we'd start with that before investing in the PC version. The school has ipads and they would set one up for him to use when needed.

[egoldber]

I think this is a common accommodation and I don't know that I would worry too much about it long term. His typing will almost certainly get faster and then we will probably simply prefer to type as it saves a step. He's still very young.

However, I would wonder more on how useful it's going to be to him in a classroom situation. Is this for use during in-class writing time? Is it typically quiet during this time? If so, is he realistically going to be able to dictate his ideas when the rest of the class is silently writing? I just wonder about the logistics of how this will work.

Does he have a laptop at school or is he typing on an iPad or desktop?

[mikeys_mom]

I think this is a common accommodation and I don't know that I would worry too much about it long term. His typing will almost certainly get faster and then we will probably simply prefer to type as it saves a step. He's still very young.

However, I would wonder more on how useful it's going to be to him in a classroom situation. Is this for use during in-class writing time? Is it typically quiet during this time? If so, is he realistically going to be able to dictate his ideas when the rest of the class is silently writing? I just wonder about the logistics of how this will work.

Does he have a laptop at school or is he typing on an iPad or desktop?

I guess I'm concerned that he will let the typing slip a bit and then it will be harder to pick up later. He tends to get very set in his way quite easily. I suppose we can tell him that the dictation is to go along with typing and that he still needs to practice that a bit and not completely throw it away.

The dictation would be used for the longer writing assignments in the language arts program - not for simply answering questions in other subjects. I have no idea how quiet the classroom is when kids are working but they said he can either go work in the computer lab, which happens to be across from his classroom, or a small room or the library if it's not busy in there. Yes, I will need to figure out logistics but they don't seem concered with finding a spot for him.

He has a laptop in school. He uses it for some writing assignments and some he does by hand. We have an ipad mini at home and the school owns about 50 ipads. They would designate one to be used by him so that the software can learn his voice. They would then transfer the data from the ipad to the laptop for editing. Again, I'm no techie but the computer teacher seems to think it will be simple.

[pb&j]

I guess I'm concerned that he will let the typing slip a bit and then it will be harder to pick up later.

Just for perspective - I didn't learn to type at all until I was 12, and I can type 80-90wpm. And I learned on an actual typewriter b/c I am old. I don't think reducing/dropping typing for a bit will slow him down very much at this age. IMO, typing is a fairly easy skill to acquire, but organizing thoughts and producing a coherent written piece from them is much harder, and requires more practice.

[HannaAddict]

My 4th grader has dysgraphia and writing is very hard for him and he can't express in writing anywhere close to what he is thinking. He just tries to do the shortest sentences possible. We are working on keyboarding but that isn't realistic as a substitution because if his age, and scribing is listed as an accommodation (but no real plan as at private). We've played around with Dragon and it is okay but really not designed for under 14 year olds and speech needs robe super clear. It wasn't reliable for our child and isn't perfect when I use it. Another student is using Siri in class for dictation too. The way we've used Dragon is really just to record longer stories etc. he needs to write, then type them out and he edits. A glorified tape recorders But it is certainly worth a try and if your son has clear speech it might be helpful. I wouldn't worry about using it as a crutch, but I would keep working on handwriting and muscle tone for handwriting and 10 minutes of keyboarding every other day. It is hard I know.

[larig]

I'm using my Mac to dictate this post. Since the last version of OSX, dictation has been built in. You can access it in any application. It works pretty much like Siri does on an iPad or iPhone. I find it to be very accurate, with no training at all. If he can have access to a mac at school they might try it out, since it's free. ETA: to access it you hit the function key ("fn") twice.

[mikeys_mom]

Just for perspective - I didn't learn to type at all until I was 12, and I can type 80-90wpm. And I learned on an actual typewriter b/c I am old. I don't think reducing/dropping typing for a bit will slow him down very much at this age. IMO, typing is a fairly easy skill to acquire, but organizing thoughts and producing a coherent written piece from them is much harder, and requires more practice.

Thanks for this perspective. Yes, I agree that we need to get him to organize his thoughts in a coherent way and something he struggles with especially on creative writing pieces. Just need to figure out the best way and it's so hard because there are technologies that exist today that didn't when we were in school. Now, ask him to document his methodology for a science experiment and he will write it up by hand in a perfectly meticulous format that flows properly from start to finish. That's just the natural way his mind works.

My 4th grader has dysgraphia and writing is very hard for him and he can't express in writing anywhere close to what he is thinking. He just tries to do the shortest sentences possible. We are working on keyboarding but that isn't realistic as a substitution because if his age, and scribing is listed as an accommodation (but no real plan as at private). We've played around with Dragon and it is okay but really not designed for under 14 year olds and speech needs robe super clear. It wasn't reliable for our child and isn't perfect when I use it. Another student is using Siri in class for dictation too. The way we've used Dragon is really just to record longer stories etc. he needs to write, then type them out and he edits. A glorified tape recorders But it is certainly worth a try and if your son has clear speech it might be helpful. I wouldn't worry about using it as a crutch, but I would keep working on handwriting and muscle tone for handwriting and 10 minutes of keyboarding every other day. It is hard I know.

Thanks for the feedback on Dragon. DS's speech is quite clear so hopefully that will work in his favour. I've played around with it a bit and agree that it's not perfect but hoping it will help get his initial thoughts on paper efficiently. The plan is that after dictating something in Dragon he can then easily move it to Word and edit it from there. Is there any reason why your DS needs to retype rather than using what he dictated as a basis?

Muscle tone isn't his issue, actually. His muscle tone is quite good and when he wants to write and has a very clear plan, he can write pages. For example, if he researches a particular topic and then wants to write out all the facts, he can do that easily because it's all just recall, not new ideas. It's processing speed that is the problem. His is just way too fast. He's got all these thoughts literally charging through him at the same time and he has no way to get them on paper effectively right now. It is especially a problem when he needs to do creative writing. The motor process of either writing or typing slows down his processing and he just can't manage both at the same time. The long-term goal is that typing becomes second nature that he really doesn't have to think about it but we're clearly not there yet.

[mikeys_mom]

I'm using my Mac to dictate this post. Since the last version of OSX, dictation has been built in. You can access it in any application. It works pretty much like Siri does on an iPad or iPhone. I find it to be very accurate, with no training at all. If he can have access to a mac at school they might try it out, since it's free. ETA: to access it you hit the function key ("fn") twice.

Unfortunately, no Macs at school or at home but it's certainly something to keep in mind for our next computer purchase. Thanks!

[egoldber]

It may just comfort him to know that the option is available to him if he needs it, KWIM? He may not find it all that useful in practice, especially if he needs to leave the room to do it.

Until their hands get large enough to fully span the keyboard, many kids find learning to type frustrating. And it's hard to build up real speed.

[mikeys_mom]

It may just comfort him to know that the option is available to him if he needs it, KWIM? He may not find it all that useful in practice, especially if he needs to leave the room to do it.

Until their hands get large enough to fully span the keyboard, many kids find learning to type frustrating. And it's hard to build up real speed.

That pretty much sums up exactly what the special-ed teacher told me
Initially, they plan to keep dictation software reserved for bigger projects and when he's having an "off" day and needs that extra support/motivation to get him going with work.

I need to get him to practice typing more at home. Sigh... It was so much easier to practice typing in the summer when there was no homework or need to decompress after a day at school. Now, it's just a challenge to get everyone fed, cleaned up, homework done and into bed at a reasonable time without completely losing my mind.