I can't stand the (mis)behavior. LONG.

[sste]

Pastrygirl, I feel like I am always chanting this on this forum but SELF-CARE!!! Of course you can't reward every 10 minutes, etc, these are super-human expectations. Therapists can do it because they are trained professionals working for a set number of hours--not around the clock with laundry and cooking and everything else that goes on in a busy family. I would seriously try to build in more de-stressing time: therapy, massage, taking a walk, coffee with a friend. I know it is hard and sometimes expensive to make that investment but you really do need to take care of you. You sound a little burnt out to me, understandably so.

Just to throw this out there. I wonder if a big part of your reaction is anxiety. It is anxiety-provoking in the extreme to see your child acting very differently and to see their (sorry I don't have a better word here) deficits. It is scary and painful to watch. And I think those emotions get sort of mixed up in or projected onto feelings of anger and frustration with the child. Certainly, I acknowledge you are feeling some legitimate anger and frustration as this is a hard situation! But the "super-charged" nature of how it feels to you I suspect may be due to the absolutely expected, logical, and understandable anxiety and upset provoked by watching your child's differences--which are all the more evident to you I think once you mentally switch into a public context like the karate class. Hope you don't mind my arm chair theorizing. I just don't want you to feel worse. You clearly love and are devoted to your DS --look at all you are describing doing with him despite the difficulties. I suspect it is the anxiety and upset from watching him that is sort of getting projected onto him, not that you actually care so much about his karate moves, kwim.

[elliput]

Just to throw this out there. I wonder if a big part of your reaction is anxiety. It is anxiety-provoking in the extreme to see your child acting very differently and to see their (sorry I don't have a better word here) deficits. It is scary and painful to watch. And I think those emotions get sort of mixed up in or projected onto feelings of anger and frustration with the child. Certainly, I acknowledge you are feeling some legitimate anger and frustration as this is a hard situation! But the "super-charged" nature of how it feels to you I suspect may be due to the absolutely expected, logical, and understandable anxiety and upset provoked by watching your child's differences--which are all the more evident to you I think once you mentally switch into a public context like the karate class. Hope you don't mind my arm chair theorizing. I just don't want you to feel worse. You clearly love and are devoted to your DS --look at all you are describing doing with him despite the difficulties. I suspect it is the anxiety and upset from watching him that is sort of getting projected onto him, not that you actually care so much about his karate moves, kwim.

Yes. I agree with this. I needed anxiety meds when my DD was 5-6-7 yo as some of her behaviors just sent me over the edge during that time. I have learned to cope better, so I don't need the meds any more, but they sure saved my sanity for a couple years.

[egoldber]

My younger DD (also 8) started Tae Kwon Do this year. It's been amazing for her. BUT, there is absolutely no way that she could do the class without her ADHD meds. She has class twice a week, Saturday mornings and Wednesday evenings. The first few times we tried the evening class it was a disaster unless she got a medication booster first. Her behavior was exactly as you described.

I would think about a further evaluation. ASD is often co-morbid with other things and you're describing classic ADHD hyperactivity and impulsivity.

[pastrygirl]

Well then just DON'T DO whatever naughty thing you are talking about kid!

This sums up my constant thoughts throughout the day! Just *Don't Do It*!

[pastrygirl]

I think you need to reassess your expectations with regards to his behavior. Do you absolutely know he does not want to behave and is purposefully misbehaving, or are you trying to hold him to a standard to which he is not capable of meeting right now?

I feel like it's a neverending battle with myself. Over the years, I've learned to lower my expectations and doing so has certainly helped. But now he's in 3rd grade, and outwardly seems soooooooo close to being like the other kids. Third grade was the start of some of my memories of being a kid, and I know I was very responsible by this age. I cared about being on time, doing things correctly, getting everything right, keeping my stuff safe by putting it away. He's a lot like me in many ways, and I want so badly for him to have inherited those parts of my personality, too. It's not evident at this point, though.

[pastrygirl]

I think I'd get to a therapist -- sorry to be so direct.

You know, I hadn't even thought of that. I was in therapy a couple of years ago because I couldn't handle being a mother to my youngest. It was pure misery from the time he was born and I needed meds to get through his first three years. Then I started to get a handle on things and weaned off the meds while in therapy. I had to stop last year due to scheduling but thought about starting again, but not necessarily with a focus on being a special needs parent until you mentioned it. I think that's exactly what I need.

It's amplified by my 5yo being SO obedient. I think that's actually making things worse for me and my expectations.

[pastrygirl]

I'll commiserate with you. I had to laugh at the kissing his brother's head thing - my 8yo is CONSTANTLY rubbing his 5yo brother's head! It drives me nuts.

Oh no! I didn't realize other kids had that obsession. It's ridiculous -- when I go through our old photos on the computer, there's my then-3yo with lips or hand on the baby's head. Again and again, through the years. That particular action is being tracked/logged during our ABA sessions because it's such a big problem!

It's tiring, dealing with it, constantly. And even though I know the boys are not aware of just how hard i'm working to take care of them, sometimes its like - I do all of this crap on my own, doing everything for our family, and you can't just put on your coat and go get in the car??!?!?

YES. This is more mentally exhausting than anything else I've ever had to do. And my husband doesn't participate much; his work is very taxing and he doesn't have any cycles left to deal with this stuff by the time he gets home from work. Weekends are all about avoidance. We each squirm away so that none of us has to turn our brains on to deal with the behavior. It's not good for any of us.

[pastrygirl]

Maybe karate could be a place where it doesn't matter and he can just have fun. I think if it were me, I wouldn't watch the lesson. I'd stay outside in case I was needed, but I wouldn't watch.

There have been a few times where I left, so that I knew I wouldn't get worked up. But then I feel irresponsible, leaving him completely in their hands. Yet, I don't interfere one bit when I'm present. At this point they know they can reprimand him or give him time-outs as needed, so I think I'll step out more. Or maybe I'll go in the other room to watch my 5yo, which I've never gotten to do. He is doing very well, apparently!

[pastrygirl]

Pastrygirl, I feel like I am always chanting this on this forum but SELF-CARE!!! Of course you can't reward every 10 minutes, etc, these are super-human expectations. Therapists can do it because they are trained professionals working for a set number of hours--not around the clock with laundry and cooking and everything else that goes on in a busy family. I would seriously try to build in more de-stressing time: therapy, massage, taking a walk, coffee with a friend. I know it is hard and sometimes expensive to make that investment but you really do need to take care of you. You sound a little burnt out to me, understandably so.

Just to throw this out there. I wonder if a big part of your reaction is anxiety. It is anxiety-provoking in the extreme to see your child acting very differently and to see their (sorry I don't have a better word here) deficits. It is scary and painful to watch. And I think those emotions get sort of mixed up in or projected onto feelings of anger and frustration with the child. Certainly, I acknowledge you are feeling some legitimate anger and frustration as this is a hard situation! But the "super-charged" nature of how it feels to you I suspect may be due to the absolutely expected, logical, and understandable anxiety and upset provoked by watching your child's differences--which are all the more evident to you I think once you mentally switch into a public context like the karate class. Hope you don't mind my arm chair theorizing. I just don't want you to feel worse. You clearly love and are devoted to your DS --look at all you are describing doing with him despite the difficulties. I suspect it is the anxiety and upset from watching him that is sort of getting projected onto him, not that you actually care so much about his karate moves, kwim.

I do carry a lot of anxiety about this. And when I'm anxious, I'm paralyzed. I already feel it -- paralysis about next week's IEP meeting. And yes, my anxiety/worry/any other scared feelings come out as anger and rage. I just want to be able to turn my brain off about this and let someone else handle it. But there is no one else. In the meantime, I continue to be mortified by his behavior and how other people (adults) judge me for it.

[pastrygirl]

I would think about a further evaluation. ASD is often co-morbid with other things and you're describing classic ADHD hyperactivity and impulsivity.

He did have an ADHD diagnosis along with ASD, but we never did anything about that. Maybe it's time to look into it more. At this point, we're not in touch with the diagnosing doctor, as it was 2 years ago. I'll have to look at the neuropsych report to see if she mentioned ADHD at all.