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  1. #21
    sste is offline Diamond level (5000+ posts)
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    I also know more than one person who was encouraged to retain and then told their child didn't qualify for services (but would have had they gone to the higher grade level). I am pretty jaded . . . the reality as I see it is that schools, while generally populated with people who care about children, do not always have the resources to help children with special needs. So it becomes this bizarre game of hide the ball. I experienced twelve people trying to convince me that my son was "so strong" in all of these areas of reading and didn't need a special education evaluation. Well, then why were they putting him into a non-special education program aimed at the absolute lowest performing readers. It was nonsensical! I also--as a general matter and recognizing variability district to district -- do not trust their special education evaluations for children with moderate level learning or behavior issues. Many districts give easier tests, don't test comprehensively etc. You really need your own experts who you trust assessing his academics and also the sensory and adhd pieces. He may be further behind than you think or they are letting on in straight academics if they are suggesting retention. You need to know that and often the school will dance around it or not tell parents because they don't want to pay for special ed. I am in forums for kids with dyslexia with LARGE NUMBERS of parents who were told their child was doing OK etc and then found out in third, fourth, fifth grade or beyond that their kid was illiterate, reading at a first grade level or below.

    I know it daunting and may not be possible to pay for private testing. But I truly believe if there is a time to call on grandparents, dig deep, do whatever, it is in this window of early intervention when it is so important to secure good testing and come up with a good plan for services and intervention.
    Last edited by sste; 03-27-2015 at 01:03 PM.
    ds 2007
    dd 2010
    baby dd 2014

  2. #22
    blue is offline Platinum level (1000+ posts)
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    Thank you all for you comments, I have read them all multiple times. ..... some updated info (warning long): on Thursday DS1 had and appointment with his counselor (Tuesday was the day of conferences that the teacher said she wants him to repeat K). I made notes of everything I wanted to cover with her, and tried to gather more info before hand (hard to do with non napping two year old following you around all day ).

    I read some of the wrightslaw website Gena linked to, and tried to find some more specific info on my state. I also casually asked DS1's teacher how many kids she usually recommends repeat K every year. She stated the average is one to two kids/year, but this year it is three (including my son). I of course didn't ask for the names of the other kids, nor did she tell me (which is good).

    Anyways, at the counselor appointment, we sent DS1 to the playroom and started talking (I have not mentioned possible repeating K to DS1 yet). I told her what the teacher said about it being out of the window of time to ask for an e-val. Counselor (I will call C now) stated it may be for the district, but doesn't think that is legal. So she called our states Advocacy group for special needs (I think that's what it is called?) and left a message. C thinks that the teacher is being told by the principal what to say regarding testing etc (because he has a budget to protect, and he also doesn't like IEP's or 504's according to C from her dealings with him and multiple children). I am choosing to believe (at this point) that the teacher is simply uninformed and is repeating what her boss has told her , and has my sons best interest at heart, but simply doesn't know the laws regarding this (I have been in a similar position with my boss, in a completely unrelated field, and was furious at my boss when I found out the truth, because it made me look like a liar).

    I then brought up my issues to C about DS1's current e-val doctor and lack of communication etc. She said I should give him another chance, and she would be happy to call him and talk it out with him later. I almost said yes, but decided to stick to original decision and said no, I am sorry that wont work. C then offered to call him right now (she has tried this at appointment before, and he is hard to get a hold of). I said OK. She found his person cell # (score) and called him up. He answered and she "called in all her chips" with him asking for his help. We had a long talk going over concerns with DS1 and the e-val process, and what his teacher said. He promised to call me back tomorrow.

    Right after we where done talking to him, the advocacy group called back! They where so helpful, and stated there is no window that closes on asking for an e-val (the same thing a lot of you folks said). And that I need to immediately write a letter formally requesting an e-val and give a copy to the superintendent, principal , and special education director. She stated the school has 25 school days to test DS1 or refuse to. If they refuse, then get it in writing, and we can then request an e-val with an independent examiner at the districts expense.

    I finished up with C and DS1 and I went home (it was to late to do the letter that night). At 9 later that night, the e-val Doc called me (I was very surprised), he said he found the teachers second Conners form she filled out and it Does show very strong scoring towards ADD/ADHD and anxiety. The first one the teacher originally did towards the beginning of the year only scored high on anxiety. He recommended that DS1 start meds right away and he would mail a script tomorrow. He also cautioned that the meds can make anxiety worse so we need to watch out for that and may need to adjust. He also stated that he would look into the fine motor issues, and he is sending addition forms to us to possible check DS1 for some for of high functioning Autism (little surprised by this part)... The news of the ADD/ADHD diagnosis, didn't surprise me or DH, we have known in our hearts DS1 has it for awhile now (even without a formal diagnosis, we even already had the talk about wither we would medicate him if he was diagnosed months ago).

    This morning I took care of the letters formally requesting a e-val through the school and hand delivered them to the appropriate places. I was going to ask you all, if we still need one to get an IEP with the school or can (would they even) consider using ours we had done. Thanks again everyone for the help, I think part of why I gave such a long update, is the hope it will help someone else out, since you all are helping me so much.
    DS1
    DS2
    DD1

  3. #23
    o_mom is offline Pink Diamond level (15,000+ posts)
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    I am glad you are seeing some action. Yes, the school will likely need to do their own eval. They should look at any test results you have, but they may use their own.

    It does sound like this school has a tendency to use retention in place of proper special Ed, so it is good you have an advocacy group available.
    Mama to three boys ('03, '05, '07)

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue View Post
    Thank you all for you comments, I have read them all multiple times. ..... some updated info (warning long): on Thursday DS1 had and appointment with his counselor (Tuesday was the day of conferences that the teacher said she wants him to repeat K). I made notes of everything I wanted to cover with her, and tried to gather more info before hand (hard to do with non napping two year old following you around all day ).

    I read some of the wrightslaw website Gena linked to, and tried to find some more specific info on my state. I also casually asked DS1's teacher how many kids she usually recommends repeat K every year. She stated the average is one to two kids/year, but this year it is three (including my son). I of course didn't ask for the najmes of the other kids, nor did she tell me (which is good).

    Anyways, at the counselor appointment, we sent DS1 to the playroom and started talking (I have not mentioned possible repeating K to DS1 yet). I told her what the teacher said about it being out of the window of time to ask for an e-val. Counselor (I will call C now) stated it may be for the district, but doesn't think that is legal. So she called our states Advocacy group for special needs (I think that's what it is called?) and left a message. C thinks that the teacher is being told by the principal what to say regarding testing etc (because he has a budget to protect, and he also doesn't like IEP's or 504's according to C from her dealings with him and multiple children). I am choosing to believe (at this point) that the teacher is simply uninformed and is repeating what her boss has told her , and has my sons best interest at heart, but simply doesn't know the laws regarding this (I have been in a similar position with my boss, in a completely unrelated field, and was furious at my boss when I found out the truth, because it made me look like a liar).

    I then brought up my issues to C about DS1's current e-val doctor and lack of communication etc. She said I should give him another chance, and she would be happy to call him and talk it out with him later. I almost said yes, but decided to stick to original decision and said no, I am sorry that wont work. C then offered to call him right now (she has tried this at appointment before, and he is hard to get a hold of). I said OK. She found his person cell # (score) and called him up. He answered and she "called in all her chips" with him asking for his help. We had a long talk going over concerns with DS1 and the e-val process, and what his teacher said. He promised to call me back tomorrow.

    Right after we where done talking to him, the advocacy group called back! They where so helpful, and stated there is no window that closes on asking for an e-val (the same thing a lot of you folks said). And that I need to immediately write a letter formally requesting an e-val and give a copy to the superintendent, principal , and special education director. She stated the school has 25 school days to test DS1 or refuse to. If they refuse, then get it in writing, and we can then request an e-val with an independent examiner at the districts expense.

    I finished up with C and DS1 and I went home (it was to late to do the letter that night). At 9 later that night, the e-val Doc called me (I was very surprised), he said he found the teachers second Conners form she filled out and it Does show very strong scoring towards ADD/ADHD and anxiety. The first one the teacher originally did towards the beginning of the year only scored high on anxiety. He recommended that DS1 start meds right away and he would mail a script tomorrow. He also cautioned that the meds can make anxiety worse so we need to watch out for that and may need to adjust. He also stated that he would look into the fine motor issues, and he is sending addition forms to us to possible check DS1 for some for of high functioning Autism (little surprised by this part)... The news of the ADD/ADHD diagnosis, didn't surprise me or DH, we have known in our hearts DS1 has it for awhile now (even without a formal diagnosis, we even already had the talk about wither we would medicate him if he was diagnosed months ago).

    This morning I took care of the letters formally requesting a e-val through the school and hand delivered them to the appropriate places. I was going to ask you all, if we still need one to get an IEP with the school or can (would they even) consider using ours we had done. Thanks again everyone for the help, I think part of why I gave such a long update, is the hope it will help someone else out, since you all are helping me so much.
    She holds kids back every year?? I find that shocking! As I said in a previous post, that would never fly in my district. I'm glad you are making good progress with evaluations.
    Green Tea, mom to three

  5. #25
    o_mom is offline Pink Diamond level (15,000+ posts)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Green_Tea View Post
    She holds kids back every year?? I find that shocking! As I said in a previous post, that would never fly in my district. I'm glad you are making good progress with evaluations.
    I was shocked by that as well!

    We usually have 0-2 a year in the whole school, but that out of 60-80 in the grade. If she is holding back 3 kids in her class alone there is a huge problem there. No way should 10-15% of kids need to repeat K.
    Mama to three boys ('03, '05, '07)

  6. #26
    PZMommy is offline Diamond level (5000+ posts)
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    I teach kindergarten, and it is super super rare to hold back kindergarteners. If anything we retain them in first grade, but even that is not very common. I can't imagine a teacher retaining two or three kids a year! Personally I'm very against retention unless it is an extreme circumstance. I'd push for him to go to first grade and get help there. If he repeats kinder he may not get as much help as he needs. A main reason we don't retain kinders is it is very difficult to get them help. The resource assessment for kindergarten is super easy. However once they get to first grade, they qualify for help because that assessment is so much harder. Good luck!!

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