Real Talk, How Hard are AP Classes?

[bnme]

For my honor level-history loving kid, APWH was way too much. He dropped down in 10th grade and is back in AP US History In 11th.

It was truly a college level course and covered a ton of material working very quickly through it. Hour+ of homework every night. Usually 2 hours. I think too much for many 9th graders. I am sure it is some what teacher/school dependent, as this teacher was extremely to tough even in the regular level class. Our school has only AP or regular, no honors. I think for most students, an A in honors or regular is better then below a B (or maybe even a B) in AP. Especially in this particular subject in 9th grade.

[StantonHyde]

DS took AP Human Geography his freshman year and LOVED it. He had an amazing teacher. And he got a 4 on the test and an A in the class. He also took honors Earth Science and Honors English. Regular Math and then other electives. DS has dyslexia, ADD, and anxiety. Freshman year was hard for him--lots of anxiety. But he did it and this year he has 2 AP classes and he is doing well. Getting a B in an AP class is better than getting an A in a regular class--at the most recent college night I attended that was stated loud and clear. (a C would not be so good) The one really good thing is that the AP class honed his ability to take notes and study. I think it was great to try it out as a freshman vs. having your first AP class be APUSH-which will be the case for DD. It was a lot of homework but he loved the class. Doing a hard thing was good for him.

DD is going to a school with an IB program. For her Freshman year, she looks honors classes in Science, English, History, and Math. She had more homework in 7th and 8th grade. The hard part for her was the social adjustment. She went from a private K-8 with 450 kids to a high school with 3,000 kids. It's what she wanted.

[erosenst]

Here AP World is only available to freshmen! If you don't take it then, you don't take it at all.

Same school district - but to add on....it's known to be one of the hardest AP classes. Our school has weighted grades which helps if they don't get an A...which DD didn't get. Having said that - it helped prepare her for at least two of the three AP classes she has this year and I think she's doing better than she would have without having one freshman year. And yes, the AP selection at our huge high school is really broad and continues all 4 years.

[ray7694]

As crazy as it is setting courses should also factor into college selection. In our area taking Honors is almost equal to AP outside of the credit to show student ability. Many colleges want you to take their courses so splitting hairs over an AP course seems silly to me unless it was needed for college.

[pinay]

I teach AP Psychology and AP Government & Politics, and they are definitely college level courses. AP World is tough- see here for pass rates for last year's tests:
https://apstudents.collegeboard.org/...-distributions

I think in general 9th graders are not ready for AP level courses. My co-AP Psych teacher also teaches AP Human Geography and is pushing for our school to open it to 9th grade, but it's a course that has a reputation for being an "intro" to AP. I don't think AP World has that same reputation. Our school offers AP Euro rather than AP World and at 10th grade rather than 9th, and it's a big jump for students. The level of rigor is definitely a lot to adjust to for many, and we often see a ton of kids enroll in AP Euro, then drop back down to regular level for US History the following year because it was just too much.

That being said, there certainly are students who can be successful in AP courses at any grade level- if your DD is an excellent reader, enjoys history, and can write well then it may be a good match for her. If there's an opportunity to talk to the teacher who will be teaching the course next year, I would definitely suggest talking to them to get a sense of how they structure the class.

[klwa]

I took AP classes back in the dark ages starting in 10th grade, only because they weren't offered in the required courses in 9th. I don't think there was a huge difference in what was required in our classes vs the honors classes.

With that said, what is the goal in having her take it? To challenge her? To lighten her load in college? To raise her GPA? (Back in the day, AP courses had a weighted GPA, so those who had all As in regular classes couldn't have as high of a GPA as those who had all A's in AP courses.) I'd talk to the high school counselor and ask how the pass rate is for Freshmen. This is also a good chance to see if there is any weighting for AP classes vs others, or whatever else your global "wants" are.

[mmsmom]

Yesterday I attended a meeting for college counseling services at DS’s (private) school. He is only in MS so this was just an info meeting on what to expect. A few things I learned that may be relevant: most colleges recalculate the GPA you submit. So if you get an extra point for an AP course the college will likely take it off when they recalculate the grade using their own scale. If you are going for a competitive college they like to see that a student has taken the most challenging courses offered to them. But it is equally important to have a good grade in the classes you take. So an A in regular history is better than a C in AP. So based on that I would say pick the class she is more likely to be successful in. I would also ask if she takes AP and finds it too challenging could she move to the honors class?

[anonomom]

I took AP classes back in the dark ages starting in 10th grade, only because they weren't offered in the required courses in 9th. I don't think there was a huge difference in what was required in our classes vs the honors classes.

With that said, what is the goal in having her take it? To challenge her? To lighten her load in college? To raise her GPA? (Back in the day, AP courses had a weighted GPA, so those who had all As in regular classes couldn't have as high of a GPA as those who had all A's in AP courses.) I'd talk to the high school counselor and ask how the pass rate is for Freshmen. This is also a good chance to see if there is any weighting for AP classes vs others, or whatever else your global "wants" are.

My goal is for her to keep as many doors open to her for as long as possible, and that means taking the most challenging courses offered right now and aiming to get good grades in them. I don't know where DD should go to college -- I'd be thrilled, financially speaking, if she got into one of our state schools but even those are ridiculously competitive at this point. And we're certainly not gunning for an ivy. But what I don't want is for DD to take herself out of the running for certain schools before she even has an idea of where she wants to go.

Yesterday I attended a meeting for college counseling services at DS’s (private) school. He is only in MS so this was just an info meeting on what to expect. A few things I learned that may be relevant: most colleges recalculate the GPA you submit. So if you get an extra point for an AP course the college will likely take it off when they recalculate the grade using their own scale. If you are going for a competitive college they like to see that a student has taken the most challenging courses offered to them. But it is equally important to have a good grade in the classes you take. So an A in regular history is better than a C in AP. So based on that I would say pick the class she is more likely to be successful in. I would also ask if she takes AP and finds it too challenging could she move to the honors class?

Back when DD was about to enter Middle School, I remember listening to a podcast about getting into college, and they asked an admissions expert which was better -- to get a B in an AP class, or get an A in a regular or honors class? The answer was "Get an A in the AP class." He was apologetic about that very unhelpful answer, but he said that's really the truth when it comes to getting admitted into many schools. That advice has stuck with me.

We have no idea yet if DD can handle an AP class. But that, imo, is a reason for her to try it -- how will she know what she can handle if she pre-emptively declines challenges? Not that I think High School should be an endless slog of work, but it seems to me that Freshman year is a great opportunity to stretch. And I think it verges on educational malpractice for the MS counselors to be categorically urging the kids take the easiest classes in their first year of HS (it has even been suggested that DD and the rest of the accelerated English kids repeat 9th grade English -- a class in which she has a 99 average right now -- rather than moving on to 10th grade English. To me, that is bonkers.)

[AnnieW625]

If it is an honors class with the option to take the AP exam and the class is filled with freshman then I don’t see the disadvantage if history is one of your daughter’s stronger subjects. If it is a mainly junior/senior level class then I don’t see the advantage of a freshman taking it. I am in the camp though that high school should be high school and not harder than your freshman year in college (I know people who did IB or other specialized programs in high school and said this or got really stressed out in high school with honors and AP classes).


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[elbenn]

Your DD as an 8th grader scored in the top 3% of the SAT? It sounds like she could totally handle an AP class!